fdl

I know I have posted about this before...but I am convinced that its getting worse not better. I need to baby my shifts to second otherwise its extremely notchy to get in, to the point where it almost grinds sometimes (shifter shakes in my hand). If I baby my shifts and really concentrate I can sometimes get the shift in nicely...very smooth.

So...the RSX had/has a 1-2 shift problem. In fact there was even a bulletin put out on it. If you go to clubrsx.com and search for "grind" or "notchiness" you will find probably a hundred threads on the 1-2 shift problem. Apparently its the syncros. And I am thinking my TSX has a similar problem with syncros. Well mine does anyways. This would explain why when i baby the shift...slowly..lettign it go into neutral first...and let the rpms drop low enough ..the shift goes in better.

So anyways...I talked to my dealer a while ago about this and they said the RSX has the same issue and that my tranny needs to get broken in and even then it may still not go away. Should I accept this? Should I wait a while and see if it gets worse and then bring it in? Or should I bring it in now? Or maybe just live with it and learn how to shift it without grinding it.

It seems to get somewhat better after the car has warmed up. The first 5 minutes are the worst. I would really like to get this fixed because its cutting in to my enjoyment of the car. And what is it with Honda trannys lately. First the TC/CL disaster, the RSX syncro problem..and now TSX..maybe (maybe not..might be just me as I seem to be very unlucky)


What should I do?

Brad

I know your pain. Now I remember early tranny problems that I had long ago with my '90 Accord when it was new. I took it back to three different Honda dealers over several months. Eventually, after each visit, it got better and better. It works well now.

My suggestion is to put your foot down and insist that the dealer resolve the problem. It shouldn't be YOUR problem that something isn't working right. Escalate the problem to the regional service representative if your local dealer(s) cannot resolve the problem.

Does your state or province have a Lemon Law?

fdl

Thanks for the advice Brad. My first desire is to actually get my dealer to admit its a "problem" rather than something normal. I'm not sure if my province has a lemon law ...I'll have to check into that. ... but I don think I would fall into that category just yet.

DEVO

To eliminate user error out of the question I would try to get a hold of another TSX and see if you can duplicate the problem. If you can then it's your shifting style, if you can't then you have a legitimate complaint and it should be taken care of.

rzee

That's a very good call. Take the dealer's demo car and try it out.

LeeLee

The first and second gears cover a range of 60mph. Going from first to second gear represents a 42% drop in the drive ratio. In other words, the synchros has to slow down the shaft by 42% before it can fully engage the gear. No other consecutive gear shift requires such a large amount of work to be done. This is why the 2nd gear synchros requires much longer time to work. And the faster you try to jam it in gear, the more notchy it will feel. Try downshifting from third into second - it goes in much easier than upshifting from first, but you are using the same synchros.

Maybe the problem you are experiencing is normal, maybe it's not. But the 2nd gear synchros does take a frequent beating and the 1-2 shift will on average feel far more notchy than other shifts. BTW, try shifting from 1 to 4 directly as if you are trying to pull a fast 1-2 shift. Similarly, try shifting from 2 to 5, or 3 to 6. The shifts are all notchy.

rzee

you mean, nobody does rev matching these days any more?

ebcheon

i agree... rev matching will make it easier on your car as well as your passengers (you won't see their head going front/back). i know what you mean about your 1-2 shifts as it does get better as the car warms up. however, like leelee said, there is a must bigger drop in rpm from 1-2. in general, the shift from 1-2 requires a reduction of 1.5k rpm in order to rev match, where all the other shifts require a 1k rpm rev match. the extra time you have to wait for your rpm to drop the extra .5k, will makes your shifts smoother.

just give it a try... i get paranoid that other drivers behind me are getting mad... but f*ck them. you can drive how you want to drive.

miner

So, as I understand what you are saying is DON"T make the 1-2 shift as fast as the others. So if I shift at 4500rmp wait until 3000 rpm to engage the clutch for 2nd gear? How do I found out what revs to match for each gear when upshiting & downshifting? I am a noobe at MT also.

LeeLee

No no, don't wait for the engine RPM to fall or anything like that. You'll turn mad watching the tach and run into the guy in front of you.

Instead, just don't lean on the second gear shift so hard if you are not in a hurry. Clutch in, ease out of first gear, lean gently on second gear shift gate, as soon as the synchros have had time to work, the shifter will fall into second. This will happen before the engine RPMs have fallen past the 2nd gear rev match point so you ease the clutch out, and apply throttle accordingly. This process takes about a second longer than if you just mash the gear in place so it's not going to cause highway violence and spontaneous gestures from your fellow automatic-driving motorists.

Jaeger

fdl, there's definitely a problem here.

I must have test-driven three different TSX's to this point and each one shifted like a dream with perfect weight, precision and feel. What you are describing is NOT normal imho. And this bit about your tranny needing time to "break in" is a load or cr@p. Have the service manager take a ride with you in one of their new, un-sold TSX's, and have him explain to you why THAT car doesn't grind the 1-2 shift. This is not a car that requires "concentration" or "babying the shifter" for smooth gear changes.

Jeeger

CopperTop

I was told by my dealer that during the 1000km breakin period, that there are only two things to be sure to do.

1) shift often to keep the revs fluctuating (don't hold it at any particular rev for an extended time)

2) shift slowly - no power shifting (I guess the tranny needs to be broken in as well)

Still doesn't change the fact that yours feels/works different to the other three you tested. Go back and get it checked out...

cartan

Many owners of the CL-S 6-Speeds have complained about the same problem. Mine took about 2500 miles to break in. This does not appear to be isolated to the TSX. I also have a friend with an S2000 and he claimed to have a similar issue when his was new.

ebcheon

that's precisely what i mean. you don't have to stare at the tach... but just shift a little slower from 1-2. after you start driving MT for a while, you'll know the speed in which to shift for each shift.

i'm also a noobie at MT, but i've learned already. there is hope my fellow tsxer.

fdl

Well, I;ve gotten lots of differnet points of views here. Thanks everyone. I am still torn but I think I will give it just a little more time and see how things go. In the meantime I may go test drive another TSX just to see how that shifter feels

I'll keep you updated on whether things fix themselves, get fixed by the dealer, or dont get fixed at all.

rb1

I mentioned this on another thread, but I believe the TSX has a cable shifter. Some VW's do too, and (at least in the VW) the procedure for properly aligning the cables and shifter is trivial and is what everyone recommends on the VW boards as a first thing to look at with notchy/problem shifts that don't improve.

Also, the TSX tranny has double-cone synchros (at least on gears 1-4 I believe), so this car should not have any synchro issues for a good while.

CopperTop

I was told triple-cone...

DEVO

yeah, i thought it was triple cone as well.

rb1

OK, I just went to the Acura site.

Gears 1 and 2 do indeed have triple cone synchros (even MORE reason not to have grind issues). Gears 3-6 are double cone. Sweet.

My Jetta gets a double synchro on 2nd but that's it...