BimmerAcura

I've only had the car for a little over a month, but this thing is really irking me and I can't get it down smoothly and it doesn't even shift into 2nd smoothly. It's like shifting through wood lol. I love the car, but any tips? The only times I can ever get it smooth is shifting at low RPM, but if im turning on a highway or left turn, im going to to have to rev to like 3.5K or so before shifting and then it's a nightmare.

Boulder TSX

Hmmm. I have an 06 TSX with 6MT and have not had any problems with that...but I have heard a couple of people here mention it on occasion. How old is the car and how many miles?

If it's not a gear engagement issue, but simply maintaining smoothness based on the revs, the main thing I can suggest is to heel-toe the accelerator a bit when going from first to second. (Matching the revs when you go into second.)

I don't need to do this on mine, but it as many long-time sports car drivers know, it does help with any car with a stick, when shifting on corners & turns. Perhaps it can be applied here.

BimmerAcura

2004 78K miles.

It's really the only ear shift I have trouble with.

Mskierki

What are you talking about? What would hitting the brake do when you are trying to accelerate through a turn?

BimmerAcura,

I have 100k+ on my '04 and don't have a problem shifting into second from first at 3.5k or even 6.5k. You may want to just give it just a second in neutral after coming off the gas before shifting into second.

I hate to say it but the syncro on second may be going bad. You may want to start by doing a trans flush and seeing if there is any debris in in the fluid.

Simba91102

It does sound like synchros, and aren't they kinda weak to begin with? Seems I've read a number of bad synchro stories on here. After a fluid change (or at least a level check), I'd suggest double clutching. That should provide some immediate relief, but there is definitely something going on inside the trans. Long shot would be clutch, but it appears to be confined to and around 2nd gear, so it would seem to be a transmission issue.

BimmerAcura

I think it's just me.

This is my first MT car and i've been practicing on it. Today, it seemed much better. If it continues, i'll get it checked out by mechanic. Is it an expensive job if it would the 2nd gear synchros?

Simba91102

I can't help you on the pricing, but if you really do think your problem may be your inexperience, perhaps you could let someone drive the car who is accomplished with a manual transmission. The Honda 6 speed trans. is regarded as one of the (if not THE) sweetest shifting MTs available.

Boulder TSX

[QUOTE=Mskierki;13930499]What are you talking about? What would hitting the brake do when you are trying to accelerate through a turn?

From Wikipedia:

Heel-toe or heel-and-toe double-declutching is used before entry into a turn while a vehicle is under braking, preparing the transmission to be in the optimal range of rpm to accelerate out of the turn. One benefit is to eliminate the jolt to the drivetrain, or any other unwanted dynamics. The jolt will not upset the vehicle as badly when going in a straight line, but the same jolt while turning may upset the vehicle enough to cause loss of control if it occurs after the turn has begun. Another benefit is that "heel-and-toeing" allows the driver to downshift at the last moment before entering the turn, after starting braking and the car has slowed, so the engine speed will not be high enough when the lower gear is engaged.

Performance vehicles are usually modified (if necessary) so that the heights of the brake and accelerator pedals are closely matched and the pedals are not too far apart, to permit easy use of heel-and-toe.

The name, stemming from earlier automotive designs where the accelerator pedal was on the left and could be actuated with the heel while the brake pedal was actuated with the toe, is misleading regarding how the technique is carried out in modern cars, i.e., operating the brake with the left edge of the foot, while rocking it down and to the right to operate the throttle. With practice, it becomes possible to smoothly and independently operate both pedals with one foot. The technique is common in all forms of motorsport, especially rallying.

As the power band of most rally cars is high in the rev range, this technique can also be used to ensure that engine rpm does not drop below the power band of the car while under braking. This technique ensures that maximum power can be reached the instant the brake pedal is released and the accelerator fully depressed.


Heel-toe shifting through corners is a well-known method of gaining an advantage in racing and rally driving, and it greatly benefits cars with a high rev power band, like the TSX. (I don't think it can help in a straight line, shifting from first to second.) After hearing more from the OP, it sounds like he simply needed to get acclimated to driving a stick for the first time...and the TSX does have a jumpy throttle which is most evident on take-off.

Mskierki

Thanks for the copy and paste. I think that you are failing to understand the question/principles here.

I know what heel-toe shifting is and where it would have its applications, but accelerating in a straight line or through a turn is not one of them.

BimmerAcura,

I would keep practicing with the shift. Make sure that you are smoothly moving the lever from first back into second. Don't force it and it should drop in without any issue, if you are yanking it back into gear that might be causing the trouble.

If you don't get used to it or someone who is familiar with a M/T has issues with it the only way to fix it is to rebuild the trans. While you have it out you should look at replacing the clutch and also the rear engine seal (which on this car is actually on the side, but I digress). Either way it would probably be cost prohibitive if this is only a minor inconvenience, if things stop working completely or start making really bad noises take it to a good shop and see what they say.

Boulder TSX

[QUOTE=Mskierki;13933359] Thanks for the copy and paste. I think that you are failing to understand the question/principles here. I know what heel-toe shifting is and where it would have its applications, but accelerating in a straight line or through a turn is not one of them.

In all fairness, you asked me specifically about how heel toe shifting and braking would help in turns. Your quote: "What would hitting the brake do when you are trying to accelerate through a turn?"

The Wikipedia post answers your question. If you read it carefully, it also discusses the need for braking ahead of the turn, and then matching revs with your toe as you accelerate.

I mentioned in the above post that the technique would not help with straight line shifting. (Perhaps you missed that.)

Certainly the braking is of no use in straight line shifting, however, the rev-matching aspect of the technique can help with the jumpy throttle response of the TSX, as it applies to shifting from first to second. If your revs are not similar in second to where they were in first, you get a jolt. It's easy to suddenly raise or lower the revs with the TSX's drive-by-wire throttle, but with practice, it can be eliminated.

I honestly don't know if this would help the OP, but many posters have described having such problems with the 1-2 engagement due to the DBW throttle being very touchy. It has also been mentioned in some old Car & Driver reviews of the 1G TSX.

The main issue for the OP does appear to be practice in general, and on that we can both agree.