KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

my back hurts... but its in..











its really not even that hard to put in.. there are stock holes for the bolts.. covered with a black sticker... the hardest part was mounting the bracket to the firewall.. had to mark and drill and not much space to work back there.. P.I.T.A... still have to play with it more tomm, the bar is resting on a sensor at the back top of the engine and it rattles at low RPMS.. i will have to relocate it.. anyone tell me what that sensor is??? top middle right in the back... don't think u can see it in my picks..

TLBaller

looks nice. in the 1st pic, the 2 bolts that is at the bottom of the pic looks like you ghetto rigged it by cutting it? the part where the bolts go look like its been cut.

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

oh... lolz... naw it is actually like that...

Ken1997TL

Which bar is this? the Legend bar?

Mikes96TL03CLS

Looks nice man!

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

yes sir.. couldn't find the RL bar u were talking about..

Ken1997TL

Sweet.. get the bugs out of it and see how the handling improves

And of course, write down your thoughts on here for us to read

snordhol

Looks like the Legend setup. So . . . . . why? What does it do? In the legend it was supposed to improve handling, but the TL was designed with out it. The RL has one, but again it is much larger car.

I think and explanation is in order.

Ken1997TL

It does improve handling. It reduces flexing in the body.. meaning the suspension doesnt have to compensate as much. Therefore.. you get more controlled handling and better steering response. Oh and it'll make the body more solid. That is a benefit since there is less stress on the windshield and other parts that you want to keep in the long run

Adam_Schwartz

So can this mod be done on 2.5 TLs?

Looks nice BTW - good work!

Ken1997TL

The bar will be a slightly different shape and width from the Legend bar, but yes it can be done.

TL-Ridaz96

nice work. U got the strut in without sacrificing the engine cap. Mind tellin me where you got your strut from? What model of the legend? I've been wanting one for the longest time. help me out. Thanks!!

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

no prob.. very simple.. i am also on the legend boards.. i see ken on there from time to time also.. but there are alot of legends that are parting out, or wrecked... i posted in black market... WTB OEM Strutbar.. and got lots of replys... i got mine for 20 bucks pick up because he was in my area... u can easily get a brand new one for 38 bucks shipped from hond...

make sure u know what you are getting.. its a second gen legend bar.. 91-95 yr legend coupe or sedan really does not matter.. i had to laugh a few times because ppl were PMing me asking 60-80$ for the bar... like i said again, know what you are getting...

it works with the engine cover but i may trim the right side of the cover, refinish it and paint everything metallic grey or black... its weird, the engine does not sit totally center so the left side clears the bar with alot of space, but the right side touches the bar.. does not have any noise tho, but i rather have some play... u can leave the cover on and it should be no problems.. im still trying to figure out what the hell that sensor at the top of the rear of the engine is.. cause that is vibrating and transfering the noise into the bar...

but driving, i def feel a difference... i don't have any suspension work so its not super tight.. but def feel less body at higher speeds.. im satisfied.. and for 20 bucks.. can't beat it.. will take complete pics when the bugs are all out and clean...

demons rage

iTrader: (1)

niceee grats on the purchase...

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

im not sure what u mean that the TL was designed without it... if you think about it, why did they skip a gen between the last gen legend to the second gen TL... they both have factory strut bars but our first gens do not..

if u think about it.. almost 80% of the cars out there do not have a factory strut... but aftermarket companies make the bars to help improve your handling.. look at all the civics out there...

i have seen some solid strut bars hold the engine compartment in tact during collisions.. u would be surprised how much it helps since it ties the center of the firewall to both sides...

Mizouse

does the vigor come with a strut bar and would it work on our 2.5TLs?

Ken1997TL

I dont think it did. I've actually never seen under the hood of a Vigor.. maybe look on eBay for pics?

Acurasnake

my dad has one and no the vigor does not come equiped with a strut bar.

the engine setup in the vigor looks VERY similar... almost IDENTICAL to our 2.5TLs!!

Ysidro

hi Kam.
Nice work you've done there.
I have a question.
how thick is the bar?
I have a metal bar thats lying at home thats about 1.75 inch thick.

the1beebster

You wouldn't happen to have a part # for the bar would ya??

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

i will measure it later for u... not sure...

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

it is just a OEM Strut Bar from Acura for Legend

TL-Ridaz96

what does the Legend MLS strut bar look like? anyone?

incase anyone wants a legend oem strut click here

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

updated some pics... i repainted alot of the covers.. gloss black.. also painted my intake..





sensor relo i was talking about




i had to notch the bracket to lower the sensor because the bar sat on the sensor and vibration would transfer into the bar when driving.. annoying as hell sound.. thought it was a new rattle...

the1beebster

^^^^ Lookin good.. I'm diggin the black cover. Nice job!

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

thanks beeb... i am a little annoyed tho.. the hood insulation rests on the cover and leaves a little mark on the engine cover... gotta figure out how to solve that...

the1beebster

I wondered what that lil spot was from. Best thing I can think of is to attach some kind of thin foam rubber piece to the insulation at the rubbing point. But I don't know how heat resistant something like that would be.

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

for now i just try to open the hood once a week and wipe it down clean...

vishnus11

hey kamlung, awesome job, this is a mod that im really considering and im sure we all appreciate the input!

I have one question though - how does the strut bar affect the ride of the car. I remember Ken mentioning a while back, that the strut bar would make the car feel more solid, and tighter, and thus should improve the way the car rides - i was wondering if you could confirm this. For example, when I drive my uncle's second gen TL, I immediately notice that it feels somewhat "tighter" than my 1st gen. I was wondering if installing the legend bar would give the same feeling.

Once again thanks for your work, and thanks in advance for any replies

Ken1997TL

Let us know if the car feels more solid. Is the ride firmer? Cornering better? etc

I'd really like to install the RL bar myself, it looks TOUGH.

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

vish and ken... i will try my best to give the best review i can...

first off let me say that the bar does make a difference... even though in OEM form, it is hollow and people say that it is too flexible to stiffen the suspension, by tieing the body to the firewall, you are limiting 'SOME' roll...
now compare this to a strut bar that an aftermarket bar that is completely solid and does not tie into the firewall... being that these bars do not tie into the firewall, then it is required those bars to be solid seeing as how there are only 2 contact points to the body... OEM bar has 4 contact points... ideally, i am trying to find a machine shop to fill up the bar to make it solid... get best of both worlds... ken can u post a pic of an RL bar?? i tried to fit one on the legend boards but noone had one for sale and i have never seen the engine bay of an RL...

now vish said he has driven a second gen, and ken used to have a second gen and now has a third gen... i have driven a second gen and on occassion i drive trancemission's 3rd gen TL... let me say that the first gen does not compare to the newer models... the obvious reason is the size... the 2nd gen and 3rd gen OEM bar is much bigger... i don't remember the size for the 2nd gen, but the third gen's bar is like almost an inch in diameter, still hollow tho... i had an experience in trance's car where i was doing 80 mph on the highway and i had to quickly swerve to avoid some wood in the road.. the car didn't miss a beat and i was greatly impressed with the stock suspension... i have not come across a point where i tested my car at that kind of speed, but at slow speeds down a side road, i do feel a difference... let me say that it is not super night and day difference, it is subtle but it is there... but for a 20$ mod, you can't go wrong... and for those of you that have an upgraded suspension, you will DEFENITELY feel a difference...

so do i recommend doing this??? YES!!! like i said before, for 20$, you cannot go wrong!!! and if you can get something like a MLS copy bar from a Legend and combine it with the OEM bar, even better... there is also debate that the prelude strut bar will fit with some bending, but ken and i already had a little discussion on the integrity of a bent bar... i have some time today and will write up a DIY for everyone... a few members on the board have contacted me on how to do this so i hope that it helps...

Ken1997TL

Here's a pic of the RL with its standard bar.

Bad pic, I'll find a better one tonight.

Ken1997TL

Here is what Acura has to say about the RL's bar...

OVAL-SECTION FRONT TOWER BAR
Instead of a conventional tubular steel front brace between the firewall and the upper front-suspension locating points, the RL uses an oversized, oval-section tower bar brace, as well as a reinforced plate that ties the firewall to the front cowl section. This design increases rigidity as much as 12 times over a conventional round tube design, reducing cowl shake on rough roads and in spirited driving, while increasing steering precision.

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

Tools required:

1.) Phillips screwdriver
2.) Socket set (size depends on the additional nuts and bolts you decide to use)
3.) 4 nuts and bolts for securing the bar to the strut tower (i also put in two washers [1 spring, and 1 regular)
4.) Drill and drill bits
5.) 2 additional bolts (1 for bracket to firewall, 1 for right bracket to strut bar)
6.) Dremel with sanding bits and cutoff tool
7.) imagination and patience

if completing sensor relo..
1.) 4"X4" sheet metal
2.) 2 additional bolts to hold sensor to sheet metal
3.) imagination and patience

Directions
1.) Open hood and locate black stickers covering two holes on the body of the strut tower. This is where the bar will bolt into the body... Remove stickers and the engine cover....

2.) Attach the firewall brackets to bar (L-shape bracket goes on the left) and test fit the bar onto these holes and find some bolts to secure. You are basically noting exactly where the brackets will mount to the firewall... You will notice that there are two stock brackets already on the firewall that hold brake lines (left side) and a black half inch tube (right side)...

3.) Go to the firewall at around the middle, and located these two brackets...





the right bracket, that holds the black tube, will be located too much to the right, and the left bracket, that holds the brake lines, will be located too much to the left... unclip the black tube and remove the bracket from the firewall... be careful not to drop the bolt, it is very tight back there... you will notice that the clip holding the brake lines will not be able to be removed... u just need to unbolt it for now... then remove strut bar from car...

4.) left side bracket [along the firewall u will see two grey plastic plugs that are covering existing holes in the firewall... remove these covers and keep them [i used them to cover the license plate holes in the front bumper]... u need to slide the bracket holding the brake lines to the right, and resecure it to the holes you just uncovered... just use the old bolt...

5.) right side bracket [you will be doing the same thing as the left side except reverse direction... you will need to move it to the next hole going left... mount the bracket in there... when completed, your firewall will look similar to the pics above...

6.) fit the bar back onto the car and mark a hole for where the left strut bracket meets the firewall..

7.) now for the left strut bar bracket you will need to drill... this was a pain in the @§§... you will need to manuever a drill bit to get to the hole but it is possible... make sure that you cover the top of the engine so you don't damage anything... you will only be able to drill one on the left side of the bracket... unless you have a 90 degree drill i don't see the right bolt being installed...



8.) now for the right strut bar bracket you will need to drill the bracket and not the firewall... the bracket will mount into the firewall at the old location that the tube's bracket was mounted on... find a bolt that fits the hole and secure the strut bar bracket onto the firewall... [NOTE: the holes on the bracket will not line up with the bar]



9.) if you look down at the bracket from a top view, you will see that the upper-left hole on the bar will completely miss the bracket... now u need to mark the lower hole onto the bracket and drill a hole for that bolt... i took off the bracket and drilled the hole outside the car... i was not going to risk drilling down into something... after you drill, you will need to find a bolt and secure the bar to the bracket...

10.) completely bolt down the strut bar to each tower and it will look like this on top

and bottom


11.) reinstall the engine cover... will take some maneuvering but u can get it on...

Now you will notice two things... the bar sits on a engine sensor and the right side of the engine cover touches the bar slightly... the easy part is to take a dremel and cut a piece of the engine cover.... i wanted a clean look and instead of sawing off one side, i notched it instead..



rear view



Now onto the engine sensor...

hopefully during this whole time, your engine was cool, because these next steps will require you work on the engine... i was a little eager and got a little burned...

after installing the strut bar, you will notice that it sits on a sensor on the top of the rear of the engine... if you leave it like this, you will experience rattle during accelaration... the engine vibrates and with the bar touching the sensor on the engine, the noise will transfer into the bar and will be annoying... a quick fix is to insulate the contact point... for a week or two, i put some rubber between it... another alternative is to disconnect the sensor from the bracket and push it back so it hangs away from the bar... i am anal so i tried to make it as clean looking as possible... directions below...

1.) remove engine cover, remove the wire harness from the sensor then remove two bolts holding the sensor on the engine... if you look it acts as a holder for the sensor and a cover at the rear of the intake manifold...

2.) the bracket is held onto the engine with two more bolts.. remove those bolts and get the bracket off the engine... be careful don't drop any bolts... its tight back there...

3.) there are two vaccum hoses connected to sensor... you will not have enough room to disconnect these tubes at the sensor, so follow them to the other end and disconnect there... remove sensor from car...

4.) what you need to do now will require some imagination... a pic says a thousand words well ill show then explain...



you will basically be notching the bracket so that you can lower the sensor and it will clear the bottom of the strut bar...

5.) mark the cutout of the bracket... you will need a cutoff tool... and cut out enough room for the wire harness...

6.) test fit the sensor onto the bracket with your notch... you will notice that obviously the holes on the bracket where the sensor used to sit, will not line up anymore... since the sensor will sit lower, the holes will sit lower also... this requires you to create an add-on to the bracket... if you look at the pic, you will see two top bolts and an additional 2 bolts right underneath it... i took some sheet metal and made an exact copy of the stock bracket with an extension for the sensor bolts... basically, the sensor now screws into the new sheet metal, and the sheet metal screws into the stock bracket via the old top holes...

7.) after you get your holes and have test fit everything... reinstall the hoses for the sensor... and then reinstall your new bracket to the engine... finally, connect the sensor to the bracket... [Do not put install the whole bracket with the sensor attached, you will have a difficult time reaching the mounting bolts onto the engine...

8.) after the sensor is back on, put the engine cover back on...

DONE!!! now take the car for a test drive and post pics...

vishnus11

74180-SZ3-A01

In case ken (or others) want to be test pilots of the rl bar above is the part number. It costs around 66 bucks OEM, so assume around 75 shipped. But hell, judgin by what Ken posted about the bar (oval vs. circular, 12 times stiffer, etc.) it looks like this bar might be the best of the bunch.

Kamlung, thanks for the input, its greatly appreciated. A DIY writeup with pics would be A+ AWESOME! Keep up the good work.

EDIT: lol, kamlung, looks like u posted a writeup while i was typing this up! Thanks.

KaMLuNg

iTrader: (5)

i will look into this to see if i can see the bar in person... if you look at where the bar contacts the body around the strut tower, it has its own two bolts right next to the strut tower... drilling will be a b!tch in that area without removing the strut or risk damaging something... but the firewall will prob be the same issue with the legend brackets... i got to find someone with an RL in the area...

binky

found some for our cars both 2.5 and 3.2

fillup05

Can't see any of the pics.
Binky those websites are in japanesse.
Can't read it.

binky

Well I cant read all the Chinese characters either....no pix? I see them...

Ken1997TL

The pix work for me too.