Samdog-1

I have read all of the reviews of the Continental DWS here. I understand they are exceptional for wet grip and snow traction.

My concern is the soft sidewall mentioned here on AZ as well as other sites. It appears to be a recurring comment that they are mis-represented as an Ultra High Performance tire. More than a few enthusiast drivers say turn-in is squishy and the car lurches during cornering as the sidewalls roll under.

Also, I have seen several comments that rubbing against a curb tore right thought the sidewall, ruining the tire. One of these posters noted that the sidewall appeared to have no steel belts in it at all -- just thin rubber.

I have handled the tires and I can squash the sidewall with my bare hands. It does appear to be rubber only and with no sturdy support.

Can anyone comment more specifically on the steering response and cornering nature of these tires?

Mr Marco

^see:

https://acurazine.com/forums/showthread.php?t=769097

MMike1981

thanks for finding that.

Samdog-1

Yes, thanks for finding that thread, it was helpful.

I've been doing more reading on the tire sites. It seems that the tread has has excellent traction, but the soft sidewall allows the vehicle to shift sideways while the tread holds the road. This gives a very disconcerting feeling to the driver. Some drivers hate it and others adjust their style and adapt to it.

It's fairly clear that spirited/performance drivers are most likely to be disappointed in the DWS, while average/cruiser drivers were happy that it was quieter and smoothed out bumps.

There are many reports of sidewall rupture after hitting a pothole or curb and most said that they've never had a tire so fragile before.

Another common report is flat-spotting after sitting 24 hours, with a vibration that lasts 15 or 20 miles and longer in the cold.

I haven't made up my mind yet, but my confidence in the DWS has taken a pretty big hit.

I might consider it as a longer wearing winter tire on a second set of wheels.

MMike1981

well, im hoping mine dont blow out lol, but i cannot wait till the winter gets here.

- no vibration noticed, have had them since mid march

ill just reiterate that it all depends on where you live. the last handful of winters in the new england are have been nuts, with multiple blizzards & wet slushy crap through March and sometimes in April. We get a steady diet of rain thru 12 months. My choice was pretty easy after seeing the results of the DWS in snow/rain. But I also fully understand hesitation in putting them on. Fortunately, i havent had many of the issues uve read about other than initial balancing problems.

Samdog-1

Thanks Mike.

I went to a Mini Cooper site on the basis that a Mini is sort of a small RDX -- that is; a tall boxy hatchback originally meant for utility but redesigned with twitchy, precise steering and very stiff suspension for driving fun.

This is what I found: http://www.northamericanmotoring.com...-feedback.html

It seems that the soft sidewall issue breaks down along "hard-core" enthusiast vs "tired of getting beat-up by the ride -- I gotta live with this thing everyday" enthusiast (or his wife).

Mr Marco

Quote:
Originally Posted by Samdog-1
Yes, thanks for finding that thread, it was helpful.

I've been doing more reading on the tire sites. It seems that the tread has has excellent traction, but the soft sidewall allows the vehicle to shift sideways while the tread holds the road. This gives a very disconcerting feeling to the driver. Some drivers hate it and others adjust their style and adapt to it.

It's fairly clear that spirited/performance drivers are most likely to be disappointed in the DWS, while average/cruiser drivers were happy that it was quieter and smoothed out bumps. I would go for a 19 or 20" X 8.5" wheel to avoid the squirm on corners. (Plus they look better on the RDX)

There are many reports of sidewall rupture after hitting a pothole or curb and most said that they've never had a tire so fragile before. Every brand of tire I have owned, with the exception of Toyo, has done that.

Another common report is flat-spotting after sitting 24 hours, with a vibration that lasts 15 or 20 miles and longer in the cold.
Same as above.
I haven't made up my mind yet, but my confidence in the DWS has taken a pretty big hit.

I might consider it as a longer wearing winter tire on a second set of wheels.

Exactly, this is what you put on your stock rims after you buy 19/20's and a summer tire for more spirited driving.


Quote:
Originally Posted by MMike1981
well, im hoping mine dont blow out lol, but i cannot wait till the winter gets here.

- no vibration noticed, have had them since mid march

ill just reiterate that it all depends on where you live. the last handful of winters in the new england are have been nuts, with multiple blizzards & wet slushy crap through March and sometimes in April. We get a steady diet of rain thru 12 months. My choice was pretty easy after seeing the results of the DWS in snow/rain. But I also fully understand hesitation in putting them on. Fortunately, i havent had many of the issues uve read about other than initial balancing problems.

I have read every review I could find on-line and every tire has its bad reviews. It all boils down to what you can afford and what you need. For me it is the Yoko ENVigor. But if I was in Chicago, Cleveland, Madison, or New England, I would choose the Conti DWS.

MMike1981

o and yea, every tire ive ever owned has bubbled or rippled and ive had a few blowouts too - cant tack that on as being a DWS demerit can happen to any tire anywhere

Samdog-1

I've had several tires curb damaged with scuffs and gouges (not me driving ). Pirellis, Bridgestones and Dunlops all survived curb damage with no ill effects, but they all had a built-in rim protector. The only bubble I ever had was on an OEM Continental, due to a curb scuff. Additionally, only the Pirelli P-Zero Nero suffered flat-spotting (otherwise great tire).

My tire guy says this DWS sidewall is thin because it lacks a rim protector. But he also insists that the grip will more than account for slower steering response and was quite enthusiastic about the tire. He drove it on Evos and AMGs during a trade show.

I still have reservations but I would like to have the wet and snow traction this tire certainly delivers. He's offering Continental's full refund for any dis-satisfaction, so I may go for it. If I like it well enough for wet/snow I may set the OE rims aside for winter only.

MMike1981

im doing a test run @ cold 35. car feels more amazing. so far if i could sum up my experience; @ 32-33 psi, the tires generally feel underinflated. not that they lack capability but they literally feel flat. they ride and handle like such. U put them at 34-35, they feel like a totally different animal and almost like they belong @ default 34-35. much less roll, way more athletic, and sharp turn in.

most likely if you feel the way that you do right now, anything that may happen if and when u buy these will only be magnified; i think you should just buy something else given your skepticism off the bat.

Samdog-1

Thanks Mike, this is very helpful.

Perhaps the "flat" feeling at 32-ish psi explains some of the user discontent I have read. Continental themselves recommend 2 to 3 additional psi for many of their products, but this information doesn't seem to be making it to the end user, resulting in negative impressions.

I went into a tire shop and shortly determined that nearly all tire brands and types in a 45 to 60 aspect ratio, have stiffer sidewalls than the DWS.
So the extra pressure is an important variable that allows the higher grip level to be observed. My research is done now and I will never know more unless I drive the DWS myself.

I've got nothing to lose but the bother of returning them, so I'm going to give them a try. I would prefer a winter-biased all season over a dedicated snow/ice tire, so if steering response is reasonable, these may be the winter tires.

(Looking at Enkei EM-5s for summer rims.)

MMike1981

i think if u run these at cold 34-35, u will be more than pleased with the steering response. the tread is pretty much self explanatory on the DWS, it simply doesnt get much more aggressive in all weather than that.

i drove primarily the entire week @ cold 35. in my conclusion so far, between over a tank of gas and 200+ highway miles, im about as satisfied as ill ever be with the DWS. they are spirited enough now to keep me happy, and offer significantly more roll-resistence in some mega turns ive done. who knew just a few more psi would change the tire so much. it really took alot of the squishy feeling away without being really 'over' inflated. im happy now.

have u checked tire racks testing of these in winter? the results are remarkable. i dont think u will have to switch these out unless u are in some real serious serious stuff.

MMike1981

btw - i contacted Continental about the pressure; they said to leave them at 32 psi. whatever.

Samdog-1

OK then, the Conti DWS are installed on the RDX.

I'm running a little on the high side of 32 psi per Continental instructions. The tire's dry grip is impressive. I haven't tried wet yet, but I expect it to be just as good as everyone has said.

The sidewall is quite flexible and it has reduced turn-in response. The combination of the high grip and soft sidewall causes an uncomfortable lurching when the RDX is thrown into a corner. But when the chassis settles, it hangs on tenaciously.

Fast sweepers are the best.

Quick transitions, like an emegency lane change maneuver, leave the body lurching on the sidewalls as it tries to catch up with the tire grip. It is an unsettling feeling that makes me wonder if an aggressive swerve might cause a tip-up or even roll.

Despite the speed rating, I don't think this tire belongs in the UHP category. On a Mini Cooper site, one guy says he rolls over bumps now instead of go-carting around them. I would have to agree -- smoother, but less fun.

On the plus side, my wife finds this tire to be very quiet and comfortable on the daily commute. She's not so sure yet about the lurchiness, but it makes her less confident.

Against Continental's recommendation, I will try 34 or 35 psi to increase rigidity, but that may cause premature center wear.

We will try them for a few weeks.

MMike1981

@ 34, the uneasy flex is pretty much mitigated.

enjoy hope i helped

Samdog-1

Thunderstorms are rolling through.

Just had it out on the back roads in the wet. This is possibly the best wet traction and lateral grip I have ever experienced (still using 32.5 psi). I was aiming for puddles and standing water to try to induce sliding. The tire cuts through water remarkably well and without that rooster tail splashing onto the windshield.

Wet braking is also very good. I did several maximum effort stops with the ABS chattering. Very quick and confident deceleration.

The grip however, does not compensate for the unsettling squirm in transitions and delayed steering response. It's a very strange combination. (Will try 33.5 psi soon.)

Earlier, my wife came home very pleased with her quiet, smooth commute. She's starting to like her new tires. They take the harsh edge off the RDX. Aaargh, I may be stuck with these things.

Samdog-1

Well, I didn't have to bump them up. It got warmer out and the morning pressure is now 33.5 psi.

That extra pound seems to be adequate to stiffen the sidewall and the steering response is better. Not what I'd prefer, but tolerable anyway.

I'll keep them at 33.5 until I can measure treadwear and see how even it is. My wife likes the softer ride, so I guess we are in Contis for the duration.

Nyjumpman23

I RE-ITERATE!!!!! - I've owned these tires before the 2ft snow storm last year - keep the tires on 35-36(i stick w/ 35) in cold weather..Abso-freakin-lutely. (i'm very very serious about this, if you want top notch performance and handling out of the tire).
----I've owned the DWS for about 9 months---

In warmer weather (the acura report says 32 period.), keep the tires around 32-33, since heat expands the rubber. It will handling nicely on the hot grueling pavement with this range of air.
You will feel a major difference on handling in this crap rain weather(in the east coast) - MIKE KNOWs, and handle exceptionally well in Snow (Mike, I'm telling you, you're first reaction will be like...WTF?, why did Acura put MICH's on this car at all in the first place...??...the DWS...WOW, WOW, WOW - well a similar reaction might occur).
This tire has done it's job to the T.

You still have to remember, regardless, the DWS, is a ALL-WEATHER TIRE, overall tire.
It does what its supposed to, and over-lapse a lot of the tire companies out there with its traction, performance, and stability.

MMike1981

o im fully satisfied so far, a small bump in pressure resolves most of the initial 'feelings' of the tire. Things are fully legit. smoke any other tire in all weather conditions. they brake better, knife thru went, dont chirp, ride smooth, relatively quiet (no noticeable howl on the highway) and overall are pretty much the best all weather ive had on any car. No other all weather tire has handled rain (and from my little experience in march) snow, as well as the DWS. what they may give up, and just a bit, in dry road, they make up in everything else. ive said before - if all weather is not the concern, buy something else, if it is the concern, these are the best.

Samdog-1

Thanks for that report.

How is it wearing at 35 psi? At 9 months have you by any chance measured the tread depth across the tire?.

calgary2800

Another member the Conti DWS soft sidewall blowout here. Was driving 35-40 hit a pothole and sidewall cracked in less than 1 block. Was lucky someone told me about it in a fast food parking lot before I went driving back home.
Next time will get a tire with much stronger sidewall.

tj19855

Cons: Mine only lasted 32k miles on mostly city driving warranty says 50k. As you can see from the pic the sidewall is extremely soft and wears out fast.

Pros: they grip like no other tire I have ever owned. They perform great on wet/dry roads.

Mr Marco

Wow, old thread alert...

Why on Earth would you need a DWS in Houston?

Plenty of much better All Season tires to choose from.

tj19855

Well these tires had very good reviews on tirerack.com, and they grip real good on wet/dry/icy roads but they didn't last as long as I wanted them to even with a high utqg rating. What tire do you recommend?

Mr Marco

Had the same issue with the Michelin Pilot Sport A/S Plus (something about the rear wheel camber settings). However they now have a third version of the tire which supposedly doesn't have such a soft outer tread-block. They are $200+ per tire, UTOG is 500 so you should get very good life out of them. Check it out:



Pilot Sport A/S 3

x2lacrosse

Since this is back from the dead, I'll chime in.

I had OEM summers on my IS, switched to the DWS and even dropped from 255's to 235's in the rear. Run them at same PSI as I did the summers. I do not notice any performance degradation at all; I drive the same roads in the same manner that I always have. Maybe if I tracked it I would notice, but does anyone really track a RDX??
I recently left the car sitting for an entire month straight; twice in a span of 3 months and there was no flat-spotting or any other problems upon driving it right out of the garage. The car was NOT driven at all during those month-long periods.
The tire is much quieter than the old summers and handles rain and snow like no other A/S I've ever had. And that's saying alot b/c I drove thru some blizzards in my old DC5-S, and this is RWD too.
The only thing I can't confirm/deny is the fragility b/c all the roads on my commute are in very good shape w/ little to no potholes. The occasional expansion joint.
Yes, the IS is much lighter than the RDX, but it's not a light car by any means. Just my 2 cents, take it for what it's worth.