CP-E intake / Hondata reflash test
05-13-2008, 06:51 PM
#41
Originally Posted by cwepruk
Those are usually reserved for people who know what they are talking about. He is attempting to sound knowledgeable while overlooking obvious empiral information.
05-13-2008, 08:57 PM
#42
Originally Posted by wwest
...In reality my remarks were not negative, just questioning.
- negatives can't be proven,
Actually this one can,...
I think I have read that there is now a diagnostic code that the emissions people use to dtermine that enough drive cycles have elapsed for the OBDII emissions staus/readings to be valid.
- negatives can't be proven,
Actually this one can,...
I think I have read that there is now a diagnostic code that the emissions people use to dtermine that enough drive cycles have elapsed for the OBDII emissions staus/readings to be valid.
Prove your negative, Sir. You know, the one that you just denied was a negative statement because it was a question. Or something like that.
If you think you read something, cite your source, Sir, and please explain how your tangential insertion of OBDII has any bearing whatsoever on the subject of this thread, other than drawing attention to yourself.
You obviously have a very high tolerance for knuckle-draggers like me, so please be patient and draw pictures if you must - it may be the only way you can prove your... points.
There are 4 items that I have found to be noteworthy and/or amusing from you:
- the marketing of an in-line resistor to fool a downstream O2 sensor, that one could interpret in this thread you accuse Hondata of perpetrating;
- the brilliant idea to put a boxful of electric fans on the hood of the RDX to blow through the intercooler;
- a braking system that works primarily on the rear of a vehicle;
- your insistence that you understand in total other points that are made and then go on to display close to total incomprehension;
- you raced a Porsche at Daytona.
05-13-2008, 09:16 PM
#43
the pure fact that this guy DOES NOT OWN and IS NOT AT ALL FAMILIAR with ACURA, HONDA etc, their computers, electronics, the way they work etc etc he should just be pulled from this whole thing.
contributes nothing, confuses the fuck out of everything, and spits uncited, unbacked, non-proven statements all over the guys who are working hard for OUR RDX.
contributes nothing, confuses the fuck out of everything, and spits uncited, unbacked, non-proven statements all over the guys who are working hard for OUR RDX.
05-13-2008, 10:06 PM
#44
Oh, BTW, I sent my ECU in for a reflash today. You can bet I will report on any resistors that get soldered to it. As if.
Mods, yes, you Moderators, how about a new forum - SMACK DOWN - where you can send off-topic or doofus posts. Let the Acurazine community have at them.
Seriously, there is damage being done in this enthusiast forum. It hurts member participation and deters new membership. If you Mods are not going to police it, then add a button in the forum posts to Ignore User instead of making us go into our accounts to make a list. At least that would be little more user-friendly.
Mods, yes, you Moderators, how about a new forum - SMACK DOWN - where you can send off-topic or doofus posts. Let the Acurazine community have at them.
Seriously, there is damage being done in this enthusiast forum. It hurts member participation and deters new membership. If you Mods are not going to police it, then add a button in the forum posts to Ignore User instead of making us go into our accounts to make a list. At least that would be little more user-friendly.
05-14-2008, 10:37 AM
#45
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by BleuM&M
Mods, yes, you Moderators, how about a new forum - SMACK DOWN - where you can send off-topic or doofus posts. Let the Acurazine community have at them.
Seriously, there is damage being done in this enthusiast forum. It hurts member participation and deters new membership. If you Mods are not going to police it, then add a button in the forum posts to Ignore User instead of making us go into our accounts to make a list. At least that would be little more user-friendly.
Seriously, there is damage being done in this enthusiast forum. It hurts member participation and deters new membership. If you Mods are not going to police it, then add a button in the forum posts to Ignore User instead of making us go into our accounts to make a list. At least that would be little more user-friendly.
If you really don't like seeing his posts then you can ignore them. I know there isn't a button to do it easily, but it's certainly not hard to do. It only takes 3 clicks of the mouse and typing "wwest".
05-14-2008, 02:38 PM
#46
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Okay, why am I "here"....
I was initially attracted to the RDX because upon reading about the SH-AWD system in detail, viewing the on line videos, etc, I decided it had to be the absolute best F/AWD system in existance today.
F/AWD = AWD system with a sideways mounted engine or derived from a FWD "base".
I currently have a 2001 AWD RX300. The RX's F/AWD system is just barely adequate provided you have an early one with a VC, Viscous Coupling, mounted across the center diff'l. The VC will, on rare occassion, help to provide increased torque to the rear drive line, as much as 75/25 F/R vs the normal ~95/5.
As shipped the RX cannot have tire chains mounted on the rear wheels due to TOO TIGHT clearance between the tread and suspension. I added 1.5" wheel spacers all around so as to be able to use rear tire chains FIRST and ONLY, for reasons of safety. When the tire chains are fitted, rarely here on the Seattle eastside, the VC will tighten up the center diff'l a little quicker due to the F/R wheel circumference variation. An obvious additional plus from the spacers is a slightly wider stance and therefore more stability.
So I test drove one of the early RDX's. I was impressed overall but didn't have a chance to really try out the SH-AWD system. Two other aspects of the RDX kept me from following up. A minor one was the seeming to me, CLUTTER, of the center dash instrument (non-tech)area. But a more important one was the fact that the turbo would come on line with even the slighest additional pressure on the gas pedal.
I suspected that would result in rather poor gas mileage in comparison to my RX and as many of you now know that proved to be the case. Because of the turbo boost capability the RDX engine compression ratio is ~8:1. But that low 8:1 ratio results in a severe lack of early onset of torque until the turbo spools up.
So, let's dream a bit, just a bit.
Assume I have just won the lottery.
I would immediately buy a new RDX and turn it over to a group of students at Western Washington State college with the following instructions/goals.
Convert the engine to the Miller Cycle.
Discard the turbo and instead use a lightweight low inerta carbon fiber positive displacement SuperCharger. The SC would be engine belt driven, primarily, but via a Toyota HSD type CVT/diff'l. The opposite input to the CVT/diff'l would be a 2-3HP synchronous AC motor, the motor itself driven by a variable frequency inverter such as Toyota uses for the various HSD drives including the Prius' A/C compressor.
The engine would use a Porsche VarioCam-Plus intake valve lift system to vary the effective Miller Cycle compression ratio from 13:1 to ~8:1. 13:1 during idle or light load cruising, but as boost came on, rises, due to increased gas pedal depression or engine loading the compression ratio would rise linearly until at FULL BOOST the compression ratio would be ~8:1.
There would be no need for a throttle plate, the VARIABLE SPEED positive displacement SC would provide the engine throttling functionality.
Obviously there would be no turbo spool-up delay.
Probably yeild more HP/Torque than stock plus STELLAR FE, so much so that a smaller engine might be more appropreate.
Questions..??
PS: AS it stands today unless Toyota/Lexus comes up with an HSD version of the AWD RAV4 before I need to replace the RX it appears that the RDX will most likely be my next SUV purchase.
I was initially attracted to the RDX because upon reading about the SH-AWD system in detail, viewing the on line videos, etc, I decided it had to be the absolute best F/AWD system in existance today.
F/AWD = AWD system with a sideways mounted engine or derived from a FWD "base".
I currently have a 2001 AWD RX300. The RX's F/AWD system is just barely adequate provided you have an early one with a VC, Viscous Coupling, mounted across the center diff'l. The VC will, on rare occassion, help to provide increased torque to the rear drive line, as much as 75/25 F/R vs the normal ~95/5.
As shipped the RX cannot have tire chains mounted on the rear wheels due to TOO TIGHT clearance between the tread and suspension. I added 1.5" wheel spacers all around so as to be able to use rear tire chains FIRST and ONLY, for reasons of safety. When the tire chains are fitted, rarely here on the Seattle eastside, the VC will tighten up the center diff'l a little quicker due to the F/R wheel circumference variation. An obvious additional plus from the spacers is a slightly wider stance and therefore more stability.
So I test drove one of the early RDX's. I was impressed overall but didn't have a chance to really try out the SH-AWD system. Two other aspects of the RDX kept me from following up. A minor one was the seeming to me, CLUTTER, of the center dash instrument (non-tech)area. But a more important one was the fact that the turbo would come on line with even the slighest additional pressure on the gas pedal.
I suspected that would result in rather poor gas mileage in comparison to my RX and as many of you now know that proved to be the case. Because of the turbo boost capability the RDX engine compression ratio is ~8:1. But that low 8:1 ratio results in a severe lack of early onset of torque until the turbo spools up.
So, let's dream a bit, just a bit.
Assume I have just won the lottery.
I would immediately buy a new RDX and turn it over to a group of students at Western Washington State college with the following instructions/goals.
Convert the engine to the Miller Cycle.
Discard the turbo and instead use a lightweight low inerta carbon fiber positive displacement SuperCharger. The SC would be engine belt driven, primarily, but via a Toyota HSD type CVT/diff'l. The opposite input to the CVT/diff'l would be a 2-3HP synchronous AC motor, the motor itself driven by a variable frequency inverter such as Toyota uses for the various HSD drives including the Prius' A/C compressor.
The engine would use a Porsche VarioCam-Plus intake valve lift system to vary the effective Miller Cycle compression ratio from 13:1 to ~8:1. 13:1 during idle or light load cruising, but as boost came on, rises, due to increased gas pedal depression or engine loading the compression ratio would rise linearly until at FULL BOOST the compression ratio would be ~8:1.
There would be no need for a throttle plate, the VARIABLE SPEED positive displacement SC would provide the engine throttling functionality.
Obviously there would be no turbo spool-up delay.
Probably yeild more HP/Torque than stock plus STELLAR FE, so much so that a smaller engine might be more appropreate.
Questions..??
PS: AS it stands today unless Toyota/Lexus comes up with an HSD version of the AWD RAV4 before I need to replace the RX it appears that the RDX will most likely be my next SUV purchase.
05-15-2008, 10:19 PM
#50
CP-E intake / Hondata reflash
Yes, got the ECU back and in, total turnaround time less than 48 hours. Two kewl silver metallic Hondata decals for my tool chest to add with the CP-E art.
With the CP-E alone, I notice smoother driveability and better response with part to full throttle. It definitely pulls harder and revs more freely, making the sweet VTEC even more so. Yes, the noise is there - with anything less than full throttle you hear the hiss of the variable flow rather than the whistle of the turbo spooling up. When I back off the pedal the BOV makes this Darth Vader breathing sound that for some reason captivates my girlfriend. At full throttle, Darth makes these short huffs during upshifts that are kinda neat. At part throttle short of kickdown in upper gears, slight intake moan typical of a low restriction or CAI intake is heard - again, nice music coming from a VTEC. The ATLP exhaust thread has a YouTube link where you can plainly hear the CP-E at work.
With the reflash, hair starts growing everywhere. What was very good with the CP-E becomes Oh Yeah. Despite some whiner comments from others, I could never say this ride had much if any turbo lag. Barely there. It went away with the CP-E. Now it feels like a catapult launch. It just starts rolling hard then LEAPS ahead, with these wild, short PHOOTs from the BOV on upshifts. The slight intake moan is now a VTEC wail that is thrilling to hear. Only 2 other vehicles I have driven - an NSX and a Ferrari - have made better music. The RDX shoves me into the seatback and doesn't let up until I roll off the gas - and no, I haven't tried Sport mode yet. And yes, the NSX and Ferrari were much, much faster.
Jordan, please get busy with that BOV swap, because I'm not sure plastic will hold up very long the way you and Hondata have this thing on the adrenalin rush!
All of the above is with my usual Shell 93 octane V-Power. This is my brief first impression. Ohhh. Baby.
With the CP-E alone, I notice smoother driveability and better response with part to full throttle. It definitely pulls harder and revs more freely, making the sweet VTEC even more so. Yes, the noise is there - with anything less than full throttle you hear the hiss of the variable flow rather than the whistle of the turbo spooling up. When I back off the pedal the BOV makes this Darth Vader breathing sound that for some reason captivates my girlfriend. At full throttle, Darth makes these short huffs during upshifts that are kinda neat. At part throttle short of kickdown in upper gears, slight intake moan typical of a low restriction or CAI intake is heard - again, nice music coming from a VTEC. The ATLP exhaust thread has a YouTube link where you can plainly hear the CP-E at work.
With the reflash, hair starts growing everywhere. What was very good with the CP-E becomes Oh Yeah. Despite some whiner comments from others, I could never say this ride had much if any turbo lag. Barely there. It went away with the CP-E. Now it feels like a catapult launch. It just starts rolling hard then LEAPS ahead, with these wild, short PHOOTs from the BOV on upshifts. The slight intake moan is now a VTEC wail that is thrilling to hear. Only 2 other vehicles I have driven - an NSX and a Ferrari - have made better music. The RDX shoves me into the seatback and doesn't let up until I roll off the gas - and no, I haven't tried Sport mode yet. And yes, the NSX and Ferrari were much, much faster.
Jordan, please get busy with that BOV swap, because I'm not sure plastic will hold up very long the way you and Hondata have this thing on the adrenalin rush!
All of the above is with my usual Shell 93 octane V-Power. This is my brief first impression. Ohhh. Baby.
05-15-2008, 10:57 PM
#51
CP-E intake / Hondata reflash
Forgot to mention, no resistors, no solder on the ECU.
I also found it interesting that the CP-E MAF sensor placement is at the front of their intake rather than at the rear of the plumbing as with OEM. In the clean air, to use a sailing term. Can't tell where it might be with the Weapon R.
I also found it interesting that the CP-E MAF sensor placement is at the front of their intake rather than at the rear of the plumbing as with OEM. In the clean air, to use a sailing term. Can't tell where it might be with the Weapon R.
05-16-2008, 10:48 PM
#52
Aint Doing Sh*t
Originally Posted by BleuM&M
Yes, got the ECU back and in, total turnaround time less than 48 hours. Two kewl silver metallic Hondata decals for my tool chest to add with the CP-E art.
With the CP-E alone, I notice smoother driveability and better response with part to full throttle. It definitely pulls harder and revs more freely, making the sweet VTEC even more so. Yes, the noise is there - with anything less than full throttle you hear the hiss of the variable flow rather than the whistle of the turbo spooling up. When I back off the pedal the BOV makes this Darth Vader breathing sound that for some reason captivates my girlfriend. At full throttle, Darth makes these short huffs during upshifts that are kinda neat. At part throttle short of kickdown in upper gears, slight intake moan typical of a low restriction or CAI intake is heard - again, nice music coming from a VTEC. The ATLP exhaust thread has a YouTube link where you can plainly hear the CP-E at work.
With the reflash, hair starts growing everywhere. What was very good with the CP-E becomes Oh Yeah. Despite some whiner comments from others, I could never say this ride had much if any turbo lag. Barely there. It went away with the CP-E. Now it feels like a catapult launch. It just starts rolling hard then LEAPS ahead, with these wild, short PHOOTs from the BOV on upshifts. The slight intake moan is now a VTEC wail that is thrilling to hear. Only 2 other vehicles I have driven - an NSX and a Ferrari - have made better music. The RDX shoves me into the seatback and doesn't let up until I roll off the gas - and no, I haven't tried Sport mode yet. And yes, the NSX and Ferrari were much, much faster.
Jordan, please get busy with that BOV swap, because I'm not sure plastic will hold up very long the way you and Hondata have this thing on the adrenalin rush!
All of the above is with my usual Shell 93 octane V-Power. This is my brief first impression. Ohhh. Baby.
With the CP-E alone, I notice smoother driveability and better response with part to full throttle. It definitely pulls harder and revs more freely, making the sweet VTEC even more so. Yes, the noise is there - with anything less than full throttle you hear the hiss of the variable flow rather than the whistle of the turbo spooling up. When I back off the pedal the BOV makes this Darth Vader breathing sound that for some reason captivates my girlfriend. At full throttle, Darth makes these short huffs during upshifts that are kinda neat. At part throttle short of kickdown in upper gears, slight intake moan typical of a low restriction or CAI intake is heard - again, nice music coming from a VTEC. The ATLP exhaust thread has a YouTube link where you can plainly hear the CP-E at work.
With the reflash, hair starts growing everywhere. What was very good with the CP-E becomes Oh Yeah. Despite some whiner comments from others, I could never say this ride had much if any turbo lag. Barely there. It went away with the CP-E. Now it feels like a catapult launch. It just starts rolling hard then LEAPS ahead, with these wild, short PHOOTs from the BOV on upshifts. The slight intake moan is now a VTEC wail that is thrilling to hear. Only 2 other vehicles I have driven - an NSX and a Ferrari - have made better music. The RDX shoves me into the seatback and doesn't let up until I roll off the gas - and no, I haven't tried Sport mode yet. And yes, the NSX and Ferrari were much, much faster.
Jordan, please get busy with that BOV swap, because I'm not sure plastic will hold up very long the way you and Hondata have this thing on the adrenalin rush!
All of the above is with my usual Shell 93 octane V-Power. This is my brief first impression. Ohhh. Baby.
05-18-2008, 09:06 PM
#53
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Originally Posted by JGard
That's a better idea than having to ship off your ECU.
How's this, though. Are you familiar with Cobb Tuning? They're huge in the Subaru world.
they have a product called the Accessport which plugs into the ODB-II port under your steering column and reflashes your ECU for you. That way, you can reflash and unflash the ECU whenever you wish. They even have different maps available for 91 octane and 93 octane and every few months they update their maps as they test and find things that work better.
I don't know how difficult it would be to make a product like that, but since I'm sure you work with all Honda vehicles out there, this could probably be huge for you. It's EXTREMELY convenient for the customer, it's fairly cheap, and it's east to go back to stock whenever you want to sell the car or take it in for warranty issues.
How's this, though. Are you familiar with Cobb Tuning? They're huge in the Subaru world.
they have a product called the Accessport which plugs into the ODB-II port under your steering column and reflashes your ECU for you. That way, you can reflash and unflash the ECU whenever you wish. They even have different maps available for 91 octane and 93 octane and every few months they update their maps as they test and find things that work better.
I don't know how difficult it would be to make a product like that, but since I'm sure you work with all Honda vehicles out there, this could probably be huge for you. It's EXTREMELY convenient for the customer, it's fairly cheap, and it's east to go back to stock whenever you want to sell the car or take it in for warranty issues.
05-18-2008, 09:27 PM
#54
Originally Posted by spongebobnopants
Ditto on this request. The AP will allow Hondata SW protection and potential buyers to get the vehicle back to stock for service visits. The ECU for $1100 is an o.k. idea, but what happens when the dealer does an ECU SW update.
05-22-2008, 12:15 PM
#58
Originally Posted by SinCity
Not sure if this was explained before or not. But why can't we have a flash via OBDII like Audi/VW/BMW?
05-22-2008, 01:15 PM
#59
why not? come up with some type of key gen or serial thing they have to request, it cant be that hard. host your flash so they can remotely access it for a 1 time use with a key/pass etc...
05-22-2008, 04:29 PM
#60
Aint Doing Sh*t
Originally Posted by hondata
What if we were to sell a brand new RDX ECU with reflash? Price would be about $1100. How many people would be interested?
The immobilizer will still need to be reprogrammed right?
05-22-2008, 08:50 PM
#61
Originally Posted by batman
hondata,
The immobilizer will still need to be reprogrammed right?
The immobilizer will still need to be reprogrammed right?
BTW, every time I push the go pedal I enjoy what Hondata's intellectual property did to my RDX. May I give props to SlowMotion Motorsports of Columbus, Ohio, an authorized Hondata dealer, for making my process quick and elegant. 2 phone calls, 2 emails, less than 48 hours later my RDX had been intellectualized. Thank You All!
05-22-2008, 10:34 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by hondata
Because we have not yet developed the hardware that will allow our dealers to do this in a secure manner which protects our intellectual property.
Not that you are adding any value that the ECU doesn't learn to quickly negate within a few drive cycles anyway. ...
05-22-2008, 11:49 PM
#63
Originally Posted by wwest
But then what's to keep someone from copying, "core-dump" your "intellectual" property from one of your "reflashed" ECUs and then simply selling it for half price...??
Not that you are adding any value that the ECU doesn't learn to quickly negate within a few drive cycles anyway. ...
Not that you are adding any value that the ECU doesn't learn to quickly negate within a few drive cycles anyway. ...
05-23-2008, 12:51 AM
#64
Originally Posted by wwest
But then what's to keep someone from copying, "core-dump" your "intellectual" property from one of your "reflashed" ECUs and then simply selling it for half price...??
Not that you are adding any value that the ECU doesn't learn to quickly negate within a few drive cycles anyway. ...
Not that you are adding any value that the ECU doesn't learn to quickly negate within a few drive cycles anyway. ...
I intended to post this earlier and didn't, but since WildWest brought it up, I'd like to relate my drive-cycle experiences.
Since my CP-E install and later Hondata reflash, I've had about 2 dozen drive cycles - as in real-world stuff, not EPA, manufacturer or despised by WildWest dyno runs - correct me if I'm wrong, but even the Mfr and EPA runs are under artificial conditions.
Despite my booting the pedal to hear the histrionics and feel the thrust, I'm seeing an average 2 mpg increase in around-town driving. There is no negate - it's going the other way, WildWest. It's plain faster too and seems to be stronger by the day. I'll have even more to report after I've come back from a 1500 mile mountain run. Come over and drive it after you've had your fun behind the wheel of a rock-stock unit. Dinner's on me.
I regret that you still display ugly, ill-founded negativity that cheapens your discourse and trashes your credibility. You wanted some, remember, because of your life experiences and your age.
Tell me, what good have you added to our discourse?
05-23-2008, 12:18 PM
#67
Originally Posted by BleuM&M
correct me if I'm wrong, but even the Mfr and EPA runs are under artificial conditions.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
05-23-2008, 03:27 PM
#68
Ukrainian RDX
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Originally Posted by batman
The immobilizer will still need to be reprogrammed right?
05-23-2008, 04:01 PM
#69
Originally Posted by hondata
You are correct. Honda uses a dyno to measure the power output of their engines under varying conditions and with various modifications. in California the smog stations and CARB testing labs, use rolling roads.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
05-23-2008, 09:11 PM
#70
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Originally Posted by MMike1981
why do u guys still deal with this dude.. seriously just stop replying, to try and find relavant info in these performance threads is a task.
05-24-2008, 11:24 AM
#72
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Originally Posted by hondata
You are correct. Honda uses a dyno to measure the power output of their engines under varying conditions and with various modifications. in California the smog stations and CARB testing labs, use rolling roads.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
I'm sure you would agree that what you are describing here is an engineering proof of design/concept for a given engine line after which these engines are discarded.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
I'm sure you would agree that what you are describing here is an engineering proof of design/concept for a given engine line after which these engines are discarded.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
05-27-2008, 03:38 PM
#73
i rebut west so strongly because he has tried to interject and tare apart good, honest, DOMESTIC work and engineering.
if he had anything to contribute to this section of the forum, more particularly, ACURA (RDX) related, thats one thing, but he doesnt, at all. and judging by your post history regarding this topic, neither do you. its one thing not to care for something, its another thing to launch verbal diarehha of the mouth in hopes of knocking off everything that comes our way. if you dont like something, feel free move on. or, if you are going to invalidate something, at least have a scintila of evidence in your favor. if west showed us something specifically related to the operation of the RDX, id be more than glad to actually read it.
obviously west is a smart old guy, unfortunately, hes somehow landed in the wrong forum to apply his knowledge.
and as to my childish post, what sin said. if u dont like my comments, go ahead and ignore my childish responses....click profile view, then ignore, done gbye
if he had anything to contribute to this section of the forum, more particularly, ACURA (RDX) related, thats one thing, but he doesnt, at all. and judging by your post history regarding this topic, neither do you. its one thing not to care for something, its another thing to launch verbal diarehha of the mouth in hopes of knocking off everything that comes our way. if you dont like something, feel free move on. or, if you are going to invalidate something, at least have a scintila of evidence in your favor. if west showed us something specifically related to the operation of the RDX, id be more than glad to actually read it.
obviously west is a smart old guy, unfortunately, hes somehow landed in the wrong forum to apply his knowledge.
and as to my childish post, what sin said. if u dont like my comments, go ahead and ignore my childish responses....click profile view, then ignore, done gbye
05-27-2008, 10:57 PM
#74
Originally Posted by wwest
Porsche tests each production engine on a dyno test cell for only an hour at various RPM and load factors. Once the engine is installed in a finished car an employee is chosen at random to road test the car under a specific driving program/procedure.
I'm sure you would agree that what you are describing here is an engineering proof of design/concept for a given engine line after which these engines are discarded.
I'm sure you would agree that what you are describing here is an engineering proof of design/concept for a given engine line after which these engines are discarded.
BTW, every Honda motor is tested per the procedure described, then installed in a finished car and driven by retail recipients under non-specific circumstances. I'm sure you would agree that those are some tough powerplants.
05-27-2008, 11:56 PM
#75
CP-E/Hondata update
Originally Posted by wwest
There is ALWAYS the silence majority...
You know, those that do the research and spend their money more wisely.
You know, those that do the research and spend their money more wisely.
535-mile leg completed on the mountain run thus far. Compared to a prior run under most similar conditions, the weather delivered temps about 9 degrees warmer (72 to 81), more humid conditions, slightly heavier load (luggage and tool boxes) and 4 mph faster average speeds, about the same traffic.
With the increased response and thrust, I would have been happy with status quo mpg. I like to cruise between 75-80 mph and use cruise control on long, relatively straight and level stretches, light traffic, setting it at 80. So with average speed going from 72 to 76, my average mpg per the MID went from 19.6 to 23.5.
Driving impressions - very nice. Downshifts on uphill twisties result in hot-and-now response. I found myself letting up earlier on the juice because I was overtaking traffic much more quickly than before the mods. I could hear the BOV and variable turbo at work in their offices - that's for you sound and fury folks - but I have to say that I got really good response without diving deep into the throttle. However, this rig is drive-by-wire so who knows what may have been done with throttle positioning - Hondata and CP-E, maybe?
05-28-2008, 05:38 AM
#76
Si Vis Pacem, Para Bellum
Originally Posted by MMike1981
i rebut west so strongly because he has tried to interject and tare apart good, honest, DOMESTIC work and engineering.
if he had anything to contribute to this section of the forum, more particularly, ACURA (RDX) related, thats one thing, but he doesnt, at all. and judging by your post history regarding this topic, neither do you. its one thing not to care for something, its another thing to launch verbal diarehha of the mouth in hopes of knocking off everything that comes our way. if you dont like something, feel free move on. or, if you are going to invalidate something, at least have a scintila of evidence in your favor. if west showed us something specifically related to the operation of the RDX, id be more than glad to actually read it.
obviously west is a smart old guy, unfortunately, hes somehow landed in the wrong forum to apply his knowledge.
and as to my childish post, what sin said. if u dont like my comments, go ahead and ignore my childish responses....click profile view, then ignore, done gbye
if he had anything to contribute to this section of the forum, more particularly, ACURA (RDX) related, thats one thing, but he doesnt, at all. and judging by your post history regarding this topic, neither do you. its one thing not to care for something, its another thing to launch verbal diarehha of the mouth in hopes of knocking off everything that comes our way. if you dont like something, feel free move on. or, if you are going to invalidate something, at least have a scintila of evidence in your favor. if west showed us something specifically related to the operation of the RDX, id be more than glad to actually read it.
obviously west is a smart old guy, unfortunately, hes somehow landed in the wrong forum to apply his knowledge.
and as to my childish post, what sin said. if u dont like my comments, go ahead and ignore my childish responses....click profile view, then ignore, done gbye
05-28-2008, 01:47 PM
#77
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Originally Posted by hondata
You are correct. Honda uses a dyno to measure the power output of their engines under varying conditions and with various modifications. in California the smog stations and CARB testing labs, use rolling roads.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
"..continuously...peak power....400 hours...(16 days)..."
But wouldn't that result in engine wear equivalent to, assuming 60MPH, at least 30,000 miles?? Or at peak power and then top RPM more likely 80,000 to 100,000 miles of roadway equivalent use??
For EVERY production engine..??
So much for the initial owner bothering with engine break in rules, speed variations, etc...!!!!
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
"..continuously...peak power....400 hours...(16 days)..."
But wouldn't that result in engine wear equivalent to, assuming 60MPH, at least 30,000 miles?? Or at peak power and then top RPM more likely 80,000 to 100,000 miles of roadway equivalent use??
For EVERY production engine..??
So much for the initial owner bothering with engine break in rules, speed variations, etc...!!!!
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
...
05-28-2008, 01:54 PM
#78
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Originally Posted by hondata
You are correct. Honda uses a dyno to measure the power output of their engines under varying conditions and with various modifications.
in California the smog stations and CARB testing labs, use rolling roads.
And you can be quite certain, as with the "rolling road" emissions testing here in WA, CA smog stations do NOT proceed with testing until they have first verified the vehicle has accrued enough prior drive cycles to have calibrated the systems and confirmed proper sensor tolerances to validate the test procedure.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
in California the smog stations and CARB testing labs, use rolling roads.
And you can be quite certain, as with the "rolling road" emissions testing here in WA, CA smog stations do NOT proceed with testing until they have first verified the vehicle has accrued enough prior drive cycles to have calibrated the systems and confirmed proper sensor tolerances to validate the test procedure.
Honda's engine test procedure involves running the engine continuously at peak power for 400 hours (16 days), followed by running the engine at peak RPM (redline) for a further 100 hours.
FYI
The Honda US engineer tasked with overseeing the RDX development, drove the RDX tested here - in real world conditions. He was impressed with its response and power increase.
05-28-2008, 02:00 PM
#79
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My company supplied the computers that control/monitor/collect data for the engine test "stand" that Ford uses to qualify every new engine or modified engine design prototype coming out of engineering. It's been awhile but 400 hours sounds about right.
05-28-2008, 09:10 PM
#80
Oh, and I forgot to mention I really am proud of the plaques in each of my many Honda products, personally signed by none other than Sōichirō Honda himself, attesting to the rigorous testing of not only his engines, but to the design and engineering of Honda products.
Is it any wonder that Honda rose to the pinnacle of motorsports, F1, and dominated? They excel wherever they focus their efforts.
Maybe Ford, Porsche and other marques would benefit by emulating Mr. Honda. WildWest, if he has some spare time on his hands, might look into Mr. Honda's life. He may learn a lot.
Is it any wonder that Honda rose to the pinnacle of motorsports, F1, and dominated? They excel wherever they focus their efforts.
Maybe Ford, Porsche and other marques would benefit by emulating Mr. Honda. WildWest, if he has some spare time on his hands, might look into Mr. Honda's life. He may learn a lot.