Originally Posted by rockyfeller

Most cops are reasonable. They are looking for real offenders. They aren't looking to hassle the innocent. Others are all about the LETTER of the law no exceptions. They are bored, biased or want to fill quotas.

So let's talk about the law. If you want to know the truth, things like mods to the headlights, tail-lights etc.; if it isn't DOT approved, it can be deemed illegal. They were engineered to pass tests for visibility under all conditions so fiddling with that is a problem. So strictly speaking ANY mod on your car can be considered illegal. Like how most of us have cleared lights, tail-lights etc. So anything you do poses a risk for a ticket of some kind. OK. So let's put that aside. State laws differ. There is nowhere that specifically says 8000k bulbs are the ones that are illegal or what spectrum the light should be. A cop can say "Your lights look blue." That's nice. That's just his opinion. In my state it vaguely states that the light has to be white and can't be colored. What does that mean though? See these laws have not been updated to talk about HIDs. So technically this can be argued in court. And this is what I do. They get me with the letter of the law? I fight back with the letter of the law. And wherever the law is flawed I take advantage of it for it's loopholes. That's how a lawyer thinks.

Actually, DOT approves nothing. The manufacturers certify that their equipment meet DOT standards under the various Federal Motor Vehicle Safety Specifications (FMVSS). While the term "white" is not specifically defined, it is generally considered to be in the 2700-5500 range. More importantly, there is a standard for intensity that you won't attain with 6000k+ bulb. Why? Because no manufacturer makes a compliant housing/bulb combination that meets the specs.

There is no need to change the regs for HIDs or LEDs - the regs give the requirements. How they are met is up to the manufacturer.

The same holds true for "clear" taillighting units. If the manufacturer can build a housing that meets the requirements (here the definition of "red" is very specific) then it can certainly be clear - however, to date there is no bulb that meets that spec, so a clear housing is "clearly" a violation.

But here is the more important thing. Ticket for 8000k headlights? Really??? Is it that serious? This is what I mean, go after real stuff. Someone with those 20,000k headlights or REALLY blue, violet or green. Yeah I get that, that needs a ticket.

Correct. In your opinion, you've set the "standard" at "20,000k or REALLY blue". The law has set it at "not white" and 8000k falls in that category.

The cops should go after things with discretion, not just knowing there is a law to back him up. The law is there for a reason, not to just write tickets. The truth is 6-8000k is very common and not such a serious thing to spank someone with. U may say "yes it is!" OK then, why do cops that sit there with their radar on generally let cars that are 10mph over the limit whizz by? Because nearly everyone is going 10 over the limit! It really is accepted and not so serious. Now someone going 20 over? Give him a ticket by all means! What as I was saying before, if you are the wrong person in the wrong place you can get that ticket for going just 5 over. You can say I gave the cop a "reason" but I'd argue that we all know what that real reason is and it isn't the speed. It's more because you are that wrong person, wrong place and wrong time.

I know you are saying if someone breaks the law, then pay the piper and they shouldn't look for side excuses or self-insecurities like race etc. I get it. But to say that some PDs don't use race a profiling factor to try to investigate and get more on you, and if they don't, at least use the original violation as a "guaranteed" minimum; the truth is, it is effective most of the time. And every rare once in awhile when they do get an actual drug bust out of it? Guess what, nothing but pats on the back, reinforcement and encouragement to keep doing it! So they feel justified in doing it.

I'd opine that the vast majority of PDs do not profile on driver appearance but I think you would surprised at how many "routine" traffic stops turn into non-vehicle related criminal offenses.

Tint is illegal in NJ, OK. But in my state 35% is allowed. So then they try to ticket for this even though I am compliant with the state I am registered in. What am I supposed to do, rip my tint off as I drive through and then put it back on. So I had to argue that I comply with my own state laws and show them the books. See this is BS, why am I guilty and have to prove my innocence?

This has been well tested in the courts. You are required to comply with the laws of the state through which you are traveling. In VA, this means no radar detectors in the car and in NJ it means no tint. Tint laws are state laws that each state enforces but most jurisdictions are reasonable. In VA, a ticket will normally get tossed if the radar detector is clearly unavailable to the passengers or driver - i.e. in the trunk (glovebox is not OK) or in a container in the rear on SUVs or wagons.

Tint laws are trickier, because there is no way to remove the tint while driving through. GA was notorious for enforcing tint laws in the interstate but they have now become more reasonable. If you are clearly just passing through he you most likely won't get a ticket for tint although it is still a valid reason for a stop. It gets tricky if you work or regularly transit the area.

Now if someone has 5% tint or tint on the windshield, something like that, give em a ticket! No excuse.

Again, you are adding you opinion to what should be ticket, yet you condemn "the system" when they determine what the threshold is.

This is not what they do. It's like an unnecessary test of competence and wit. It is easy money for them to try and get someone feeling scared or guilty of doing something "oh so wrong". Gimmie a break, there are better things to do in life! You know what? If I was a real criminal and I really wanted to hide something with my tint, I would NEVER be in a flashy car anyways. I would be in an SUV with tinted windows (which somehow are legal right?) or a panel van.

You would be surprised at the "real" criminals that get done in flashy cars. Criminals aren't usually the brightest bulbs in the box (hence the high k bulbs )

SO how come people like that are not as much as a concern, hmm? The real criminals are slipping by camouflaged with the normal cars, duh! Tinted window laws that say that tint can't be used at all is just about making money. The law should be 35%. That is totally reasonable. No front plate? Another DUMB law!

Front plates are also state laws.

I am SO glad that you haven't experienced this ceb. But being that you are Hispanic could mean that this is something you COULD experience too. But this all depends on where you live and drive, so our experiences will be different. So you are right, it's not just about race. It's where you are. I can tell you for sure there are places that you wouldn't want to be driving at the wrong time of night,

I can think of lots of places that I wouldn't want to be in - but it has nothing to do about being stopped by the po-po.

you too would get a hassle in a flashy car. Age is also a factor. And if you don't "look Hispanic" that is another factor. If you say you don't know what I mean by that, come on.

Of course I know what you mean by that and of course you can often distinguish race by appearance.

I am not at all trying to offend you at all. I am explaining how some people perceive us minorities. They bucket us into these categories and stereotypes. Our haircut and clothes, all matter. That is the makeup of the "profile" I am talking about. It shouldn't have to be OUR job to shatter their preconceived notions. But in order to stay out of trouble that is exactly what I try to do. I wish the effort doesn't have to be on our end, but it does.

We all stereotype at one point or another about all sorts of things, but I believe that the "profiling" of drivers based on race has long come to an end for the most part and is often used as an excuse when people don't want to blame themselves for their own mistakes.

My office has a variety of people from all walks of life and all ethnicities in it. We also have two guys, within a couple years of each other, same race and general appearance who live in the same part of town and both drive "flashy" cars with clearly non-conforming mods. Both drive to work on very similar routes at the same time of day.

In the last year, one has been ticked twice coming to work and once driving home. The other one hasn't. The guy with the tickets is always complaining on how the cops are picking on him because of his race and he is regularly in traffic court. The other guy just shakes his head in disbelief.

There are many factors involved in a traffic stop but one guy must be doing something that gets the attention of the cops apart from his race.

Again I reiterate that what I meant before by "Jews" in fact was Hasidic. And yes there is an obvious way they look like.

Sure, and had you said "Hasidic" in your first post....

These cops look at not only the car but the person driving.

Probably at some point but there is ALWAYS something about the car or the driving that first gets their attention.

Yes it is true that the majority of the courtroom was there for moving violations. But either minorities can't drive or they are getting more tickets for some reason. I was only a handful of guys there with equipment violations and some of their experiences mirrored my own, they said they also get targeted all the time by the same PD. I mentioned before that this police force doesn't do just speed traps. The cops that get me are either driving with me on the road (and they pass me to "investigate" and look into the car like a hungry shark and THEN pull me over.) or they sit by the side of the road with their radar off. They just sit there watching each car. So what's that about? This is an 11-13mile stretch is trolled by a force of 20-25 cops so they are rampant, literally driving around on top of each other lol. Speed limit is set artificially low at 50mph. You can easily do 65mph on it, but I actually put the cruise on 50mph with my Valentine One on.

I didn't mention this but sometimes they block onramps at rush hour on the highway. (Thanks for creating safe unnecessary traffic for us.) They eye each car and then pull cars they want to the shoulder. Another cop comes by with a clipboard writing tickets. That is another way they got me one time. I watched as every Camry, Accord and Sienna was passed by (probably filled with real criminals, haha who knows.) In the shoulder with me was every lowered, tinted car with rims. It looked like a Honda or Acura car meet. lol. I get it, our cars are "breaking the law" in some idiotic way. Is it really that serious?? Of course not. $$$$ It's all about the Benjamins. Cha-ching! Pizza party at the PD. So I can't even go in that jurisdiction. I have actually mapped it out and I know their exact borders. Since 2012 my routes always bypass around it. Guess what, NEVER been pulled over since. No mystery there. So either I'm all of a sudden not breaking the law of all the other PDs or maybe just maybe; I'm not somewhere I'm being profiled.

It doesn't sound like you are being profiled. It sounds like there is a PD with a goal of writing tickets for violations (technical or otherwise). If you were being profiled then you'd be the only one on the side of the road. It sounds like you have plenty of company and it sounds like they might be profiling cars with equipment violations - perfectly legal.

So I am not sitting here being cynical, angry, bitter and judgmental like you imagine I am. I am actually happy-go-lucky and accept everyone. This is not some anger-rant about race. Surely this is a minority and not the majority. I give the benefit of the doubt. But I am also on the defense when I need to be and evade cops when I can. When and if I get flack I am the least bit surprised and they won't catch me off-guard. I stay educated and know my rights and that is the moral of the story. I just accept that it is, what it is and I gotta look out for myself. And I advise everyone the same, that's all.