JTS97Z28

iTrader: (4)

Daily drivers can't be parked in the garage?!?

Mr24v

iTrader: (1)

These things don't just happen, or are normal wear and tear. It's a design defect. We have an 08 FX-35, and the dash bubbled at 60K miles on a hot summer day. I took it to the dealership, and they acted as if they never heard of the issue and wanted to charge me $1800 to replace it. The bumper to bumper warranty had just expired.

Two minutes of searching online revealed that the bubbling was a manufacturing flaw caused by the material and adhesive they used, so Infiniti issued a recall. They used different materials in the new dash to prevent bubbling.

Fortunately my TL-S with 103K hasn't had the dash cracked. I would be curious to see a poll of owners who have had their dash cracked with the following information:

Region
Year of Vehicle
Mileage of Vechicle when it happened
Something pertaining to the amount of time spent in direct sunlight

SHOstopper1992

One of the MAIN things that makes anything a recall or lawsuit worthy is when safety becomes a concern. Until someone's death is caused by the dashboard or transmission, it will be dismissed.

The only actual issue that could be made is that the Dashboard cracking could prevent proper air bag deployment for the passenger.

I hate cars

I've owned mine since new. For the first 2 years it was mostly parked outside in the Vegas and Phoenix sun. Since then it's been garaged at home and parked under covered parking at work. When I drive it anywhere else I use a sunshade. I've posted on why I think this happens and my almost cracked dash that I saved just in time.

Part of the problem is people expecting perfection. I see people all the time getting pissed off around here because their 140,000 mile 5at finally went out. A transmission is a wear item. It has a finite life. The clutches will eventually go out especially in city driving. Ours are not failing in under 20k miles and they're not locking up on the freeway when they fail causing a safety issue.

The cracked dash would be annoying but these cars are not new anymore. Mileage should have very, very little to do with it, only time. I've seen tons of cars with cracked dashes at about the same age both foreign and domestic.

I hate cars

This is a BS reason for getting the dash fixed. The dash does not control airbag deployment. A cracked dash certainly doesn't hinder deployment. It's made thin in the airbag area so that it rips apart easily during deployment. A crack is only going to help things out and it does not affect position of the air as once deployed. The dash's only role is to get out of the way of the bag.

As I said on the transmission, ours are not locking up while driving down the freeway. Usually there is some warning and then the car no longer moves under it's own power. Much different than basically locking up the front wheels and making the car unmovable as the 2g did and the early '04s.

If you can sue for the transmission failing as it does in our cars you can sue if the engine dies or it runs out of gas or you have a flat tire.

Mugen.Justice

The place where I rent (house converted into apartment) has a single-car detached garage. To get to the garage is a single-car-width driveway. Unfortunately, myself and five other housemates share that driveway. With people's different schedules it became way too much of a hassle to coordinate so I can get my TL in and out. Soooo...I'm reduced to using that garage as storage for the vehicle I'm not driving.


I know, it sounds ass-backwards, and it pains me to park the TL-S outside.

JTS97Z28

iTrader: (4)

Ahh ok I gotchya.

Acura_Girl_Forever

I have an 2008 TL (1st purchased in 2007) with 133000 miles on it and I don't have a cracked dash or transmission issues. I know there are owners with cracked dash issues and transmission issues but I don't feel that every TL will experience the problem or has experienced the problem. I also live in Texas where it is humid. I don't think that the amount of people that voice a concern about the dash issues on the internet is a significant number compared to how many 2004-2008 TLs were sold overall. That is my guess on why a class action lawsuit has not been filed.

Healingduck

I'm probably wrong, but I thought the 07-08 dashes were made out of a different material and didn't crack.

Acuramon

I used to read these "Cracked Dashboard" threads with a kind of semi-interested detachment. After all I had a 2005, here it was 2014 and my dashboard was just fine. Then one day my dashboard cracked...

Not saying it's inevitable that it will happen to everyone but everyone saying, "My dashboard is just fine" should know they are just as vulnerable as those whose dashboards have already succumbed. Nothing you can do about it but wait and hope it doesn't happen.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

agreed with IHC.

at all these people that bought the car used then expecting perfection

GhostTL09

iTrader: (1)

Springfield Acura replaced my 2001 TL Tranny. I bought it in October 04 with 32k miles on it. Within 40k miles the tranny was slipping. I researched and saw the recall notice on 01's and took it right over to them. After a couple days of checking they replaced it. I drove it all the way up to 225k miles when i traded it in!

gatrhumpy

iTrader: (1)

I am a reliability engineer, so I know a lot about root cause analysis, design problems, reliability of components, etc. I have not put a lot of thought into coming up with a root cause analysis, but this is what I do know.

From the person that said that ALL dashboards will crack, that's hogwash. Was the person that told you that a design engineer? If not, then it's an opinion based on a couple of cases that they have (might have) see personally. There might be a fair amount of cracked dashboards for 2004-2008 Acura TLs, but there are such a wide ranging amount of things that go into why a dashboard might have cracked, including: where it's parked (and for how long), humidity, amount of maintenance done to maintain dashboard, previous accidents, use of sunshields, etc. The factors are all scattered. Until someone comes up with a root cause analysis for this problem, no one will ever know or pin down what the problem is.

triax37

iTrader: (1)

I love engi-nerds...err, engineers!!!

gammah

Does the dashboard turn white and then crack? That is what I am seeing on my dashboard. I even have applied vinyl protectant and lexol leather cleaner/conditioner on it, but still goes white.

I hate cars

I know one of the triggers because I caught mine right before it cracked and was able to save it.... barely.

I always park it in the covered parking at work and the garage at home but one day I was late and had to park it on the last spot of the covered parking. When I came out for lunch, the sun had hit only half the dash, just the passenger side. The driver's side was still in the shade.

The dash was under tension big time. I could see the outline of the passenger airbag and it had a deep dimple at one of the corners. It was about to tear. I was too afraid to drive it or to move it to a different spot or even turn on the AC or defrost and rapidly change temperature. So I put the sunshade on gently and a towel in the passenger window and came back a few hours later and the dash was almost back to normal. It still had a small dimple in it.

By the time I got home about 6 hours later the dimple was barely noticeable if you looked at it just right and now it's completely gone.

I suspect that if you park it in the sun it's probably best to have the whole dash in the sun than just a portion of it. Since then I've been extra careful to park it in such a way that it sees complete shade 99% of the time but the rare time it sees sunlight, it's completely exposed and not under a tree or partial shade.

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

Based on what the OP said, if all the dashes will crack in a matter of time, then in 5 years, every single TL on the road should have a dash crack. The argument from him now is that the 08's haven't had enough time yet, but in 5 yrs it will be 2019 so that should be plenty of time. If not every single dashboard is cracked by 2019, then the OP will be wrong.

EL BAN

Bought my 2008 TL off the dealer 0 miles back in Oct 2008..

At 70k miles the dash cracked, I believe it was the first 2008 to crack in Puerto Rico and it was a bit of a hassle to get them to change it at the dealer since there are only 2 dealers at the Island..

I had a bit of a leverage because I was the first owner and I had also bought a 2012 MDX new off the lot also.. And still I ended up paying half the labor ~350 bucks..

Was garaged everyday from 2008 until 2011 when I purchased a track car and started garaging it so it wouldn't risk be stolen..

Cracked in 2013..

I would say its just a matter of time before many other 07-08 have the issue..

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

very surprised this happened to you but Im sure you are one of the rare cases. I mean, not one, but TWO cracked dashes for a 2008, plus you say it was garaged after 2011. Does the sun shine harder in puerto rico or something? lol

EL BAN

I was too.. I always thought it was specifically an 04-06 issue.. Until that day I spotted the crack on the dash and was so pissed..

I also had my car pretty well tinted for PR, had 20% all around including the front window fully tinted which actually had me get pulled over in FL after the car was brought overseas.. They would also get changed every year to have them nice and dark..

It could be related to the constant sun.. Its not that the sun shines harder in PR but we do get 80-95 degree weather the entire year..

December to February our weather was perfect for the beach while many states in US were freezing their arses xD

Oh and you got it the other way around, it was garaged from Oct 2008 until February 2011. In Feb 2011 I got the track car and the TL slept outside. So it was exposed from Feb 2011 until late 2013 when it cracked..

flonzer

Sorry for the delay, was out of town for a few days. I do agree that sunlight or humidity has something to do with some dashes cracking faster than others. My 05 TL has always been garaged since purchased brand-new. I have always used a sunshade and 303 to clean the dash. My dashboard has been cracked for nearly 4 years now. I was told by nearly 10 different Acura employees that this is a defect in the dashboard, including the Acura employee that already commented on this page saying the same. I'm not just making this up,this was acura that told me every 04 through 08 dashboard will crack. so bitch at them not me. Maybe that is a bold statement on their behalf saying all will crack, but I would assume a majority will see enough sunlight in their lifetime to crack. Hell, there was one in Alaska with a dash that was cracked. There was an engineer who did some research on our dashboard, I will have to try and locate that page online in order to remember exactly what his conclusion was. Now as for the safety concerns with the airbag and the transmission,there are 300 plus complaints on the NHTSA website for our generation vehicle. There are quite a few accidents that have occurred from random airbag deployment and transmission failures according to the website. I have not filed out one of these complaints myself yet but definitely will now. I would recommend anyone with these problems to go on their website and fill out a complaint formal also. That way maybe we could get a better count on how many of these issues actually exist. My original transmission lasted only 40,000 miles. (Normal?) My second transmission lasted almost 100,000 miles.(normal?)Now that I'm on my third transmission I do not know what to expect out of it. All failing in similar ways with gear slippage and high rev RPMs only allowing the car to go about 20 or 30 miles an hour and then dying just after. As said before my car has always been meticulously maintained, services were always performed on the transmission and on the vehicle, by only acura. Most of the transmissions that have gone out seem to be from a similar malfunction with the second gear on the automatic transmissions. Most of the transmission failures I have seen seem to be the same way that mine have failed. It just seems very odd how many dashboards and similar transmission issues I have seen throughout our generation.

flonzer

I can't wait till your dash cracks. Seems like when people say there's hasn't cracked yet it happens very soon after. Also there are plenty of 08's with cracks out there.

djdonte

The only reason anything substantial got done with the 2g transmissions is because they were locking up and/or shifting into 2nd at higher speeds. I'm sure there were crashes caused, injuries and monetary damages involved. All they did was extend the warranty and replace your tranny with a new one that would carp out soon anyway. I've been involved with a few class action lawsuits and the most I've ever gotten was like 120 bucks. One time my payment was a trial gym membership.

I hate cars

You can't possibly believe a cracked dash can cause random airbag deployment and you can't possibly compare the 2G transmission locking up on the freeway to one that at worst neutrals out.

You have had several of what seems like identical early trams failures. When they repeatedly fail in the same way you should probably question if the switches and other sensors/solenoids are being carried over to the new trams or if the cooler is defective instead of accepting the same failure over and over.

Of course most on the way to failure default to second gear. This is the gear the transmission mechanically (hydraulically) defaults to when there's a serious electronic fault or a complete loss of electrical power. You can go fast enough to get home while not being so high you overheat the fluid. So the 2nd gear default during failure really doesn't mean they're failing in the same way, it's the backup plan to get you home during a failure regardless of the failure type.

And to wish a cracked dash on someone, really?

Also, did no one read what I wrote? I caught mine in the process of cracking. I know one of the triggers of cracking if not THE main cause.

Acura-OC

Here is another opinion. When things get hot they usually expend and when they cool off they shrink.

When dash gets hot pores on the most out layer expend and let moisture in just like a sponge and later when it cools off pores shrink trapping moisture under the top layer. Unfortunately water is an exception to the rule it expends when it cools off.

Now you have two materials during cooling off period one is shrinking (dash cover) another expending (moisture inside dash).

It depends on humidity level temperature range and rate of change (speed of cooling off).

I think if cooling is fast enough to shrink out layer and trap (enough) moisture under it will damage dash regardless whether it is being garaged kept in a shade or treated with chemicals.

This process in the nature called natural fracking.

I think we 3G TL owners have being fracked by Acura engineers.

I hate cars

I see your point but water follows the normal rules above freezing and below boiling. What you say is definitely true in the temp extremes and I know snoot of road maintenance crews hate it. I think it's been a considerable pain in the a$$ at Mount Rushmore. I almost made a reference to a cereal but you missed my last joke that was a quote from "Friends" on the "moo point" lol.

The one thing I know beyond a doubt is uneven heating of the dash will lead to cracking and if think that is more important than absolute temp. Maybe humidity does have something to do with it whether it's by "fracking" slowly over time or if the water actually makes the material more brittle over time.

With the way my poor dash was distorted that day with the sun only hitting part of it, there's no doubt in my mind it would be cracked now if I hadn't caught it when I did.

I've always been curious how many with cracked dashes have driven with the strut brace under hood removed. In the past people have ended up with cracked windshields from hard bumps or potholes with the brace removed back when these cars were still being made. I could really see torsional stiffness taking a dive with the under hood brace removed and the behind the rear seat braces removed.

gatrhumpy

iTrader: (1)

So anecdotal stories. Got it.

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

When I worked for Acura, the engineers looked into the issue and had released a half ass report. Just to be clear, not a TSB report. I would If this was a selective issue (Not happen to all) if the cracks happen in very random places. Key indicator that this is a faulty design, is that 90% of the cracks start in the same locations. You will have it start on the right side airbag cut out and by the center speaker traveling over to the top of the cluster. Acura engineers won't admit the real cause of the issue but blame if mainly on using anything other than a damp cloth to clean the dash board.

Let's go way back before the cracks. Everyone complained about the dashboard turning ashy in color and seeing the airbag cut-out lines. The only solution was some form of dashboard treatment. A thread back in 2006 about dashboard issues https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-problems-fixes-114/ok-can-not-get-rid-off-ashy-dashboard-608623/. People are mistaken about only those in the southern states will suffer dashboard cracks. False. I live in Northern NJ and this past winter being super cold, cracked my dashboard. In fact, my brother who also has a 2004 TL his dashboard cracked just a few weeks before mine. In fact, the dashboard crack thread on Azine had more people from the North East complain their dashboards also cracked.

So was it the cold now? Let's go back to what temperatures do; Cold-shrinks / Heat- expands. So, let's say one morning the temps are roughly 6 degree's (Very cold), you get inside the car and let it warm up. You crank the heat to full speed, high temp because your nuts are frozen.. The dashboard material is now SUPER stiff, while temps going out the vents are way above the temp of the dashboard. The Dashboard is under extreme stress. This process of expanding and compressing has happened many times before however, summer and winter seasons are the "Extreme" seasons. The dashboard can no longer expand, and a crack forms in a spot that gives.

So, for those that had it happen during winter, notice on a day it will break over 50, you notice the cracks disappear. Your interior warmed up enough to cause the dashboard to expand and seal the crack. It's simple. The dashboard loses its "Elasticity", can no longer expand and compress, also compromised by two notorious weak spots that give in . This is a design flaw. I was the guy who said they will all crack, and they will. It's a flaw design, it comes down to time and time is affected by location and weather conditions.

04WDPSeDaN

iTrader: (1)

I forgot to mention:

The 1st generation TSX also suffered dashboard cracks forming 99% of the time on the passenger right side of the airbag cut-out. Tsx dashboard cracks aren't as highly known or have failed as much as the 3rd gen TL. Note, the material on the 4th gen TL and 2nd gen TSX are different. It could be vinyl, but the material feels and looks like the issue of cracking won't happen.

To really investigate the issue, you will have to do a ton of homework. Airbags aren't made at Acura. There's a company who make all manufactured airbags. Just as the parts on cars are usually made in all different locations brought to one location to put a vehicle together. For the hell of it, manufactures may have an outside company make their dashboards. Engineers and designs will supply the information, the company will make it. I could be wrong. Look at Lexus and toyota. Some of their dashboards from similar years as the 3rd gen TL and 1st gen TSX also suffered cracking. I didn't research if their cracks all form in the same locations when they start. There's a lot to look into, just like an airplane crash. They may find what caused it, but there's always the but why did it happen, or why did it fail. Food for thought really.

Acura-OC

Here we go again.
How could I miss your joke if I used it to reply to another person appraised value? I was not replying to you.

On topic, if it was uneven heating there would be relatively similar population of cracked dashes all over but from reading this message board it appears that there is higher concentration of cracked dashes in states with higher humidity level and most of the cracks in the same location.

The maximum density of water occurs at 3.98 °C (39.16 °F). Water begins it expansion right after 39 °F

It is true for all car not just Acuras so at the end it all comes down to elasticity.

I hate cars

You still don't get anything. How can so much go over your head. It was a joke and you obviously have that stick too far up your ass to understand it. Still pissed you got caught in that huge lie I guess.

Water begins it's expansion RIGHT AFTER 39F??? So is that 40F or 38F? You need to understand the material you're copying or it just doesn't make sense when you try and pass it off as your own. Only one of those answers is correct. Guess which one?

Acura-OC

Neither of the numbers represent freezing point.

Anytime facts do not confirm your statements or your theory you blame the messenger and for some reason you are not able to do it in a civil manner. If you cannot change your mind are you sure you have one?

DeathMetal

iTrader: (2)

Oh, FFS.

The construction of the dashboard is a laminated scrim that has insufficient dimensional stability under a range of exposed conditions. If there a large gradient in vinyl content, it will split after the plastisol has been cured and undergone too many iterations stress exceeding the elastic capability and undergone yield.

The failure mode is energy flux, but there's a flat-out engineering shortcoming in the vinyl formulation. THAT IS THE ROOT CAUSE.

EL BAN

It was interesting to see how after it craked, when exposed to sunlight you would get in the car and not see any crack since it expanded to the point where they werent visible, once you rolled down the windows or started the air conditioner you could see the crack appear..

I hate cars

No, it's the constant freezing of water contained within the vinyl coupled with the vaporization of the ice when the sun hits it from the east at just the right angle. If you look at a cracked dash you can see the natural "fracking" down in the vinyl and even down in the age rings that indicate the age of the dash. You can tell if it had a particularly bad winter according to which age ring has the worst fracking.

Back to reality, I think it's several things and without most if them it won't crack.

The material drying out, losing it's elasticity as you said.

When you mention dimensional stability would you consider my experience with the dash skin under severe tension from being only partially in the sun, unevenly heated in that category?

I have to wonder if some of the dimensional instability comes from the overall attachment to the cars chassis and chassis flex. Is it the vinyls attachment to the rest of the dash? I truly think it's the uneven heating or cooling of the dash coupled with a brittle material especially when not maintained correctly, and the inability to allow proper expansion and contraction independent of the cars chassis or the frame of the dash itself.

This would easily explain why some can survive in really hot areas and some crack in milder climates.

I hate cars

That supports my claim even more. It also makes me happy I didn't turn the AC on when mine was about to crack. I think all it would have taken is a few more degrees of temp difference between the driver side and passenger side.

Acura-OC

If only people in Florida new that all they had to do is to park facing toward California even when car is always being garaged to create even heat distribution. For some creepy reason dash always has more sun on the passenger side right around airbag.

I hate cars

I'm glad you figured it out finally.

FamilyGuy

There's probably a few failure mechanisms at work with these kind of issues, and any combination in between, all of which will lead to the same end result. Uneven temps from uneven sun exposure, as IHC points out, resulting in tension stresses, overall life of material and exposure / atmospheric conditions, material properties themselves and overall design, potential residual stresses from manufacturing processes and installation, and even stresses from driving / chassis flex. Like the engineer above said, we'd need a good root cause analysis and test many different conditions, together with a materials and design review, to identify all failure mechanisms. No one's gonna do that...so get some sunshades, aerospace 303 and cross your fingers

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

you clearly didnt understand my statement, and I dont think you'd understand it if I explained it