SK2003TypeS

All the more reason to get one

groebuck

if your going rotary and don't want to spend the cash (if you are a weekend warrior the dewalt is expensive for how much you are going to use it) check out www.harborfreight.com

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=90820 for 60 bucks or

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=46507 for 25 . I have the 25 dollar one and believe me it is every bit as good (for my weekend warrior status) as spending 200 bucks on a dewalt - and if you hate a rotary or just decided you can live with your DA then you have only spent 25 bucks...!

ejeckert

I use my Mr. Clean Autodry...works pretty damn good but my TLs white so I could wash it with anything. I do notice that the Carwash with Mr. Clean get a lot of road film off the car. The Wash mitt is pretty black with road film after Im done. And the car looks really good!! I just need to wax it. I used Zaino on my CL-Type-S 3 coat I think it took me 2.5 hour and that included the dawn wash...no claybar. I dont think you need to use the claybar on a new TL claybars typically are for older cars that need some minor finish restoration. Claybar reminds me of wet sanding only not as abrasive. I dont use them but once agin my car is White. I am considering zaino again for my new TL but keep hearing of NXT is it good and will it last like zaino?? I love watching the water repell of the car after its been zainoed...People ask me whats on it (my old CL) because the water repells off so fast. But any suggestion I am considering the NXT. Zainos nice but I fell like a chemist and dont want to spend more then 2 hours doing this. Let me know what you guys think.

joerockt

So when did you change your mind about this??

DarkWraith33

Might as well chime in....

This thread again reminds me of why I went with Blackfire (I'm sure most of you have read my thread "review"). I had NO desire to apply 11 to 35 coats of product, nor did I want to spend $120, nor did I want to become ExcelDetail's padawan learner to remember Z2 (ZFX) Z7 Z69.... (Perhaps the numbers from LOST are actually the CORRECT steps of Zaino products to use??? Wrong forum...)

The Blackfire was $50 shipped... Two steps the first time and a coat every 3-5 months or so with continued protection, depth and shine. People still comment on the look after several months since application. (It's due...) Absolutely perfect for a nice car that is also a daily driver. If I were not able to get the Blackfire, I would most likely use Liquid Glass... or NXT.

And no Dawn dammit...

For every drop of Dawn you use on my car, I shall kill you...

(Pardon the many external TV/movie references.... )

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

You people are sooooo misguided. You do not have to apply XX coats of Zaino to get the paint looking great. From day one I've been using Z and my car has never looked better.

My TL turns 6 years old next month and it has 80,XXX miles on it and people never believe it's a '99. Yeah I know you're all sick of the pictures, but there's the proof. SSM is such a tough color to show depth and reflection. I think Zaino does a pretty damn good job. And its durability is unmatched.

Keep using what you're using. Opinions are like a$$holes....everyone's got one.



Oh and BTW, this was after all the previous coats of Zaino were stripped and this is with 1 coat of Z2.

CLpower

wasn't my car, wouldn't dawn my car


I'm still definately against dawn wash. I wanted to give zaino one last try before I never used it again and wanted to use it properly

CLpower

Exactly, find something YOU like and use it often



my problem is I keep finding stuff I like

Anthony Orosco

Do you also do the same for the NXT? If you QD the Zaino after each wash of course it is slick but the question is do you QD after each wash with the NXT, if not why?



Nice looks but it really looks no different from this silver 350Z I detailed with only a paint cleaner and a paste wax.



But this is a new car so it may not be a fair comparison. Here then is a NSX that was polished and then treated with Shokar sealant. It is over 14 years old and has over 240,000k miles on the original engine.



Anthony

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

I think you just proved my point. Use what you like and quit the bitching.

Anthony Orosco

Exactly, although I did not mean for my post to be a put down of yours, as it may of come across.

Anthony

CLpower

Welcome to the board Anthony!!

Anthony Orosco

Well thank you

joerockt

Ah, well that make sense...Gotta follow Sal's instructions

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

Nope, none at all. I just get tired of people bitching about how hard Zaino is to use. I really just don't get all the drama.

DarkWraith33

Perhaps the Z bro's kick you back some $$$ since you seem WAY too upset when someone drops a line on Zaino... Take a deep breath. Apparently, drama is "catchy."

Seeing as other products of the same ilk as Zaino (i.e. Blackfire, Liquid Glass, NXT, etc...) have remarkably less "steps" to achieve results while following the instructions to the letter, coupled with the fact that most people here (correct me if I am wrong) are using these products to shine and protect their daily driver, I think it is a completely fair statement to say that Zaino, when following the directions , is indeed more difficult to use.

Adding cut stone using mortar to the side of your house is no better than adding vinyl siding for the most part (personal preferences aside), but it is certainly more difficult. Your house will look nicer and be well protected. A wise person here once said, "Opinions are like a$$holes, everyone's got one."

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

DW,

I started to write a long, drawn-out post but decided that it's really just wasted bandwidth.

Keep on believing.

DarkWraith33

I know, it's very hard to dispute clear, simple logic:

Blackfire: Clay, Polish, All Finish Paint Protection (Sounds simple huh)

NXT: Clay, Polish (get good base for the NXT), NXT (Not too bad...)

Zaino: The basic products you will need are Z1 or the new ZFX accelerator additive, Z2, Z5 (optional, but highly recommended), Z6 and Z7. (Hmmm... That's 5 products that they describe as the BASICS!... And oh crap, they left out the clay...)

SK2003TypeS

Yes, I QD'd with Meg's FI after washes in the above scenarios.
NXT on the car - wash with GC and QD with FI - slickness dropped off in a couple of weeks.
Zaino on the car - wash with GC and QD with FI - slickness is still there after weeks and weeks.

I'm starting to grow to like the NXT wash. Initially when I started using NXT wash, I didn't like it as much as GC. I noticed I use a slightly different ratio.

Nice to see another Autopian

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

See now you're just being ignorant.

The part you're missing for BF and NXT are:

polish.....wait two weeks......polish again because it's lost all its protection.....wait two more weeks......polish again.....see the pattern?

I Zaino maybe once every two months on my car and the water always beads. I went an entire NE winter without Zainoing and the water still beaded. Can you say the same for BF or NXT?

What 5 products? Zaino has three main steps:

1 - Mix ZFX with Z2Pro (wow that was a tough one) - reason for this is that ZFX is a curing agent and it would turn Z2Pro to a rock if it was incorporated into the bottle.
2 - Apply ZFX/Z2Pro
3 - Apply gloss enhancer as needed

Z5 is a swirl filler so it's not needed each time.
Z7 is the car wash - you do wash the car before you polish it don't you?

Maybe you need to get your facts straight next time.

DarkWraith33

My ignorance... with the Zaino process is equalled by your ignorance of the other products mentioned above...

Perhaps being a mod you've read my BF thread? ONE SINGLE COAT still going strong after months of Pgh rain and recent BALLZ OUT heat, so your 2 week thought process is inherently flawed. Shoot, even carnuba will do you up fine for 2 weeks under most situations. (Haven't used NXT so I'll have to leave that as is.) So yeah, I CAN say that about my BF. I've only reapplied a few places (hood) as a control to test the longevity of the product so I can come back here and report.... And note... I am not all emotional when someone dogs the product. I report, you decide...

Now, FWIW I did indeed go and read up on the Zaino site and somewhat familiarized myself with their product. (Along with what I've read here, which are mostly results based.) Perhaps their initial descriptions of what they consider basic are a lil overboard, but in reading more I do see that the "steps" needed minimally are basically the same. (minus the addition of a curing agent, allowing 24 hours between coats, being uber-careful to stretch the product thin enough to avoid streaks and long dry times....)

Perhaps we might just agree to disagree...

I am humble at your feet, our moderator...

NSXNEXT

iTrader: (2)

I have no problem when people dog Zaino, when they actually understand it's application process. I constantly read "Zaino sucks, it's too hard to apply, its too expensive, it streaks.... Wah wah wah

And :whocares: about my mod status? Did I ask you to kneel before Zod and kiss my Zaino-infused automobile?

Shawn S

I’ve tried many different products since I owned my first car back in 1985 and Zaino is by far the best.
Anyone who bashes it and says how difficult it is to apply simply doesn’t understand the system.
Sure if you analyze every product on their website you’re gonna get dazed and confused.
I have several different bottles on my shelf and I use only what is needed at the time.

It’s not worth wasting time typing any more for someone who has their mind made up against it.
Go to ANY car enthusiast website or local meet and the people with the best shine will be talking Zaino.

DarkWraith33

Perhaps spending all that time applying Zaino, properly and by the letter, allow you to work out all the anger management issues you have...



It's funny though, the more I do read, contrary to what I actually thought before, while the results for some end up great...

Zaino does seem to suck...

DarkWraith33

What's really funny is that NOWHERE... NOWHERE did I EVER say that Zaino did not produce the best results... From what I hear is that it DOES! You people read this stuff right?

You're right... Why bother to write more when the MODS don't read it/can't understand basic contextual english. (Oh but I will...)

I simply stated that the whole process seemed a bit much and went through why I thought that. This is a discussion board. God forbid someone go against what you feel so strongly in your heart regarding Zaino... People present opinions...

As MODS you should know that opinions are lilke a$$holes... Everyone has them... And they all STINK...


Today's lesson... Listen up children.

AlterZgo

Like the original poster, I think people just need to try Zaino before complaining that it is too hard to use. I respect what the original poster had to say, but I think he didn't need to do all those steps.

Honestly, it is really no more difficult than applying traditional wax. The good part is, it lasts a LOOOOONG time unlike traditional wax. So, in the long run, it is much easier to use b/c you don't have to apply it a million times. Of course there are those who love to layer many coats of Zaino on. For myself, I typically apply 2 coats of ZFX activated Z2 and that's pretty much it.

Before ZFX, Zaino was a bit of a pain to use b/c of the longer wait time. Now, it's just wash and clay bar the car (same steps regardless of what products you use), then apply the ZFX activated Z2 and buff off (just like you would do with wax or whatever other product you choose). You're done.

6 mos later, your car will still have that newly waxed shine. Mine does. I don't anticipate having to re-do the process until at least 1 yr.

Another problem people have w/ Zaino is that they simply use WAY too much. I can Zaino my TSX about 2 1/2 times w/ 1 oz. When people apply too much Zaino, it is much harder to remove. I typically use a damp applicator (spritzed w/ some Z6 or water) and apply 2 very light coats. So light that you can only barely see the haze at certain angles. When you do it properly like this, it is very easy to remove and it provides just as much protection as putting on heavy layers.

CLpower

hmm, while I agree zaino is a great product, your statement is not really the case.



I'm a wax nut, i haven't used zaino in over a year on any of the cars i've done. There is a reason for it. I simply don't find it to be the best. Sure it has it's uses. If I wanted a wax to last a long time it would be something I considered (although I have other products I think could give Zaino a close run for endurance; Megs #16 comes to mind). But I don't mind re-applying once a month; and frankly zaino doesn't give me close to the shine or pop I want out of my products. BUt as has been mentioned. No one is right on what is best, it's all up to interpretation. If it's for you, it is. But to claim it's the "best" bar none, etc; is just as ignorant as those that bitch about how hard it is to apply, etc.

Simply for me, zaino is best on light colored non metallics. It doesn't give the pop to metallics I get from other products (p21s, natty's paste, NXT, etc) and doesn't provide the debth I want on dark colors.

But if it's for you and you like it, no one is right in telling you that you are wrong. "find something you like and use it often"

CLpower

Zaino does NOT require any more effort then any other product should, frankly IMO it requires less. It's all in the prep.

Hawhyen51

Beautifully stated! The bottom line is if you're happy with the results of the products you use, be it Zaino, BF, Klasse, Pinnacle or whatever, then all is good. Thank You CLpower for your putting it in perspective.

AlterZgo

I think everyone's in agreement that people should use what they like.

With that said, the misinformation about Zaino pertains to its alleged difficulty of use. As CLpower, myself and NSXNEXT has stated, it requires no more work than using any other wax or wax like product.

I have no problems w/ people saying other products give better results than Zaino. But, I will dispute all claims that indicate Zaino is hard or complicated to use because it just isn't the case.

DarkWraith33

I'll certainly buy that... While Zaino doesn't necassarily market to the masses, a slightly more more clear instructions page and product names would do alot to perhaps remove that "Zaino seems harder to use" persona and possibly increases sales for those guys... More $$$ for them = better products for everyone. They need a marketing guy...

Winterwaves

Yeah, I'd agree with that. The numbering system is weird, for one thing. For my car, it boils down to:

Step 1. Use #7.
Step 2. Use #18.
Step 3. Use either #2 or #5, depending on whether you have swirls or not (and now which one removes swirls again? I forget...oh yeah, #5). Oh, and mix these with ZFX, whatever that is (can't tell by the name, that's for sure).
Step 4. Use #6.
Step 5. Use #8.

Yeah, that'll be easy for Joe Schmoe walking into Pep Boys or Kragen to understand.

joerockt

Maybe Zaino isnt for dumb fucking people?

I get it...If its that hard for your, seriously, just stick with turtle wax

Winterwaves

It's not hard for me. I was just making a comment on the marketing of the product to the masses, though.

Marketing 101: Don't make things more confusing than they have to be. Make sure your customer clearly knows what the product does, and in what order they need to be used. Provide clear instructions. Give the customer a clear idea of the benefits of your product over the competition. If you have two very similar products (say, Z-2 and Z-5), or a product that is only used in conjunction with another product (like ZFX), make sure that the customer understands the differences and knows how things fit together and what to purchase for what. In other words, make it, yes, "user friendly." And then market the heck out of it.

Otherwise, you just end up with the enthusiasts that can take the time to figure it out, and a whole other sector of missed potential customers that end up thinking "this is confusing" or "this is too much work" or "What's the difference betwen this product and this other product that they offer?" and end up just saying the heck with it and, yes, buying Turtle Wax instead. BTW, that doesn't make them stupid. It's just simple marketing rules.

DarkWraith33

Well stated....

DarkWraith33

This guy must be dumb er sumtin... He likes the Turtle Wax...

http://reviews.autopia.org/censura.p...ils&itemid=456

And all those new turtle wax commercials... Now they got some marketing peeps...

SK2003TypeS

well said.

A properly prepped car will probably look good with Miracle whip as an LSP.

CLPower....your avatar....

joerockt

First off, what makes you think that Sal Zaino wants to market to the casual shopper in WalMart?

The casual Walmart shopper would never 1) Wash to strip wax 2) Lube and clay their car 3) Wash car again 4) Dry Car 5) Apply first layer 6) apply second layer 7) Buff 8) apply wax.

The casual Walmart shopper would grab a bottle of Turtle Wax, wash car, throw on wax and call it a day. So, even if Zaino was numbered sequentially in the order you should use the product, you would have Walmart shoppers scratching their head, wondering why they need all these products when they can just grab a bottle of turtle wax. I used to be one of those people, but the reason I changed my habits was because of the forums and the experences of other people. Can that knowledge and info be conveyed at a kiosk in Walmart? Maybe...Would the Walmart customer give a shit? Probably not...

Zaino is marketed to enthusiasts, and YES it is "too much work", but thats the point! I do a full detail on my car every 6 months, so no matter what products I use, its going to be "too much work". The casual Walmart shopper isnt intrested in this.

And while I agree the #scheme should be different, it took me all of about 5 mins to figure out what I needed. So I guess if you dont know the process of a properly detailed car, the yes, it would be confusing and thus, Zaino isnt marketed to those people...

joerockt

"Autopians beware, joe six-pack will narrow the gap in how the cars look."

CLpower

well the big problem is, none of the other companies really state what is needed for a proper surface prep. Only zaino really touches on that


Even TW needs proper prep