Royal Purple motor oil...HOT DAMN!
07-08-2011, 03:00 PM
#41
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my aunt had gotten a brand new honda accord back in 1998 and to baby her she was putting premium fuel in the car....just to get shitty gas mileage...
after couple months she called honda and asked them the reason, they asked her to put regular oil and see the difference....after going thro 1-2 tanks on regular the gas mileage went up and stayed there....
when she took it in for the next service and mentioned this incident the mechanic said "the engines are tuned for regular gas, but pumping in premium you are wasting money on the gas and reducing you mileage"....
I was a kid back then and didnt care much about the issue but the incident stuck in my head....
07-08-2011, 03:13 PM
#42
Senior Moderator
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I'm just fine using a Dino.
Another oil thread
Another oil thread
07-08-2011, 03:16 PM
#43
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and when i got a notification of the you posting, I was like "crap, here comes the ban hammer" LOL
07-08-2011, 03:24 PM
#44
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^ to be honest- everyone has been quite civil here. No need to warn or ban anyone.
07-08-2011, 04:06 PM
#45
funny I have had an almost first hand experience....
my aunt had gotten a brand new honda accord back in 1998 and to baby her she was putting premium fuel in the car....just to get shitty gas mileage...
after couple months she called honda and asked them the reason, they asked her to put regular oil and see the difference....after going thro 1-2 tanks on regular the gas mileage went up and stayed there....
when she took it in for the next service and mentioned this incident the mechanic said "the engines are tuned for regular gas, but pumping in premium you are wasting money on the gas and reducing you mileage"....
I was a kid back then and didnt care much about the issue but the incident stuck in my head....
my aunt had gotten a brand new honda accord back in 1998 and to baby her she was putting premium fuel in the car....just to get shitty gas mileage...
after couple months she called honda and asked them the reason, they asked her to put regular oil and see the difference....after going thro 1-2 tanks on regular the gas mileage went up and stayed there....
when she took it in for the next service and mentioned this incident the mechanic said "the engines are tuned for regular gas, but pumping in premium you are wasting money on the gas and reducing you mileage"....
I was a kid back then and didnt care much about the issue but the incident stuck in my head....
Use of higher octane fuel- Let's look at the increase in fuel economy question first. The plain and simple answer is absolutely not, higher octane gas does not effect fuel economy at all. The octane number is a rating that has nothing to do with how efficient it is in moving your car.
The octane rating of gasoline is a relative number showing the amount of isooctane in the gasoline as opposed to the amount of heptane in the gasoline. To make it simple, the octane rating is a representation of how much energy it takes to ignite that gasoline. This octane measurement does not indicate the amount of energy the gasoline produces, which would be an indicator of fuel economy. The final answer is:octane rating and increased fuel economy have no relationship whatsoever!
Does premium gas make your car run better? Once again the simple answer is no, there is no increase in a cars performance with premium gas.
Last edited by Turbonut; 07-08-2011 at 04:09 PM.
07-08-2011, 04:44 PM
#46
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so what gas do you use in your TL ?
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
07-08-2011, 05:35 PM
#47
Senior Moderator
Maybe your Aunt used premium because she took the car to the strip, but you'll find no difference in fuel mileage between grades with the same driving techniques.
Use of higher octane fuel- Let's look at the increase in fuel economy question first. The plain and simple answer is absolutely not, higher octane gas does not effect fuel economy at all. The octane number is a rating that has nothing to do with how efficient it is in moving your car.
The octane rating of gasoline is a relative number showing the amount of isooctane in the gasoline as opposed to the amount of heptane in the gasoline. To make it simple, the octane rating is a representation of how much energy it takes to ignite that gasoline. This octane measurement does not indicate the amount of energy the gasoline produces, which would be an indicator of fuel economy. The final answer is:octane rating and increased fuel economy have no relationship whatsoever!
Does premium gas make your car run better? Once again the simple answer is no, there is no increase in a cars performance with premium gas.
Use of higher octane fuel- Let's look at the increase in fuel economy question first. The plain and simple answer is absolutely not, higher octane gas does not effect fuel economy at all. The octane number is a rating that has nothing to do with how efficient it is in moving your car.
The octane rating of gasoline is a relative number showing the amount of isooctane in the gasoline as opposed to the amount of heptane in the gasoline. To make it simple, the octane rating is a representation of how much energy it takes to ignite that gasoline. This octane measurement does not indicate the amount of energy the gasoline produces, which would be an indicator of fuel economy. The final answer is:octane rating and increased fuel economy have no relationship whatsoever!
Does premium gas make your car run better? Once again the simple answer is no, there is no increase in a cars performance with premium gas.
A car's engine works on combustion in a controlled manner. A gas with a lower octane rating will ignite more easily and can prematurely ignite before the piston reaches it top position causing knocking and engine damage, especially on HIGH COMPRESSION MOTORS like OURS!!
The car's ECU will sense this damage and retard the timing of the motor to stop the damage from occurring. When it does this the car will naturally produce less power while still consuming the same amount of gas to maintain the fuel to air ratio.
BUT if you use the octane that the manufacturer recommends, like in the TL you use 91/92/93 the timing is not retarded (in most cases unless there are other circumstances) and you get full power and the best fuel efficiency. By putting premium into a car that has a recommendation of regular, you aren't really getting any better gas mileage since the compression is going to be lower and there will be little chance for damage.
so what gas do you use in your TL ?
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
07-08-2011, 06:33 PM
#48
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^^^ thanks for the explanation AJ....yeah i asked those questions to prove my point since I could explain my point like you did....
07-08-2011, 06:35 PM
#49
I see what your trying to say but it's a bit incorrect. Octane and Fuel economy have a DIRECT relationship in many modern cars.
A car's engine works on combustion in a controlled manner. A gas with a lower octane rating will ignite more easily and can prematurely ignite before the piston reaches it top position causing knocking and engine damage, especially on HIGH COMPRESSION MOTORS like OURS!!
The car's ECU will sense this damage and retard the timing of the motor to stop the damage from occurring. When it does this the car will naturally produce less power while still consuming the same amount of gas to maintain the fuel to air ratio.
BUT if you use the octane that the manufacturer recommends, like in the TL you use 91/92/93 the timing is not retarded (in most cases unless there are other circumstances) and you get full power and the best fuel efficiency. By putting premium into a car that has a recommendation of regular, you aren't really getting any better gas mileage since the compression is going to be lower and there will be little chance for damage.
In short using 87 or 89 can damage the motor in the TL over time because of the knocking. Besides that you will be getting worse gas mileage and actually spend more money in gas!
A car's engine works on combustion in a controlled manner. A gas with a lower octane rating will ignite more easily and can prematurely ignite before the piston reaches it top position causing knocking and engine damage, especially on HIGH COMPRESSION MOTORS like OURS!!
The car's ECU will sense this damage and retard the timing of the motor to stop the damage from occurring. When it does this the car will naturally produce less power while still consuming the same amount of gas to maintain the fuel to air ratio.
BUT if you use the octane that the manufacturer recommends, like in the TL you use 91/92/93 the timing is not retarded (in most cases unless there are other circumstances) and you get full power and the best fuel efficiency. By putting premium into a car that has a recommendation of regular, you aren't really getting any better gas mileage since the compression is going to be lower and there will be little chance for damage.
In short using 87 or 89 can damage the motor in the TL over time because of the knocking. Besides that you will be getting worse gas mileage and actually spend more money in gas!
funny I have had an almost first hand experience....
my aunt had gotten a brand new honda accord back in 1998 and to baby her she was putting premium fuel in the car....just to get shitty gas mileage...after couple months she called honda and asked them the reason, they asked her to put regular fuel in and see the difference....after going thro 1-2 tanks on regular the gas mileage went up and stayed there....
my aunt had gotten a brand new honda accord back in 1998 and to baby her she was putting premium fuel in the car....just to get shitty gas mileage...after couple months she called honda and asked them the reason, they asked her to put regular fuel in and see the difference....after going thro 1-2 tanks on regular the gas mileage went up and stayed there....
07-08-2011, 06:43 PM
#50
Senior Moderator
07-09-2011, 02:06 PM
#51
Senior Moderator
If you read the post by swoosh:
My reply was that the use of higher octane fuels used in a vehicle that had a regular or 87 octane recommendation, as did his Aunt’s ’98 Accord, would see no difference in fuel mileage if premium were to be used. There was never any intent or any part of the reply that would lead one to believe that a vehicle that had a premium recommendation would be able to survive and maintain the same mileage when using a lesser octane fuel. We can't get any higher octane fuel than premium unless one wants to use race or aviation fuel.
My reply was that the use of higher octane fuels used in a vehicle that had a regular or 87 octane recommendation, as did his Aunt’s ’98 Accord, would see no difference in fuel mileage if premium were to be used. There was never any intent or any part of the reply that would lead one to believe that a vehicle that had a premium recommendation would be able to survive and maintain the same mileage when using a lesser octane fuel. We can't get any higher octane fuel than premium unless one wants to use race or aviation fuel.
I haven't seen any of those UOA's... If you PM me a link or something so I can read up on it?
07-09-2011, 05:36 PM
#54
Unless you pay extra for synthetic, then we have Acura synthetic or Mobil 1.
07-09-2011, 06:19 PM
#55
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With octane ratings don't use more then is required & don't use less. Using more is a waste of money & using less will decrease performance, mileage & could damage the engine if the knock sensor is slow or dead.
Any oil that meets the required SAE spec is good to go. I use Mobil 1 but in reality its overkill, but I tend to overrun the change interval & it makes me feel better if I do..
Any oil that meets the required SAE spec is good to go. I use Mobil 1 but in reality its overkill, but I tend to overrun the change interval & it makes me feel better if I do..
07-10-2011, 10:12 PM
#56
Team Owner
Realistically, since the TL's engine is fully electronically controlled, would it even be possible to tell if it runs any differently after an oil change? I personally think not.
I use the M1 5W-20 EP by the way (I guess it gives me peace of mind, but dino oil would work just as well).
Said another way, the absolute crappiest oil available now is still better than the best oil of 10 years ago (assuming it follows the SAE standard at present).
I use the M1 5W-20 EP by the way (I guess it gives me peace of mind, but dino oil would work just as well).
Said another way, the absolute crappiest oil available now is still better than the best oil of 10 years ago (assuming it follows the SAE standard at present).
Whether a change in operation is noticed when switching to a different oil is high questionable, but why the big deal over the use of Royal Purple? Oil is oil as long as it has the recommended API service designation and changed on schedule.
All the RP HP oils are GF-5 and SN approved for 2010-2011 gasoline vehicles:
0-20
5-20
5-30
10-30
Even the Long Rider 15-40 is not only approved for vehicles through 2010 with a SM rating, but also approved for diesel applications CJ-4
RP 10-40 and 5-40 are SM approved <2010
I'd steer clear of the Long Rider 5-20 and 5-30 as they are SL approved for 2004 and older vehicles.
As I said before, save money and use Dino oil that's on sale, e.g. Formula Shell from BJ's, $1.92/qt, SN GF-5 rating and I load up on it whenever on sale.
All the RP HP oils are GF-5 and SN approved for 2010-2011 gasoline vehicles:
0-20
5-20
5-30
10-30
Even the Long Rider 15-40 is not only approved for vehicles through 2010 with a SM rating, but also approved for diesel applications CJ-4
RP 10-40 and 5-40 are SM approved <2010
I'd steer clear of the Long Rider 5-20 and 5-30 as they are SL approved for 2004 and older vehicles.
As I said before, save money and use Dino oil that's on sale, e.g. Formula Shell from BJ's, $1.92/qt, SN GF-5 rating and I load up on it whenever on sale.
I get what I paid for, a GF-5 SN Dino oil for less than 2 bucks a qt. In the millions of miles I've driven, never used a synthetic and never an engine lubrication problem, not even with the Turbo rotary (15-40 Shell Rotella). This isn't to say that a synthetic isn't valuable in a harsh environment, extremely low/high but for us Jersey people Dino will do and save me a great amount of money over time, especially with the 4 cars that are presently in the household. Do the math and see the difference, something like putting premium in a car that calls for regular, will it hurt, no, but it certainly will cost more in the end, no doubt about that.
so what gas do you use in your TL ?
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
what difference does 87 and 93 make ? it doesnt hurt anything to use 87 in the TL engine which demands 91/93....if there is no difference then why is it listed to use 91/93 ?
PS: dont take my questions personally....trying to learn here...
UOAs are absolutely 100% worthless in determining wear. Ignore wear metals and concentrate on other aspects of a UOA. I've posted in detail why the standard UOA won't detect significant wear but can pick up oxidation as wear and give a false report. Mobil One was thought to have an iron wearing problem and it turned out to be the UOA picking up oxidation the Mobil was cleaning. Redline also turns in terrible UOAs at first due to the cleaning but it consistently has the least amount of wear during my tear downs than anything else. A particle count is the only way to get an indication of wear. Let's just say 3 times in a row, UOAs in no way even remotely matched up to my teardowns.
07-10-2011, 10:55 PM
#57
Burning Brakes
so then it did good according to this just overpriced.....
07-12-2011, 09:36 PM
#59
Team Owner
The load bearing test in that article was originally designed to test grease. It has no bearing on how an oil performs in an engine. It's been shown that bleach will do better in that test than most oils. I wouldn't put any weight into that test.
09-28-2011, 02:55 PM
#60
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Hi,
I work at a Goodyear and I hear a lot of different opinions about motor oil. I currently have Penn Platinum in my TL but I'm considering the M1 EP. I'm at 75k is it worth changing brands?
I work at a Goodyear and I hear a lot of different opinions about motor oil. I currently have Penn Platinum in my TL but I'm considering the M1 EP. I'm at 75k is it worth changing brands?
09-28-2011, 04:48 PM
#61
While M1 EP is comparable to Pennzoil Ultra.
You'll be good with any of them. It doesn't matter what mileage your at, If you want to try out a new oil then give it a shot.
09-28-2011, 07:45 PM
#62
Instructor
I don't have an issue with the OP's excitement over changing to RP. I was using PP 5w20 for several runs and caught RP 5w30 on sale for around $4.50/qt at NAPA. I changed to that and it made the valvetrain much quieter and a smoother feeling engine. (Note: I just remembered a ran bit of seafoam in the oil right before the change so maybe it was attributed to that, although I do not recommend doing this, I was ignorant at the time.) I used RP 5w20 in the next OCI and didn't notice any improvement. Next I will run Redline 5w20 for comparison.
09-28-2011, 09:34 PM
#63
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