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On my '04 TL with only 35K miles, should I replace water pump & timing belt?

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On my '04 TL with only 35K miles, should I replace water pump & timing belt?

 
Old 07-10-2019, 05:46 PM
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On my '04 TL with only 35K miles, should I replace water pump & timing belt?

I have a 2004 Acura TL with only 35,000 miles; should I replace my water pump and timing belt which is recommended at 100,000 miles or 7 years? I'm over twice the time but less than half the miles for that recommendation. The engine runs perfectly with no unusual sounds or performance issues.

Thank you,
Pete
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Old 07-10-2019, 06:17 PM
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Old 07-10-2019, 06:30 PM
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How likely do you think it would be that the water pump and/or timing belt would fail if I didn't replace it? Very likely, somewhat likely or not very likely?

Thanks again,
Pete
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Old 07-10-2019, 06:33 PM
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rubber deteriorates over time. Plus the timing belt tensioner begins to leak and fail.

15 years is impressive but I would replace it now if i were in your shoes
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Old 07-10-2019, 07:23 PM
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Originally Posted by peter7654 View Post
I'm over twice the time but less than half the miles for that recommendation.
Having done this maintenance on my CL-S6 at 105K, years ago, the belt and components looked new as I removed them. I gave them a quick look, and then without hesitation, proceeded to promptly throw them in the trash. They served their 'useful life' and it was time to replace them, end of story. No second guessing.

Originally Posted by peter7654 View Post
Very likely
Why risk it on such a nice car.

Shop the Aisin TKF-004 timing belt kit on the internet, find a local Acura/Honda specialty shop in your area to do the install, save money over what the dealership would charge. Easy Peasy!

Last edited by zeta; 07-10-2019 at 07:29 PM.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:01 PM
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Originally Posted by peter7654 View Post
I have a 2004 Acura TL with only 35,000 miles; should I replace my water pump and timing belt which is recommended at 100,000 miles or 7 years? I'm over twice the time but less than half the miles for that recommendation. The engine runs perfectly with no unusual sounds or performance issues.

Thank you,
Pete
What gives you the opinion Honda/Acura recommends 100,000-miles or 7-years? I ask because as far as I know all 3G TLs have a standard service requirement of 105,000 miles with no time limit.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:10 PM
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No time limit? Thought it was 105k or 7 years.

If there any documentation online to support this?

Would love to know because the 2007 TL-S6 is on original timing belt.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:17 PM
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60k mile intervals if you live in extreme hot/cold climate.

Otherwise no time limit, and 105k mile intervals.
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Old 07-10-2019, 08:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Saving4aTL View Post
No time limit? Thought it was 105k or 7 years.

If there any documentation online to support this?

Would love to know because the 2007 TL-S6 is on original timing belt.
Check your Owner's Manual, it is quite specific.
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Old 07-10-2019, 09:16 PM
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Lots of good ideas guys, thank you! I forgot to mention that I'm retired now and only drive 300 miles per year. So I might just take my chances and if the worst happens I can always give the car to charity and save myself from having to trade it in when I go new vehicle shopping.
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Old 07-10-2019, 10:01 PM
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Is it a manual and from a non-salt state? If so, I’m charity.
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Old 07-11-2019, 12:38 AM
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Originally Posted by peter7654 View Post
I have a 2004 Acura TL with only 35,000 miles; should I replace my water pump and timing belt which is recommended at 100,000 miles or 7 years? I'm over twice the time but less than half the miles for that recommendation. The engine runs perfectly with no unusual sounds or performance issues.

Thank you,
Pete
When i purchased my 2007 Acura tl type s this year with 102000km i did the timing belt and waterpump replacement which had never been done. The belt was in insane condition no visible sign of cracking or any junks missing. It was difficult to tell the difference between the old one and the new one. The auto tensioner on the other hand was leaking the oil or whatever fluid was inside of it. In my opinion the tensioner will go bad before the belt or waterpump will.

Last edited by MATT2816; 07-11-2019 at 12:44 AM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 04:37 AM
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Originally Posted by peter7654 View Post
I have a 2004 Acura TL with only 35,000 miles; should I replace my water pump and timing belt which is recommended at 100,000 miles or 7 years? I'm over twice the time but less than half the miles for that recommendation. The engine runs perfectly with no unusual sounds or performance issues.

Thank you,
Pete
Have you ever changed out the coolant? If not, your best bet is to go ahead and do the service with a new timing belt, water pump, tensioners and new accessory belt. Rubber dries out as it ages and can crack. Plus coolant can damage the engine if it isn't swapped out on a regular basis. (CORROSION) and it's why brake fluid needs to be replaced every 2-3 years. You won't need spark plugs or valve adjustment as your mileage is low. Your tires should be checked for dry rot also!
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:48 AM
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I'm and old guy also, but sometimes the logic that I see is somewhat troublesome.
Guess what I'm trying to say is why would one defer the $1000 repair and wait for the belt to go, destroy the valves,
donate the car, then look for something else to buy that is certainly going to cost more than $1000, not to mention the aggravation?
We all know the belt's life will not be infinity, but at what time will it decide to let go, couldn't venture a guess, but our '04 was
changed after 14 years and it looked new, but I say change the belt etc. and be done with it.

Did have a car that had a belt let go after 21 years, but it wasn't a timing belt, just one of four belts at the front of the engine,
but happened to be the one that drove the water pump. Didn't realize that they were on there that long and actually, once
again, the belt looked new, no cracks etc, just split and no damage, just got all four new belts and did an install.
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Old 07-11-2019, 07:04 AM
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Because Peter is RICH!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:09 AM
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You can take a chance like "The Goose" in the problems & fixes forum, who recently just blew up his engine because his timing belt snapped. See picture in that thread.

https://acurazine.com/forums/3g-tl-p...ptions-980813/

If you live in the snow belt then you should change it. I don't understand the logic either, of not taking care of a car properly then, explode, dump, and spend over 20k again buying another decent one. It obviously costs way more than a timing belt job. It's not so much the belt that goes, it's the hydraulic tensioner that fails over time due to hydraylic fluid leaking out of it, loosening up the belt causing it to jump teeth on the cam gears.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:44 AM
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There are many YouTube videos on how to DIY. $185 for the gates/Aisin kit on amazon is the total for a complete timing belt job.
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Old 07-11-2019, 09:33 AM
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Originally Posted by Saving4aTL View Post
There are many YouTube videos on how to DIY. $185 for the gates/Aisin kit on amazon is the total for a complete timing belt job.
The Aisin kit is reasonably priced, but it doesn't come with a front main seal as well as cam seals; for that reason alone I'd rather buy the Honda kit.
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Old 07-11-2019, 01:35 PM
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What is the difference in price?

Could the cam and front main seal we purchased separate from the kit?
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Old 07-11-2019, 01:37 PM
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Yup, I figured it out a year or so ago; I think buying ala-cart saves a few dollars; I don't remember the price difference being significant.
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Old 07-11-2019, 05:00 PM
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My TL is pretty low mileage (06, 50k miles) also and I had the timing belt and water pump replaced last year. While the belt itself looked fine the water pump was actually starting to leak very slightly.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:06 PM
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There is no such thing as a "Honda kit". Honda kit is what people put together on Ebay. You also don't need the cam seals, they don't hardly ever leak at all. Changing cam seals requires cam gear holding tool and knowledge of dialing in timing while you take the cam gears off. I just did my 3rd timing belt job at 305k miles, they are still not leaking. I did reseal the oil pump because it was leaking BAD. And the crank seal, since the entire oil pump needs to come off to do that job. If anything, the "Honda kit" should consist of oil pump seal, front crank seal, (leave out the 2 cam seals), tensioner pulley, hydraulic tensioner, idler pulley, water pump, timing belt, thermostat, 2 gallons of Honda OEM type-II blue coolant, a tube of Permatex Ultra Grey, 6 Denso Iridium long life or Denso Iridium IK20 power plugs, and a new serpentine belt. That's all the parts I used.
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Old 07-11-2019, 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted by Saving4aTL View Post


60k mile intervals if you live in extreme hot/cold climate....
Nope. 60K mile intervals if you drive REGULARLY in those conditions, which rules out any location in North America....

Originally Posted by Saving4aTL View Post
Otherwise no time limit, and 105k mile intervals.
MID indicating a "4" is the only think listed in the SM or OM....No time limit, no mileage limit
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:30 PM
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Originally Posted by t-rd View Post
There is no such thing as a "Honda kit". Honda kit is what people put together on Ebay. You also don't need the cam seals, they don't hardly ever leak at all. Changing cam seals requires cam gear holding tool and knowledge of dialing in timing while you take the cam gears off. I just did my 3rd timing belt job at 305k miles, they are still not leaking. I did reseal the oil pump because it was leaking BAD. And the crank seal, since the entire oil pump needs to come off to do that job. If anything, the "Honda kit" should consist of oil pump seal, front crank seal, (leave out the 2 cam seals), tensioner pulley, hydraulic tensioner, idler pulley, water pump, timing belt, thermostat, 2 gallons of Honda OEM type-II blue coolant, a tube of Permatex Ultra Grey, 6 Denso Iridium long life or Denso Iridium IK20 power plugs, and a new serpentine belt. That's all the parts I used.
Not sure where you're getting your information, but both of my J-Series engines started leaking from the cam seals between 130,000 and 150,000 miles, and based on lots and lots of comments both here and on other Honda/Acura related forums, I am not the only one with leaking cam seals.

Last edited by horseshoez; 07-11-2019 at 08:32 PM.
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Old 07-11-2019, 08:44 PM
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Originally Posted by t-rd View Post
There is no such thing as a "Honda kit". Honda kit is what people put together on Ebay. You also don't need the cam seals, they don't hardly ever leak at all. Changing cam seals requires cam gear holding tool and knowledge of dialing in timing while you take the cam gears off. I just did my 3rd timing belt job at 305k miles, they are still not leaking. I did reseal the oil pump because it was leaking BAD. And the crank seal, since the entire oil pump needs to come off to do that job. If anything, the "Honda kit" should consist of oil pump seal, front crank seal, (leave out the 2 cam seals), tensioner pulley, hydraulic tensioner, idler pulley, water pump, timing belt, thermostat, 2 gallons of Honda OEM type-II blue coolant, a tube of Permatex Ultra Grey, 6 Denso Iridium long life or Denso Iridium IK20 power plugs, and a new serpentine belt. That's all the parts I used.
most of the ebay kits that say HONDA on them are fakes, a few threads with bad waterpump pictures....
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Old 07-12-2019, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by horseshoez View Post
Not sure where you're getting your information, but both of my J-Series engines started leaking from the cam seals between 130,000 and 150,000 miles, and based on lots and lots of comments both here and on other Honda/Acura related forums, I am not the only one with leaking cam seals.
I'm getting my information from my own engine. I have zero leak around the cam seals. I have 305k miles and 12 years on my AV6 J engine. You need to worry about the rear main seal and the oil pump seal like I said. I worked on this just 2 months ago for 2 weeks, serious oil pump leak, soaking down to the a/c compressor.

And that's not a "Honda Kit", it is a kit by APSG (like everyone else that put it together), stated "Genuine/OEM" fits. Also the OEM Honda crankshaft seal is in the color black, it is not brown or orange. I just put one on and still have the original plastic bag. And that's not the OEM Honda water pump, it is an Aisin water pump. Aisin was the water pump supplier, but the OEM water pump is now made by Yamada Japan. I have pictures of Aisin and OEM water pumps side by side if you need them, I still have both physical pumps in my garage. The OEM water pump still has the highest quality. This kit you listed is under $300 because aftermarket parts are used.

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Old 07-12-2019, 08:55 AM
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Originally Posted by t-rd View Post
I'm getting my information from my own engine. I have zero leak around the cam seals. I have 305k miles and 12 years on my AV6 J engine. You need to worry about the rear main seal and the oil pump seal like I said. I worked on this just 2 months ago for 2 weeks, serious oil pump leak, soaking down to the a/c compressor.
Okay, one engine, we have another member engine here as well with over 300,000 miles on the original cam seals; that makes two. That said, over the last number of years I've heard reports of literally dozens of J-Series engines leaking past the oil seals. Yes, there may be the occasional outlier, but as a general rule, the seals will leak well before the second timing belt service; in my experience and those of other members here, typically by 150,000 miles.

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Old 07-12-2019, 11:40 AM
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Oil pump seal leak, taken 2 months ago. Black all over to the right side of the pump. No drip of oil down from the cam area. Also a picture of OEM crankshaft seal after I inserted it. The OEM crankshaft seal is black in color, not brown or orange as the aftermarket ones. The kit you posted above most likely has aftermarket seals re-sealed into plastic bags with fake Honda stickers. Finally a picture of a real vs. fake Honda thermostat. Real OEM one is on the left, fake one on the right looks way weaker than the OEM one.





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Old 07-12-2019, 12:48 PM
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Ha, are you somehow suggesting Amazon is selling counterfeit Honda parts? Geez, for some reason I'm betting you're wrong.
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Old 07-12-2019, 06:03 PM
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Originally Posted by horseshoez View Post
Ha, are you somehow suggesting Amazon is selling counterfeit Honda parts? Geez, for some reason I'm betting you're wrong.
amazon doesn't buy directly though Honda, it's very possible they sent boxes of fake products.

I've gotten fake perfumes and other knockoffs both though amazon directly and 3rd party sellers. Same with ebay, my buddy got fake NGK spark plugs that trashed his civic motor. The print on the NGK was off by a lot. They were listed on amazon and I contacted amazon to remove the listing since they were selling fakes.
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Old 07-12-2019, 06:20 PM
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You don't have to believe me, if you don't want to. Go and find reviews of Aisin TKH002 on Amazon, there were indeed people that received counterfeit parts, counterfeit Aisin parts. There are many 3rd party vendors on Amazon, that's not of Amazon directly. There are actually parts sold on Amazon, the seller shown as "Honda". I spoke to my local Honda dealer directly, at the counter, there is no such thing as a Honda store on Amazon. Honda sells parts directly online privately dealer by dealer, they source parts from Honda's local warehouses or directly from Marysville, Ohio. You don't know what you are buying until you get a counterfeit part, just like I did. Your "Honda kit" is sold by APSG with mixed parts from Bando, Aisin, and FelPro, that is not Honda. FelPro's cam seals are brown/orange, I know, because I have a set in my garage. Honda OEM cam seals are made by NOK and they are black in color.
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Old 07-12-2019, 06:33 PM
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Sorry guys, I strongly suggest counterfeit products will not last very long on Amazon's site; they wouldn't willingly open themselves up to the inevitable law suits.
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Old 07-12-2019, 06:45 PM
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Originally Posted by horseshoez View Post
Sorry guys, I strongly suggest counterfeit products will not last very long on Amazon's site; they wouldn't willingly open themselves up to the inevitable law suits.
All this counterfeit talk now has me thinking if forum member 'losiglow' truly purchased an OEM axle, recently from Amazon, as he believes:

Originally Posted by losiglow View Post
I pulled the trigger on the drivers side. Got an OEM for $110 after a $60 gift card on Amazon. Be here Friday, I'll swap it out on Saturday
Post #22 on this thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/third-g...enance-980843/
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Old 07-12-2019, 07:42 PM
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Originally Posted by zeta View Post
All this counterfeit talk now has me thinking if forum member 'losiglow' truly purchased an OEM axle, recently from Amazon, as he believes:



Post #22 on this thread: https://acurazine.com/forums/third-g...enance-980843/
I searched Amazon and didn't see even a single axle claiming to be Acura/Honda OEM axles.
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Old 07-12-2019, 08:57 PM
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OP sounds like he's hot a sweet whip!
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Old 07-13-2019, 02:38 PM
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You all have convinced me to get a new timing belt, water pump, tensioners and accessory belt. I've had the coolant and brake fluid replaced on a regular basis so that should be OK. Thanks again for all the thoughtful comments. (Pete)
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