cherishzm

Hello all,

I bought a used 04 TL AT with 49k miles about a month ago from a old gentleman who said he usually pumped 89 octane gas (mid-grade in this area) in it and at that time I did not think it would do too much harm to the car other than some loss of power, but I'm just kinda got worried after reading some posts.

I own 05 Odyssey which I believe uses the same engine and when I drive the TL, I feel the gas pedal is little heavier and it takes more effort to feel the power of 270hp engine. Is this typical for TL's? The Odyssey is much heavier but the gas pedal is light and I feel it has little more power. It might be just my feeling.

Is there something that I can do at this point? Will fuel system or injector cleaning or doing other stuff help?

Thanks!

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

You'll find the Odyssey has the 3.5 low compression V6 that runs on 87. The 89 in the TL won't cause any long term problems, so when the tank gets near empty, just fill it up with premium and you'll be good to go.

TheChamp531

iTrader: (3)

It would also be good to do a Seafoam treatment as it could have buildup in the fuel injection system. Just for peace of mind. Also, check the DIY Seafoam thread about it.

GL with car and check around the 3G garage and forums to make your car better performance and exterior wise.

Welcome to Acurazine!

01tl4tl

just add a bottle of redline fuel cleaner or a can of seafoam to half a tank of gas
That will get most of it for you

Do the intake vac port method of seafoam- or use bg or wynss honda gm- I dont want to discriminate against any of the good brands~
its really easy DIY and restores like new performance to any car, truck, lawn mower- yes I use seafoam in the mower gas to act as a storage stabilzer, and cleaner once added to tank

Then stick with 91- Teir 1 quality gas is preferred- most name brands are certified to that standard- it has twice the amont of cleaners added to the gas than the govt minimums that all gas must carry--helps to keep things clean
10% Ethanol added to gas is to blame for much of the crud left behind in combustion these days...

NAiL05

As mentioned everyone gives good tips. The reason why the old man said he ran 89 just fine is prob because he never even pushed the pedal all the way down once owning the car.

ballerjai

Hmm, if there isn't a problem with 89, I would stick with it unless you drive pretty hard, then I'd recommend going 91.

I would tell you to seafoam, but I never done it myself yet.

Majofo

Sometimes when I'm feeling backed up.. I pour some seafoam on my bran flakes and it works! I just let it seep a bit and then fume it out! BOOM!! lol....

I would definitely use premium petro (+91) from a tier 1 gas station only.. timing is pulled even on 93...

01tl4tl

baller- you must have a year/15 on it by now- lets seafoam that thing so you know!!

I would like to see you drive it in The City on 87-89 pingpingping,,sound like a cable car

The manual says 91- not,, 89 if you dont drive it hard

94eg!

It's really hard to believe how cheap some people are. The price difference in running 89 vs 91 is $1.40 on a 14 gallon fillup.

$1.40 PEOPLE!!!

My wife still thinks it cost a lot to fillup the TL. Eventhough it gets 31mpg on 91 octane vs her 22mpg on 87 octane in her Element. I've tried explaining it to her multiple times that the TL is cheaper.

Majofo

ttribe

Well done....

Clean>Rice

i wish i got 31 mpg on my TL...................my trip computer says 24

ttribe

Sounds like you are in a lot of stop and go traffic...24 is about what I get when I have a mix of open freeway driving, with some stop and go mixed in. Recently, I had to drive to a town about 100 miles outside of Phoenix for a meeting and hit 33 on the mpg.

Clean>Rice

yea, most of my miles come from local and a little freeway...BUT, even when i filler-er-up and then drive all freeway, no traffic, i do not get over 30mpg (only freeway) .

TL|GTX

i get 17

Clean>Rice

Yea, i used to get 14 when i just got my car. but that was because of the lines at school, waiting to get out! and where i live, there are a lot of hills and redlights (and Po-Po's ).

you prob enjoy going fast...or like accelerating.

NAiL05

I get 25-28 mixed depending on my driving style. I always use 93 in my car never lower since the compression in these motors is 11:1 I am not risking it. I know how touchy it can be since my old h22 had the same compression. Run shitty gas and that car will treat you like shit if not kill your car.

cherishzm

Thanks everyone for the replies. I'll read DIY Seafoam post and try that soon. I will only use 93 octane gas.

This forum really rocks!

JTS97Z28

iTrader: (4)

Where I live here around Chicago 91 isnt even available.
The three grades are 87 octane is the standard low grade, 89 is mid grade, and 93 is premium. Out west all they offer for premium is 91? humm

NAiL05

Depends on location. We have 93 in texas. I have seen a couple of stations down here with 87, 89,91, 93 all in one.

LaCostaRacer

How does using a mid-grade gasoline require using Seafoam to mitigate the lasting effects of mid-grade gasoline? I believe that is nonsense needing to Seafoam a car that had been using a lower octane fuel. The performance is only affected and that is only under high-load situations to begin with.

These are two separate subjects: 1) what are the long-term ramifications to using a lower octane fuel (answer=none) .vs. 2) How often do you need to clean my intake/fuel system. (answer: people report amazing results using Seafoam even when using Premium the entire time and every 20k or so miles.)

It's amazing why anyone would want to skimp on $1.40 difference in fuel for a full tank of premium gas, but we hear about this topic pretty often. You would be far better off financially skipping the Starbucks Latte once a week assuming you tank up weekly or less frequently and the Latte sets you back $3.50 each time.

94eg!

That is not really the case. Every time you fill up your tank, the ECU resets the ignition timing to stock. Once the knock sensor detects detonation (pining), weather it's audible to you or not, it then retards timing again till it stops.

The fact is your engine is still pinging at least a few times per tank. Even a little detonation can be extremely hard on the rod bearings pistons and rings.

BTW: Detonation can happen at all rpm. Especially when you open the throttle at low rpm...

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

The timing doesn't reset everytime the car is filled, but the modern knock sensors are very sensitive and you'll probably never hear the sound, but chances are that if the previous owner used 89, he ertainly wasn't hard on the car and that the timing adjustment was never needed.

As far as build up, that's also a misnomer, as you'll see no more with the 89 vs. the 91, so like I said earlier, start with the 91/93 and you’ll be good to go, don’t look for any more trouble or problems.

shadowkahn

you also have to remember that in different areas of the country, different gas passes for premium. go up in the Rockies and you'll find 85 octane regular gas. Premium will be around 89. This is not a tragedy - at altitude there's less oxygen and so you need less octane in the gas to provide the same detonation resistance. It only becomes an issue when you then leave the mountains and get closer to sea level, at which point you'll want to fill up again with "regular" premium.

cherishzm

Thanks all for the comments.

Let me tell you guys what I know about E10 gas and change in octane rating. This may vary by state or region, but I'm certain this is true in SE region especially Carolinas.

From about two years ago in NC, most gas stations started carrying E10 gas (90% conventional gas and 10% ethanol) due to a cost advantage. There's a federal tax credit of 45 cents per every gallon of ethanol mixed with gas to make E10. And it is known that mixing 10% ethanol with 90% conventional gas will boost overall octane rating by about 3 making effective octane rating for regular gas to 90 in NC whereas posted octane rating is 87.

The lowest octane conventional gas available in NC is 87 for regular gas, so basically even if the octane rating sticker says 87 regular in stations, it is actually 90 octane E10 gas. Most stations have the midgrade gas labled at 89 octane but it is identical to the E10 regular gas. It is perfectly fine because the octane rating is 90! People who pump midgrade gas are just paying 10 cents more for the same regular E10 gas.

Premium is 93 octane here, but gas stations or gas suppliers use the similiar tactic to mix just the right amount of 87 octane gas + 93 octane gas + 10% ethanol to make the octane rating 93. They will not just mix 10% ethanol with 90% 93 octane premium gas which will indeed boost it to 96 octane.

I work for a company in this industry (BP and Exxon fuel distrubutor) and know other companies in the industry have been suffering from low profit margin so they are doing everything to lower the cost. Even big oil companies such as Exxon, Shell, and BP are doing and will do the same thing especially when crude oil and gas price goes up.

When you have a choice of getting 90 octane E10 for the price of regular gas or paying about $3~4 more per fillup to get 93 octane E10?

Majofo

I highly doubt E10 87 is actually 90.. I hope states stop pushing that crap.

cherishzm

At least in NC, E10 87 is actually 90 or very close to 90.

Unless 84~85 conventional gas is available to mix with ethanol or gas price drops below the net cost of ethanol, it'll be the same.

shtewps

iTrader: (1)

Im trying to get on a TL really soon.. have one on hold actually. Is there any way to tell if the car has been running on premium or not? How can I tell if the engine is pinging?

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Who cares what was used. When you get the car fill it up with premium and it will be good to go.

94eg!

As far as Ethanol goes, there is a lable right on the pump that states how much Ethanol by volume is contained in the fuel you purchasing.

When Ethanol is mixed, the octane may go up, but the amount of energy your purchasing goes down. Since Ethanol does not contain as much energy as gasoline, your fuel economy will suffer. There is nothing you can do about it. I believe this mixture rate is seasonal and is part of the reason you get different mileage during the summer vs winter...

01tl4tl

the summer -winter gas has additional anti smog crud put in the summer gas

Gas stations have no control over whats in the gas- its all done in the final mixing room at the refinery
Ethanol 10% was USA GOVT MANDATED after their last great idea of MTBE added to gas was destroying The Earth thru the groundwater--ooops
So ethanol was pushed upon us, car makers determined 10% was the MAX they can tune the engine for- so 10% became the standard
Look at all the pump labels you want across the country- its 10 percent ~
A very few stations/brands may not be in compliance yet, but few and far between

Cars run on less than 91 or unknown history, add a can of redline FI cleaner or a can of Seafoam engine cleaner to 1/2 tank of gas- that will get rid of deposits
If 60-70k miles or more its ready for new spark plugs too

Another `bonus` of E10 is that it has less actual combustion power- so it leaves behind way more partially unburnt crud than the old gas did.
This is one reason to do yearly cleaning of gas and intake manifold thru vac port with seafoam or wynns or bg or honda or gms cleaning stuff

Babnik

Why do stations even have 89, it's not like any car requires it. People are either gonna put in 87 or 91+. Or are there actually cars that require 89?

Turbonut

iTrader: (1)

Daughter's Jeep Hemi Grand calls for 89 octane.

esco786

iTrader: (2)

op, it should be ok..but once you switch to your chose octane, stick to it...don't switch back and forth.