Not your usual "should I buy this or that?" thread
12-26-2015, 10:54 AM
#1
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Not your usual "should I buy this or that?" thread
Clearly the Acura forums are going to wax poetic about the RLX but this one will ask about specific features.
I'm looking for a new sedan with the electronic nannies common to modern cars. I'm looking at the E350 vs the RLX. Based upon my experiences with BMW, I will never buy another one in the US.
From a technology standpoint, the MB wins hands down, from rear collision mitigation to the properly adaptive highbeams that modify the beam depending on oncoming traffic and the (kinda cutesy but questionably useful) autonomous parking.
Where the RLX shines is in reliability. The electronic nannies are a generation behind MB but mostly work as intended. Although the German magazines rate MB's 4matic above SH-AWD and BMW's X-drive, I think that the SH-AWD is superior to both in dry conditions.
While I've drove the RLX in normal conditions, I'm concerned about the gawd awful turning radius compared to the MB. While the MB has a class leading <35ft turning radius, the RLX is over 40 and my current TSX is a hair under 36.
Because of my parking garage at work, this could be a huge issue. Whenever I drive my mom's RX300 (13 years old and 30k miles) to work to run up the miles, I'm always hoping that I can find an easy to get into spot without going down into the bowels of the building.
Is the turning circle as bad in parking lots and parking garages as it seems on paper? Who here owns both a RLX and an E class and can speak to this.
I'm also contemplating the FWD just because it has such great incentives and is easier to find - does that one turn tighter? It doesn't appear as if PAWS helps with that.
I'm looking for a new sedan with the electronic nannies common to modern cars. I'm looking at the E350 vs the RLX. Based upon my experiences with BMW, I will never buy another one in the US.
From a technology standpoint, the MB wins hands down, from rear collision mitigation to the properly adaptive highbeams that modify the beam depending on oncoming traffic and the (kinda cutesy but questionably useful) autonomous parking.
Where the RLX shines is in reliability. The electronic nannies are a generation behind MB but mostly work as intended. Although the German magazines rate MB's 4matic above SH-AWD and BMW's X-drive, I think that the SH-AWD is superior to both in dry conditions.
While I've drove the RLX in normal conditions, I'm concerned about the gawd awful turning radius compared to the MB. While the MB has a class leading <35ft turning radius, the RLX is over 40 and my current TSX is a hair under 36.
Because of my parking garage at work, this could be a huge issue. Whenever I drive my mom's RX300 (13 years old and 30k miles) to work to run up the miles, I'm always hoping that I can find an easy to get into spot without going down into the bowels of the building.
Is the turning circle as bad in parking lots and parking garages as it seems on paper? Who here owns both a RLX and an E class and can speak to this.
I'm also contemplating the FWD just because it has such great incentives and is easier to find - does that one turn tighter? It doesn't appear as if PAWS helps with that.
12-26-2015, 01:54 PM
#2
I'll be the first to dive in on your request:
The MB and BMW may have some additional cool tech over the RLX or Lexus ES models, but I have never felt the turning radius of the RLX was any issue. In very limited situations it has required a back up and recommit to the intended line in a parking garage, but that has been the unusual experience. The AWD experience in snowy weather without dedicated snow tires has been amazing (last year). I can only imagine what it would be like with snows on it. I just installed dedicated snows on my new MDX SH-AWD and will likely experience the drive with those on next week when we are expecting the white stuff to fall from the heavens (FINALLY!!!!).
I think that the Lexus or Acura models will be less expensive over time with normal maintenance and less stuck on the side of the road break downs (tires excluded). Forget depreciation as most cars are terrible with that aspect.
Regarding the "nannies", I keep my Lane Departure Warning off all the time as it is annoying to me (personal preference). My wife likes it on, but it drives me crazy so off it goes. The collision mitigation warning is also annoying in any car IHO. The ABS in the RLX-SH is excellent as it seems to allow for threshold braking without it kicking in unless you are in real trouble. Unusual experience for me as every other car has not performed like that in my many years of driving experience. The traction control is effective without completely killing the throttle as in many other cars out there when you are needing it.
I maintain that if you drive a Sport Hybrid, you will be compelled to buy one. Don't attempt to drive one unless you are prepared to get one because you will lose sleep until you do after getting some seat time in that car. Very special.
I hope this was helpful.
The MB and BMW may have some additional cool tech over the RLX or Lexus ES models, but I have never felt the turning radius of the RLX was any issue. In very limited situations it has required a back up and recommit to the intended line in a parking garage, but that has been the unusual experience. The AWD experience in snowy weather without dedicated snow tires has been amazing (last year). I can only imagine what it would be like with snows on it. I just installed dedicated snows on my new MDX SH-AWD and will likely experience the drive with those on next week when we are expecting the white stuff to fall from the heavens (FINALLY!!!!).
I think that the Lexus or Acura models will be less expensive over time with normal maintenance and less stuck on the side of the road break downs (tires excluded). Forget depreciation as most cars are terrible with that aspect.
Regarding the "nannies", I keep my Lane Departure Warning off all the time as it is annoying to me (personal preference). My wife likes it on, but it drives me crazy so off it goes. The collision mitigation warning is also annoying in any car IHO. The ABS in the RLX-SH is excellent as it seems to allow for threshold braking without it kicking in unless you are in real trouble. Unusual experience for me as every other car has not performed like that in my many years of driving experience. The traction control is effective without completely killing the throttle as in many other cars out there when you are needing it.
I maintain that if you drive a Sport Hybrid, you will be compelled to buy one. Don't attempt to drive one unless you are prepared to get one because you will lose sleep until you do after getting some seat time in that car. Very special.
I hope this was helpful.
The following users liked this post:
ceb (12-26-2015)
12-26-2015, 04:50 PM
#3
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
I'll be the first to dive in on your request:
The MB and BMW may have some additional cool tech over the RLX or Lexus ES models, but I have never felt the turning radius of the RLX was any issue. In very limited situations it has required a back up and recommit to the intended line in a parking garage, but that has been the unusual experience. The AWD experience in snowy weather without dedicated snow tires has been amazing (last year). I can only imagine what it would be like with snows on it. I just installed dedicated snows on my new MDX SH-AWD and will likely experience the drive with those on next week when we are expecting the white stuff to fall from the heavens (FINALLY!!!!).
I think that the Lexus or Acura models will be less expensive over time with normal maintenance and less stuck on the side of the road break downs (tires excluded). Forget depreciation as most cars are terrible with that aspect.
Regarding the "nannies", I keep my Lane Departure Warning off all the time as it is annoying to me (personal preference). My wife likes it on, but it drives me crazy so off it goes. The collision mitigation warning is also annoying in any car IHO. The ABS in the RLX-SH is excellent as it seems to allow for threshold braking without it kicking in unless you are in real trouble. Unusual experience for me as every other car has not performed like that in my many years of driving experience. The traction control is effective without completely killing the throttle as in many other cars out there when you are needing it.
I maintain that if you drive a Sport Hybrid, you will be compelled to buy one. Don't attempt to drive one unless you are prepared to get one because you will lose sleep until you do after getting some seat time in that car. Very special.
I hope this was helpful.
The MB and BMW may have some additional cool tech over the RLX or Lexus ES models, but I have never felt the turning radius of the RLX was any issue. In very limited situations it has required a back up and recommit to the intended line in a parking garage, but that has been the unusual experience. The AWD experience in snowy weather without dedicated snow tires has been amazing (last year). I can only imagine what it would be like with snows on it. I just installed dedicated snows on my new MDX SH-AWD and will likely experience the drive with those on next week when we are expecting the white stuff to fall from the heavens (FINALLY!!!!).
I think that the Lexus or Acura models will be less expensive over time with normal maintenance and less stuck on the side of the road break downs (tires excluded). Forget depreciation as most cars are terrible with that aspect.
Regarding the "nannies", I keep my Lane Departure Warning off all the time as it is annoying to me (personal preference). My wife likes it on, but it drives me crazy so off it goes. The collision mitigation warning is also annoying in any car IHO. The ABS in the RLX-SH is excellent as it seems to allow for threshold braking without it kicking in unless you are in real trouble. Unusual experience for me as every other car has not performed like that in my many years of driving experience. The traction control is effective without completely killing the throttle as in many other cars out there when you are needing it.
I maintain that if you drive a Sport Hybrid, you will be compelled to buy one. Don't attempt to drive one unless you are prepared to get one because you will lose sleep until you do after getting some seat time in that car. Very special.
I hope this was helpful.
Your comment has made me more concerned about the parking garage where you often have to snake your way through narrow passages created by badly parked cars.
I guess I'll have to try one in my garage.
The following users liked this post:
sooththetruth (12-27-2015)
12-26-2015, 06:30 PM
#4
Senior Moderator
The RLX's turning radius sucks balls but I'm used to having to maneuver a little extra in the parking lots now. It's not really an issue in the real world for me anymore. Yes, the Germans have more tech, but you also pay more for that tech and the tripoint star/little blue roundel.
The RLX is an absolute bargain in both cost to acquire and cost to maintain. If you buy used, you miss the worst of the depreciation, which is certainly worse in this car than the terrible depreciation of the Germans in the same class.
The RLX is an absolute bargain in both cost to acquire and cost to maintain. If you buy used, you miss the worst of the depreciation, which is certainly worse in this car than the terrible depreciation of the Germans in the same class.
The following users liked this post:
sooththetruth (12-27-2015)
12-26-2015, 10:39 PM
#5
Three Wheelin'
From my perspective and experience after 2+ years with a 2014 Advanced PAWS RLX, if you're looking for a short term lease, go for a 2016 model.
But (IMO), if you're looking to make a long-term purchase for a car to keep for the next 5-10 years, I would wait till 2017/2018 when Acura comes out with the follow-up to the RLX. The current RLX is NOT the true "flagship" vehicle it could have been, and even Acura has finally fessed up to it being a "dud". And IMO, not representative of what the brand is capable of, especially for the asking price. The things the car does good are great. But there are a lot of areas that simply missed the mark for a vehicle of this class. For this alone, while not a guarantee, it's almost certain that we'll see a real step up from Acura on the next run. That's why I would wait.
If you're interested in how I arrived to that "opinion",just go and search for all prior threads from me starting from 2013 and on.
But (IMO), if you're looking to make a long-term purchase for a car to keep for the next 5-10 years, I would wait till 2017/2018 when Acura comes out with the follow-up to the RLX. The current RLX is NOT the true "flagship" vehicle it could have been, and even Acura has finally fessed up to it being a "dud". And IMO, not representative of what the brand is capable of, especially for the asking price. The things the car does good are great. But there are a lot of areas that simply missed the mark for a vehicle of this class. For this alone, while not a guarantee, it's almost certain that we'll see a real step up from Acura on the next run. That's why I would wait.
If you're interested in how I arrived to that "opinion",just go and search for all prior threads from me starting from 2013 and on.
Last edited by holografique; 12-26-2015 at 10:48 PM.
The following users liked this post:
bronx1480 (12-30-2015)
12-26-2015, 11:33 PM
#6
Three Wheelin'
And if they dont come swinging strong with a true refresh in 2017/2018, then all the more opportunity to get a 2016 model (the best one of the lot) for a price that is well worth its cost. Not the MSRP that is IMO too high for what the car offers.
12-27-2015, 12:18 AM
#7
I have to weigh in and say that the turning radius, in tight situations in parking garages does make it difficult. While I have the Sport Hybrid the parking is not enhanced with the torque vectoring. The RLX is a large car, both in width and length. I don't know how it compares to the MB you are looking at but the RLX's turning radius is not good.
In regard to the other nannies, my opinion is somewhat mixed. I love the ACC and use it frequently. It makes the driving, particularly on long trips much less of a strain. Not that this is really cutting edge tech these days. I also keep the LDW off but do use the lane keeping assist. While I like using it, I have to say that it gets a little frustrating because it often turns on and off because the radar has trouble "seeing" the lanes. When it can see the lanes it works great but it is not able to do so all the time. I understand that many of the roads I use on my daily commute have faded lane markers so the roads are partly to blame. Bottom line is that it feels like technology that still needs some work. I have a 2014 so maybe the 2016s show some improvement.
In general I like the nannies but I find they can be somewhat distracting and inconsistent. In some ways I think driving without them makes me pay better attention to the road.
In regard to the other nannies, my opinion is somewhat mixed. I love the ACC and use it frequently. It makes the driving, particularly on long trips much less of a strain. Not that this is really cutting edge tech these days. I also keep the LDW off but do use the lane keeping assist. While I like using it, I have to say that it gets a little frustrating because it often turns on and off because the radar has trouble "seeing" the lanes. When it can see the lanes it works great but it is not able to do so all the time. I understand that many of the roads I use on my daily commute have faded lane markers so the roads are partly to blame. Bottom line is that it feels like technology that still needs some work. I have a 2014 so maybe the 2016s show some improvement.
In general I like the nannies but I find they can be somewhat distracting and inconsistent. In some ways I think driving without them makes me pay better attention to the road.
The following 3 users liked this post by Malibu Flyer:
Trending Topics
12-27-2015, 08:05 AM
#8
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
12-27-2015, 08:16 AM
#9
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
Equipping an E350 exactly the way that an RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be equipped, the MSRP is 74,265.
Remember that a stock E50 does not include things like rear air bags, heated rear seats, ventilated front seats, a premium audio system, rear sun shades or a sunroof.
The negotiated price of this E350 in my part of the world might come down to 63,977. That assumes the Mercedes cash back to the dealer of 3,000 is still active. If it's gone, then you're looking at 66,977.
That is still more than what the negotiated price of the RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be...possibly as much as ten grand more than what the negotiated price would be in some parts of the world.
Your Mercedes will not have torque vectoring AWD. The Mercedes 4 Matic's claim to fame is that it tries to keep an equal amount of torque to each wheel under most circumstances, including circumstances where the car's attitude, traction, speed and/or safety would be enhanced if it had torque vectoring like the Sport Hybrid system.
Your Mercedes will consume more fuel, not handle as well, won't be as safe, and it will not perform as well as the RLX.
Your Mercedes will be less reliable.
Remember that a stock E50 does not include things like rear air bags, heated rear seats, ventilated front seats, a premium audio system, rear sun shades or a sunroof.
The negotiated price of this E350 in my part of the world might come down to 63,977. That assumes the Mercedes cash back to the dealer of 3,000 is still active. If it's gone, then you're looking at 66,977.
That is still more than what the negotiated price of the RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be...possibly as much as ten grand more than what the negotiated price would be in some parts of the world.
Your Mercedes will not have torque vectoring AWD. The Mercedes 4 Matic's claim to fame is that it tries to keep an equal amount of torque to each wheel under most circumstances, including circumstances where the car's attitude, traction, speed and/or safety would be enhanced if it had torque vectoring like the Sport Hybrid system.
Your Mercedes will consume more fuel, not handle as well, won't be as safe, and it will not perform as well as the RLX.
Your Mercedes will be less reliable.
12-27-2015, 09:25 AM
#10
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
From my perspective and experience after 2+ years with a 2014 Advanced PAWS RLX, if you're looking for a short term lease, go for a 2016 model.
But (IMO), if you're looking to make a long-term purchase for a car to keep for the next 5-10 years, I would wait till 2017/2018 when Acura comes out with the follow-up to the RLX. The current RLX is NOT the true "flagship" vehicle it could have been, and even Acura has finally fessed up to it being a "dud". And IMO, not representative of what the brand is capable of, especially for the asking price. The things the car does good are great. But there are a lot of areas that simply missed the mark for a vehicle of this class. For this alone, while not a guarantee, it's almost certain that we'll see a real step up from Acura on the next run. That's why I would wait.
If you're interested in how I arrived to that "opinion",just go and search for all prior threads from me starting from 2013 and on.
But (IMO), if you're looking to make a long-term purchase for a car to keep for the next 5-10 years, I would wait till 2017/2018 when Acura comes out with the follow-up to the RLX. The current RLX is NOT the true "flagship" vehicle it could have been, and even Acura has finally fessed up to it being a "dud". And IMO, not representative of what the brand is capable of, especially for the asking price. The things the car does good are great. But there are a lot of areas that simply missed the mark for a vehicle of this class. For this alone, while not a guarantee, it's almost certain that we'll see a real step up from Acura on the next run. That's why I would wait.
If you're interested in how I arrived to that "opinion",just go and search for all prior threads from me starting from 2013 and on.
That reputation will be hard to change even if they accidentally build a class leader.
12-27-2015, 10:01 AM
#11
Torch & Pitchfork Posse
Personally, I have not had many issues with the turning radius.
That said, my client's parking garage is tight and two way traffic rules (stay to the right side of the aisle) are NEVER observed. With the 2016 Advance trim level the surround cameras are very helpful. At low speed I can keep the forward camera on, which gives me a better view peering around corners for oncoming traffic. Further the surround camera and particularly the 360 birds eye view makes precise parking a breeze.
That said, my client's parking garage is tight and two way traffic rules (stay to the right side of the aisle) are NEVER observed. With the 2016 Advance trim level the surround cameras are very helpful. At low speed I can keep the forward camera on, which gives me a better view peering around corners for oncoming traffic. Further the surround camera and particularly the 360 birds eye view makes precise parking a breeze.
12-27-2015, 10:18 AM
#12
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
It uses the rear sensors to determine if a rear collision is imminent. If so, then it will tighten the seatbelts, move the headrests towards your head (the headrests include what MB calls NeckPro that snaps the headrest towards your head) and put the brakes full on (if stopped) to keep you from rearending the car in front of you.
Interestingly enough, the front collision mitigation (part of the adaptive cruise with full stop) is designed to stop as close as possible to car in front of you in order to give the car behind you more space to stop.
The auto high beams actually change the shape of the high beam depending on oncoming traffic to redirect the beam around the oncoming car.
The technoligy is far advanced - but so are the upfront and ongoing costs.
12-27-2015, 10:34 AM
#13
Three Wheelin'
If you've created a great product, you shouldn't have to "drop drawers" on your pricing to get it to sell.
12-27-2015, 10:37 AM
#14
Instructor
The RLX's turning radius sucks balls but I'm used to having to maneuver a little extra in the parking lots now. It's not really an issue in the real world for me anymore. Yes, the Germans have more tech, but you also pay more for that tech and the tripoint star/little blue roundel.
The RLX is an absolute bargain in both cost to acquire and cost to maintain. If you buy used, you miss the worst of the depreciation, which is certainly worse in this car than the terrible depreciation of the Germans in the same class.
The RLX is an absolute bargain in both cost to acquire and cost to maintain. If you buy used, you miss the worst of the depreciation, which is certainly worse in this car than the terrible depreciation of the Germans in the same class.
Knowing the group on this board, and trusting Honda Co., I am wondering if someone will explain a good reason for the design: increased tire wear, or increased maintenance involved in allowing the better turn radius, or even safety compromises at high speed.
That being said, a poor turn radius will be a frequently suffered compromise to deal with in a vehicle.
Last edited by sooththetruth; 12-27-2015 at 10:41 AM.
12-27-2015, 11:00 AM
#15
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
Equipping an E350 exactly the way that an RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be equipped, the MSRP is 74,265.
Remember that a stock E50 does not include things like rear air bags, heated rear seats, ventilated front seats, a premium audio system, rear sun shades or a sunroof.
The negotiated price of this E350 in my part of the world might come down to 63,977. That assumes the Mercedes cash back to the dealer of 3,000 is still active. If it's gone, then you're looking at 66,977.
That is still more than what the negotiated price of the RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be...possibly as much as ten grand more than what the negotiated price would be in some parts of the world.
Your Mercedes will not have torque vectoring AWD. The Mercedes 4 Matic's claim to fame is that it tries to keep an equal amount of torque to each wheel under most circumstances, including circumstances where the car's attitude, traction, speed and/or safety would be enhanced if it had torque vectoring like the Sport Hybrid system.
Your Mercedes will consume more fuel, not handle as well, won't be as safe, and it will not perform as well as the RLX.
Your Mercedes will be less reliable.
Remember that a stock E50 does not include things like rear air bags, heated rear seats, ventilated front seats, a premium audio system, rear sun shades or a sunroof.
The negotiated price of this E350 in my part of the world might come down to 63,977. That assumes the Mercedes cash back to the dealer of 3,000 is still active. If it's gone, then you're looking at 66,977.
That is still more than what the negotiated price of the RLX Sport Hybrid-Advance would be...possibly as much as ten grand more than what the negotiated price would be in some parts of the world.
Your Mercedes will not have torque vectoring AWD. The Mercedes 4 Matic's claim to fame is that it tries to keep an equal amount of torque to each wheel under most circumstances, including circumstances where the car's attitude, traction, speed and/or safety would be enhanced if it had torque vectoring like the Sport Hybrid system.
Your Mercedes will consume more fuel, not handle as well, won't be as safe, and it will not perform as well as the RLX.
Your Mercedes will be less reliable.
12-27-2015, 12:15 PM
#16
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
Honda and Acura do not have adjustable headrests (except for the basics) because there is an integral passive system that causes the headrest to move in the right direction when someone is rear ended, or in a serious frontal collision.
If they allowed more adjustments to the headrests, then this proved and very safe system would have to be replaced with something much more expensive and more complicated.
The word "headrest" is probably a malaprop, because we do not really want someone's head to be in contact with the headrest under normal conditions.
If they allowed more adjustments to the headrests, then this proved and very safe system would have to be replaced with something much more expensive and more complicated.
The word "headrest" is probably a malaprop, because we do not really want someone's head to be in contact with the headrest under normal conditions.
The following users liked this post:
sooththetruth (12-27-2015)
12-27-2015, 12:20 PM
#17
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
NHTSA and IIHS both show in their testing that the RLX is rated better than the E350.
I'm not going by memory...I just looked it up. :-)
This is a subjective observation, but I would say that the Acura comes out significantly better.
I'm not going by memory...I just looked it up. :-)
This is a subjective observation, but I would say that the Acura comes out significantly better.
The following users liked this post:
hondamore (12-27-2015)
12-27-2015, 12:25 PM
#18
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
What exactly is "rear collision mitigation" and how does that work?
It seems to me that in order to prevent whiplash, it would have to do something about moving your car the opposite direction from an object closing quickly on your rear bumper.
That's why I asked for clarification of that earlier, because it seems to me that this indicates some very complicated logic and programming, and a bigger (devoted!) chip than people are inclined to put into automobiles.
If it only means that it's going to keep you from ramming a brick wall while you're backing up, then that's a hell of a lot simpler and something that would be cheap and easy.
I had gone the way of believing this simpler thing, but now you've said it would've prevented whiplash, so I'm back where I started.
Thanks very much for any help you can provide.
It seems to me that in order to prevent whiplash, it would have to do something about moving your car the opposite direction from an object closing quickly on your rear bumper.
That's why I asked for clarification of that earlier, because it seems to me that this indicates some very complicated logic and programming, and a bigger (devoted!) chip than people are inclined to put into automobiles.
If it only means that it's going to keep you from ramming a brick wall while you're backing up, then that's a hell of a lot simpler and something that would be cheap and easy.
I had gone the way of believing this simpler thing, but now you've said it would've prevented whiplash, so I'm back where I started.
Thanks very much for any help you can provide.
12-27-2015, 02:36 PM
#19
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
What exactly is "rear collision mitigation" and how does that work?
It seems to me that in order to prevent whiplash, it would have to do something about moving your car the opposite direction from an object closing quickly on your rear bumper.
That's why I asked for clarification of that earlier, because it seems to me that this indicates some very complicated logic and programming, and a bigger (devoted!) chip than people are inclined to put into automobiles.
If it only means that it's going to keep you from ramming a brick wall while you're backing up, then that's a hell of a lot simpler and something that would be cheap and easy.
I had gone the way of believing this simpler thing, but now you've said it would've prevented whiplash, so I'm back where I started.
Thanks very much for any help you can provide.
It seems to me that in order to prevent whiplash, it would have to do something about moving your car the opposite direction from an object closing quickly on your rear bumper.
That's why I asked for clarification of that earlier, because it seems to me that this indicates some very complicated logic and programming, and a bigger (devoted!) chip than people are inclined to put into automobiles.
If it only means that it's going to keep you from ramming a brick wall while you're backing up, then that's a hell of a lot simpler and something that would be cheap and easy.
I had gone the way of believing this simpler thing, but now you've said it would've prevented whiplash, so I'm back where I started.
Thanks very much for any help you can provide.
The MB NeckPro keeps your head from snapping back (and the torso from moving forward). The headrest can be snapped back into position after an activation. Interestingly enough, the RLX video doesn't show the neck as snapping back either so you're right - the RLX may be as safe as the MB in this case.
12-27-2015, 03:28 PM
#20
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
I know how NeckPro ™ works.
What I don't understand is "rear collision mitigation" and what that does.
What I don't understand is "rear collision mitigation" and what that does.
12-27-2015, 03:47 PM
#21
With the 2016 Advance trim level the surround cameras are very helpful. At low speed I can keep the forward camera on, which gives me a better view peering around corners for oncoming traffic. Further the surround camera and particularly the 360 birds eye view makes precise parking a breeze.
12-27-2015, 04:51 PM
#22
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
When the car - using the rear sensors and cameras - determines that you will be rear-ended (i.e. a rear collision), the headrests snap forward to the back of your head and the seatbelts get tensioned to keep you from moving forward from the impact.
12-27-2015, 06:15 PM
#23
My vote is for an E350 4MATIC Wagon in Dolomite Brown Metallic with a Panorama roof on 18-inch AMG twin 5-spoke wheels. It is unfortunate Acura does not make a wagon.
12-27-2015, 06:59 PM
#24
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
What should I expect to pay for a SH-AWD Advance?
12-27-2015, 10:25 PM
#25
Senior Moderator
Personally, I have not had many issues with the turning radius.
That said, my client's parking garage is tight and two way traffic rules (stay to the right side of the aisle) are NEVER observed. With the 2016 Advance trim level the surround cameras are very helpful. At low speed I can keep the forward camera on, which gives me a better view peering around corners for oncoming traffic. Further the surround camera and particularly the 360 birds eye view makes precise parking a breeze.
That said, my client's parking garage is tight and two way traffic rules (stay to the right side of the aisle) are NEVER observed. With the 2016 Advance trim level the surround cameras are very helpful. At low speed I can keep the forward camera on, which gives me a better view peering around corners for oncoming traffic. Further the surround camera and particularly the 360 birds eye view makes precise parking a breeze.
I sure could use that.At this point in the year (end-December, end-quarter, end-year), certainly not MSRP. You could probably wangle quite the deal if you were interested, and if there is a suitable candidate in your area. The latter is the most difficult part of procuring a Sport Hybrid as they are so few.
12-28-2015, 06:11 AM
#26
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
If it's using the rear bumper sensors, then I guess this all happens very quickly, like ⅛ s before impact.
It seems to me this might raise other issues, but I have no idea of the logic involved in making sure this kind of system is reliable. I'm not even aware of Honda considering something like this...on their cars the seatbelt will be tight as soon as the G-meters detect a change, and on a rear impact the headrest moves where it should go, passively but automatically.
But this is a very interesting idea and I hope that people are looking at things like keeping the rearward camera active at all times even when it's not on the driver's screen. (Honda cameras are not always powered on the cars on the road right now.)
12-28-2015, 06:12 AM
#27
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
This especially seems odd, considering Mercedes doesn't have rear air bags as standard equipment. I wish I could understand the logic, but I don't.
Not yet, anyway.
Not yet, anyway.
12-28-2015, 05:03 PM
#28
Exact car I was thinking of - but it stickers at $77k once you add Distronic plus, lighting package, premium and leather. Plus, given the maintenance costs (the prepaid maintenance for 4 years - 4 services - is over $2k) while I can get 5yr, 60k prepaid service for the RLX for $900.
What should I expect to pay for a SH-AWD Advance?
What should I expect to pay for a SH-AWD Advance?
12-28-2015, 07:44 PM
#29
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
That's very interesting. What a great idea.
If it's using the rear bumper sensors, then I guess this all happens very quickly, like ⅛ s before impact.
It seems to me this might raise other issues, but I have no idea of the logic involved in making sure this kind of system is reliable. I'm not even aware of Honda considering something like this...on their cars the seatbelt will be tight as soon as the G-meters detect a change, and on a rear impact the headrest moves where it should go, passively but automatically.
But this is a very interesting idea and I hope that people are looking at things like keeping the rearward camera active at all times even when it's not on the driver's screen. (Honda cameras are not always powered on the cars on the road right now.)
If it's using the rear bumper sensors, then I guess this all happens very quickly, like ⅛ s before impact.
It seems to me this might raise other issues, but I have no idea of the logic involved in making sure this kind of system is reliable. I'm not even aware of Honda considering something like this...on their cars the seatbelt will be tight as soon as the G-meters detect a change, and on a rear impact the headrest moves where it should go, passively but automatically.
But this is a very interesting idea and I hope that people are looking at things like keeping the rearward camera active at all times even when it's not on the driver's screen. (Honda cameras are not always powered on the cars on the road right now.)
Mercedes-Benz TechCenter: PRE-SAFE<sup>®</sup> PLUS
12-28-2015, 07:46 PM
#30
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
12-28-2015, 08:31 PM
#31
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
12-29-2015, 12:26 PM
#32
VW (Audi included) front wheel drive vehicles have a decent turn radius. I know that the ALL WHEEL DRIVE Subaru has a good turning radius. Lexus has improved their turning radius in their highest selling SUV (based on the Camry), but the turning radius had been a bitter complaint about the vehicle before the improvement. I wonder why the RLX (Acura) isn't able to reverse engineer a good turning radius in a front wheel drive car.
Knowing the group on this board, and trusting Honda Co., I am wondering if someone will explain a good reason for the design: increased tire wear, or increased maintenance involved in allowing the better turn radius, or even safety compromises at high speed.
That being said, a poor turn radius will be a frequently suffered compromise to deal with in a vehicle.
Knowing the group on this board, and trusting Honda Co., I am wondering if someone will explain a good reason for the design: increased tire wear, or increased maintenance involved in allowing the better turn radius, or even safety compromises at high speed.
That being said, a poor turn radius will be a frequently suffered compromise to deal with in a vehicle.
12-29-2015, 06:44 PM
#33
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
VW (Audi included) front wheel drive vehicles have a decent turn radius. I know that the ALL WHEEL DRIVE Subaru has a good turning radius. Lexus has improved their turning radius in their highest selling SUV (based on the Camry), but the turning radius had been a bitter complaint about the vehicle before the improvement. I wonder why the RLX (Acura) isn't able to reverse engineer a good turning radius in a front wheel drive car.
Knowing the group on this board, and trusting Honda Co., I am wondering if someone will explain a good reason for the design: increased tire wear, or increased maintenance involved in allowing the better turn radius, or even safety compromises at high speed.
That being said, a poor turn radius will be a frequently suffered compromise to deal with in a vehicle.
Knowing the group on this board, and trusting Honda Co., I am wondering if someone will explain a good reason for the design: increased tire wear, or increased maintenance involved in allowing the better turn radius, or even safety compromises at high speed.
That being said, a poor turn radius will be a frequently suffered compromise to deal with in a vehicle.
12-29-2015, 07:23 PM
#34
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
The following 2 users liked this post by ceb:
RLX-Sport Hybrid (12-29-2015),
sooththetruth (12-30-2015)
12-29-2015, 07:47 PM
#35
Skip the lease and just finance it. Interest rates are as low as they will be again during our lifetimes.
12-30-2015, 05:52 AM
#36
Grandpa
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Virginia, Besieged
Age: 68
Posts: 7,596
Received 2,609 Likes
on
1,475 Posts
They're assuming that the RLX Sport Hybrid will depreciate the same way that all conventional hybrids depreciate. I have no idea if that is true. There just aren't that many of them back on the market after a year.
12-30-2015, 12:31 PM
#37
Senior Moderator
With that deal, it'd be better to just finance.
It's too bad Acura doesn't do better leases for the Sport Hybrid....but with so few on the ground, I guess they don't have to.
12-30-2015, 07:01 PM
#38
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
The residual in my lease was 49%. My monthly payment is, honestly, only a little more than what you're being offered (12k/yr 3 yr lease), and my cap was a few hundred less than the 2014 MSRP, as I've shared before here. Something's fishy in Denmark with that deal. I lease because I have a clear tax advantage for my business in doing so.
With that deal, it'd be better to just finance.
It's too bad Acura doesn't do better leases for the Sport Hybrid....but with so few on the ground, I guess they don't have to.
With that deal, it'd be better to just finance.
It's too bad Acura doesn't do better leases for the Sport Hybrid....but with so few on the ground, I guess they don't have to.
12-31-2015, 10:54 AM
#39
Three Wheelin'
Try $63k @ $980 for a 2014 P-AWS Advanced....and more issues than you'd care to have dealt with, some of which were never fully addressed by Acura...
You've burned me good Acura....real good.
12-31-2015, 12:25 PM
#40
Suzuka Master
Thread Starter
I think this is the first any of us have heard that you aren't fully satisfied
The RL had the same path - MSRP or MSRP+ in 2005, then huge discounts a few years later. In 2011 my sister traded her 2005 for a new 2010. IIRC, she got a 3 year "one pay" lease for $12k plus her trade. In 2013, she turned the RL back and leased a TSX tech for $6k.