Originally Posted by Pens Fan

I test drove an Advance model yesterday and agree it is an excellent vehicle-very quiet and luxurious. The only aspect it lacks is the snob appeal of an MB, BMW, or Lexus emblem on the grill.

Originally Posted by GoHawks

I think your hypothesis has merit and I actually agree with your point here. Honda did have a cult following and there are people who truly appreciated (myself included) the engineering that the company put in their cars. Remember I stayed with the brand for over 19 years and most recently owned a 2006 RL. I loved that car and recently got into a debate in the BMW forums defending it.

Me personally.... I don't care that it's a FWD based car. I think the tech is pretty cool. The styling does NOTHING for me and if I am going to spend that kind of money, I want to at least REALLY like how it looks. As I said before it kind of looks "old man-ish".

As for Acura as well. It would be fine if they just came out and said, "fine, we are different, we will continue be geeks when it comes to engineering our cars knowing that we won't be for everyone".

But they don't. THey still give the impression that they want to compete with Lexus and the Germans.

Many of you are too young but do you remember their original tagline?

Precision Crafted Performance

As a matter of fact I think I still have a T-Shirt laying around with that from when I bought my first Acura (a 1993 Vigor).

Those three words said it all, but then they shoot themselves in the foot and introduce barely disuised Honda Civics as Acuras, or dumb down the AWD systems in the RDX to cater to the masses and they dilute the brand and send mixed messages.




See my previous comment. This is my point exactly. If Acura wants to be in the top-tier they are going to have to develop un-Honda-like cars.

That's OK if they don't or can't go there. Just stop trying to pretend like you are. Again, the dumbing down of the RDX, and barely disguised Civics are case-in-point.

I don't entirely agree with the comment that it has nothing to do with the understated styling. I do think if they would introduce a car that would turn some heads, at least they would get some attention and get people to give the car a chance. This RLX will only attract people who appreciate Honda for what they were. It will not bring new people to the brand, and that's what they are saying they want.

Listen, I have moved on. I don't own Acuras anymore, so why am I still here?

Because I drove Acuras for a LONG time. At one point I thought I would never leave the brand, and some day I hope to return. I really made my decision last year when the first pictures of the RLX came out. When the 2nd gen RL came out I fell in love with it. I had to have it.

No such emotion with the RLX and Cadillac got me to take a chance on them with the styling of the CTS coupe. See my point?

I'm just hoping Honda figures out what they want to be and sticks with it. Either be a brand that defines Precision Crafted Performance and be OK that it won't appeal to everyone, or make the leap and make a run to compete with the top tier, but this in-between stuff is killing the Acura brand. They have had a few recent sales successes with the MDX and TL (sales successes), but the TL has fallen out of favor due to their horrendous styling approach. as once a beautiful car and gave it that abortion of a beak. Yeah they've softened it a bit, but the damage was done.

I think in the end Acura has become a platform to introduce technology that will some day trickle down to the rest of the brand.

Maybe that's OK too.

Originally Posted by GoHawks

On that note (regarding Honda of old) read this review of the new Accord Coupe with a V6 and a manual.

http://www.detroitnews.com/article/2...xt|FRONTPAGE|p

FWD or not, it makes me want to go out and buy one!

Originally Posted by Colin

^^ I'm certainly not as cynical as you are. I think that at some point we simply need to face facts. Acura (Honda) is not going to build a purpose built rear wheel drive chassis for this car. It simply doesn't fit in their business model. In some respects, Cadillac didn't even build the ATS chassis, isn't it borrowed from Opal? With a viable chassis in the corporate inventory, Cadillac was spared the expense of developing a low volume product From scratch.

Not having this luxury, and understanding how Honda works, it's easy to see why everything they've done revolves around an existing chassis. It's readily apparent that this car isn't going to be for everyone and I think Acura realizes that. It is my opinion that they are accepting of this and will take what ever sales they can get. I also believe that deep down they care more about the TLX then they do this vehicle. It simply makes more sense to focus on the American built TLX versus the Japan manufactured RLX. However, the RLX can serve as a technological showcase and "testbed" for other vehicles.

Originally Posted by Glashub

What were RL's prior to 2005? Boring looking FWD cars. Looks like their returning to their roots in 2013, if you ask me.

From Edmunds about a 2000 RL (Price I think was around $45K):

Pros

Quality construction, refined look and feel, value priced.


Cons

Competition offers rear-wheel drive and V8 power.

Originally Posted by KeithL

WOW Acura caved in to the rest, I liked not being locked out of nav while driving. Infiniti voice commands suck and they lock everything out once the car is rolling. Sorry to see Acura treat us like children.

Originally Posted by weather

^^^ As much as I like the look of the Genesis, if I am going to spend that kind of money, I want a brand name that is going to inspire luxury. I know Acura is not as good as Lexus and so on, but Acura still triggers more a "luxury" impression than a Hyundai. I am not trying to say that I am a brand snob but for me, it still means something. It is not everything because I am not prepared to spend 50K on a car that has poor reliability but when you combine a semi luxurious feel and great reliability, great handling and decent looks, that spells a winning combo for me. The reason why I love my 2012 TL so much. I am not going to lie though....I am worried about the 2014 TLX, in fact, I am very worried but time will tell. I am EAGER to see some spy pics and concepts because that will determine whether or not I stick with Acura or go Lexus GS or Infiniti Q50 (which at the moment, if I had to pick the one that gets me most interested, this is the one)

Originally Posted by Rocket_man

The Accord, ILX and RDX are the same way. It is the wave of the future for Honda/Acura. Lexus does this as well but a few companies have marketed a bypass. I don't know if anyone has found a way around this on the Honda Nav.

Originally Posted by Rocket_man

I'm in the same boat as you Weather, but my short list is IS, Q50, 3-series.

Originally Posted by JonFo

For some of us, that's a distinct advantage. I actually prefer the 'stealth wealth' an Acura has.

My neighborhood is crawling with those other three brands and a good dose of Caddys as well. But last I counted, there were about 5 or so >2005 RLs in our 2,500 or so households.
A good friend up the street has both an X5 and a 540 BMWs and love the 'status', but pay dearly for it at purchase and in maintenance (even if under warranty, they still waste time).

Originally Posted by weather

Hey Rocket_man....I could easily see myself going to the IS, especially when I get to see one in the flesh. The "F" edition that we saw pictures really got me excited eventhough many people say the styling is awckward...Its like "deja vu" with my TL *lol* I would love to get a 3 series but I am still scared of the gremlins which is why I'd prefer to stick with the Asian companies. I know its not as bad as before with BMW and Audi but I am still a bit nervous where there is no dealer network in the town I live....closest is about 2h away.

Originally Posted by GoHawks

Also to answer your question specifically about the ATS platform. No it was not borrowed from Opel. It is an entirely new (Alpha) platform of which the ATS is the first model built on it.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GM_Alpha_platform

Originally Posted by Colin

Thanks for the clarification. I suppose that GM will find more ways to amortize this chassis than Honda could which gives them a bit of an advantage.