RL09

So Forbes magazine warned consumers about 13 new cars to avoid.

They kick it off with the RLX. Then there's the Q50, and a bunch of American cars.

Acura, bring back the RL for the love of God.

http://www2.forbes.com/business/13-n...void-for-2016/

truonghthe

30% of original value after 5 years? seem like I will be shopping for a SH-AWD for the next five years. I think the bad reps come from that PAWS base model, it literally a fancy stretch Accord V6.

projektvertx

iTrader: (2)

I'm gonna go ahead and move this over to RLX. Definitely an interesting topic.

Philisophe

kurtatx

Don't overthink it. It's the bland styling for a flagship model.

hondamore

Many on this forum have already discovered the solution to this "problem":
1. Buy the low-production Sport Hybrid version of the RLX which has a better reputation, better performance, better fuel economy than the PAWS version and a rarity that makes it hard to find for those that want one. That rarity leads to an artificial demand later on when you want to sell. Also, as the world marches away from fossil fuels, the hybrid logo on the side becomes more valuable (also if oil price ever do go crazy again, having a large sedan that gets 32mpg and goes 0-60 in under 5 seconds will certainly help with the resale value).

2. Avoid being an early adopter and paying MSRP...that is, shop around for a good deal. Very nice discounts are out there where you can save 20% or more off of MSRP making the depreciation MUCH, MUCH more palatable.

3. Keep and enjoy driving your RLX Sport Hybrid for more than three years - the time when the majority of the depreciation occurs. Those who typically hold onto their cars for 10 years do very well. Let's say you buy a Sport Hybrid RLX that retails for $65K, but get a great deal and buy it for $50K. 10 very enjoyable years later, you are surprised to find that there is a cult following of the Sport Hybrid version and you are amazed that you sell it for $10K or more if you can get a bidding war going. Your cost to drive an amazing luxury car with surprising performance and great gas mileage is thus $4000 per year or $333 per month.

Wow, the Sport Hybrid RLX is the greatest value ever!!

Just my two cents.

robscharp05

Certified Pre-Owned RLX's (14-15) are about the same price as Certified TLX's. As it goes for 2016-2017 models there's none because they're still on lease and sales wise are just a tad higher than NSX.. Pick up an RLX NOW! If you think the RL is rare, how rare do you think the RLX is going to be in 7-8 years from now.

romrunning

I have to say, perhaps it's just my lead foot, but I have a really hard time getting anywhere near 32mpg overall.

hondamore

I will leave explanations of outstanding mileage numbers to George "the mileage king"

There is a whole thread on Sport Hybrid mileage that discusses the effect that the lead foot plays in mileage numbers. Other points made in the thread include the negative effects of winter gas and cold weather on mileage. My 32mpg statement was a middle of the summer mileage claim WITHOUT heavy metal of any kind in the right foot and driving style/speeds that includes a lot of EV mode.

miner

At best on my daily commute to the office (8.5 miles) I can only get about 20 - 25% EV mode. It seems that EV mode is used mainly for the 0 - 45 mph range.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I dont think MPG is the point of the car.

Limelight

I agree - that's why it's called a Sport Hybrid... The MPG is simply a compelling and welcome by-product.

The hybrid component was designed as a performance tool with the obvious benefits to fuel economy under light driving and warmer weather conditions. It was designed to satisfy their goal of providing V8 performance on 4 cylinder fuel economy - and for that, it's actually pretty darn cool tech whether or not you like the bland sheet metal, dual screens, high MSRP etc.. I seldom use Sport mode, but when I do get on it, it's a very fun car to drive.

George Knighton

But it does help. :-)

32.1 MPG lifetime average for my KC2, and I am not a light foot.

George Knighton

My daily commute involves a secondary road with speeds that will vary from 40 mph to 60 mph, with a rare confrontation with a farm tractor.

I'm at the top end of average MPG, with ⅓ of my typical day in EV.

George Knighton

Now, now.

Don't make me drive over there.

At 32.1 mpg.

George Knighton

Don't think I can manage 10 years.

But I'm very interested in the 2020 model year and where they'll go with the whole Legend concept.

hondamore

I agree wholeheartedly, however, the point to be made is that, if some point in the future gas prices go stupid again, the prospect of trying to sell a used Sport Hybrid that is a LOT of fun to drive, is a GREAT highway cruiser, has a TON of room inside AND gets AMAZING gas mileage... suddenly, the resale value won't be as bad as some are saying.

hondamore

Someone buying a new $65000 car likely cares very little about the mileage number, however, someone buying an 8-10 year old used Sport Hybrid for $10000 might me more impressed by the mileage numbers and thus willing to spend a bit more to buy one which is the point to be made related to the thread topic.

That said, I gave ZERO importance to the mileage numbers when I bought my Sport Hybrid, but I have been having a lot of fun "hyper-miling" from time to time as well as enjoying the amazing acceleration and handling in Sport Mode from time to time.

Limelight

That describes my initial purchase decision and user experience to a "T".

romrunning

I used to laugh when I would see older people driving who would accelerate rapidly from a stop and then poke along when reaching their lower "cruising" speed. However, in looking at ways to get the highest MPG, I think that actually might be the best method for getting the best MPG from this hybrid powerhouse.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

I dont think that to be true.
one doesnt buy a vehicle of this class, even used, for the fuel mileage...even with the hybrid moniker

someone buying a 8-10 year old flagship likely doesnt care about fuel cost or maintenance cost.
Rather, they know what the car is and how capable it is.

truonghthe

well done crab boy, and that someone is me. Trust me if MPG or maints cost was the deal breaker I wouldn't buy my RL in the first place, I laughing every time when people buying luxury or sport car and complaining about the repair bills/ MPG and maint. I guess I am accustomed to repair bill since the Acura Legend lol.


RLX SH is a rare breed but it also will have a double edge sword effect (well not so much for guy who trade in every 3 years) is that when the car getting old (10 years) not too many aftermarket part available for these car so the only source is from dealer/manufacture and you will be at their mercy for part pricing.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

the gotta have it's pay for it and I reap the benefits, later.

However; I full well know what I would be getting into with part replacements.
it's like any other cool ass used flagships on the market right now.. SURE! price of entry is low....Lot's of AMG cars for pennies!!
but when going in on such a car, you have to know parts wont be cheap. or fuel, for that matter.

George Knighton

Speaking as one of those older people, yes, it is the best way.

:-p

RL09

I came in to type something very similar then saw your post. Original RL price is similar, only once on the 2nd hand market, many in those discussions cite mileage as an important factor.

I have more concerns but I'm uncertain of certain rlx detailed specs to see if my concerns are worthy. I intend to find out while at dealer next week.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Just past 60,000 miles and the original brake pads all around are still measuring near new. Amazing!

hondamore

My 10 year ownership comments were primarily directed in response to comments regarding the RLX's depreciation rate and a solution to the "problem". For those who don't mind paying extra to scratch that "new car itch", I have no problem with more frequent purchases.

In my opinion, Acura flagships seem to have a very different depreciation "cycle" than the German luxury brands. There seems to be a large demand for 2-3 year old Mercedes and BMW's coming of leases - the segment of the population who want to look like they are wealthy enough to waste money on a very expensive car but whose budget necessitates buying used (or those who are simply practical enough to let somebody else eat the first big bite of depreciation). The demand for these brands seems to drop dramatically, however, when the warranty period expires and those VERY expensive repair bills preclude ownership demand. The RLX, in contrast, lacks the snob appeal to create that initial demand for lease returns and as a result, suffers higher initial depreciation. Then, later on in their life cycle, they become more attractive due to the throngs of loyal Honda/Acura buyers seeking a taste of the luxury features at a fraction of the original cost and thanks to historically fewer and less expensive repair costs (relative to their German equivalents). Thus, I believe it is easier to sell a 10 year old Acura flagship than a 10 year old Mercedes or BMW and thus the price you can get is often a pleasant surprise.

Just my two cents.

mondster

Article is from 2016

RDX10

hondamore

As hybrids become more and more common, the cost of battery replacement continues to fall as many manufacturers offer "refurbished" batteries for their hybrids at a cost that is not a lot more expensive than replacing the timing belt. That said, if the public perception is that shared by RDX10, then it would hurt resale.

I will likely trade in my Sport Hybrid at my Acura dealer and their cost to replace the battery will be far less than their cost to replace the tires before they resell the car.

Further to the point regarding resale value of hybrids, there are already several governments around the world that are banning the sale of ICE only cars and Hybrid-only traffic lanes are popping up everywhere, so I'm pretty sure those trends may help the resale value of hybrids in the future as non-hybrids suffer the same fate as "Hummers" did once they are labeled as gas guzzlers.

alum04org

Enjoyed this thread and your thoughts. Just began discussing a replacement for Wifey's 2008 TL Type S (still love the car, 97K miles, but the little things going wrong lately are wearing on her), and was looking at the RL/RLX as an option.

RL09

So my general opinion on this Forbes article is that it's very biased and perceived from a purely market angle.

That Forbes reporter doesn't take into consideration the kind of car being purchased here, and how it compares to it's peers from other brands. The performance and options on the RLX is simply far more superior.

The reporter focuses mainly on resale value. And that is affected I think by people who do not know what the RL/RLX really is. They do not understand the HUGE difference with a miserable little TL/TLX, and do not understand the quality and reliability they would enjoy with a car like this vs peer brands.

As for my personal choice, I test drove an RLX (not hybrid) and found it a nice car, just the drive is different than my RL. Too different. I'll explain.

I do not controlling my car via some simulator. I want hands on drive-feel. I don't like that I am only simulating steering left or right, but a computer is steering eventually. I don't get to feel a tiny little street condition, I don't have the same response time - and I am very detail oriented while driving.

I don't like that a computer is taking my commands and working three electric motors, one on each back tire, to manage acceleration/deceleration. The real time camshaft feel coming out of one engines depressing one pedal, feels real.

I do not like a computer driving my car for me, even if it is with my commands.

I wish they'd bring back the RL as it was up to 2012, and add all the new stuff to it. I'd be floored, in love, and would sell a kidney and buy it brand new.

hondamore

I believe the "computer control" features of MOST modern cars is primarily safety driven. Lane keep assist, Traction control, ABS, Adaptive Cruise Control, Collision Mitigation Braking and other features which are all convenient and make driving more pleasurable, are all primarily SAFETY features that require electronic intervention to work. You can't get a 5-star safety rating without these features and it is tough to sell a luxury car without a 5-star safety rating.

That said, I think you should test drive the Sport Hybrid version of the RLX. I think you will be surprised at how "natural" it feels. I drove an '05 RL for 10 years and my Sport Hybrid RLX is even more "fun" to drive.

Just my two cents.

RL09

I did not say anything about those features. I suppose electronic control over the steering wheel makes the lane keep assist work. But still...

The direct handling of steering cannot be the same...

hondamore

I don't disagree with you that electronically controlled steering is not the same as its mechanical ancestors. All I am saying is that ALL manufactures HAVE to use the modern electronic systems primarily for safety reasons and sadly that means we all have to get used to driving with the help of a computer.

RL09

Sounds like grounds for a class action.

I am more reliable than a computer malfunction - and on steering wheel? High chance of deadly malfunction.

Sorry - but no thanks.

hondamore

Your beloved RL has a computer that pumps the brakes for you, has traction control that cuts power to the throttle when it senses a skid and does so WITHOUT FAILURE. The latest technology is equally reliable AND doesn't get tired or get distracted and can react MUCH faster than a human ever could. Bottom line, modern cars are just plain safer than ever before. Zero chance of deadly malfunction, very high chance that it would save your ass some day.

Bottom line, drive what makes you happy.

Malibu Flyer

I agree with everything hondamore says above. You should really test drive a Sport Hybrid RLX. It certainly has a different feel than anything else you may have driven and while it won't give you the 'old school' control feeling you seem to desire, most of us who own the car really like the drive. In fact that is what made me buy the car after a 30 minute test drive. I too had a '05 RL on which I put on over 120,000 wonderful miles. While I really liked the RL, I find the RLX Sport Hybrid's drive different but even more fun to drive.

I will add that if you don't want to have the computers driving the car you will find less and less options as time goes on. Cars these days are computers with 4 wheels. That is a trend which is increasing, not diminishing.

RL09

Dont remind me

Is it full time like that, or only for cmbs?

I'm old fashioned that way.

I can understand it can still feel good like the Sport-Hybrid, but yes I'm the type who likes to feel my ride, her responses...

RLX-Sport Hybrid

A few weeks ago I made a post here about a momentary and unexpected hydroplane incident at full highway speed at night into and through a puddle that scared me for a second. Seeing in the HUD the way the power was rerouted in real time to the different wheels to keep that seemingly uncontrolled moment in time to a minimum and help me avoid a clear accident into a retaining wall, is just an example of the fantastic technology that works when you need it. I can't say that almost any other drive system would have reacted the same, even the semi-electonic/mechanical original SHAWD in the RL, TL and MDX. There have been countless times in which the traction control offered in the hybrid version of the SHAWD made minced meat of road conditions that other drive systems may have had real issues with. I generally don't drive in the snow because I have the luxury not to, so I really need "limp home" abilities in case while I am trying to get home from somewhere and it starts to snow, I can get there safely. After 3 years with the Blackbird, and 4 years previously with my old TL with the older version of the SHAWD, I can say unequivocally that the hybrid SHAWD is miles ahead of its time, and one day automotive historians will appreciate the RLX Sport Hybrid as something special. It was and is the test mule for the system for Acura in the market place, and now they are continuing to spread its technology around the brand. The RDX and TLX are next to get some version of it. The news that Acura is looking to bring a turbo V6 option to the market is great! If or when they make a turbo V6-hybrid option for the RLX, it will be a NSX "light" performance vehicle and if they do that in conjunction with the Performance Crafted show car, it will be a tremendous success for the brand. I hope they do. I will be a buyer if that hits the market.

This changes nothing in my mind to get the Cadzilla I am planning to buy. That is a separate bucket list gift to myself. Have a nice day everyone. Be safe.