RLX-Sport Hybrid

As I was at my dealer this evening I ran into an Acura executive who just happened to be there. We had a brief but interesting conversation and I jumped at the opportunity to speak to him on behalf of all of us on the board. I told him that if the RLX is to actually be the flagship of the brand and the NSX is to be the halo car, then they have to get real serious about it and make a commitment to it in marketing and further product development because their competition is. We will see what if anything comes from this contact, but I hope they take me seriously as I think we on this forum have a lot of ideas that they should listen to as we are their target buyers and they best not forget it. If this topic peaks your interest I will expand on my conversation with him.

Malibu Flyer

I'm very interested in his response to you, if you are in a position to share what he said.

pgeorg

As am i.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Ok, so here is the rest of the discussion.

When I went in to pick up my MDX from service, I found the service manager, the sales manager and the Acura corporate manager all talking with each other about how to best market an unsold 2014 ILX that was still on the showroom floor. The Acura rep turned to me and asked if a sign saying $10,000 off would entice me to buy it. I said no as I am not the demographic to buy that car at this time. The sales manager then said that I am one of their very special customers as I have purchased many Acuras over the years and currently own both a new MDX and a Sport Hybrid. The Acura rep’s face lite up and he said “well I want to talk to you”! So he and I started our fairly brief discussion from there. I said that there are many things Acura is doing well, but there are clear opportunities to capture new customers if they were to make some changes. The rep frowned momentarily, but was respectful and patient listening to what I had to say. Here are the things I touched on:

1. The show car wheels and brakes typically look great but what we get in the production models pale by comparison. (TLX and RLX show cars relative to the production versions)

2. Limited hybrid options for both economy and performance. It should be available in every model these days and the more they do the lower the manufacturing costs will be per unit of production.

3. TSB issues regarding wind noise and most importantly the suspension noises many including me have complained about. (The Blackbird is at the shop as I write this post right now to address it again and I already had the TSB done previously). They clearly saw an issue and redesigned the 2016s to have updated shocks and sway bars to remove or eliminate the problem, so clearly there is a repair that can be implemented. That is what I am hoping they will do for me.

4. The car reviewers were not coached on how to access 1st gear and thus the reports on performance, while very complimentary, don’t give the whole picture as everyone who tested it did so starting in 2nd gear!

5. The hybrid technology going into the next NSX is directly shared with the Sport Hybrid and they have not referenced that at all in the current marketing efforts that I have seen. I said that both cars should be marketed together, partially to share the marketing budget across two models, but also to draw more positive attention to the brand to show off how cutting edge they can be. If you are dreaming of an NSX but it is outside your budget, the Sport Hybrid is a way to get a hint of what it is like to drive an NSX for $65,000 or less depending on the version (which they should all be the Advance model for manufacturing simplicity).

6. All Sport Hybrid owners should be offered a special NSX experience ( on a race track like Road America or at Monticello Motor Club) which would of course be video taped to make testimonials for future marketing campaigns as well as woo those buyers to consider the NSX as a bucket list purchase. Maybe to offer an exclusive deal for Sport Hybrid customers (Ferrari does this as you can’t just go into a dealership and buy a LaFerrari off the floor. You have to be “invited” to buy one). I’m not saying the NSX is on the same level as Ferarri, but conceptually keeping the Acura customers “in the family” could also elevate the brand in general if they publicized it correctly. Exclusivity is a hard thing to create when you have volume, but less so if you have limited supply. The Sport Hybrid is exclusive ONLY because of the short supply because very few people (in the public) truly know about the car, much less the people who sell it. Only us owners truly get it and that irritates me.

I continued on from there with additional thoughts but that covers the bulk of my comments. I emailed the Acura rep last night offering to share additional ideas in greater detail so we will see what if any response comes from this.

hondamore

RLX-Sport Hybrid...you did an excellent job of conveying many of the sentiments shared on this board to the Acura executive. Hopefully he/they will take your comments to heart.

holografique

Great stuff, and thank you.

My only wish is that I could have been part of that conversation to convey some perspectives from the PAWS "alpha" testers...the ones who have brunted the most amount of pain in Acura's failure of the RLX.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

That was the goal. Had I been able to plan for such an opportunity I would have had a topic list prepared as that was just off the top of my head. Hopefully it will translate into meaningful change. Truly I hope they engage all of us as a focus group so we can all participate in the discussion. One of the coolest things about the ICE is the when the Vtec kicks in. It reminds me of my first Acura which was a 1989 Integra. Although much less powerful, there was something about winding the needle past 4k to 7k rpm gauge that kept me doing it time and time again. We get that effect in the Sport Hybrid too, but imagine it with a single small turbo added! We don't want to step on the NSX's toes (well maybe a little), but how cool would that be??? The only issue is we can only enjoy that experience in 1st, 2nd and for a short while in 3rd gears as we are already blowing past every posted speed limit in North America by then. But boy isn't it fun? I think so. That is what the average person does not experience and appreciate. They mention it in a recent TLX commercial, but that is about it if my memory serves me.

brian6speed

iTrader: (5)

If Acura listens to its customers their cars will just get worse. That is why Acura/Honda is so bad now compared to 80's/90's.

Acura buyers are stupid. They don't realize performance vs luxury is about compromise. They don't know difference between double wishbone and mac strut suspension geometries, etc. It would be like having a house wife telling Nasa how to build spaceship.

You want Acura to give a free driving school to RDX owners where they drive NSX, lol. Why would Acura do that, makes no sense.

First off, offering driving school won't sell more RDX'S because soccer mom's don't care about race track driving. Acura would just lose over 1k for every driving school entry.

Offering free driving schools won't sell more NSX'S also. If I drove the NSX on track it would convince me not to buy it, not other way around. Heavy car with no steering feel that understeer at limit for novice drivers, no thanks.

People who buy RDX'S are not track rats and will never track RDX or any vehicle for that matter.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

I made no reference to RDX buyers, only Sport Hybrid owners, and yes if the NSX is supposed to be a special car (not for everyone), then doing special things for those buyers is part of the enjoyment of purchasing such a vehicle. Buying luxury items like that often have "perks" such as if my wife were to enter a fancy store the sales people may offer her a glass of Champaign as a nice touch. There are Caddilac CTS-V track days for "certain" select people just as there are Porsche, Ferarri, Lamborghini, and Jaguar track days at the Monticello Motor Club, Limerock, Circuit of the Americas and others for members and select guests only to enjoy a factory day with trained factory authorized drivers to get their best and newest cars on a closed private track. Typically there are very nice lunches provided, exclusive grab bag items not available to the public, and many other things that make that day special. It is possible you have not experienced such a thing so you may not believe these things are what luxury buyers enjoy sometimes. However, Acura does not provide this experience yet maybe they should. You seem to disagree and that is fine. I believe that if Acura or any auto manufacturer wants to sell more product, they should hear constructive feedback from its current and potential customers. You may not agree but I think the average enthusiast knows much more than they used to in times past. Back in the 60's and 70's you could build a monster motor and install it in your garage with little more than fairly basic tools. Now you need engineers, scientists and massive computing to design and build what we drive today. It is hard to tinker with a car anymore. However, I think the NSX while not perfect and nothing is, was designed not to kill its customer so they could live long enough to buy another Acura one day. So if it plows the front end unless you are in sport plus or what ever is the track ready setting, so what. If you drove that car fast enough on a public road for it to under steer, you have already put everyone else's lives in danger around you because you are going way too fast.

Malibu Flyer

My suggest for Acura [since i am sure they are listening] is to offer test drives in the RLX Sport Hybrid to a select owners of PAWS and TLXs. Would not have to be on a track, but some interesting drive where a potential customer could feel the car's handling and power. Test drives of this type would do a lot more for Acura's sales figures than track drives of the NSX.

I don't mean to dis the concept of a NSX track experience but Acura certainly needs to improve marketing of the RLX, especially the Sport Hybrid. Baby steps.

BTW - I personally would jump at the chance to test drive a NSX on a track if it were offered.

JM2010 SH-AWD

I second that!

neuronbob

Thanks for taking my idea to the visiting exec! I'll take a test drive in a 2G NSX any day of the week.

Thanks for speaking up for us.

holografique

Does that actually even have to be stated? I just assumed it was assumed

RLX-Sport Hybrid

It occurred to me that by stating that only Sport Hybrid owners should get the special treatment, I was being rude by excluding the FWD RLX owners. Not my intention. My apologies. The idea behind the track day concept was just a thought to make the "flagship" buyer feel special as other brands do that in some way, and Acura does not. It would be fun to do it, but who knows if you don't ask right?

RLX-Sport Hybrid

It was the best I could do with no notice and I was trying to remember what others had struggled with and report those things.

By the way, my front shocks are being replaced with new ones again. I tried to see if they would use the 2016 versions and the new sway bars. They are not doing it. Now if it happens again.... I will pick up the Blackbird tomorrow.

George Knighton

It is scary having to instruct in a group of drivers whom an organization is unable to vet.

Just saying.

Been there. Done that. Won't do it again.

Putting somebody whom you do not know into a high HP car can lead to unfortunate situations.

You can wrestle him for the steering wheel but there is no way you'll reach the brake pedal across that console.

:-)

George Knighton

People need to do Group 1 in little 90 HP Civics.

:-)

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Again the concept of the track day with an NSX was just an attempt at pointing out that Acura could do something (anything) special for their target market customer like other manufacturers do.

George Knighton

That's fine, and I understand completely, but you'll have to prove the vetting or you won't be able to get people to sit the right seat.

:-)

Rollercoaster at VIR with somebody who doesn't know what he's doing will make even an experienced old man throw up.

It's a grand idea, but I'm just not sure how you'd do it.

First off, how many NSX Sport Hybrid are the firm going to risk putting on track at once?

I mean, you'd need a dozen of them.

Event insurance goes through the roof when you have to say they're all Group 1 sorts of people, or, even worse, Group 2 sorts of people who think they know things they really don't.

And if it's in a state with a common law tradition, no event waiver or organization waiver is going to limit the tort action, as Porsche has learned to its great cost.

I don't want to get into a fight with you. I know where you are coming from, and I think we'd all like for that kind of thing to be realized...but I don't see how it could happen.

:-)

George Knighton

You could do something like Tesla does every once in a while.

But that's not that much fun, now, is it?

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Maybe it was not the greatest idea. So they should provide better coffee at the dealership. That will make people feel special right? I hope the spirit of my recommendation was received even if the deliverable was not.

wstr75

Hey, I am glad you brought up the NSX driving experience to the Marketing person. What you don't ask for, you don't get. And a big YES to your connecting the RLX-Hybrid to the NSX. It is the "same" technology (albeit at a significantly higher level of performance in the NSX) and why not leverage the breakthroughs Honda's engineers have accomplished by showing off the technology through BOTH vehicles?

I sure would like to own a hybrid NSX and hope Acura sells a whole slew of them so maybe in 2026 I can buy a ten year old NSX for a good price. So, yes, yes, yes to Acura letting folks drive NSXs so more folks can experience the thrill and hopefully will ante up $155,000+ . . . . .so there will be more used NSXs on the road ten years from now . . . . . for a guy like me to buy at a good price!

JM2010 SH-AWD

Good point. I'm reminded of when I was an "instructor" at a Japanese motorcycle company's "guest day" at an off-road venue. Flashbacks of screaming engines coupled with shouts of "pull in the clutch, pull in the clutch" still haunt me, followed by exploding picnic tables of potato salad!

nist7

Dang! That is scary and a good point to totally vet the attendees...maybe only let certain ones drive the cars but anyone can attend and watch/mingle.

I had a personal lesson in this when I was at a Ford test drive/demo event few years ago and crashed a new Mustang GT over the curb at a parking lot test course....quite embarrassing and painful to the ego than to the body , thankfully.

Definitely raises my respect for higher hp powered RWD cars.

But to go back to the thread topic, I was hoping to hear more from Acura's side on what they have in plan for marketing/change in their line up....looks like so far its a one sided, but good ideas from OP, where an acura enthusiast had the ears of some higher ups from Acura for few min.

I just looked on acura site and saw the top end RLX is MSRP over 60,000! Sorry but if I'm in the market for a 60k higher end luxury car Acura likely not top of my list.......

TacoBello

I like how you feel entitled, as someone who bought a 60k car, to get preferential treatment to drive a 250k car. That's not even the same realm.

I also like how you specifically cut non-SH owners out, because hey, SH owners are 2 steps above everyone else

I also like how you think Acura should specifically focus on the people who buy 600 SHs per year, rather than the people who buy car models that actually make Acura money. Yes, Acura should invest more money on that money burning platform.

I also like how you equate Acura to being on the same level as Porsche, Ferrari, Lamborghini, Jaguar and even Cadillac. (you say you don't, but please, that's exactly what you're doing)

I also like how you think that because Cadillac has CTS-V days, for CTS-V owners to drive their CTS-Vs, you believe that RLX-SH owners should be able to drive a car that's not even theirs (the NSX) around a track, because hey, they're entitled to. Have you considered what the insurance costs for something like that are? Maybe buy an NSX first and then ask Acura to set some track days up.

I also like how you were trying to speak for all of Acura buyers and enthusiasts, by telling the Acura Exec what YOU want to see from Acura. I'm sorry, but are you not seeing the issues here?

Finally, I question your driving prowess if you think it's difficult to understeer a car on public roads. Don't take it personally, but based on your statement above, I wouldn't want you anywhere near a 250k sports car being pushed to its limits.

Thank you and good day.

hondamore

^^If you re read the OP's statement, the Acura rep ASKED to talk to him and ASKED for his opinions. He is entitled to share his views when asked.

Having a special track day to ride along in an NSX as a special "thank you" to buyers of your flagship sedan is not an outrageous idea - especially when sales of that flagship haven't been stellar.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

Taco,

Life is very short and I am going to waste just so much of my time addressing you by saying this: If you are trolling on the RLX side of AZ with the intent of stirring trouble, lobbing insults and inaccurate interpretations of the comments made here as well as the people who post on the RLX forum (all of us), then only go back into ramblings and crow about how we are pretentious elitist entitled people, you are only making yourself look stupid. My intent was to try to think of what others had said previously and share those ideas, in addition to my own perspective (for the benefit of everyone as I do not have a axe to grind like you do for some reason). I want the brand to do well in the market place. Providing constructive feedback was the intent. Both your country and ours have made it a priority and a right to freely express ourselves, even if that expression is in direct opposition to someone else. However you apparently did not get that message while you were in high school as well as realize that insulting others only makes you look truly stupid. Grow up and get some class, since you have none. Yes it is the internet and anything goes apparently, but unless you have something constructive to add (and you have demonstrated time and time again you don't), go elsewhere.

Good day sir.

neuronbob

Wow has this thread gone off the rails in my absence.

a) The NSX driving day was only an idea. I'm sure Acura will sweat the details should they decide to actually do something like this.

b) Taco, I have no problem with treating folks who bought the most expensive product (currently) in the lineup, to something special to keep them with the brand.

Mercedes dos it, BMW does it, Cadillac does it, why shouldn't Acura? It's part of what true luxury brands do.

Last, keep the powder dry and keep it on topic. This ain't Ramblings, chaps.

cu2wagon

I do believe you answered your own question.

TacoBello

Please, show me ONE company that wants you to drive a quarter million dollar vehicle of theirs after spending 50-60k on a different model. I'm all ears.

I can understand if maybe Acura put together an autocross day for RLX owners to bring their own cars and put them to the test (not that anyone would show up), but what was suggested is nothing short of nonsense.

This thread IS still on topic. I've just looked through every other section and I'm trying to find where people have been asking for a hybrid ILX or TLX (in something more than a random, one off comment). I don't see anything. What's even more ludicrous is how we all know the production numbers for the RLX-SH and the NSX are limited, in part, due to the batteries. If Honda can't churn out more than ~600 SHs and ~800 NSXs per year, how are they going to mass sell hybrid ILXs and TLXs. Didn't Honda itself say they limited the RLX-SH production numbers due to constraints with manufacturing?

I'm also curious as to what I misinterpreted and where insults were flung. Questioning someone's driving ability, based on their own comments is not an insult.

ceb

I think that the mere question of asking an RLX driver what it would take to buy a two year old ILX clearly shows that (at least that person) they don't know their buyer demographics.

I think what Acura needs to do is figure out what the competition is and then figure out a way to match the quality and features at a better pricepoint.

If the RLX is competition for the E-class, then it needs to have similar options and the advertisements need to clearly show that comparison.

Where are the auto high beams that go around corners, the pre-safe like functions and all the rest? Acura has SH-AWD that (unless you read the German AutoMotorSport magazine) is superior to 4Matic.

While the Hybrid is an interesting feature, I'm not sure it is draw for luxury car buyers that look at MB because it has one huge disadvantage - it decimates trunk space which is an important feature in this segment.

neuronbob

Haven't seen insults yet, just being preemptive, and my comment wasn't directed at you in particular, Taco.

I'm just surprised at the level of emotional debate over a suggestion that, given Acura's track record, will likely not come to pass anyway.

A more realistic suggestion for Acura is to do a V-corral like Cadillac does for CTS-V owners at various racing venues around the country, in support of the Pirelli championship racing. I attended such an event at Mid-Ohio last summer. They brought a 3G CTS-V and the Cadillac staff gave rides to a few lucky people between races. I'd take a ride in a 2G NSX around Mid-Ohio any day of the week. Alternately, since Acura has a TLX in that racing series, they could even invite TLX owners.

PS, cu2, Touché. Hopefully Acura can make a change for the better.

Jim 2004

Since we're competing with other premium brands, how about Japanese delivery for the RLX? Kind of like BMW and Mercedes, who let overseas customers go to Germany to drive their just-built cars before they are shipped. Might be an adjustment for Americans since the Japanese drive on the left-hand side of the road, but probably safer than track day in the new NSX.

JM2010 SH-AWD

^^ Yikes. I have enough trouble driving left-hand cars on left-driving roads overseas. Lots of scrubbing the curbs with the left wheels!

holografique

For the record, the whole "track day" thing is not that far fetched.

Saab did it back in 98/99 during the release of the Aero 9-3 / 9-5 series. I attended one at Stone Mountain here in Atlanta, and it was awesome. They had 2 courses, one where you got to drive the cars through a course they laid out using cones in a very very large open parking lot area. The other course you sat shotgun with a professional driver while they followed suit with about 5 other cars all in tandem, literally on each others asses, at high-speeds and tight turns.

It was a ton of fun, and don't recall anything that was done that created any major liability or question of safety.

Certainly not the same as taking an NSX out on a track, but again, it's not that far-fetched.

Comfy

Saw a good TV advert today for Acura RLX which showed the NSX and Acura precision concept prominently. I think Acura's advertisement is in line with what OP discussed with the manager (mentioned somewhere in the beginning of this thread). It's possible they took some part of his comments seriously or someone from Acura is following this thread.

RLX-Sport Hybrid

I'm sure my comments had nothing to do with it, but it is a coincidence. Those commercials take months to produce so it was in motion long before. Oh well.

Comfy

I understand. That's why I said it's "possible". Lol. Anyway glad that Acura is moving in the right direction, that is - desirability.

dzionny_dzionassi

What direction? I'll believe it when I see it. I mean actual product... Everything is joke in current Acura lineup. I like hybrid drivetrain idea in RLX.