nothome17

Coming up on 100K miles on my 2007 Acura TL Type S. I'm considering of trading it in and leasing a TSX.

I don't think I will be keeping the car for more than 4 years or driving the car more than 10K miles a year.

First time leasing, so I need some tips or advise on working out a deal with the dealers. What should I look out for? What questios should I ask? What fees should I avoid?

TSXy Luster

If you are adamant about leasing a car and only keeping it for under 4 years and have all the money to spend, then go get yourself a BMW.


I drive 3500 miles a year in my TSX and I bought it.

aznspectre

Are you saying you don't recommend leasing? I was considering it also only because I know sometime down the road, I might want to change cars

bdwpac81

TSXy, can you explain further?

MrOtocinclus

nothome17, I'm on my second TSX lease. The first thing to do is to not treat this as a lease. Treat it as if you were buying a new car, and negotiate everything up front. In other words, get a good price first, don't mention it's a lease. Don't consider monthly payments, because the dealer will use the illusion of low monthly payments to trick you into paying more.

Then, look up Acura's lease rates for this month. Here's a good resource:

http://www.ridewithg.com/index.php/2...es-march-2012/

Another resource to look at is leaseguide: http://www.leaseguide.com/

After this, you should be well-armed going into any lease. Good luck.

nothome17

MrOtocinclus: Good info, thank for the links.

You don't mind giving me a run down on the numbers you got for your last 2 leases. So in, that way, I can use it as a negotiating template.

TSXy LUSTER: I did look into other cars but only Acura was willing to give me the full market value for my 2008 Acura TL Type S.

nothome17

Ohh BTW, I did read the post by TTK5 on his post " Might be bye-bye time. " and read all the opinions. He sure did get slammed by some chick in there. Hilarious.. some chick got butt hurt about not helping the economy. Speaking of economy, killed time at work reading it.

ceb

How very true. Too often do I see people forget that they need to negotiate the price up front, including all costs before you start talking lease.

Don't ever answer the question about "what do you want your monthly payments to be" seriously. My usual answer is "I'm not sure if I want to pay cash or finance the car yet." A further iquiry gets a "I'm looking at paying $2.95 a month - can you do that?"

The "money factor" is often times negotiable as well, but you will lose if you dont clarify the price of the car first.

PyroDave

nothome, you may be able to sell the 08 TLs privately without too much difficulty depending on miles and condition for above your buyout price, and then go in for the lease without trading in. price depends on state and stuff due to taxes. when i went to lease, i told them i do not want to put anything upfront, and to roll everything in. i paid $330 a month for 36 months on a base 2010 TSX I4 with absolutely 0 down.

nothome17

Neither did I know you can negotiate the price up front.

Thought about selling it privately but I live in Arizona. Probably get shot and killed. Mexico is just around the corner. Not worth my life I think. But i'll think about it some more.

PyroDave

i mean... its arizona, i really dont think you'll get shot trying to sell a TLs... its not a 70K car, its like 25K

iamitman

You PM Box is full so here is your reply. I leased my SE for $349/month with zero down when they had that off around MLK day, Jan 16th. Offer was for only base TSX but they were willing to do anything for me to get in the 6MT SE as it was not in demand in my area. So, it all depends on your dealer if you can lease an SE. Hope this helps!

Good Luck!

TSXy Luster

leasing vs. buying/financing is always a debate among people and there is no need trying to convince the other side of your own reasons. I personally hate leasing cars and I bought/financed my TSX.

As for other dealerships not giving you your price for your current car, you can always go private like what he said or keep shopping around until you find a dealership that will.

nothome17

I forgot to mention that I'd prefer the redesign of the TSX if it doesn't get cancelled. So probably the 3rd year of the new TSX.

That's why I'm thinking about leasing. Don't plan to keep the TSX but would like to buy the new one if it looks sexy. right TSXy?

TSXy Luster

TSXy thinks the 2nd gen TSX is TSXy enough. It is TSXy in all the right places with its TSXy curves, which just gives you more to hold on to and love during TSXy times.

nothome17

I agree, it does look TSXy but I'm banking the 3rd gen TSX will top the 2nd gen. Remeber the 2nd gen integra? The 3rd gen integra was a lot sexier. And take for example the 3rd gen TL. Which I have right now. Soo sexy.. 3rd time is TSXy....

iamitman

There will be no 3rd gen TSX, it seems.

TSXy Luster

you don't know that. no one knows that (except some of the big wigs at Acura) until it is official. All everybody is doing now is speculating, or in other terms: assuming and we all know what that means.

krolyat

Since we are unsure of what is to come of the ILX and the 3rd gen TSX I would wait until spring comes and they announce the price of the ILX. (it's still on track to hit showrooms in the spring according to Acura's site)

The price should give us a glimpse in to what is to come or if it really is the "speculated" TSX replacement

Since you will be leasing if they do happen to git rid of the current TSX your depreciation would not be quite as bad as if you owned the new TSX you are looking to get.

mkeefe

Lease only if you don't intend to drive over the allotted amount, it can become costly very quickly. If you happen to own your own company, lease it under that, its tax deductible. However if you buy it under a business you can also depreciate over time.

If its for personal use then i'd be certain a lease is what you want. I crunched all the numbers when I was shopping and decided my monthly payment was low enough i'd just finance. Based on the amount I put down it made it much more manageable and in 4 years (wow, long time) i'll own the car outright, if I don't pay it off faster.

Matt

ceb

The ILX will clearly not be a replacement for the TSX but it will become the new "entry level" Acura by virtue of being the least expensive.

As a general rule, current models only take a resale hit when they are facelifted or a new version of the same model comes out. The BMW 3 series took a hit this year once the new 3 series arrived here but it didn't take a hit when the 1 series arrived a few years back.

You inadvertently brought up a benefit of leasing that many people find attractive - knowing what the "trade-in" value of their car is at the end of the lease, while selling your car after a few years is a crap shoot.

Leasers must also be aware that they can negotiate the buy out price of their car at the end of the lease if they want to buy it or they can sell it privately if they think that they can get more than the buy out price, but they are assured of a residual value for their own planning purposes.

For all practical purposes, when you are leasing, you are merely paying the anticipated depreciation plus interest and, if you take care of the car and stay within the mileage limits, you can calculate the costs of driving the car for three years almost down to the penny - something you cannot do when buying a car.

Just for the record, I've never considered leasing a car because of the miles I drive, so I'm not an advocate - or a detractor - of leasing.

Leasing clearly has more potential pitfalls than buying if you aren't careful. Dealers can play more games and obfuscate more costs in a lease. They have invented new terms for commonly known words to increase the mystery of leasing and making it sound less ominous. "Cap cost reduction" instead of "down payment" and "money factor" instead of "interest" are all calculated to have you focus on one thing - the monthly payment. Making the money cactor a tiny little fraction is designed to make you think that it is an inconsequential number, when in fact it generally is a pretty hefty interest rate.

ceb

A few years ago my sister needed to replace her aging RL and wanted to replace it with a new RL but thought she would downsize in a few years. Since she puts very few miles on her car, we considered leasing and running the numbers actually made it worthwhile.

After negotiating a price and the MF (and reduced costs even more by paying all of the lease costs up front - kind of like multiple security deposits,) the total lease costs plus residual value ended up being $26 less than the negotiated cost alone.

If she decides to buy her car at the end of the lease, I'm pretty positive that she can negotiate the residual (buy out) cost down by a few thousand, making the lease far cheaper than buying the car outright.

This was a very unusual situation where all the stars were in alignment and Acura had low MF combined with an artificially high residual for a slow selling car with a depreciation that is incredibly high.

TSXy Luster

The estimated prices of the ILX models have already been released and while their highest trim is about $1000 below the TSX's base model, that does not mean the TSX is done.

nothome17

Theres a post: Looks Like the TSX Will NOT be Replaced by the ILX

Looks like theres going to be a 3 generation TSX. It's gonna be TSXy..

ressling

I leased my '09 TSX and vowed never to lease again. Interest rates are just too good right now, especially through Acura/Honda Financing (i.e. 0.9% APR). You're basically throwing away money if you'd ever want to buy it out.

Only car I would consider leasing these days is a BMW, because all maintenance/warranty issues besides tires are covered.

nothome17

Okay, so help me out here. When signing for the lease, what fees are legit and what are made up?

TrojanTSX

If you want to lease try a bank or credit union first. Acura's lease terms are terrible in my opinion.

With the credit union I am leasing, my 2011 is 340/month for 5 years, 2000 down, 15000 mile limit a year, no security deposit, 0.10 mile penalty for overage.

We picked up another TSX (2009 with 12,855 miles on it) for my wife at auction and are paying 280/month for 5 years with the same above.

First time leasing for me, 2nd time for the wife. I did it since I am not going to mod these cars and I never have owned a car more than 5 years. With leasing I have garaunteed equity at the end of the lease no matter what. The TSX is one of the few cars that have a high resale value which allows for a low lease payment. We looked at other cars around the same price of the TSX and the payments were about 100 more a month because of the huge depreciation factor.

The really nice thing is that I was hit last November in the 2011, caused 7500 in damage and since I used the credit unions body shop I have no worries about depreciation. That would not happen with a car that is being financed to purchase. My Blackbook value would have dropped at least one level maybe two depending on the dealer.

MrOtocinclus

I think at the end of the day, just pay whatever makes you comfortable. The amount of misinformation I see on the internet is astounding. It seems like everybody has the right answer, there's no use trying to use logic and facts.

MoaarLow

Yep! everyone to themselves has the right answer.
Just do all the negotiating wl the sales man. be very FIRM!
Theyre going to put you in what i call the "box" where you sign paperwork etc.
And theyre going to get you for your first months payment, doc fees, DMV fees ETC.

Just cause a little scene, You've put enough Down already etc. youre not comming out of pocket anymore, And be ready to walk out the office. I did it and surely he came after me and said dont worry about it. they will take the loss on a few hundred bucks to get the car on the road

ressling

If you end up leasing, don't put any money down. That was my biggest regret. Cap-cost reduction simply isn't worth it when you don't own...

TrojanTSX

I put a small down payment down which ends up about doubling my equity when I turn the car back in.

PyroDave

i put 0 down, including no taxes or anything. told them to roll everything into monthly payments. i pay 330 a month 36mo

TrojanTSX

Just curious....how many miles is that for and what is your penalty for overage?

ceb

There is no "equity" in a lease. Any money you put down as cap cost reduction is part of your lease costs and won't affect the residual.

Cap cost reduction will decrease your monthly payments and equal out in the long run if you keep your cat through lease end but is money flushed down the toilet if the car is totaled or you return your lease early.

TrojanTSX

Your right on most leases, however, on mine it will not be.

Lets just say that I can turn in my lease now and still have a really decent down payment for another car. This is true if the car is totaled also.


All I can say is that its good to have family in the leasing business!

ceb

Ahhhh...

ceb

Calculating the true cost of a lease is easy but nobody ever does it because they ALWAYS focus on monthly payments.

Lease costs:

Add total monthly payments to cap cost reduction, acquisition fees, lease turn in fees and what not (taxes, DMV fees etc) for your total lease costs. Add the residual and that is your total cost for the car.

Costs for buying:

Negotiated price plus tax, tags, fees plus total interest that you will pay over the life of the loan (bankrate.com or a number of other calculators will give you that bottom line number) for the total cost of your car.

Compare the two total costs to see how much more (or less) the lease costs you. At that point you can decide if it is worth it.

PyroDave

its for 10K miles/year and i believe overage is 12 or 15 cents. i had no intent to buy out

a77

Got to say leases in America sound far more complicated than in Canada. You have an interest rate that is published. You have a guaranteed buyout, depending on what mileage you agree, and that's it. My own deal is at 0%, the residual is 70% on a 2 year lease, that's it. dealers may want to tack on "lease agreement fees" or "documentation fees" and other crap but it can all be negotiated out. The dealer has to make a profit but whether they do this by reducing the price of the car substantially and then getting some of it back through these fees is up to them. You can always check on line, factor in what discount you want and bargain on that basis. Fact is cars depreciate whether you lease finance or pay cash. Just with leasing you have a guaranteed value after a set period. You can always try to sell privately if you want to. which is better primarily depends on how long you want to keep the car for. If you think for longer than the lease term then paying cash or financing, depending on rates, may well be a better deal.

ceb

Same thing in the US. Some posters here have muddied the waters because they got special deals or used confusing terminology.