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I've read a lot of good things about removing the clutch delay valve. From what I have read it was placed there to limit the flow of fluid that ends in the slave cylinder. There are tutorials on other forums. Basically remove the C clip and pull out that two pieces inside. I'm hoping it will help with the guessing of the bite point on the clutch as well as lazy clutch response. I've only had to downshift in a furry for intense acceleration a few times, but when I last had to do it i noticed that the clutch seemed to lag a split second behind my foot motion and I want to blame this delay valve for that. I've also read that this will help make the clutch last longer.
- I plan on purchasing a new CSC for piece of mind, is there a decent performancec aftermarket alternative (not low quality auto store ones) or should I just stick with OEM?
- Has anyone ever done this to their cu2 and can comment on their thoughts now thats is probably been years since the modification was done?
a company called, K-tuned, makes master and slave cylinders without this restrictor.
If I had to do it over again, I'd probably just buy this guy and install it. no need to fuck with the C-ring.
a company called, K-tuned, makes master and slave cylinders without this restrictor.
If I had to do it over again, I'd probably just buy this guy and install it. no need to fuck with the C-ring.
I was looking at that same posting but I couldn't verify that it would fit the 2g tsx. On K-Tuned's site it does not confirm it will fit. All K series use a universal CSC? The photo looks a bit different than the 2g tsx:
EDIT - Did some more image searching and they look pretty darn close. Will this part fit? You also mentioned the CMC has a restrictor too? The CMC is a PITA im not going to touch that one
note; it says some compatibility issues depending on line fitting orientation
Yeah I read that too. Looks like the fitting is diffrent than OEM, most likley for their SS clutch line. I'd like to stay OEM if I could, but if I had to why not.
i mean; if you're going through the trouble of buying a new slave cylinder, this could be a real shot!
i just took my original off, but of course, trouble with everything i do! lol
getting the C-clip out was a little difficult, and when I did get it...it sprung across the garage. be sure to point it down and cover with your hand, so you dont make the same mistake i did.
then, i needed my neighbor (luckily he is a car guy too) to help bleed the clutch
to be honest; it's only because these cars are "semi-luxury", and wanted the ride to be smooth.
I hate my dual mass flywheel setup and want a more conventional clutch set up
older cars never had these kinds of restrictors or valve delays in them
^check the front of the MC to see if it has this diamond shape on it.
f you look at the CMC on these cars more closely, you'll notice that all of these models have a triangular shaped feedback plate positioned at the very end of the cylinder. This plate is basically a secondary valve that was designed to slow down the clutch engagement and reduce shock to the clutch itself and the surrounding drivetrain parts. This setup might be perfectly fine for people that just drive their cars for simple daily use, but the delayed engagement can cause wear to the synchros and possibly even the gears on performance applications. The reason is fairly simple, the factory CMC delays the clutch operation, so it does not open fast enough to keep up with a fast shift. This means that pressure is being applied to the transmission synchros during the shift, before they are ready for the actual gear change.
it says it doesnt; but ive got to wonder why heeltoeauto sells it for my 06 TL. I havent really looked into it because i dont want to spend money.
but if I were to get serious; i'd look into it closely and figure things out. Just throwin ideas out!!!
I would love to do this, I forget how weird the clutch is in this car, until I drive my family members stick shift cars and realize how slow I clutch in and out in the tsx.
Chatted with K-Tuned. Long story short, this should work for the CU2. The part will work with 9th gen civics and it is the exact part number CSC as ours. The K-Tuned CSC requires K-Tuned's SS braided clutch line that goes from the CMC to the CSC. Our cars have steel lines that expose a ~1 foot area of rubber hose. It seems more common just to replace that hose rather than the whole line. Due to this reason the K-Tuned CSC is not going to be for me.
I'm going to pickup a new OEM CSC off of HeelToe (they are the cheapest) and get ready for a swearing fit trying to remove that damn C-Clip. I'm not too crazy on seeing any dremel marks on the CSC, but if I have to I will. I'm sticking with the OEM clutch line.
Here is the chat:
Hi, I cannot find for certain if part number KTD-CLK-KSS will fit a 2012 Acura TSX i4. Could you please check?
Also the description says "you may need to upgrade your clutch line", does this mean it will not work with OEM clutch lines?
- KTuned Rep - One sec, let me see if I can verify. KTuned Rep - We cannot confirm the fitment unfortunately.
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Can you confirm a new model Honda that it would fit? For example, the TSX uses the same CSC as the 9th gen civic
- KTuned Rep - Ours will work on the 9th gen Civic. We just have not confirmed for the 2012 TSX.
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Just to confirm, Civics from 2012 to 2015 correct?
Same part: https://www.hondapartsnow.com/genuine/honda~cylinder~assy~46930-swa-g01.html
- KTuned Rep - 9th gen us 2012-2015
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Does this CSC require an aftermarket SS clutch line? The connector looks diffrent from OEM
- KTuned Rep - It requires our clutch line
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Your clutch line goes all the way to the CMC. There are smaller versions that just replace the ~1 foot of rubber. Would something like this be compatible? https://www.heeltoeauto.com/fastline-performance-stainelss-braided-clutch-line-2009-14-acura-tsx-cu2.html
- KTuned Rep - Ours is designed to use our line.
I just ordered a new LUK dual mass flywheel and LUK Clutch and Pressure Plate for my TL; while I was at it I ordered a new Clutch Slave Cylinder which I figure I'll alter before the time comes to do the clutch.
I just ordered a new LUK dual mass flywheel and LUK Clutch and Pressure Plate for my TL; while I was at it I ordered a new Clutch Slave Cylinder which I figure I'll alter before the time comes to do the clutch.
Do you have a build thread for that or are you having a shop do the work?
Do you have a build thread for that or are you having a shop do the work?
I will be doing the work myself; that said, my plan is to milk the current clutch as long as I can. Currently, unless I'm up in VTEC range, the clutch holds perfectly well.
Ordered the CSC from HeelToe. $80 shipped, not a bad a price. Ordered a set of picks as well as a double sided 8mm and 10mm flared nut wrench. I just hope I dont accidentally catch one of the hooks in a finger when I am trying to remove that stupid C clip.
It looks like the service manual calls for another grease from where the rubber boot that shields the pin meets the metal CSC chassis. Part number 08C30-B0234M. It's very expensive. One forum was calling it M77 grease which has a diffrent part number and people were just using caliper slide grease instead. Not too worried about it but does someone know more about this grease?
Also, had a little chuckle in the service manual talking about the delay valve. According to the manual it only effects when engaging the clutch, not disengaging:
I'm curious about the M77 grease; that looks like engine assembly lube, the stuff you use when punching pistons in and coating new cam lobes with; I don't understand why such a lube would be used for a slave cylinder.
From searching it seems to be a silicone grease, a lot of searching brought results for brake caliper service. I'm guessing its purpose for the CSC is to add waterproofing when the rubber meets metal. Unless I'm missing something I'm just going to use simple caliper pin grease. This is what I have been using for 10+ years with good results: https://www.napaonline.com/en/p/BK_7651351
Got the CSC. Was able to perform the delay valve removal this morning. Took me about 15 minutes to remove the C clip. It was not as bad as I thought, although when I first started playing with it my patience was tested.
I ended up not really using the picks I purchased. I was able to get the C clip out with a razor blade and a fine flat tip screwdriver. Be careful, I had a few close call slips. I'd say the goal is to remove a little bit of steel on the CSC delay valve cap area so you can get a tool inside the groove to lift it out of place. Installation will hopefully be later today
I cant believe how restrictive the delay valve looks. Here are some photos of the process:
WOW. What a difference. I would have gladly paid $500+ for this type of improvement. I have brought the car to the dealer before because of the second and third gear nibble + clutch slipping. I thought I bought an abused car. The dealer never mentioned the CSC delay and what I am experiencing is normal. It was that stupid delay valve. At 52,000 miles I don't think my CSC was failing, but I wonder if that screen was getting clogged. I'll update if my opinion changes but I don't see why this shouldn't be recommended as a first mod when someone buys the manual TSX.
Results:
- No more clutch slipping in slow/relaxed shifts
- Bite point seems to be in the same spot every time
- 90% eliminated second and third gear nibble - It feels like a new gear box. It makes a smooth "Tick Tack" sound when entering a gear. After about 100 miles of driving, I felt the nibble a few times, which I am chalking up as rev matching/RPMs difference.
- Fast shifts are effortless
I'm beyond happy and baffled why they introduce this into cars. Looking at my old CSC, after 6 years and 52,000 miles, the delay valve area was filthy and corroded. It would have made the job so much harder. Definitely buy a new one if you can.
Hey guys, sorry to resurrect this thread, and this may be old news, but after studying the CSC for the TSX, it looks as though, with the flange position and everything else it may be a very close fit for the 4G SH-AWD 6mt TL's.
If you correct for orientation, check the photo's out.
4G TL Slave cylinder:
TSX CSC:
The ONLY difference seems to be that the chamber that holds the check valve has a C-clip and stopper, as to where the 4G TL's version, the end is capped over. I think I might buy one to confirm...
Let us know if you do. I don't think removing the delay valve is difficult nor time consuming to remove, having recently done so on the used Civic Si slave cylinder I am using. I was able to remove the steel cap after some effort it would be much easier removing the end on a new part.
I looked at other clutch master cylinders, too, but ended up buying a new LuK part, then removed the guts and happily found no delay valve inside.
Let us know if you do. I don't think removing the delay valve is difficult nor time consuming to remove, having recently done so on the used Civic Si slave cylinder I am using. I was able to remove the steel cap after some effort it would be much easier removing the end on a new part.
I looked at other clutch master cylinders, too, but ended up buying a new LuK part, then removed the guts and happily found no delay valve inside.
So the LUK one for the TL doesn't have a delay valve?
I didn't look for anything TL related, as I have an '11 TSX and am using an '08(?) Civic 6-speed, so some parts (clutch slave cylinder, hard line, bracket) were still present.
I dif remove the internal snap ring from the backside of the CMC, removed the pushrod, washer, and spring, and there was no delay valve present. I can' speak as to whether the Acura CMC for my '11 TSX has the delay valve inside or not, but here's the part number and interchange info from Acura:
The delay valve is located in the slave cylinder for the TL's, and apparently in the TSX as well.
They'll I usually in the slave cylinder on most cars I believe. That's why I'm so curious. With my 2012 Subaru legacy GT, they did the same thing, delay valve with the slave cylinder, but you could replace it with one from a WRX, and it was resolved. This is a little more tedious, but if the TSX CSC has the C-clip like it looks like it does, the flash position looks VERY similar to the TL's meaning it would fit the same.
I'll try to purchase one this coming weekend.
The delay valve is located in the slave cylinder for the TL's, and apparently in the TSX as well.
They'll I usually in the slave cylinder on most cars I believe. That's why I'm so curious. With my 2012 Subaru legacy GT, they did the same thing, delay valve with the slave cylinder, but you could replace it with one from a WRX, and it was resolved. This is a little more tedious, but if the TSX CSC has the C-clip like it looks like it does, the flash position looks VERY similar to the TL's meaning it would fit the same.
I'll try to purchase one this coming weekend.
Why bother trying to do a conversion; removing the delay valve is easy enough and well documented in this forum.
You show me where? Because, I was under the impression that the slave cylinder wasn't able to be modified due to it not having an accessible C-clip?
If you have a link that'd be very helpful...
The delay valve has to be inserted into the CSC body when it's assembled, so if there is not end cap retained by an internal snap ring like on the TSX's, it must be held inside another way. The aluminum body of the CSC cannot be cast and the inner bore machined after the plastic valve is put in place.
11-28-2017, 01:05 PM
I havent really looked into it because i dont want to spend money.
