TSX69

It is pretty clear tht a lot of people here are unhappy w/ the 2009 TSX but are we expecting too much from Acura? Do they actually know what they are doing? w/ their off-the-beaten-path-ways it is often hard to tell.

The TSX is supposed to be an entry level point to draw new customers in who will hopefully stay in the family when it is time to upgrade. Keeping it a 4 cylinder will help keep the cost down & may even be more attractive to buyers w/ gas prices what they are. I know I know, luxury shoppers have $$$ & are not that concerned w/ stuff like that but this is entry level so they are trying to appeal to those people who are looking @ Accords & might wanna spend a little extra for an Acura. Not to mention being the only 4 cylinder model out there gives them a niche market share that they can exploit.

The 2009 model is not that different from the 2004-2008 model which found buyers, so maybe the new 1 will not bomb like people are predicting. I was not around in 2003 when the TSX debuted, but was it greeted w/ the same amount of animosity & gloom & doom (A FWD, 4 banger rebadged JDM Accord?!?)

Now, apparently in a year or so the Type S will debut w/ a 6 cylinder, turbo diesel and/or SH-AWD based upon rumors. That will not only attract the more performance oriented people but also give current TSX owners who do not want a TL something to trade for. Granted, I do not completely understand the wait till 2009 when the competition already has like 300+ hp among other amenities that the TSX does not (keyless tart, ventilated seats ...)

Based upon their 5 year time line, these 2/3 levels of TSXs will attract a broad range of entry level luxury buyers so in 2014, they can introduce the TSX posters here has been waiting for & move up to Tier 1? In other words, they are taking the very slow approach ... which is ticking off enthusiasts but it may work. Acura is known for being relatively cheap so quickly jumping up in price may backfire on them.

Not to mention there have always been rumors of a coupe & convertible that may also debut in the 2009 body style that will help keep the public interested in the TSX over its 5 year run. On a side note: I still say that they should make a hybrid sedan just for bragging rights & variety reasons. A hybrid sedan & a turbo diesel coupe would be nice ... they do not have to have as many models as a 3 Series but some options not unlike the Civic would be a welcome change.

freeperjim

Since 09 TSX has grown in length, it's become a less expensive version of TL.

As it stands now, Acura/Honda has chosen to leave the smaller, more personal sized segment to BMW-3 series, 1 series, Audi A4, Lexus IS250/350, MB C-Class, etc.

I was excited for the Sports4 as it appeared to fit perfectly in this "personal upscale" segment. Alas, we received a larger, overgrown TSX that appears to have even less power than 08 model.

What were they thinking? :-(

After 2 Acuras, I will look elsewhere.

godfather2

i'm not really sure what acura is up to, they could've tried to reach out to forum members and see what the loyalists were in to. anyways, i believe that acura should've done what audi has done with their s5/a5 line-up. audi introduced the s5 first (which is atypical) to garner enthusiasm/support/interest and it has worked BRILLIANTLY. if acura would only introduce the sportier "type s" tsx for 2009 (or whatever they may call it), things would be looking a little bit brighter from my perspective.

hunterk1

Exactly; if I wanted a bigger TSX, I would have bought a TL.

I was planning on keeping my '06 for some time anyway - by the looks of it (and the way everything is getting bigger) I'll hope for a US CSX introduction by 2015. By then I'm sure the CSX (i.e. Luxury Civic) will be as big as the '04-'08 TSX.

provench

I am not sure I'd conclude that until you see the new TL ... all indications are that it will get bigger and more expensive. I see Acura sliding the TSX and the TL "up" both in cost/features and in size/luxury. To be honest I am not sure this is a bad long term strategy. My biggest disagreement is Acura sooner of later is going to have to bring engine options and allow overlap in the two platforms as some will want smaller + bigger engine, some will want larger and more luxurious, but cheaper (engine smaller to lower costs). I am a LONG time Acura driver, but sooner or later they have to find a way to smartly create a BMW like lineup (albeit smaller because they don't have the resources).

dom

More expensive

I've spent quite a bit of time pricing out the competition today and in Canada at least the TSX is already far too much. Sure you may spend 1 to 3 k more in most cases but you're also getting more car.

And by more car I mean car, not a USB port and DVD Audio.

provench

Yeah ... and if they don't bring the TSX Type S ...... HUGE gap between TSX and new TL / TL Type S is what I am thinking. Because as shown to us now ... they can't move it up market at all - no question.

TSX69

I ponder what the % is of people who buy the same car again. I am a person that likes variety so I would never consider buying a TSX again under normal circumstances but apparently there are people here considering another TSX.

If market research shows that most buyers are more like me, that would explain why they did not change the TSX that much - they figure they will just nab the new generation. Current buyers I guess are supposed to trade up to a TL/RL.

Red@8

I am not sure where to post this as most of the threads in this section have turned into opinions about the 09 TSX.

A lot of people on here are complaining about the changes (or lack there of). I agree. I dont like the new shape and I dont like what they have done in terms of the redesign. Most of us on here are more performance oriented and dont really represent the majority of TSX owners I would assume.

I have to think that Acura redesigned the TSX with its competion in mind. What baffles me is that I cant think of what car this TSX is competing with. I mean The Audi A4, BMW 3 series, and Lexus IS has way more models, body styles, engines to chose from.

If you are barely able to afford the germans/lexus you can afford the TSX as they all have basically the same starting price and the TSX gives you more features. SO for the base model german/lexus buyer the TSX makes a smart choice. But what about for all the people who are in the market for non base IS/3 series/A4, the TSX is left in the dust.

I certainly dont want to see 121 different models like audi and bmw provide but a 2 model lineup similar to Lexus would be nice. I know it is early to write the TSX off just yet as another model may be announced (we hope) but if it is a one model show again I among many others are not happy.

Oh yeah for those saying upping the TSX too much will step on the toes of the TL. Well in relaity the TL needs to step up anyway. Right now in its bracket (is350/g37) it is the slowest/most underpowered, least features and still fwd which just isnt cutting it at that level. I know when I purchased my is350 i test drove that and the TL and it just couldnt compete. Sure it was cheaper by a few thousand, but that wasnt my concern. I know the TL is acuras best selling car but I am sure they could steal some sales from lexus and infiniti with a better model.

One level up the RL is a joke and we all know it. It needs to take a BIG step up so I would worry about making the tsx and tl better and forgetting if they step on the RL's toes. I am sure the 5 new RL owners wont mind.

/end rant

ostrich

I own an 04 TSX now, and I was very curious to see what the new TSX would be like, as I certainly might replace the 04 with the new one, if it would have features like the RDX turbo engine, SH-AWD etc. More importantly, I was reading somewhere before that Acura was going to separate the Euro Accord and the TSX so that Acura would have more individual identity. That was very exciting to me, when I read it.

Unfortunately, neither has come true, at least for now. To me, the engine is a huge let down. So people will tell me that perhaps in a year's time, there will be a Type-S? Sorry, too late. This segment is too competitive for you to hold out on something like this. Also, the fact that this is even MORE similar to the Euro-Accord than the current generation is very concerning to me. I don't know how Acura can be taken seriously as a luxury brand when you share the exact same car as Honda. If the TSX had come out right away with turbo and SH-AWD that the Euro-Accord would never have, that would be a different story altogether.

My last hope is the new TL. Truthfully, I am not sure how they can beat the current TL for looks because it is absolutely gorgeous as it is. Going by what Acura has offered in terms of "design" lately, it is a very scary prospect indeed.

So, as a current TSX owner, I don't want to get another Euro Accord. But it does not look like I have anything to move up to - the RL is too ugly for words and I need to wait for the new TL but I am not optimistic.

In short, all of the Acura strategies make no sense to me. I keep hearing that we need to wait, but guess what? There are too many good and (gasp!) reliable premium brands out there to wait for you. Yup, the premium segment is no longer just full of unreliable German brands. Your Japanese competitors have gone way past you and taken over as one of leaders in this segment when you are still struggling with brand identity and strategies.

vitocorleone

The new engine would've been fine if they'd shrunk the car/trimmed some weight instead. The looks are ok to me. I'm tired of the ever-expanding size of cars - the size of the TL was a big reason I didn't get one.

I'm keeping my 04 prob until 3rd gen comes out, but if I had to buy a new car today I'd probably get a 3 series - they're reliability ratings have gone up dramatically as of 06 or so.

curls

Just FYI, the TL-S isn't slow.
http://forums.thecarlounge.net/zerothread?id=3177228

Beats the new G35 and the IS350 by 2 full seconds... that's pretty impressive for FWD especially! And, it's cheaper than the other 2 cars!

Ganplosive

on a seperate note, anyone notice Acura sponsoring more sporting events and putting up more commercials? Seems like they're trying to get into the spotlight. I saw for the first time in my life a TSX commercial (for the 08's) and just seeing the Acura commercials gave me hopes of something bigger and more grand in the next few years

TMQ

Here's what I think: Acura is putting almost zero dollars into the base TSX. It's just a rebadged Europ Accord, like it was, and continues to be. Half of the TSX buyers probably have no idea.

Acura is spending time working on the supercar, the grille, and RL. There, Acura, your efforts are well spent.

xjohnkdoex

iTrader: (2)

and i think that basically is the reason why the next gen changes are so subtle.

people who buy as the TSX are probably a relatively small segment compared to the rest of the world who know it as the accord. drastic changes can potentially lead to turning off your huge established user base internationally. it's basically a 'safe' change.

if acura wants to really make the TSX stand out, offer the base model, and like the reports suggest, offer different versions including sh-awd, turbo, diesel to the US. that'll at least differentiate it a little from the rebadged accord it really is.

on a side note, i've noticed some more acura commercials on TV. not sure if it's just a push to get rid of the 08's, or if they're actually ramping up their marketing in general.

dom

Fixed, because I'm pretty sure you were being sarcastic. At least I hope.

Have you seen the grille, the Advanced Sport Concept and the RL? If that is well spent effort I would really hate to see their poor effort.

Red@8

VERY impressive. But its also VERY rare to see that. Those 3 cars have been tested against each other countless times and the TL always comes last or second last (middle). Its just like the is350 vs the 335. The 335 is almost always faster but i think i remember two tests where the is350 beat it. 9/10 the TL is not faster, not on the track, not at the strip, not on the street. Plus even with the overboosted lexus steering i think the rwd dynamics beat out the TL. Dont get me wrong, i test drove all three before i got my is. The TL is a great car and I cant take that away from it. But imo the IS is better in numerous diferent ways.

Oh - the TL is cheaper becuase it has many less features than the IS. ALso just for argument. The TL-S list price is $425 more than what I paid for my full load IS350 OTD. NOw i didnt get a negotiated price for the tl-s but i think its fair to say we can call it even after taxes and all.

LaZyPiGgY

Good call with that. Obviously the Acura brand is a good bang-for-the-buck, but it in reality, the other "comparably equipped" cars have much more features, thus adding to its increased price. It isn't always about the price mark-up because of brand name, though that is part of it. You pay for what you get.

amadeus303

iTrader: (2)

^^^My 2 cents (and just my opinion)... you could stack all the features you want on the Lexus, but if I can't get a "sports sedan" in a stick, it's a dealbreaker for me. That's one of the few things that has kept me from going to Lexus, and sticking with Honda/Acura. Even Infiniti does not have an option for an MT on its G35x sedan...

My point is not to start a debate on AT vs MT; however, for me, even given that the IS would be faster (and more refined), I'd still take the TL-S just because I like to row my own gears.

amadeus303

iTrader: (2)

Red - I disagree. I test drove all 3 cars as well when I was considering dumping my TSX, and the TL-S was noticeably faster on my butt dyno to the IS. Even moreso, my father ended up buying a TL-S, and my cousin has the IS350... the TL-S, hands down pulls on the IS without question.

My old college buddy has a 335. Now THAT is a different story...

craigtl35

if anybody can get me the source for this document, i would greatly apreciate it. pm me a link if at all possible sorry to revive a thread but i am doing research for a paper on marketing and this information would be supurb
pm me if anybody knows the link please.
thanks, craig

Higgs Boson

I worked for Nissan corporate for 5 years then quit and moved across the country and landed in a job as an Acura Service Advisor. I never even looked twice at Acuras in my life. After driving to work in my 2009 Nissan Frontier Pro-4X (which was a nice truck) for a while, I got tired of the truck ride, etc.

I traded in for an 09 TSX w/Tech. I really love the car as a commuter. It is not a performer but I don't expect it to be, either. I wanted something with a nice ride, nice features, reliability, and decent mileage to drive on a daily basis (I have a Z06 for kicks).

A day after owning the car, I thought, you know, I would love this exact TSX with the RDX turbo engine and SH-AWD. That would be perfect.

And I don't even know anything about Acuras. And I think that would be a great combo. I don't want a bigger car than the TSX, but I do want the tech/drivetrain features reserved for the bigger cars.

Higgs Boson

Let me rephrase that comment, "I don't know anything about Acuras." What I mean is that I am not an "Acura enthusiast" per se, nor do I know all there is to know about Acura's history, etc.

the_razor

I completely agree with you, an RDX engine with SH-AWD will make this car more fun to drive than now. One thing I really hope future TSX's will have is more torque.