DJMikeT

Hey guys,

So I have my new engine (Type S) back in the car only to find that the harness that came with the engine is about a foot to short.

It's a JDM engine so it could have of a Saber or other car that had the Type S engine but the wire harness is a different length than the TL.

If I use my base TL harness then I'm missing a connector on the passenger side of the throttle body.

What are my options? Order the correct harness?

Thanks in advance.

Karanx7

iTrader: (2)

If you are using the base ECU, you should just use the base wire harness. Also remove the VSA TB, and consider removing the IMRC valve.

If you are using a Type S ECU, then post some pics. The US wire harness will reach for sure. Don't know much about the Saber, but I imagine it should reach.

DJMikeT

OK, I plan on using the base ECU and not the Type S and I also thought about just changing the harness and using my original base TL harness but here is where I am confused if everything will work correctly.

Here are some pictures of what I'm talking about:

This one is the replacement Type S air intake and it has this extra throttle thing or whatever it is on the passenger side.



Which is powered or controlled by this solenoid



This is my base TL engine that was removed (it has no plug going to where to solenoid is in the previous picture).



So if I swap to my original base TL harness that device will not work which leads me to my next question.

Do I even need that thing (passenger side throttle device) to work, is it part of VSA? I have no idea what is does actually. Without it will there be any reduction on engine performance?

The only other thing I could thing of would be to change out throttle bodies but once again I do not know how this will affect engine performance.

I'm really in a bind and I was hoping to have the car running by this weekend.

2002-2003 Type S harness will set me back about another $300 since the one that came with the engine is definitely to short.

Any help on this would be immensely appreciated!

SuperGreg

That extra piece is the IMRC (Intake Manifold Runner Control). That opens up a baffle in the intake manifold at a certain RPM to get the max amount of low end torque while retaining max horsepower in the upper RPM ranges. Without it you will not get all the performance out of the J32A2 engine. You'll need the Type-S ECU for this to work.

I would guess that without the IMRC you'd be better off with the J32A1 manifold... but that's just like, my opinion man. If I recall correctly the Type-S has a higher redline, so again using the base ECU you're going to be down on horsepower even further.

01acls

That extra thing on the other side is the Intake Manifold Runner Control (IMRC) actuator. It optimises the air flow in the manifold at all rpms/mph.

Your situation really sucks.

Since the engine harness is too short to reach the other harness, can the other harness reach the ecm/engine harness by rerouting them?

Another option is to make a new hole in the firewall so the route is shorter or more direct.

Maybe the combination of both to get them to meet halfway?

DJMikeT

OK, at this point I really don't care about the "Extra" performance. I really just need the car back.

Another thing with the J32A2 manifold my hood with no longer close all the way.

So if I put my base J32A1 intake manifold on the J32A2 I wouldn't have all the extra bonus horsepower as if I had the Type S manifold but it should be just as good as the Type P base engine was before correct?

I'm really thinking of swapping the intake manifolds and using my old harness and calling it good for now and maybe try to get all the stuff down the road to take advantage of the Type S engine.

This whole thing has really gotten to be somewhat of a nightmare.

As for 01acls suggestion there's really no alternative other than getting another harness, the one that came with is way way short and trying to cut a hold in the firewall where it would need to go through would be right where existing stuff is in the way.

DJMikeT

Is there a fix for the hood issue if I decide to stick with the Type S manifold? I really didn't see anything I could do (adjustment wise), it really sticks up quite a bit higher than the base manifold.

Also even if I got the proper length Type S harness, I would still have to use the Type S ECU for the IMRC to work correctly right?

From what I'm told if I go with the Type S ECU I will have a CEL and there's no way it will pass inspection.

01acls

No I don't think so, anyway you look at it the new motor is better than the old even without the IMRC bc of the higher compression. With the higher compression you will have more hp all the time, straight across the board. Meaning everytime the coils fire you're enjoying the benefits of the higher compression, which translates to higher hp.

For your sake I hope SuperG is right, that the two manifolds are interchangeable.

Here's another option idea...

Contact the seller that sold you the engine/ecm/harness and tell them they sent the wrong harness, it's too short. Ask them to exchange it for yhe correct/longer one?

Explain to them that not everyone will need a harness bc some people are just interested in replacing a Type S motor and already have their own Type S harness.

01acls

If you're worry about passing inspection then changing the manifold is the way to go, assuming it fits.

That's not a bad compromise bc everything else will fall in place.

DJMikeT

Ya I thought about contacting the seller about the harness issue, but even with the proper harness I will still have issues. I mean the hood for one, how the hell would I fix that??

Then inspections would be a huge issue, I don't want to have to get an illegal inspection every year and pay out the ass.

I wish I would have just found another base model engine instead of this.

I really hope the intake manifolds are changeable because that's the route I'm leaning towards now.

ErickUa5

The hood will close just fine.
Use your old harness if the jdm one wont reach.

DJMikeT

My hood is in a major bind if you force it close, it's bulging right in the middle and the side don't go flush with fender, I'll check it over again tomorrow but from as far as I could see with my flashlight it is hitting on the intake manifold.

Also what about the Intake Manifold Runner Control on the Type S manifold, just leave it unplugged and go like that???

ErickUa5

Thats strange as I have the same engine and the closes fine even with the plastic covers on. I see some chrome letters on top of the EGR plate, those should not be there.
Looks like the trunk emblems

ErickUa5

Yes you can leave that unplugged, I used a zip tie to keep the runner open.
It wont affect idle quality.

DJMikeT

Yup I just took those off, it close fine on the drivers side but it's still off a little on the passenger side.

I can live with it, it may have been like that all long and I just noticed it.

Also there was a battery lead in the way on the drivers side that was really making it not close.

It's good enough and I'll try and mess with the passenger side adjustment bracket or something after I get the rest of this lined out.

DJMikeT

OK, good to know I will do the same. I'll have to remove my old harness off the old engine tomorrow. Looks like I'll have to remove the intake manifold to get to the injector plugs that's going to be a PITA.

Karanx7

iTrader: (2)

A few things...

1. You should have NO issue closing the hood. The engine is not going to be a clearance problem for the hood. If you have issues closing the hood, you installed something incorrectly. Inspect what the problem is, and fix.

2. Just use your old ECU and old wire harness. Yes, you lose out on a bit of power, redline, and tuning. But it's not a big deal. Plus no one has mentioned you would need to reprogram your keys (tow the car to dealer).

3. You could swap to your old manifold, or just keep the new one. Don't worry about the empty plug, the base ECU can't use it anyways.

DJMikeT

Swapped out the harnesses today and put my original harness back in. I did run into an issue with a plug on the passenger side behind the power steering pump, the Type S engine had a different type plug configuration, it was almost the same but slightly different and the plug from the base harness wouldn't click into place. I just simply cut and swapped the plugs. Also on the base harness there is one extra plug that doesn't get used once again right by the power steering pump. On the base TL engine there's a lead coming up from behind the timing belt, the Type S didn't have the lead so I just taped that one up.

The throttle body and intake manifold had some carbon build up and a little oil so I'm cleaning it up and have a few other minor things and then I'll try starting it up tomorrow.

I hope I don't have any issues, I've been working on this thing for 5 days now.

I also checked fitment on the base intake manifold compared to the Type S and it's a perfect match.

Also got the hood to close properly.

SuperGreg

Have you decided if you are going to go with the base manifold or the Type S and holding the manifold runner open?

DJMikeT

I decide to use the Type S since it looks like it would allow more air flow and probably better performance. I removed the IMRC since I cannot control it anyway and will rig the manifold runner open as you stated above.

Karanx7

iTrader: (2)

Sounds like you're describing a coolant temp wire, which you would need. Post some pics and I can confirm.

thoiboi

Splice some wires to lengthen it..?

DJMikeT

OK, here's some pictures of the extra plug I was talking about \. I see the one you are talking about that goes to the block (to the left in the photo behind the Power Steering bolt) but I have no clue where this one goes, it's behind the timing belt housing and I don't even see a way to get to anything back there. I looked over the Type S multiple times and this wire is not there on that engine.

These are pictures of the original Type P engine:

DJMikeT

Also on the harness that came with the Type S engine there was not an additional plug like on the Type P.

Chojun

The Type S has a 3rd fan sensor, could that be it?

01acls

TLP "sensors"

1. Radiator Fan Switch B.

2. Crankshaft Position Sensor.

ErickUa5

Thats the fan switch B, According to the diagram its responsible for letting the fan control module know the coolant has reached 219F and thats all.
Fan switch A is directly wired up to the relays for both radiator Fans to go on at 199F and its also connected to the ECU.
So the important one is A, However I will try a few things with my own to see if you should splice fan connector B and put the wires together or just leave it alone.

I ran into a similar same issue when putting an 02 Type S engine in a 6 speed CLS, The harness side had no connector for fan switch B, Left it like that and never overheated.

DJMikeT

I started it up today and let it idle for an hour, once the car got hot both fans kicked on, isn't that what's it's supposed to do?

DJMikeT

Also I think some people here are looking at these pictures backwards. The pictures are of the BASE Type P engine.

The Type S engine didn't have the extra wire coming out from behind the timing belt area like the Type P engine.

Also the original harness for the Type S didn't have the extra plug like my Type P harness does.

ErickUa5

Yes its working like it should, Glad to hear you got it running.

DJMikeT

Engine side looks good, I had one code which is an O2 sensor. I think I damaged the one after the CAT when putting my exhaust back together. It fell on me and the wire is all that was holding it up.

Transmission side: I don't know!!!!!

I already had doubts when I drained the tranny fluid and it looked like chocolate milk.

I drove it around the block and once it shifted out of 1st the RPM's went straight up and it wouldn't shift into any other gears.

When you put it in Reverse it shifts pretty hard going into it.

I got these on my reader:

1. O2
2. O2
3. Reverse Switch Circuit Range / Performance
4. Transmission Range Switch ATP RVS Switch

I'll have to look into the tranny stuff tomorrow, really disappointing since I've been working on this thing for a week now. I was really hoping to be able to just drive the car.

ErickUa5

Looks like theres an issue with the range sensor, Which one did you use ? reuse the old one and retest.

DJMikeT

I used the one off the new tranny I got, I will swap parts tomorrow and see what happens.