Rear Fog Lights, updated pics
08-22-2009, 09:59 AM
#1
Ackniculous One
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Rear Fog Lights, updated pics
Well, finally got around to it and started the temporary setup for my rear fog light project. I just need to hide the wiring, but this is the look i was hoping for.
Essentially remove the existing 7443 bulbs from the inner brake/running light section of the housing and the h11 5000K HID bulbs turn and click right into the bulb slots on the housing. Simply wire up the pos/neg from the ballasts to a separate switch and relay up front. This is a $56 shipped H11 HID Kit from ebay.
These ad hoc rear fogs are very bright, my Palm Centro camera does a so/so job of capturing this, but trust me, they are very bright red. The rear fogs will ONLY be used during heavy fog or heavy rain/snow, not for driving around with them on all the time. Basically anytime there is low visibility.
If you are not familiar with rear fogs, do a google search. This is a common safety feature on many European cars. Some have one light, some have two..I decided to do two lights. If you decide to do one, it is typically mounted on the side of car behind the driver. So for US, left side..in right hand drive countries, the right side, etc.
The brake lights/running lights will still work, just only on the outer panel of each housing. That is the only downside is that I now only have two brake lights instead of four. I have also considered just getting some red tint or red spray for the existing back up lights and mount these there to keep all four brakelights, but i would lose backup lights. Or, just do a single rear fog on the left in the backup light with red tint on housing and just use the right side as the backup light. This solution is simple, so I can mess around with it.
Here are the pics.
Regular lights are on in the outer position, rear HID fogs on in the inner section for comparison of brightness.
Left side
Right Side
Here is my car along with Phee's so you can see how much brighter the HID fogs will be than just running lights alone.
Essentially remove the existing 7443 bulbs from the inner brake/running light section of the housing and the h11 5000K HID bulbs turn and click right into the bulb slots on the housing. Simply wire up the pos/neg from the ballasts to a separate switch and relay up front. This is a $56 shipped H11 HID Kit from ebay.
These ad hoc rear fogs are very bright, my Palm Centro camera does a so/so job of capturing this, but trust me, they are very bright red. The rear fogs will ONLY be used during heavy fog or heavy rain/snow, not for driving around with them on all the time. Basically anytime there is low visibility.
If you are not familiar with rear fogs, do a google search. This is a common safety feature on many European cars. Some have one light, some have two..I decided to do two lights. If you decide to do one, it is typically mounted on the side of car behind the driver. So for US, left side..in right hand drive countries, the right side, etc.
The brake lights/running lights will still work, just only on the outer panel of each housing. That is the only downside is that I now only have two brake lights instead of four. I have also considered just getting some red tint or red spray for the existing back up lights and mount these there to keep all four brakelights, but i would lose backup lights. Or, just do a single rear fog on the left in the backup light with red tint on housing and just use the right side as the backup light. This solution is simple, so I can mess around with it.
Here are the pics.
Regular lights are on in the outer position, rear HID fogs on in the inner section for comparison of brightness.
Left side
Right Side
Here is my car along with Phee's so you can see how much brighter the HID fogs will be than just running lights alone.
08-22-2009, 11:21 AM
#6
pretty sure way to get pulled over for what the cop thinks are your brake lights stuck on! no kidding,,
usa has no rear fog spec that I am aware of- if there is a DOT please link
I dont know about europeans except they understand side mounted turn signals and roundabouts,,
have doubt americans would understand the side mounting of a `fog light`..
BUT
on usa semi trucks they use superbright LED strips and lights, I live in a severe fog area and a well lit truck can be seen thru dense fog over 1/2 mile ahead, and in slightly better conditions up to a mile or more away!
First time I saw one that well lit had to check into them~
Truck repair shops- even NAPA auto parts- carry a large selection of LED lights you could easily add to the lower bumper and lower siderails of the car pretty easy and run off a seperate power switch
Make it look like a semi going down the road!
Working on my bike with LEDs to make it appear larger than it is, visable at a greater distance to cagers
(thats bike term for car drivers--trapped in a cage)
usa has no rear fog spec that I am aware of- if there is a DOT please link
I dont know about europeans except they understand side mounted turn signals and roundabouts,,
have doubt americans would understand the side mounting of a `fog light`..
BUT
on usa semi trucks they use superbright LED strips and lights, I live in a severe fog area and a well lit truck can be seen thru dense fog over 1/2 mile ahead, and in slightly better conditions up to a mile or more away!
First time I saw one that well lit had to check into them~
Truck repair shops- even NAPA auto parts- carry a large selection of LED lights you could easily add to the lower bumper and lower siderails of the car pretty easy and run off a seperate power switch
Make it look like a semi going down the road!
Working on my bike with LEDs to make it appear larger than it is, visable at a greater distance to cagers
(thats bike term for car drivers--trapped in a cage)
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08-22-2009, 11:49 AM
#8
Ackniculous One
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Tom, I can appreciate your comment. It isn't common knowledge to most folks, but all newer US spec Audi's, BMW, Mercedes, Land Rovers, Volvo's and even the older Oldsmobile Aurora vehicles have Rear Fogs. There are some other cars also. The only US made car that has them is the Olds Aurora, they are on the rear bumper. I see cars with their rear fogs on all the time. In fact, Joe in our Azine crew who also has an Audi RS4 showed me his rear fogs. There are some BMW owners here that can confirm they have them as well. BUt to your point, I am pretty sure there is no requirement to have them here in the US, but it is permitted.
Remember, the rear fogs on those cars and mine, are not supposed to be driving on with them all the time, only during times when visibility is poor. Sure, my car did not come with them from factory, but I'm not worried about getting pulled over in a heavy downpour when these are on. I know here in ATL when the weather is bad and folks that have these on their cars and know how to use them, they are very effective for providing visibility to other drivers.
Not a definitive source, but here is some info from Wikipedia:
"In Europe and other countries adhering to ECE Regulation 48, vehicles must be equipped with one or two bright red "rear fog lamps" (or "fog taillamps"), which serve as high-intensity rear position lamps to be energised by the driver in conditions of poor visibility to enhance vehicle conspicuity from the rear. The allowable range of intensity for a rear fog lamp is 150 to 300 candelas,[15] which is within the range of a U.S. brake lamp.[5] For this reason, some European vehicles[which?] imported to the United States have their rear fog lamps wired as brake lamps, since their European-specification brake lamps may not be sufficiently intense to comply with U.S. regulations, and in North America rear fog lamps are not required equipment. However, they are permitted, and are found almost exclusively on European-brand vehicles in North America — Audi, Jaguar, Mercedes, MINI, Land Rover, Saab and Volvo provide functional rear fog lights on their North American models. The final generation Oldsmobile Aurora also had dual rear fog lights installed in the rear bumper as standard equipment.
Most jurisdictions permit rear fog lamps to be installed either singly or in pairs. If a single rear fog is fitted, most jurisdictions require it to be located at or to the driver's side of the vehicle's centreline — whichever side is the prevailing driver's side in the country in which the vehicle is registered.[15] This is to maximise the sight line of following drivers to the rear fog lamp. If two rear fog lamps are fitted, they must be symmetrical with respect to the vehicle's centreline.[15] Proponents of twin rear fog lamps say two lamps provide vehicle distance information not available from a single lamp. Proponents of the single rear fog lamp say dual rear fog lamps closely mimic the appearance of illuminated brake lamps (which are mandatorily installed in pairs), reducing the conspicuity of the brake lamps' message when the rear fogs are activated. To provide some safeguard against rear fog lamps being confused with brake lamps, ECE R48 requires a separation of at least 10 cm between the closest illuminated edges of any brake lamp and any rear fog lamp.[15]"
source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automot...Rear_fog_lamps
Remember, the rear fogs on those cars and mine, are not supposed to be driving on with them all the time, only during times when visibility is poor. Sure, my car did not come with them from factory, but I'm not worried about getting pulled over in a heavy downpour when these are on. I know here in ATL when the weather is bad and folks that have these on their cars and know how to use them, they are very effective for providing visibility to other drivers.
Not a definitive source, but here is some info from Wikipedia:
"In Europe and other countries adhering to ECE Regulation 48, vehicles must be equipped with one or two bright red "rear fog lamps" (or "fog taillamps"), which serve as high-intensity rear position lamps to be energised by the driver in conditions of poor visibility to enhance vehicle conspicuity from the rear. The allowable range of intensity for a rear fog lamp is 150 to 300 candelas,[15] which is within the range of a U.S. brake lamp.[5] For this reason, some European vehicles[which?] imported to the United States have their rear fog lamps wired as brake lamps, since their European-specification brake lamps may not be sufficiently intense to comply with U.S. regulations, and in North America rear fog lamps are not required equipment. However, they are permitted, and are found almost exclusively on European-brand vehicles in North America — Audi, Jaguar, Mercedes, MINI, Land Rover, Saab and Volvo provide functional rear fog lights on their North American models. The final generation Oldsmobile Aurora also had dual rear fog lights installed in the rear bumper as standard equipment.
Most jurisdictions permit rear fog lamps to be installed either singly or in pairs. If a single rear fog is fitted, most jurisdictions require it to be located at or to the driver's side of the vehicle's centreline — whichever side is the prevailing driver's side in the country in which the vehicle is registered.[15] This is to maximise the sight line of following drivers to the rear fog lamp. If two rear fog lamps are fitted, they must be symmetrical with respect to the vehicle's centreline.[15] Proponents of twin rear fog lamps say two lamps provide vehicle distance information not available from a single lamp. Proponents of the single rear fog lamp say dual rear fog lamps closely mimic the appearance of illuminated brake lamps (which are mandatorily installed in pairs), reducing the conspicuity of the brake lamps' message when the rear fogs are activated. To provide some safeguard against rear fog lamps being confused with brake lamps, ECE R48 requires a separation of at least 10 cm between the closest illuminated edges of any brake lamp and any rear fog lamp.[15]"
source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Automot...Rear_fog_lamps
Last edited by CJITTY; 08-22-2009 at 11:53 AM.
08-22-2009, 11:58 AM
#10
Ackniculous One
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Just to clarify, these will have their own separate switch and when I brake, the outer panel of my tails will illuminate normally along with the third brake light, so my brake lights are not impacted other than reducing from 4 bulbs (2 each side) to 2 (one each side). Plenty of cars have single brake lights on each side, so nothing out of the ordinary there
08-22-2009, 01:02 PM
#11
bringin lead
Oh man, if we tatted our member numbers, you're in the single digits. No sweat though, we've only been through a couple hundred pages on the wall since youve been out. Not much catching up to do!
08-22-2009, 07:31 PM
#13
pretty sure way to get pulled over for what the cop thinks are your brake lights stuck on! no kidding,,
usa has no rear fog spec that I am aware of- if there is a DOT please link
I dont know about europeans except they understand side mounted turn signals and roundabouts,,
have doubt americans would understand the side mounting of a `fog light`..
BUT
on usa semi trucks they use superbright LED strips and lights, I live in a severe fog area and a well lit truck can be seen thru dense fog over 1/2 mile ahead, and in slightly better conditions up to a mile or more away!
First time I saw one that well lit had to check into them~
Truck repair shops- even NAPA auto parts- carry a large selection of LED lights you could easily add to the lower bumper and lower siderails of the car pretty easy and run off a seperate power switch
Make it look like a semi going down the road!
Working on my bike with LEDs to make it appear larger than it is, visable at a greater distance to cagers
(thats bike term for car drivers--trapped in a cage)
usa has no rear fog spec that I am aware of- if there is a DOT please link
I dont know about europeans except they understand side mounted turn signals and roundabouts,,
have doubt americans would understand the side mounting of a `fog light`..
BUT
on usa semi trucks they use superbright LED strips and lights, I live in a severe fog area and a well lit truck can be seen thru dense fog over 1/2 mile ahead, and in slightly better conditions up to a mile or more away!
First time I saw one that well lit had to check into them~
Truck repair shops- even NAPA auto parts- carry a large selection of LED lights you could easily add to the lower bumper and lower siderails of the car pretty easy and run off a seperate power switch
Make it look like a semi going down the road!
Working on my bike with LEDs to make it appear larger than it is, visable at a greater distance to cagers
(thats bike term for car drivers--trapped in a cage)
Would you really get pulled over? I've seen mini's and bimmer's with their rear fogs on in broad daylight in cali.
08-22-2009, 08:46 PM
#14
I was unaware of the usa catching up to EU standards- finally!! I am corrected but doesnt the wiki say say same brightness as brake lights?
or did I miss a pic with brakes on too?
If wired properly and used when appropriate- it appears to be no problem
I am all for more tail lighting in bad weather,,our fog is pea soup- zero feet visabilty,,cant see the end of the hood...cant expect an idiot going 70 into the fog bank to see and slow for you,,,give them a big source of light to notice,,as long as it doesnt reflect so much light into the fog that its blinding instead of helping
At the track, formula cars that dont have a normal brake light must have a `rain light` on the rear so other cars can see you in bad conditions
or did I miss a pic with brakes on too?
If wired properly and used when appropriate- it appears to be no problem
I am all for more tail lighting in bad weather,,our fog is pea soup- zero feet visabilty,,cant see the end of the hood...cant expect an idiot going 70 into the fog bank to see and slow for you,,,give them a big source of light to notice,,as long as it doesnt reflect so much light into the fog that its blinding instead of helping
At the track, formula cars that dont have a normal brake light must have a `rain light` on the rear so other cars can see you in bad conditions
08-23-2009, 02:24 AM
#16
Ackniculous One
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I think the wiki said they would just wire them up as brake light on european cars coming over as us spec but I know they can easily be activated..my friend did it on his Volks GTI. i'm pretty sure that on the newer bmw's and for sure the audi's that the rear fog is nearly twice as bright as the brake lights. I liked Tom's idea on the red led strip, but I wanted a completely removable and quick solution with oem look. sometimes I wonder if I might just try using just the left side only installed in the backup light section with red film tint just on that section. keep the pass side clear with reg backup bulb. that way, I got all 4 brake/running light bulbs in and the rear fog is more noticeable not next to other red lights. i'll play around with it, see what I finally decide. this solution is very flexible
08-23-2009, 11:42 AM
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^^^ Thanks, I'm with you on that, i like the way it looks. One issue I forgot to mention, since there is no brake light bulb in that inner section now, it reads BRAKE LAMP warning light on dash. I guess the fix for that is to put the bulb back in the connector and just keep it out the housing..or figure out a way to make a circuit loop on the connector so I can get rid of the warning light. I don't want to leave the bulb in the connector and having it sitting in between the housing and liner...
08-23-2009, 11:47 AM
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I was unaware of the usa catching up to EU standards- finally!! I am corrected but doesnt the wiki say say same brightness as brake lights?
or did I miss a pic with brakes on too?
If wired properly and used when appropriate- it appears to be no problem
I am all for more tail lighting in bad weather,,our fog is pea soup- zero feet visabilty,,cant see the end of the hood...cant expect an idiot going 70 into the fog bank to see and slow for you,,,give them a big source of light to notice,,as long as it doesnt reflect so much light into the fog that its blinding instead of helping
At the track, formula cars that dont have a normal brake light must have a `rain light` on the rear so other cars can see you in bad conditions
or did I miss a pic with brakes on too?
If wired properly and used when appropriate- it appears to be no problem
I am all for more tail lighting in bad weather,,our fog is pea soup- zero feet visabilty,,cant see the end of the hood...cant expect an idiot going 70 into the fog bank to see and slow for you,,,give them a big source of light to notice,,as long as it doesnt reflect so much light into the fog that its blinding instead of helping
At the track, formula cars that dont have a normal brake light must have a `rain light` on the rear so other cars can see you in bad conditions
08-23-2009, 02:12 PM
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i cant speak for the rest of europe, but here in the UK, we require one fog light on all cars made after 1981. it either has to be on the right side or on both. never just the left side. my tl-s has one too. but i just took out one reverse light and wired in a 13 led replacment bulb.. though they dont really do any good during the times of fog you would really need it. looks good tho. thats exactly how they are done here in england.
08-24-2009, 10:27 PM
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Updated with night videos
Well, the night pics didn't work out so I decided to shoot some quick videos with these HID rear fogs.
Video
HID rear fogs from far then close up:
http://s566.photobucket.com/albums/s...t=HPIM1170.flv
Video
HID rear fogs close up:
http://s566.photobucket.com/albums/s...t=HPIM1168.flv
Video
HID rear fogs from far then close up:
http://s566.photobucket.com/albums/s...t=HPIM1170.flv
Video
HID rear fogs close up:
http://s566.photobucket.com/albums/s...t=HPIM1168.flv
Last edited by CJITTY; 08-24-2009 at 10:29 PM.
08-25-2009, 11:28 AM
#30
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Interesting mod. I remember the rear fog light switch on my parent's Volvos. I didn't see much difference turning them on at night (when I stood behind the car ...) But I understand the utility of such a light in low visibility situations.
It's a shame this isn't 'standard' on most vehicles. I'm sure people in the Bay Area / Vancouver or other places with fog being a common problem would appreciate this safety feature.
It's a shame this isn't 'standard' on most vehicles. I'm sure people in the Bay Area / Vancouver or other places with fog being a common problem would appreciate this safety feature.
08-25-2009, 01:08 PM
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