obespalov

I'm reposting something that was written by "cemcflc" in another rear view mirror topic which I think deserves it's own post:

"Exploding Mirror - Chronic Sore Throat

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FOLLOWING THE EXPLOSION OF YOUR MIRRORS, HAS ANYONE EXPERIENCED A CHRONIC SORE THROAT, MIGRAINES and INTESTINAL PROBLEMS? At first, I thought it purely coincidental, however, since this incident I've had a chronic sore throat, migraines and intestinal problems. I've visited numerous doctors and one has finally diagnosed me with Multiple Chemical Sensitivity. Multiple Chemical Sensitivity - also referred to as MCS - is known as a Chemical Injury. In broad terms, it means an unusually severe sensitivity or allergy-like reaction to a chemical or pollutant. THE CHEMICALS INSIDE OF MAGNA'S MIRRORS ARE HIGHLY TOXIC WHEN INHALED -- particularly inside of a hot car with the windows up.

My rearview mirror exploded last November, spraying a black liquid substance all over the interior of my Acura TL (the tan leather seats, carpet and center console). It even eroded/burnt a hole through my center console.

Magna replaced my mirror free of charge, no questions asked. An auto repairman at my Acura dealership stated in my service repair report that these mirrors contain mercury. Although, they attempted to clean car thoroughly, he advised me to trade it in as soon as possible. He said that the chemical most likely leaked between my center console onto the floor board and could not be removed.

Upon receiving this information from my dealership, I requested the list of chemicals used inside of these mirrors from Magna Donnelly (the manufacturer of these mirrors). Magna would not share this information with me, stating it's proprietary information and the chemicals (there are 7-8 of them) are patented.

A week later, I received a call on my cell phone from the Magna's Vice President, Neall Lynam, assuring me that the chemicals used in Magna's mirrors are not toxic. (I later discovered that he had lied to me.) I also asked him why a recall hadn't been issued on these mirrors, and he stated that he felt it was not necessary. Not necessary?

I continued to remain ill for no apparent reason. I no longer believe that my illness and the exposure to theses chemicals was purely coincidental.

I hired an attorney to subpoena the list of chemicals from Magna. To my (and my attorney's) surprise, all of the chemicals used in their mirrors are highly toxic. One of the main symptoms, upon being exposed to these chemicals, is a chronic sore throat and interstinal problems.

I signed a disclaimer with Magna, therefore, I'm unable to disclose this information. However, I can assure you that if you've been exposed to them (particularly, for a long period of time), then there's a probability that you (or any of your passengers) may also become ill.

My attorney is filing suit against Magna Donnelly for personal damages to my car and injuries suffered as a result of their carelessness to issue a recall on their rearview mirrors. If you (or anyone you know) has experienced any type of illness as a result of being exposed to these chemicals, please respond to this posting. Perhaps, a class action law suit should be in order."

obespalov

Another post made by "cemcflc":

"TO ALL OF YOU WHO ARE SUFFERING HEALTH PROBLEMS OR VEHICLE DAMAGES (OR BOTH) SUBSEQUENT TO A REARVIEW MIRROR LEAK...

Here's a press release issued by Donnelly. Donnelly states that the new 'solid core' mirror is considered 'SAFER'. But, what exactly does 'SAFER' mean? SAFER because there's not the possibility of passengers inhaling the toxic fumes upon combustion? SAFER because the liquid doesn't explode in your face as you're driving down the interstate?

In this press release, Dwane Baumgardner (Donnelly chairman and CEO) states, "Our new EC mirrors take safety two steps forward by eliminating the potential for fluid leaks and by dramatically improving the survivability of the product."

Therefore, I have two (2) questions for Magna:
1) Why is 'eliminating fluid leaks' considered a safety measure?
2) If it's considered a safety measure, why hasn't a recall been issued on the old 'liquid core' mirrors?


PRESS RELEASE....

SOURCE: Donnelly Corporation
WEBSITE: http://www.accidentreconstruction.c...99/111099a.html
Donnelly Announces Solid Polymer Matrix(TM) Technology for Safer, More Robust Auto-Dimming Mirrors

HOLLAND, Mich., Nov. 10 /PRNewswire/ -- Donnelly Corporation (NYSE: DON - news), the world's leading supplier of automotive mirrors, has begun using Solid Polymer Matrix (SPM)(TM) technology to produce electrochromic (EC), automatic- dimming rearview mirrors that are safer and more robust than competing products available in the market today.

Donnelly designed its SPM(TM) technology to use a solid substance sandwiched between two pieces of glass, which darkens to reduce reflectivity when electric current is applied to it. With the older technology that is the industry standard today, the electrical current is applied to a liquid substance contained between two layers of glass. If the mirror is broken, the liquid substance can leak out and the mirror will fail immediately.

With Donnelly's Solid Polymer Matrix(TM) technology, there is no liquid substance to leak, and the mirror can continue to function for a period of time even if the glass is cracked.

"An electrochromic mirror is essentially a safety product; it makes driving safer by eliminating glare,'' said Dwane Baumgardner, Donnelly chairman and chief executive officer. "Our new EC mirrors take safety two steps forward by eliminating the potential for fluid leaks and by dramatically improving the survivability of the product.''

Over time, Donnelly plans to base most or all of its electrochromic mirror products on the company's Solid Polymer Matrix(TM) technology. EC mirrors using the technology will begin appearing on production vehicles in North America and Europe next year.

Over the past two years Donnelly has emerged as a strong competitor in the world market for electrochromic mirrors. During the last 12 months the company doubled its production of electrochromic mirrors, and is on track to double its EC sales again within the next 24 months.

Donnelly Corporation is the world's leading manufacturer of automotive mirrors. Through its mirror products and other product lines, Donnelly is a supplier to every major automotive manufacturer in the world. The company has been based in Holland, Michigan, since 1905, and today has approximately 6,000 employees in 12 countries worldwide. Donnelly has been named by the Society of Automotive Engineers as a model company in lean manufacturing practices. In addition, Donnelly is nationally recognized as a leader in the application of participative management principles and systems."

obespalov

My mirror is not broke but I'm thinking of telling the company that it is and just getting the safer replacement one...

Bob_F

Based on posts on this forum, I think that the manufacturer recently discontinued the mirror replacement program. Some people have received replacements from their local Acura dealers.

Bob

fsttyms1

If its not leaking they wont do a thing for you. and why are you reposting this?

obespalov

I was really troubled by the possibility of serious adverse health affects from the contents of the rear view mirror. By reposting it, I wanted to know directly if anyone else if having any health condidions as a result of this.

If the situation is serious enough, I'd rather push for a recall than wait for the possibility of my mirror exploding. Or even pay out of pocket for a new one if I have to.

fsttyms1

it hasnt been that big a issue on these boards. some have gotten the bubble, some have leaked. And i dont know of any one that has had helt issues from it. We arent the only cars running them. If it were that big a issue i think there would have been a large recall on them by now

obespalov

Though the percentage of people that have had leakages may be small, there may still be a high potential for hazard. Even those who have had adverse health affects from the leak may not have been able to identify the leak as the cause of thier condition. I mean, for a long time, common sense things like smoking causes lung cancer were not known, and more recently Asbestos.

I think it would take a lawsuit before a major company would admit laibility to an issue this large and issue a recall.

fsttyms1

Like i said, acuras arent the only ones running these mirrors, and they have been in use for along time. If you want to persue a lawsuit or try to get them recalled by all means go for it. I personally wouldnt waste my time and if mine started to go bad i would simply replace it before it started to leak (insert common sense here)

CJITTY

I turn my mirror off now since my tint is plenty dark in the back window. I'm actually glad this was a repost because I heard the mirrors leak/explode from time to time, but had no idea of a possible link to a health issue. I'll be checking it more frequently for leaks now, but my car doesn't sit in the sun since I have a garage at work and home. Maybe I should saran wrap my mirror just in case..lol

obespalov

I think it would be common sense to replace it as well if it leaked or "exploded", and I'm happy the company has been providing free replacements. However, it would not be common sense for me to know that the contents inside could be hazardous. Also, I would hate the feeling of having a possible ticking time bomb in my car which if it explodes, would mean I'd have to sell my car to avoid breathing in toxic vapors on a hot day.

Bob_F

That made me laugh!

But maybe you're on to something there. Since my mirror hasn't leaked yet maybe I could wrap the case in something to provide a better seal. Maybe something like a fiberglass cloth and resin shell. ;-)

Bob

fsttyms1

Honestly, if it were that big a issue i think it would have been delt with by now. If your that worried about it call to see if you can get a new one. And i dont think the "explode" it bursts inside causing it to leak

fsttyms1

CJITTY

Yeah, the saran wrap may work if you wrap it really tight so you can still see with the mirror somehow. I'm not to worried about it, since my car never gets really that hot on the inside since it's under ground all day. I use a reflective sunshade too if it does go outside for an extended time. Honestly, I'd be more concerned if my mirror exploded in my face while driving or popped and leaked that crap on my interior. If I see that, I'm callin HAZMAT and tell them...clean that sh|t up! LOL!!! Damn, this whole time I'm watching out for drunk drivers and SUV mom's talkin on cell phones...now I gotta watch my own car's rearview mirror...what's next..sigh

vash68

Man, I dunno where u getting your optimism from.. When was the last time u saw American corporation used common sense and took care of the problems caused by its product without some victimized ppl raisin hell in court? DOnt get me wrong, I dont quite like how some ppl exploit judicial system in this country to their benefits, but this is a case when it should be.

It's all about profits nowdays. Did u loose your job lately? Was it outsourced? Did company cut corners? Did CEO and CTO boosted their earnings? How is that for common sense?
If only a hand full of ppl on this forum suffered chronic sore throat and intestinal problems (!!!) , then how many cases was not reported? think of that. Do u even know what it feels like to be chronically ill when medical costs are sky rocketing? I have 2 kids and 2 mortgages, who is gonna take care of them if I get ill and loose my job as a result? The American Corporation?


Just a question: is 3rd gen TL affected by this problem? Could not find a date or article linked here..

Thanks!

fsttyms1

WTF are you rambling about????

youngBuk

my rear view mirror is getting ready to explode.....i tried to take it off but couldnt can somebody help me before it explodes in my face while im driving and crash into people and die?

MikePA

Stop by a local AutoZone and get a couple mirror condoms.

fsttyms1

How about using a little common sense and going to the dealer to have them take it off and replace it. They may even do it for free. Call your dealer and or acura client services and tell them of your mirror problem and see if they will replace it

there are a few threads that someone said how to get it off

randomthought

I don't think the mirrors pose that much of a threat. If they did "explode" and cause health problems so much, then the problem would have come up and the company would have dealt with it before it reached a certain point. The reports on this forum show only a fraction of the numbers of Acura's that have had the problem, and not EVERY acura owner is on this forum.

Mine has not had any leaks or bubbles yet, but I did turn it off. If it does break, it would be some common sense to open the windows if the liquid was strong enough to burn through the center console.

youngBuk

nice idear fatty

lMlRxlFlLUlBlBY

well i have a 02 tl~s. i realized that everytime i turn it on i get a mild headache now readin this im kinda worried

fsttyms1

Exactly.

And mine has been on since the day i bought the car (over 200,000 miles ago). No bubbles no leaking and it works great.

I think Its in your head. Unless its leaked out its not effecting you. Especially "when" you turn it on. The problem (if any) would be if it had leaked out and the chemical toxins are in teh car, not in the mirror functioning properly

obespalov

WTF?

obespalov

Type 'Ford Pinto' into wikipedia to see an example of where it took a while for a company to recall a product. And we're not talking about the car lighting on fire as a result of the leak from the rear view mirror, but rather a harder to recognize problem like mild chemical poisening.

fsttyms1

Once again. If it were that big/Large of a problem the NTHSA would have had a manditory recall on them as honda/acura ARE NOT the only ones to use them. If they were infact failing like the poster claims there would have been an investigation into it.

Also we have NO idea if the guy that posted it was infact suffering a thing. Do you believe every thing you hear and read?

93LT1

We also have no idea if the guy is in fact having health issues as a result of the chemicals. I for one can't stand the abuse in the court system but I'm glad the post was posted and yes I'm in the process of having my mirror replaced.
my .02

MegaKillTron

Mine has a crack in the top right corner, I wonder if I can get that replaced?

Bob_F

Since the fluid inside can certainly damage your interior I would definitely replace it. And your dealer might even replace it for free.

Bob

xdxlx

What if i want to take preventative measures, like replacing it before it splatters all over my interior? Acura won't even listen to me huh?

6MTUA5

iTrader: (2)

Holy shit.. my rearview mirror has been leaking for a while. like the top half is a darker color and the bottom half is always clear. i always have it turned on for some reason but as soon as i read this i turned it off. i have been having the symptoms you have been talking about for the past few months. if there is something really wrong with me, I would definately do whatever necessary to try and win a suit and get some money and/or new TL out of this. I have been to many doctor appts and missed many days of work because of feeling ill. should i go to the doctor and tell him about these possible poisins so he can test for them for proof (and to see if its really the mirror or something else)? will acura replace the mirror if i take it to them even though my car's not under warranty because they know about this possible chemicals?

Thanks and be fast, I dont wanna die from my rearview!!

6MTUA5

iTrader: (2)

^^^^^^^Actually, I made a mistake up there^^^^^^^

I said that the top half of it was a little darker and most of it was clear but i went out there and looked at it again, and just a little section of the top was clear and THE REST was black. I took a picture to show, but I can't find out how to insert it.

vash68

I think this moderator is suffering from not-so-mild case of stubborness. I wonder if his rear view mirror is involved..

Hello Pow! Ppl come here to share their opinions and voice their concerns, so please stop trying to shut them up! And if you don't like it, then go and moderate some BMW forum!

MikePA

Lemme get this straight...Your mirror has been leaking fluid on your console and you have not done anything about it? Yeah, right.

Great, thanks to this thread, anyone with a sore throat or an allergy will be chased by lawyers to file a class action law suit.

There's no more wrong with you than any other deadbeat looking to win in the lawsuit lottery game. While you're at it, breathe in some asbestos, start smoking, and take some bootleg Vioxx. Get some silicone breast implants, too. OD on Viagra and go blind. One of the lawsuits will hit gold.

Sure beats working for a living.

And all this began right after you bought your TL, right? Or did it start soon after you decided work was a hard way to make a living?

Darn right, you should. Tell him about the poisons, too. I am sure if you tell enough doctors about your pending lawsuit, you will find one to diagnose any disease you ask them to, and blame the mirror. Heck, they'll throw in a stress disorder over worrying about the tranny.

They sure will. They'll probably give you a mirror out of a 2007 model, and toss in the rest of the car, too. Note: Reconsider the aforementioned Viagra suggestion. Could drive a new car if you are blind.

I hope I was fast enough. Can I join the class action lawsuit? Please, pretty please.

I don't want to to die prematurely, either. The world would be so much poorer if you did.

stiletto

Well I have seen worst and stranger car care practices, so I don't see this as abnormal. People run around doing 70+mph on spare doughnuts, drive around at night with perfectly working headlights that are turnned off, drive around with leaks in the radiator, cables misswired, wipers that don't wipe, busted locks and inside door handles, broken glass... the list is endless.

They are obviously not as graced and perfect as you. God forgive them.


I highly doubt it. You obviously have NO IDEA how "class action lawsuits " are filed or come about. However, you sound like an ASS commenting like that.

God forbid you find yourself in any situation one tenth as helpless as the poor original poster or anyone else that is suffering because of the negligence and bean counting of large corporations.


Actually, now that you mention it, many have already... (more on this below)


Yeah, but with a chronic illness... I don't know it doesn't sound like to much fun to me. Statistically speaking, it tdoe's not work like that. besides, Any and all will agree with you there: Working for a living is a punishment, obviously to you too. Most likely, all the money earned would not be worth the suffering of the symptoms after paying out lawyers, and doctors, and all the OTC meds you took untill you realized what was wrong with you in the first place.


Did I say you sounded like an ass before, I am sorry, you sound like an illiterate ass. No where does it mention that the problem started right after the purchase of the TL.


Have you not experienced tranny issues? Doctors always ask you to narrow down cause. What are you an idiot???


It was a perfectly formulated question that you answered by blowing hot gas from your ass... Acura has been known to be erratic in its dealings with defective parts. I am sure that if you have a true concern, any one with some common sense will try to assist you. If the mirror in question is/has been leaking, AND you have symtoms, AND you act reasonable at the dealership (or over the phone), you might get a free mirror as the very least. Specially if you can demonstrate that your next mirror might be autodimming, but it will be the "newer safer" model and it will NOT be installed on a Honda. I would wait for the class action lawsuit before the new TL materializes, however.


Well... you sound like the one you hate when you say that. Can't even comment on your response, except to say you should try prozac. You sound like a very sour person.


Another Ass comment. WTF are you trying to say? The guy/girl has 9 posts. why don't you hold agun to their head and tell them they aren't invited here anymore?

More like:

BACK ON TOPIC: Thanks for the concern and bringing up the subject. I hope your issues are resolved quickly. Get competent help for your problems. You might want to research health issues with other owners of other brands since Donnelly is supplier to ALL major manufacturers. Good luck.

MikePA

Blah, blah, blah. I didn't quote your message because one copy of your drivel is enough.

I wasn't responding to the original poster, you moron. This so called 'exploding mirror' problem is not widespread and anyone looking to make money off the so called problems caused by it, as the person I responded to (I mentioned this again in case you forgot already) is simply someone looking to win lawsuit lottery.

TlsNavi03

iTrader: (1)

This guys got a point.

I'm not doubting the issues with the mirrors, or effects they may have.

BUT,

Suing seems to be the new AMERICAN WAY!!

6MTUA5

iTrader: (2)

MikePA, you are a fucking idiot.

First of all, the fluid isnt and hasnt been leaking and burning all over the interior. The fluid is leaking but does seem to be contained inside the mirror but i do remember some of it coming out one time (I have pictures but cant figure out how to upload them on thread). I bought this car used and don't have a warranty to take it back to the dealership to get a brand new mirror. If you were a full time college student like me, you wouldnt have the money to buy a new mirror either, and how and i supposed to know that this leaking rearview mirror could be hazardous to my health??? You would think they would check for these things before they put them in cars. The only thing I am trying to do here is get some kind of compensation IF this fluid from the rearview mirror is the cause of my health problems. I'm not looking for an 07 TL and millions of dollars, just something (i.e. to cover medical bills, time taken off from work, etc.). I live in Florida, so it gets very hot in my car, and may not need the fluid to be pouring out to have an effect on me.

Mike you're an idiot, saying that I "started to feel this way after I found out that working was a hard way to make a living"..... i'm not even gonna say anything more, besides you're an idiot.

MikePA

Everyone has a reason why they want something for nothing.

I imagine you've already contacted obespalov.