I compare my M45 to my former RL
01-03-2007, 12:26 PM
#41
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I compare my M45 to my current RL
I have a 2006 RL. Actually, it's primarily my wife's car. I also just got a 2007 M45. I agree with a lot of the comparison. I also have my own take on things.
As far as which vehicle is better, I can't say that there's a clear winner. The M45 clearly has more power and performance, but I'd really recommend test driving both to see what appeals to your needs before deciding whether the Acura is underpowered or just right for your needs. Prior to getting the RL, I was driving a 1991 Q45 that I've had since it was new. My feeling was that the difference in power was a big factor. My wife didn't want to admit it, but she misses the power. There are times that I want to change lanes, there is a big enough opening, but I decide to wait because of the difference in lane speeds. That's not the case with the M45 or Q45. Then again, typical traffic and driving conditions vary so much from one place to another that this might never be an issue for some people. And it's not as if it's an everyday problem for me either.
As for features, I think I'd give the edge to the RL. A lot of the features are more intelligently designed and better integrated. But not all of them. To me, it seems as if the M45 was designed by several teams of very talented engineers who each did their best on each part, but did not necessarily talk to the other teams very much. The RL has more of a holistic design.
Both cars handle well. Both have dynamic vehicle control systems that provide for excellent handling and control. The RL adds AWD, and the M45 Sport adds Rear Active Steer. It would be nice to have both, and each has advantages in different circumstances.
Both offer adaptive (intelligent) cruise control. Acura's gives more feedback. Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste, but I like it personally. The Acura gives detailed information about whether it's locked into the car ahead or sees it as open space, or when a vehicle cuts in front of you. Some might not find that important, and ultimately, you are supposed to be paying attention and reacting based on road conditions anyway, but I find it nice to know what the vehicle is "thinking."
The Acura uses the system for collision mitigation, and I think that's a great feature. The M45 will sense things too, lock the seatbelts, and prepressurize the brake system so emergency stops will be faster, but will not warn the driver in any way, nor slow down the vehicle if ICC (ACC) is not on. Personally, I'd like it to flash a light or ring a bell since the circuitry is there anyway. Even if it does not brake for me, it could at least tell me what it knows. But it doesn't and it probably has more to do with what the lawyers said than what the engineers said.
The M45 has a lane departure warning, so if you drift out of your lane without signalling, it lets you know. It's nice, but ultimately I think the collision mitigation would be more helpful. But both would be nice.
Both have decent stereos, and both have a demo DVD audio disc (with the same opening song) to show it off. If audio is that important to you, you can demo each one and decide which is better. Then again, a true audiophile will reject both, and prefer a $50,000 home system.
Both offer backup cameras. The M45's does a better job in varying lighting conditions, shows lines that indicate distance, and shows a moving indicator of where your car will go, that changes as you turn the wheel. Both will help you park and avoid hitting children, and except in certain lighting conditions, will let you see everything you need to see. Both claim that they are not a substitute for looking over your shoulder, but the M45 comes closer.
The RL's navigation system is more intuitive. It integrates voice commands and screen menu prompts very well, while the M45 offers voice as an alternative. The M45 disables certain functions while the vehicle is moving, but allows for voice control. But you can't just switch to voice and speak the name of the screen option you'd like to select. Since both cars know if there's a passenger, and even if it's a heavy passenger (read: adult) there is no technical reason to disable anything when there is a passenger. But the M45 does it anyway. The RL switches to night view based on time of day and season, while the M45 goes by the headlight switch. Since both have automatic headlights, the implication should be obvious but was lost on the M45 team. The Acura also gives a lot more ability to customize things and turn features on and off. Both do a decent job of finding things. The RL, in some circumstances, will present a user with a list of matching locations by name instead of factoring in distance, and will show a restaurant that's 2500 miles away before it shows one nearby. But in general, it does a good job, especially with voice prompts. The M45 uses one voice to give directions, but a different one when it inserts street names. It sounds awkard. But it speaks the street name for all streets, as far as I've encountered so far. The RL will occasionally say "the road" instead of inserting a street name if it can't figure out the pronunciation. But aside from the gait being a little off, the speech is far more natural from the RL.
The biggest problem I have with the M45's system is the "address book." I use the term in quotes because it isn't an address book. If you had a paper address book, and you had pages of addresses but no names, would you find it useful? That's how the M45 does it. You tell it to take you to 12452 Cherry street, and it decides to save it as Cherry street. When you get there, it tells you that you've arrived, but the screen does not show the 12452. So if you don't remember the house number (which is a reasonable assumption if you needed a navigator to get you there) then you had better have written it down. If you decide to save the address as "Bob's house" then the M45 won't show you "Cherry street" at all. Imagine a paper address book with people's names but no addresses. Yes, the car at least knows the coordinates, but as an address book, it's pretty bad. If I key in Bob's address, and drop my kids off there, and then my wife wants to use the car to pick them up, she can ask the navigator, but it will never tell her quite which house it is.
If I tell it to find Costco in Centerville by giving it an address of 982 Elm stret, it will save it as Elm street by default. Going through an address book looking for Elm street is not the intuitive way to find Costco the next time I want to go there. And if I change the name to Costco, it's fine until I save the Costco in Pleasanton. The Acura would show me the details for each listing when I searched my address book, but the M45 is not all that it should be.
The M45 lacks automatic door locking. The RL lacks cooled seats, but both heat seats. The M45 offers climate controlled seats in the back seats too. The M45 lacks OnStar and integrated traffic. Both offer XM, but the M45 offers Sirius as an alternative. The RL gives you XM for a year, but the M45 gives you a three month trial.
Both offer Bluetooth. The RL shows more detail (depending on the phone) such as battery strength. The M45 flashes the name of the phone on the navigator screen when it syncs, which is nice, and makes it easier to switch phones using a menu. The M45 also shows the phone antenna strength in the corner of the navigation screen even when the phone is not being used, which is nice since it gives a good idea of coverage in general. Voice dialing is easy from both, but the RL gives a different talk button. The advantage of that is that it won't change your radio or set the temperature to 17 degrees below 0 by mistake, but it's an extra set of buttons.
The RL does more to customize things for each driver. Both put the seat in the proper place, etc. But the RL puts the CD back to the same track and a few other things. The problem with the RL is its method of determining the setting. It goes by who opens a door first. So if my wife touches the passenger handle before I open the driver door, it gets set for her. Pressing button 1 or 2 will get my seat in place but does not switch things from driver 1 to driver 2. I need to open the vehicle from a locked state to get things the way they should be. So if my wife parks in the garage but does not lock the car, I must first touch the handle to lock things, and then pull the handle to unlock the car.
Both have things that could have been done better. The layout of the controls in the RL is a bit nicer, or at least I find it more intuitive. It does a better job of integrating navigation, traffic, phone, driver settings, etc. If only it made it easier to switch drivers.
If you are looking for the ultimate in power and performance, I'd give the nod to the M45. But the RL still handles extremely well, has nice ergonomics, practical features, and a collision mitigation system that could save your life. Ultimately, it boils down to personal taste. I could live with either just fine, my wife is not jealous of my car, and I'm not jealous of hers. We probably would not switch with each other, but would not feel short changed if we did switch with each other.
Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.
If Acura offered a V8, perhaps my wife would have gotten the V6 anyway. For practical purposes, it's all most people will ever need.
As far as which vehicle is better, I can't say that there's a clear winner. The M45 clearly has more power and performance, but I'd really recommend test driving both to see what appeals to your needs before deciding whether the Acura is underpowered or just right for your needs. Prior to getting the RL, I was driving a 1991 Q45 that I've had since it was new. My feeling was that the difference in power was a big factor. My wife didn't want to admit it, but she misses the power. There are times that I want to change lanes, there is a big enough opening, but I decide to wait because of the difference in lane speeds. That's not the case with the M45 or Q45. Then again, typical traffic and driving conditions vary so much from one place to another that this might never be an issue for some people. And it's not as if it's an everyday problem for me either.
As for features, I think I'd give the edge to the RL. A lot of the features are more intelligently designed and better integrated. But not all of them. To me, it seems as if the M45 was designed by several teams of very talented engineers who each did their best on each part, but did not necessarily talk to the other teams very much. The RL has more of a holistic design.
Both cars handle well. Both have dynamic vehicle control systems that provide for excellent handling and control. The RL adds AWD, and the M45 Sport adds Rear Active Steer. It would be nice to have both, and each has advantages in different circumstances.
Both offer adaptive (intelligent) cruise control. Acura's gives more feedback. Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste, but I like it personally. The Acura gives detailed information about whether it's locked into the car ahead or sees it as open space, or when a vehicle cuts in front of you. Some might not find that important, and ultimately, you are supposed to be paying attention and reacting based on road conditions anyway, but I find it nice to know what the vehicle is "thinking."
The Acura uses the system for collision mitigation, and I think that's a great feature. The M45 will sense things too, lock the seatbelts, and prepressurize the brake system so emergency stops will be faster, but will not warn the driver in any way, nor slow down the vehicle if ICC (ACC) is not on. Personally, I'd like it to flash a light or ring a bell since the circuitry is there anyway. Even if it does not brake for me, it could at least tell me what it knows. But it doesn't and it probably has more to do with what the lawyers said than what the engineers said.
The M45 has a lane departure warning, so if you drift out of your lane without signalling, it lets you know. It's nice, but ultimately I think the collision mitigation would be more helpful. But both would be nice.
Both have decent stereos, and both have a demo DVD audio disc (with the same opening song) to show it off. If audio is that important to you, you can demo each one and decide which is better. Then again, a true audiophile will reject both, and prefer a $50,000 home system.
Both offer backup cameras. The M45's does a better job in varying lighting conditions, shows lines that indicate distance, and shows a moving indicator of where your car will go, that changes as you turn the wheel. Both will help you park and avoid hitting children, and except in certain lighting conditions, will let you see everything you need to see. Both claim that they are not a substitute for looking over your shoulder, but the M45 comes closer.
The RL's navigation system is more intuitive. It integrates voice commands and screen menu prompts very well, while the M45 offers voice as an alternative. The M45 disables certain functions while the vehicle is moving, but allows for voice control. But you can't just switch to voice and speak the name of the screen option you'd like to select. Since both cars know if there's a passenger, and even if it's a heavy passenger (read: adult) there is no technical reason to disable anything when there is a passenger. But the M45 does it anyway. The RL switches to night view based on time of day and season, while the M45 goes by the headlight switch. Since both have automatic headlights, the implication should be obvious but was lost on the M45 team. The Acura also gives a lot more ability to customize things and turn features on and off. Both do a decent job of finding things. The RL, in some circumstances, will present a user with a list of matching locations by name instead of factoring in distance, and will show a restaurant that's 2500 miles away before it shows one nearby. But in general, it does a good job, especially with voice prompts. The M45 uses one voice to give directions, but a different one when it inserts street names. It sounds awkard. But it speaks the street name for all streets, as far as I've encountered so far. The RL will occasionally say "the road" instead of inserting a street name if it can't figure out the pronunciation. But aside from the gait being a little off, the speech is far more natural from the RL.
The biggest problem I have with the M45's system is the "address book." I use the term in quotes because it isn't an address book. If you had a paper address book, and you had pages of addresses but no names, would you find it useful? That's how the M45 does it. You tell it to take you to 12452 Cherry street, and it decides to save it as Cherry street. When you get there, it tells you that you've arrived, but the screen does not show the 12452. So if you don't remember the house number (which is a reasonable assumption if you needed a navigator to get you there) then you had better have written it down. If you decide to save the address as "Bob's house" then the M45 won't show you "Cherry street" at all. Imagine a paper address book with people's names but no addresses. Yes, the car at least knows the coordinates, but as an address book, it's pretty bad. If I key in Bob's address, and drop my kids off there, and then my wife wants to use the car to pick them up, she can ask the navigator, but it will never tell her quite which house it is.
If I tell it to find Costco in Centerville by giving it an address of 982 Elm stret, it will save it as Elm street by default. Going through an address book looking for Elm street is not the intuitive way to find Costco the next time I want to go there. And if I change the name to Costco, it's fine until I save the Costco in Pleasanton. The Acura would show me the details for each listing when I searched my address book, but the M45 is not all that it should be.
The M45 lacks automatic door locking. The RL lacks cooled seats, but both heat seats. The M45 offers climate controlled seats in the back seats too. The M45 lacks OnStar and integrated traffic. Both offer XM, but the M45 offers Sirius as an alternative. The RL gives you XM for a year, but the M45 gives you a three month trial.
Both offer Bluetooth. The RL shows more detail (depending on the phone) such as battery strength. The M45 flashes the name of the phone on the navigator screen when it syncs, which is nice, and makes it easier to switch phones using a menu. The M45 also shows the phone antenna strength in the corner of the navigation screen even when the phone is not being used, which is nice since it gives a good idea of coverage in general. Voice dialing is easy from both, but the RL gives a different talk button. The advantage of that is that it won't change your radio or set the temperature to 17 degrees below 0 by mistake, but it's an extra set of buttons.
The RL does more to customize things for each driver. Both put the seat in the proper place, etc. But the RL puts the CD back to the same track and a few other things. The problem with the RL is its method of determining the setting. It goes by who opens a door first. So if my wife touches the passenger handle before I open the driver door, it gets set for her. Pressing button 1 or 2 will get my seat in place but does not switch things from driver 1 to driver 2. I need to open the vehicle from a locked state to get things the way they should be. So if my wife parks in the garage but does not lock the car, I must first touch the handle to lock things, and then pull the handle to unlock the car.
Both have things that could have been done better. The layout of the controls in the RL is a bit nicer, or at least I find it more intuitive. It does a better job of integrating navigation, traffic, phone, driver settings, etc. If only it made it easier to switch drivers.
If you are looking for the ultimate in power and performance, I'd give the nod to the M45. But the RL still handles extremely well, has nice ergonomics, practical features, and a collision mitigation system that could save your life. Ultimately, it boils down to personal taste. I could live with either just fine, my wife is not jealous of my car, and I'm not jealous of hers. We probably would not switch with each other, but would not feel short changed if we did switch with each other.
Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.
If Acura offered a V8, perhaps my wife would have gotten the V6 anyway. For practical purposes, it's all most people will ever need.
01-03-2007, 12:49 PM
#42
Senior Moderator
^ wow, another great RL vs. m45 review. I also hate how nissan/infiniti disable the manual control of the navi when driving. I absolutely hate that in my 350z. You can however "cheat" if it's a previous address or something already saved, but forget about putting in something new unless you're stopped.
01-03-2007, 01:03 PM
#43
Burning Brakes
Hagrinas,
Great post. Thanks. My bother has an M35x and other than the differences between the M35 and M45, your post is spot on. I also agree with your final statement:
“Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.”
I don’t think the lack of a V8 is really hurting the RL all that much. I think what’s killing it is Acura’s incredibly poor advertising and promotion. A good advertising campaign would work wonders. Infinity sells plenty of M35’s, and FX35’s. BMW sells plenty of 6 cylinder 5 series. Lexus sells it’s share of 6 cylinder GS’s. Acura needs to decide if they really want to sell cars and find an agency that can help them do that.
LL
Great post. Thanks. My bother has an M35x and other than the differences between the M35 and M45, your post is spot on. I also agree with your final statement:
“Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.”
I don’t think the lack of a V8 is really hurting the RL all that much. I think what’s killing it is Acura’s incredibly poor advertising and promotion. A good advertising campaign would work wonders. Infinity sells plenty of M35’s, and FX35’s. BMW sells plenty of 6 cylinder 5 series. Lexus sells it’s share of 6 cylinder GS’s. Acura needs to decide if they really want to sell cars and find an agency that can help them do that.
LL
01-03-2007, 01:29 PM
#44
Suzuka Master
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I have had a 2006 M45 sport for a little over a year now and had to correct some of your inaccuracies...
Both offer adaptive (intelligent) cruise control. Acura's gives more feedback. Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste, but I like it personally. The Acura gives detailed information about whether it's locked into the car ahead or sees it as open space, or when a vehicle cuts in front of you.
The M's system does this too. If you have ICC on and there is a car in front of you, there will be a symbol of a car in front of the radar "beams" on the display. When there is no car, it won't show the car symbol.
the execution of the lane departure system is very lame...no way to control the volume of it and it freaks out when the roads are wet at night. But no worries, because under any normal radio volume, you can't hear the beeping anyway.
I don't see how the "implication" is lost on the M45. I think the RL basing night mode on time and season is redundant and unnecessary. Who cares what season or what time it is...if headlights need to be on and car is in night mode, then headlights need to be on and car is in night mode. Basing it on seasons and time is meaningless.
It's impossible to make a mistake like this unless you actually are trying to. it may take the correct command, or it may not take the right number, but if you are not paying enough attention to what it is doing and set your temperature wrong when you are trying to make a telephone call, then i question whether you are paying enough attention to even be driving.
Originally Posted by Hagrinas
Both offer adaptive (intelligent) cruise control. Acura's gives more feedback. Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste, but I like it personally. The Acura gives detailed information about whether it's locked into the car ahead or sees it as open space, or when a vehicle cuts in front of you.
The M45 has a lane departure warning, so if you drift out of your lane without signalling, it lets you know. It's nice, but ultimately I think the collision mitigation would be more helpful. But both would be nice.
The RL switches to night view based on time of day and season, while the M45 goes by the headlight switch. Since both have automatic headlights, the implication should be obvious but was lost on the M45 team.
Voice dialing is easy from both, but the RL gives a different talk button. The advantage of that is that it won't change your radio or set the temperature to 17 degrees below 0 by mistake, but it's an extra set of buttons.
01-03-2007, 01:39 PM
#45
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by synth19
^ wow, another great RL vs. m45 review. I also hate how nissan/infiniti disable the manual control of the navi when driving. I absolutely hate that in my 350z. You can however "cheat" if it's a previous address or something already saved, but forget about putting in something new unless you're stopped.
As a former '06 M45 owner myself, I can REALLY agree on the Nav points, and I'm with Synth on the Nav lockout ... it completely and totally blows.
Another thing the RL does that the M doesn't is to tell you which side of the street your destination is on. That may not sound like a biggie, but if you're on a multi-lane street, or a divided roadway, it's kinda important to know which lane to get in. That has saved me having to make the block more than once. In short, the RL's Nav is just quicker and easier to use, period.
I'd give the nod to the M for trunk space, but I think driver's space is a good bit tighter. The main culprit is a wide center stack that intrudes into the driver's knee space. After a few highway hours in the M I found myself struggling to find someplace to put my feet and legs that didn't hurt or cause cramps. By contrast, the RL's center stack is naroow and recessed just right so it doesn't create pressure points on my knee.
But one of the biggest issues with the M is gearing. I don't remember exactly now, but I recall the engine was taching over 3,000rpm at 60mph. Hell's fire, my RL is doing only about 1,700 at 60, IIRC. Basically, I can run 20 or 30mph faster in the RL in 5th gear at the same engine speed as in the M. That's part of the reason I never squeaked out more than 24mpg on the highway in the M, and I do well over 28 in the RL.
Last comment would be road noise. I had the Premium Pkg. M, and its Goodyear RSA's were very noisy. The lower profile tires on the Sport are even more so. And there isn't enough sound deadening in the M to keep it out of the cabin. By comparison, the RL is tomblike, and I much prefer that.
Good review!
.
.
01-03-2007, 02:02 PM
#46
Safety Car
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Over the Holidays while in Arizona my wife and I rented a M35 from Alamo ($618/wk) and drove around Phoenix & Tucson, down to Nogales for a day. I was happy to get back to my RL. The M35 had 4000 miles on it and was a mess inside. I noticed how the tranny was less smooth and the engine tone more noticable. Plus there was a sqeaky drive belt that was annoying. The interior ergonimics & plastic quality had a lot to be desired - not the quality I was expecting. I did like how teh stereo had RDS for FM and AM stations. The mileage for the 3.5 was avg. about 19.8 miles/gal for the trip. As mentione, I was glad to get back to my RL.
01-03-2007, 02:08 PM
#47
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Originally Posted by miner
Over the Holidays while in Arizona my wife and I rented a M35 from Alamo ($618/wk) and drove around Phoenix & Tucson, down to Nogales for a day. I was happy to get back to my RL. The M35 had 4000 miles on it and was a mess inside. I noticed how the tranny was less smooth and the engine tone more noticable. Plus there was a sqeaky drive belt that was annoying. The interior ergonimics & plastic quality had a lot to be desired - not the quality I was expecting. I did like how teh stereo had RDS for FM and AM stations. The mileage for the 3.5 was avg. about 19.8 miles/gal for the trip. As mentione, I was glad to get back to my RL.
Because quality of materials on the M i feel is slightly better than the RL, but the RL's layout is more intuitive and more streamlined. But I would never say the "plastic quality" had a lot to be desired when comparing the M to the RL, because that's just not so.
01-03-2007, 04:08 PM
#48
Senior Moderator
Awesome review and thanks for your thoughts, Hagrinas. 
Though I am an RL owner, I appreciate the M series. The M45 I couldn't fathom here in snowy (most years, anyway, this one seems an exception) northeast Ohio due to RWD, but I did test-drive the M35x at the Infiniti dealer across the street from my Acura dealer.
Yet another voice asking for a V8 in the RL. Are you listening, Acura? I'd likely have bought the V6 version anyway, as it offers more than enough power for my needs, but the V8 would make the RL the ultimate geek luxury car.
Speaking of power, if your wife feels the power is lacking, she really needs to step on it because most of the RL's power and torque are in the upper part of the power band. That's how I drive my RL on the freeway......never felt a lack of power.
Though I am an RL owner, I appreciate the M series. The M45 I couldn't fathom here in snowy (most years, anyway, this one seems an exception) northeast Ohio due to RWD, but I did test-drive the M35x at the Infiniti dealer across the street from my Acura dealer.Yet another voice asking for a V8 in the RL. Are you listening, Acura? I'd likely have bought the V6 version anyway, as it offers more than enough power for my needs, but the V8 would make the RL the ultimate geek luxury car.
Speaking of power, if your wife feels the power is lacking, she really needs to step on it because most of the RL's power and torque are in the upper part of the power band. That's how I drive my RL on the freeway......never felt a lack of power.
01-03-2007, 06:20 PM
#49
Burning Brakes
Good review Hagrinas. I really love the way the m45 looks. Just that I needed awd also.
I agree a v-8 would have been the way to go for Acura, but honestly with a intake and pulley this car now feels like it has a baby v-8 down low. The difference is that dramatic. So for under $500 in aftermarket mods you can fix the RL's short comings.
I agree a v-8 would have been the way to go for Acura, but honestly with a intake and pulley this car now feels like it has a baby v-8 down low. The difference is that dramatic. So for under $500 in aftermarket mods you can fix the RL's short comings.
01-03-2007, 06:30 PM
#50
Three Wheelin'
Hopefully, Honda will create a new platform that can handle a V8 engine or larger. Personally, I don't know if a V8 would be good for the current FWD Global Midsized Platform.
Touge, could you please explain the intake and pully enhancements for us dumb kids?
Touge, could you please explain the intake and pully enhancements for us dumb kids?
01-03-2007, 07:32 PM
#52
Three Wheelin'
Very nice and and good read review. As I have said many times, I have test driven every car in the 45-60K class. I drive a new one almost every weekend. Last weekend was the New Volvo S80. The V8 is not out yet and the 6 is crap.
I can tell you when you get up in the luxury class, there is very little difference in the cars. It really comes down to nit picking. The M was the closest to what I like about the RL. The power and torque was impressive. For me only the audio system disappointed me. It was enough that I did not want to spend that much money on a car and thinking about upgrading the system everytime I heard it. The
dvd audio is very acceptable but the other inputs are just not that good.
I can tell you when you get up in the luxury class, there is very little difference in the cars. It really comes down to nit picking. The M was the closest to what I like about the RL. The power and torque was impressive. For me only the audio system disappointed me. It was enough that I did not want to spend that much money on a car and thinking about upgrading the system everytime I heard it. The
dvd audio is very acceptable but the other inputs are just not that good.
01-04-2007, 11:11 PM
#53
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Originally Posted by mrdeeno
I have had a 2006 M45 sport for a little over a year now and had to correct some of your inaccuracies...
The M's system does this too. If you have ICC on and there is a car in front of you, there will be a symbol of a car in front of the radar "beams" on the display. When there is no car, it won't show the car symbol.
The M's system does this too. If you have ICC on and there is a car in front of you, there will be a symbol of a car in front of the radar "beams" on the display. When there is no car, it won't show the car symbol.
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
the execution of the lane departure system is very lame...no way to control the volume of it and it freaks out when the roads are wet at night. But no worries, because under any normal radio volume, you can't hear the beeping anyway.
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
I don't see how the "implication" is lost on the M45. I think the RL basing night mode on time and season is redundant and unnecessary. Who cares what season or what time it is...if headlights need to be on and car is in night mode, then headlights need to be on and car is in night mode. Basing it on seasons and time is meaningless.
The first time I drove it at night, it was in daytime mode, and I didn't know why. Today, I drove it in the rain. There was plenty of light, but my headlights were on (which is another thing the M45 does not do sensibly) and the navigator switched to night mode. It's surprising to me that the automatic headlights were not automatic in this case, given how many vehicles have done it automatically for so long. Even my six year old minivan is set to put the headlights on when it rains, unless I configure it not to. In any event, the navigator started out in night mode. I had to switch it manually. The lights were on when I pulled out of the garage, and stayed on afterward. At some point on the trip, the lights went off, but I have no idea when. The navigator stayed in day mode, which was fine with me, but it would have been nicer if it had worked like the RL.
The M45 also lacks a dashboard indicator for the headlights, making it harder to tell if the lights are on in certain conditions.
If you think it's meaningless for the navigator to dim just about the time that it's getting dark, then we will have to disagree. I found that even the cheapest after market navigator gets this right for me, and the M45 does not.
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
It's impossible to make a mistake like this unless you actually are trying to. it may take the correct command, or it may not take the right number, but if you are not paying enough attention to what it is doing and set your temperature wrong when you are trying to make a telephone call, then i question whether you are paying enough attention to even be driving.
01-06-2007, 01:20 PM
#54
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Originally Posted by Hagrinas
So far, it's worked well for me. I don't feel deprived not having it in the RL though. I've never had a false alarm, wet roads or otherwise. But I can't speak for all road conditions. I've heard others complain about it, and can only assume that it will be a problem for some. I agree about the volume. Either the beep should be louder, or it should lower the sound system temporarily. It should also do that when the navigator prompts with voice, just as the RL does.
As for the conditions in rain, it may also have something to do with my 6000k hids. because of the lack of yellow light in 6000k compared to the OEM, the markings on roads are much harder to see in wet conditions and may be contributing to the false alarms.
It's still not clear to me how this is supposed to work, but according to the manual, "When you turn the headlight switch on, the background color changes." That's all it says. But since I don't use the headlight switch, that's obviously not relevant. It doesn't seem to work as documented, or how the Infiniti help desk explained it to me, which is actually a good thing. If it really did go by the switch instead of whether the headlights are on, it would be even worse.
The first time I drove it at night, it was in daytime mode, and I didn't know why. Today, I drove it in the rain. There was plenty of light, but my headlights were on (which is another thing the M45 does not do sensibly) and the navigator switched to night mode. It's surprising to me that the automatic headlights were not automatic in this case, given how many vehicles have done it automatically for so long. Even my six year old minivan is set to put the headlights on when it rains, unless I configure it not to. In any event, the navigator started out in night mode. I had to switch it manually. The lights were on when I pulled out of the garage, and stayed on afterward. At some point on the trip, the lights went off, but I have no idea when. The navigator stayed in day mode, which was fine with me, but it would have been nicer if it had worked like the RL.
The first time I drove it at night, it was in daytime mode, and I didn't know why. Today, I drove it in the rain. There was plenty of light, but my headlights were on (which is another thing the M45 does not do sensibly) and the navigator switched to night mode. It's surprising to me that the automatic headlights were not automatic in this case, given how many vehicles have done it automatically for so long. Even my six year old minivan is set to put the headlights on when it rains, unless I configure it not to. In any event, the navigator started out in night mode. I had to switch it manually. The lights were on when I pulled out of the garage, and stayed on afterward. At some point on the trip, the lights went off, but I have no idea when. The navigator stayed in day mode, which was fine with me, but it would have been nicer if it had worked like the RL.
Further, the auto-headlight sensitivity can be changed. I don't remember which way is which, but I believe that turning the sensitivity up will make it turn on sooner as its getting dark or if it's raining out.
The M45 also lacks a dashboard indicator for the headlights, making it harder to tell if the lights are on in certain conditions.
If you think it's meaningless for the navigator to dim just about the time that it's getting dark, then we will have to disagree. I found that even the cheapest after market navigator gets this right for me, and the M45 does not.
I found that both the M45 and the RL will do strange things when they don't understand commands. Rather than asking to repeat, they will do something that sounds sort of like what the speaker said. I'm not the one who is not paying attention, and I'm not the one who is setting things wrong; it's the car that sets things wrong when it does not understand commands. The RL might screw things up with the radio or climate control when I ask for a navigation thing, but it will not do it with a phone command.
01-07-2007, 12:24 AM
#55
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Originally Posted by mrdeeno
Yes, but your example is trying to make a phone call and inadvertently changing the temperature, which is the example I am refuting. It may select the wrong commands at times, but it is very difficult to "inadvertantly" turn the temperature down when trying to make a phone call that you have to be making this mistake intentional for it ot happen.
01-07-2007, 12:36 AM
#56
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Originally Posted by Rob L
I also agree a 6 speed auto should be on the car. IMO it was a bad choice to go with a 5 speed than a 6 speed.
01-07-2007, 09:51 AM
#57
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by Trackruner228
I think the reason is that acura is scared to build a new tranny. They probably remembered what happened when they designed a new tranny for the 2G TL (my car), and thought well these 5 speeds last for a long time lets not change them and have them all die like they did on those TLs.
In any case, I have to say the RL does pretty well with its 5spd, whereas the M45 REALLY needs a 6th gear. That car revs so high at highway speeds that it's almost distracting, whereas the RL is relaxed and calm at speed. More gears may help with midrange power, but otherwise the RL is nicely geared IMO.
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01-07-2007, 01:18 PM
#58
Three Wheelin'
Acura doesn't BUILD anything. There's no such thing as an Acura manufacturing plant. They are primarily a design company.
That being said, I would like to see Honda engineer a 6-speed tranny, but hey, I remember when the 1999 TL had only a 4-speed. . .
That being said, I would like to see Honda engineer a 6-speed tranny, but hey, I remember when the 1999 TL had only a 4-speed. . .
01-07-2007, 02:07 PM
#59
Racer
Originally Posted by jhr3uva90
but hey, I remember when the 1999 TL had only a 4-speed. . .
01-07-2007, 02:30 PM
#60
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by jhr3uva90
Acura doesn't BUILD anything. There's no such thing as an Acura manufacturing plant. They are primarily a design company.
But let me restate: I don't think Honda builds their own transmissions for Acura cars. Like most other Japanese mfr's, they source them from suppliers like Aisin and Jatco.
.
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01-07-2007, 02:37 PM
#61
AcurAdmirer
Originally Posted by phins2rt
Funny how that tranny doesn't have many problems but the 5 speed that came after it has been very detrimental to the brand.
My transmissions may explode tomorrow, but I have to say both of them (in my RL and my TL) are among the smoothest-operating AT's I've had, bar none. They operate so buttery that I can slip through the gears without my passengers feeling a single shift.
.
.
01-07-2007, 03:30 PM
#62
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Originally Posted by Mike_TX
Isn't it true that the trans problems were a relatively small part of the production run and the issue was corrected a long time ago?
My transmissions may explode tomorrow, but I have to say both of them (in my RL and my TL) are among the smoothest-operating AT's I've had, bar none. They operate so buttery that I can slip through the gears without my passengers feeling a single shift.
.
.
My transmissions may explode tomorrow, but I have to say both of them (in my RL and my TL) are among the smoothest-operating AT's I've had, bar none. They operate so buttery that I can slip through the gears without my passengers feeling a single shift.
.
.
It was a design problem that made it more likely to fail at a higher rate than is acceptable.
This applied to all v6 mounted trannies from the accord, odyssey, prev. TL, CL, MDX, and i think some carried over into the current gen TL's also. Not sure if any current RL's have had it, i haven't heard or ready any postings concerning the RL.
01-07-2007, 04:00 PM
#63
Three Wheelin'
The tranny problem afflicted only a small percentage of TLs and CLs overall, although the Type S versions of those cars were more susceptible.
01-07-2007, 09:29 PM
#64
Racer
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
Isn't it true that the trans problems were a relatively small part of the production run and the issue was corrected a long time ago?
Maybe Honda/Acura has learned from the past, but I would be a little leary of a new six speed tranny if they decided to include this in future models.
09-13-2007, 10:04 PM
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Originally Posted by shepsan
I have now driven my new 2006 M45 Luxury Model sedan enough to form an opinion about it. At the same time, I am able to make a preliminary comparison with the car it replaced, my superb 2005 Acura RL.
Unequivocally I believe each is a fine luxury sedan. Either is able to meet my driving needs with safety and comfort. Both are improved versions of immediate predecessors and as such are more outstanding values then any previous car of their brand.
There are certain aspects that I consider to be paramount in a luxury sedan. In order of importance to me are safety, engine performance, ride, overall visual style, fit, finish, creature comforts and price. Both the RL and the M45 surpassed these criteria by exceeding my expectations.
There are no factory options available to purchase for the RL. All of its numerous features and high-tech bells and whistles are included the single basic price of the RL.
The M45 is priced in the more traditional way. Its basic price includes a vast number of standard features. In order to equip it with other features that catered to my desire for creature comforts, I purchase the Journey and Tech packages at additional cost. These packages matched in similarity those integral to the RL as well as three additional features not offered by Acura in the RL.
Thus, nearly comparably equipped, I paid $51,019.25 for the six cylinders 300hp
powered RL and $59,911.17 for the eight cylinders 335hp powered M45 luxury Models. These figures include taxes, fees and registration permits.
A frequent criticism of the RL is that it is inferior to other luxury simply because Acura does not offer an engine with eight cylinders. I reject this assertion as nonsense. It has been my experience owning numerous high-powered V8 and V12 engine cars that the 2005 RL equipped with six cylinders 300hp engine produces enough power and acceleration to enter freeways at optimum speeds, safely pass other cars when required to do so and to cruise at interstate speeds with ease and comfort. I will concede that the RL engine does not stimulate me with the same physical “rush” generated the M45 V8 335hp engine.
So, what are the differences in the engines? The RL has a pleasant punch of sedate power. The M45's engine propels with verve and muscle. Both take me to my destinations in the same amount time driving within posted speed limits. If I were driving on the autobahn, I would want to have my foot on the M45 pedal. Driving in the city, the RL is more then adequate.
There is a downside to exhilarating engine power and that is higher gasoline consumption. Of the two sedans, better gas economy was my reward as an RL owner. The M45 swallows gasoline at a higher rate and requires more frequent fill-ups at the pump.
There are many cost consequences owning an RL vs. an M45. As previously mentioned, it begins first at the time of initial purchase and builds because of frequent fill-ups at the pump. There is also an unexpected cost that I failed to anticipate, maintenance. I drove the RL in excess of 10k before first oil and filter change was required. The M45 requires a first oil and filter change at 3,750 miles and one thereafter as increments of 3,750 miles occurs.
Another difference is that the M45 requires (per the operator’s manual) a structured break-in period of 1200 miles. With the exception of a brief few miles to properly set the brakes and to allow the car to properly seat, I drove the RL from the very beginning as I did on the last day I drove it; with gusto!
The RL has its unique SHAWD. I never drove the RL in snow or in really foul weather. Nevertheless, I liked the SHAWD very much. I found that the RL’s handling on sharp curves was sure and safe.
The M45 is a RWD vehicle. Its suspension and ability to stabilize on curves at fairly high speed is as good as it gets. So much power married with such good handling has given me a very great sense of pleasure.
Both of these sedans are outfitted with a wide variety of creature comfort electronics including Bluetooth. My favorite feature in both is the navigation system. Each is excellent and can be operated by the driver using mechanical hand controls or by using voice recognition or a combination of each. The systems differ from one another in complexity and in visual and audio features. I found the RL system to be simpler to learn and operate. The M45 system is more sophisticated. Neither, however, was difficult to learn nor to master. Of the two, I favor the M45 system mainly because of its voice prompts and text menus.
The audio system is good in the RL. It is exceptional in the M45. The range, timber and overall sound quality of the M45 system are superior to the RL.
The M45 has a CD player in the dash, a navigation DVD unit in the glove compartment and a DVD audio and movie player located in the center console. Movies can be shown on the main video dash screen only when the car is not being driven.
The M45 has the DVD navigation unit in the trunk and the CD player in the dash.
I previously mentioned that three features were integral to the M45 option packages I purchased. None are present in the 2005 RL. The M45 has a camera mounted near the rear trunk latch. It provides a view to the rear of the vehicle while backing up. There is also a lane departure warning when the car ventures over an adjacent lane line and an intelligent cruise control which protect against ramming a car in front of the M45 when on it is on cruise control.
The M45 has driver and front seat passenger heat and air-conditioned seats. The 2005 RL has only heat controlled front seats.
Both cars are of similar dimensions. However, the M45 has more inside passenger and trunk space then the RL. In my family, the definitive authority on style and visual beauty is my wife. She says, “The RL is more beautiful on the outside and more luxuriously appointed on the inside. She also says the RL has the more comfortable seats. “
Hmmmmmm, although I recognize that it is not wise to argue with one’s wife, her subjective statement is just that . . . subjective. Long ago I learned that beauty is indeed in the eye of the beholder. I think both cars are great to look at.
Here are my conclusions: The 2005 Acura RL provides a good, safe and comfortable ride. I got more then my monies worth for the price I paid for it. Best of all, I never had a single mechanical failure with the RL. It not only looked and felt like a luxury sedan, in my estimation, it was one in every sense of the word.
My 2006 Infiniti M45 is a sleek and well-appointed. I think its electronic creature comfort technologies are better then those in the RL. The greatest difference between the two in my estimation is the power and thrust of the M45. The Infiniti engine is awesome. Its transmission is stellar. The car is quiet at speed limits and rockets with a purr on the edge of a growl at high speeds. It is music to my ears.
Both automobiles handle very well. The RL with its SHAWD always gave me a sense of security. The way the M45 handles, I am always in control.
I sold the RL for the following reasons. I do not keep a car for more than two to three years. The resale value of the RL has plummeted in recent times. Lastly, I was offered a price for my RL by a private party that I could not refuse.
As of this writing, it is my opinion that the overall quality of the 2006 M45 Luxury Sedan equipped with the Journey and Tech packages is superior to the 2005 RL.
The $8,891.92 difference in cost between the two is a nonissue to me. However, if price is the determining consideration, one cannot go wrong choosing the RL.
After I have ten thousand or so miles on the M45, I will write a more detailed report of my findings.
Regards to all.
Unequivocally I believe each is a fine luxury sedan. Either is able to meet my driving needs with safety and comfort. Both are improved versions of immediate predecessors and as such are more outstanding values then any previous car of their brand.
There are certain aspects that I consider to be paramount in a luxury sedan. In order of importance to me are safety, engine performance, ride, overall visual style, fit, finish, creature comforts and price. Both the RL and the M45 surpassed these criteria by exceeding my expectations.
There are no factory options available to purchase for the RL. All of its numerous features and high-tech bells and whistles are included the single basic price of the RL.
The M45 is priced in the more traditional way. Its basic price includes a vast number of standard features. In order to equip it with other features that catered to my desire for creature comforts, I purchase the Journey and Tech packages at additional cost. These packages matched in similarity those integral to the RL as well as three additional features not offered by Acura in the RL.
Thus, nearly comparably equipped, I paid $51,019.25 for the six cylinders 300hp
powered RL and $59,911.17 for the eight cylinders 335hp powered M45 luxury Models. These figures include taxes, fees and registration permits.
A frequent criticism of the RL is that it is inferior to other luxury simply because Acura does not offer an engine with eight cylinders. I reject this assertion as nonsense. It has been my experience owning numerous high-powered V8 and V12 engine cars that the 2005 RL equipped with six cylinders 300hp engine produces enough power and acceleration to enter freeways at optimum speeds, safely pass other cars when required to do so and to cruise at interstate speeds with ease and comfort. I will concede that the RL engine does not stimulate me with the same physical “rush” generated the M45 V8 335hp engine.
So, what are the differences in the engines? The RL has a pleasant punch of sedate power. The M45's engine propels with verve and muscle. Both take me to my destinations in the same amount time driving within posted speed limits. If I were driving on the autobahn, I would want to have my foot on the M45 pedal. Driving in the city, the RL is more then adequate.
There is a downside to exhilarating engine power and that is higher gasoline consumption. Of the two sedans, better gas economy was my reward as an RL owner. The M45 swallows gasoline at a higher rate and requires more frequent fill-ups at the pump.
There are many cost consequences owning an RL vs. an M45. As previously mentioned, it begins first at the time of initial purchase and builds because of frequent fill-ups at the pump. There is also an unexpected cost that I failed to anticipate, maintenance. I drove the RL in excess of 10k before first oil and filter change was required. The M45 requires a first oil and filter change at 3,750 miles and one thereafter as increments of 3,750 miles occurs.
Another difference is that the M45 requires (per the operator’s manual) a structured break-in period of 1200 miles. With the exception of a brief few miles to properly set the brakes and to allow the car to properly seat, I drove the RL from the very beginning as I did on the last day I drove it; with gusto!
The RL has its unique SHAWD. I never drove the RL in snow or in really foul weather. Nevertheless, I liked the SHAWD very much. I found that the RL’s handling on sharp curves was sure and safe.
The M45 is a RWD vehicle. Its suspension and ability to stabilize on curves at fairly high speed is as good as it gets. So much power married with such good handling has given me a very great sense of pleasure.
Both of these sedans are outfitted with a wide variety of creature comfort electronics including Bluetooth. My favorite feature in both is the navigation system. Each is excellent and can be operated by the driver using mechanical hand controls or by using voice recognition or a combination of each. The systems differ from one another in complexity and in visual and audio features. I found the RL system to be simpler to learn and operate. The M45 system is more sophisticated. Neither, however, was difficult to learn nor to master. Of the two, I favor the M45 system mainly because of its voice prompts and text menus.
The audio system is good in the RL. It is exceptional in the M45. The range, timber and overall sound quality of the M45 system are superior to the RL.
The M45 has a CD player in the dash, a navigation DVD unit in the glove compartment and a DVD audio and movie player located in the center console. Movies can be shown on the main video dash screen only when the car is not being driven.
The M45 has the DVD navigation unit in the trunk and the CD player in the dash.
I previously mentioned that three features were integral to the M45 option packages I purchased. None are present in the 2005 RL. The M45 has a camera mounted near the rear trunk latch. It provides a view to the rear of the vehicle while backing up. There is also a lane departure warning when the car ventures over an adjacent lane line and an intelligent cruise control which protect against ramming a car in front of the M45 when on it is on cruise control.
The M45 has driver and front seat passenger heat and air-conditioned seats. The 2005 RL has only heat controlled front seats.
Both cars are of similar dimensions. However, the M45 has more inside passenger and trunk space then the RL. In my family, the definitive authority on style and visual beauty is my wife. She says, “The RL is more beautiful on the outside and more luxuriously appointed on the inside. She also says the RL has the more comfortable seats. “
Hmmmmmm, although I recognize that it is not wise to argue with one’s wife, her subjective statement is just that . . . subjective. Long ago I learned that beauty is indeed in the eye of the beholder. I think both cars are great to look at.
Here are my conclusions: The 2005 Acura RL provides a good, safe and comfortable ride. I got more then my monies worth for the price I paid for it. Best of all, I never had a single mechanical failure with the RL. It not only looked and felt like a luxury sedan, in my estimation, it was one in every sense of the word.
My 2006 Infiniti M45 is a sleek and well-appointed. I think its electronic creature comfort technologies are better then those in the RL. The greatest difference between the two in my estimation is the power and thrust of the M45. The Infiniti engine is awesome. Its transmission is stellar. The car is quiet at speed limits and rockets with a purr on the edge of a growl at high speeds. It is music to my ears.
Both automobiles handle very well. The RL with its SHAWD always gave me a sense of security. The way the M45 handles, I am always in control.
I sold the RL for the following reasons. I do not keep a car for more than two to three years. The resale value of the RL has plummeted in recent times. Lastly, I was offered a price for my RL by a private party that I could not refuse.
As of this writing, it is my opinion that the overall quality of the 2006 M45 Luxury Sedan equipped with the Journey and Tech packages is superior to the 2005 RL.
The $8,891.92 difference in cost between the two is a nonissue to me. However, if price is the determining consideration, one cannot go wrong choosing the RL.
After I have ten thousand or so miles on the M45, I will write a more detailed report of my findings.
Regards to all.
09-14-2007, 03:16 PM
#66
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Originally Posted by tatu
just an opinnion.i run my RL with the motorcycle crews here in boston 2 members of opisite clubs have the q45&q45 sport, that by the numbers are faster than the RL,unfortunatley they both lost to my RL both in top speed and 1/4-1/2-1mile races .so im sorry to say that the q45 is overrated ,overpriced&underpowerd but to each there own and u must do what makes u happy.
But this thread was about the M45. There is no 2007 Q45, so I'm not sure which Q45 you mean. Perhaps you meant an M35?
After having the M45 for about 9 months, and the RL for over a year, I can tell you that the RL does not come close to the M45 in acceleration and would get blown away in everything you mentioned. It could be that you're a much better driver than the members you went against, or they were light on the pedal.
In any event, sheer power is not what makes the RL a great car. It has the M45 beat in plenty of other ways, and it does all boil down to preference. My preference was not to have two identical cars, among other things. I like my M. My wife likes the RL. I like the RL too, even though I drive it less.
If you want to boil it all down to a pissing contest, you will lose. If you want to take an overall look at each vehicle and what it offers, you can figure out what suits you best, and there are plenty of people who would consider the RL a hands down winner, and point out that in traffic, you won't get anywhere any faster in the M.
If it makes you feel better thinking that your RL can beat an M45 in a sheer test of acceleration, then go ahead and thing that. I don't believe that you posted because you expected us to scratch our heads and decide that everybody else must be wrong.
09-14-2007, 03:26 PM
#67
Senior Moderator
The RL would have its hands full with the M35 (let alone the M45) when comes to performance and could possibly fare worse once the M35 inevitably gets the VQ35HR (or VQ37HR). The RL is an awesome car in its own rite but, it is just not on the same performance level as the M45.
09-14-2007, 03:30 PM
#68
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Originally Posted by tatu
just an opinnion.i run my RL with the motorcycle crews here in boston 2 members of opisite clubs have the q45&q45 sport, that by the numbers are faster than the RL,unfortunatley they both lost to my RL both in top speed and 1/4-1/2-1mile races .so im sorry to say that the q45 is overrated ,overpriced&underpowerd but to each there own and u must do what makes u happy.
The last (final) gen Q45 was a boat and didn't handle very well (it was a pre-ghosn era model) and the gearing was all wrong too, which is why it never made the acceleration times that it was advertised with (i think it advertised acceleration in the upper 5sec range to 60mph, but was closer to mid-6 seconds). But even then that is very close to the RL (mid-6 to 7 sec. to 60mph?).
but the discussion is about the 2nd gen M45, which, with all things being equal, will TOAST the RL in acceleration.
BTW...spell-check FTW!
09-14-2007, 04:16 PM
#69
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Gentlemen, my opinion about my 2006 RL is well known. I have written many posts extolling its attributes. However, to compare its power to my 2006 M45 is absolutely ludicrous. The M45 with its exceptionally powered V8 engine and mated transmission puts it into an entirely different class and runs rings around the RL with regard to sheer power and speed.
Not only does it accelerate quicker from a standing start than the RL, but it flys to its higest rated speed when the pedal is put to the floor. Although the RL propells to high speeds, it simply does it at a slower rate.
The M45 does not handle curves at high speeds to the same degree of control as the RL. But, I find the overall ride comfort of the M45 better than the RL
They really are different cars displaying a number of similar and yet many far different attributes. The RL is richly ambiant and sedate. The M45 is also richly ambiant but is also a tiger.
At my age, if I had to choose one over the other as my FINAL car, it would be the RL not the M45.
I also own and drive a 2007 Lexus ES350. It is not as powerful as either the RL or the M45 but more stylish, comfortable and sedate than either the RL or M45.
Its 0 to 60 is 6.2sec. However, even though it moves quickly to its highest speed, both the RL and M45 have a far greater visceral thrill driving factor than the ES350.
To my way of thinking, we are exceedingly fortunate to have such great choices in automobiles that offer similar yet unique features.
Not only does it accelerate quicker from a standing start than the RL, but it flys to its higest rated speed when the pedal is put to the floor. Although the RL propells to high speeds, it simply does it at a slower rate.
The M45 does not handle curves at high speeds to the same degree of control as the RL. But, I find the overall ride comfort of the M45 better than the RL
They really are different cars displaying a number of similar and yet many far different attributes. The RL is richly ambiant and sedate. The M45 is also richly ambiant but is also a tiger.
At my age, if I had to choose one over the other as my FINAL car, it would be the RL not the M45.
I also own and drive a 2007 Lexus ES350. It is not as powerful as either the RL or the M45 but more stylish, comfortable and sedate than either the RL or M45.
Its 0 to 60 is 6.2sec. However, even though it moves quickly to its highest speed, both the RL and M45 have a far greater visceral thrill driving factor than the ES350.
To my way of thinking, we are exceedingly fortunate to have such great choices in automobiles that offer similar yet unique features.
09-14-2007, 04:31 PM
#70
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
What year q45 are you talking about?
The last (final) gen Q45 was a boat and didn't handle very well (it was a pre-ghosn era model) and the gearing was all wrong too, which is why it never made the acceleration times that it was advertised with (i think it advertised acceleration in the upper 5sec range to 60mph, but was closer to mid-6 seconds). But even then that is very close to the RL (mid-6 to 7 sec. to 60mph?).
but the discussion is about the 2nd gen M45, which, with all things being equal, will TOAST the RL in acceleration.
BTW...spell-check FTW!
The last (final) gen Q45 was a boat and didn't handle very well (it was a pre-ghosn era model) and the gearing was all wrong too, which is why it never made the acceleration times that it was advertised with (i think it advertised acceleration in the upper 5sec range to 60mph, but was closer to mid-6 seconds). But even then that is very close to the RL (mid-6 to 7 sec. to 60mph?).
but the discussion is about the 2nd gen M45, which, with all things being equal, will TOAST the RL in acceleration.
BTW...spell-check FTW!
It would be interesting to know how the RL's 3.5L does against the M35's 3.5L. Too lazy to search for 0-60 specs on the two cars. Anyone know that stuff off the top of their head?
09-14-2007, 04:34 PM
#71
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Sorry, I made mistyped the year of the RL. The RL is a 2005 year model not 2006.
To set things straight,
2005 RL
2006 M45
2007 Lexus ES350.
All three really fine automobiles.
To set things straight,
2005 RL
2006 M45
2007 Lexus ES350.
All three really fine automobiles.
09-14-2007, 04:58 PM
#72
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Originally Posted by SpicyMikey
The M45 better beat the RL in straight line acceleration. it's got a 4.5L v8 with gobs more low end torque and hp.
It would be interesting to know how the RL's 3.5L does against the M35's 3.5L. Too lazy to search for 0-60 specs on the two cars. Anyone know that stuff off the top of their head?
It would be interesting to know how the RL's 3.5L does against the M35's 3.5L. Too lazy to search for 0-60 specs on the two cars. Anyone know that stuff off the top of their head?
Are we talking M45 or Q45? Because this dude is confusing me (and i'm not because of his spelling errors).
Originally Posted by tatu
just an opinnion.i run my RL with the motorcycle crews here in boston 2 members of opisite clubs have the q45&q45 sport, that by the numbers are faster than the RL,unfortunatley they both lost to my RL both in top speed and 1/4-1/2-1mile races .so im sorry to say that the q45 is overrated ,overpriced&underpowerd but to each there own and u must do what makes u happy.
09-14-2007, 05:01 PM
#73
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Originally Posted by shepsan
Sorry, I made mistyped the year of the RL. The RL is a 2005 year model not 2006.
To set things straight,
2005 RL
2006 M45
2007 Lexus ES350.
All three really fine automobiles.
To set things straight,
2005 RL
2006 M45
2007 Lexus ES350.
All three really fine automobiles.
09-14-2007, 05:14 PM
#74
Go Big Blue!
Originally Posted by mrdeeno
Are we talking M45 or Q45? Because this dude is confusing me (and i'm not because of his spelling errors).
http://www.egmcartech.com/2007/02/23...-infinit-m35x/
09-14-2007, 05:31 PM
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mredeeno, I tested both versions of the M45 before making my decision to purchase. I found the ride of the sport "harder" on my old bones. Besides, the interior of the sport was not to my liking.
The two main reasons that I chose the M45 over the sport model was because of the differing suspension systems. They are different. Then too, the tire sizes also differ. The sport has 19" and the standard 18". These two factors make the standard an easier ride than the sport.
By the way, the last Q made was superceded by the 2006 M45 in every way. I do not really know to which model tatu refers.
I do not put much stock in published listings of various speed factors. It is behind the wheel allowing my senses to react that I determine the degree of excellence in a car's acceleration and handling. It is not scientific but it works for me.
The two main reasons that I chose the M45 over the sport model was because of the differing suspension systems. They are different. Then too, the tire sizes also differ. The sport has 19" and the standard 18". These two factors make the standard an easier ride than the sport.
By the way, the last Q made was superceded by the 2006 M45 in every way. I do not really know to which model tatu refers.
I do not put much stock in published listings of various speed factors. It is behind the wheel allowing my senses to react that I determine the degree of excellence in a car's acceleration and handling. It is not scientific but it works for me.
09-14-2007, 07:11 PM
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sorry about the spelling, i was half dead. Anyway yes the M45 is faster of the line because it's 2 wheel drive. But if you know how to drive your Rl and manipulate the v-tech once in 3rd you pull off,and the fact that the Rl is lighter than the M45.I still think its overpiced & underpowerd, its a 4.5 litre and it's only pushing 330 but so is the chrysler m-hemi!and thats a 5.7!. You can tap alot of power from your Rl boy's,you just have to know how.
In regard's to te m35x havent done it up in a staight,but cornering it doesn't stand a chance. shepsan if youre happy dude, thats all that matters.
In regard's to te m35x havent done it up in a staight,but cornering it doesn't stand a chance. shepsan if youre happy dude, thats all that matters.
09-14-2007, 07:56 PM
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Originally Posted by lland
Hagrinas,
Great post. Thanks. My bother has an M35x and other than the differences between the M35 and M45, your post is spot on. I also agree with your final statement:
“Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.”
I don’t think the lack of a V8 is really hurting the RL all that much. I think what’s killing it is Acura’s incredibly poor advertising and promotion. A good advertising campaign would work wonders. Infinity sells plenty of M35’s, and FX35’s. BMW sells plenty of 6 cylinder 5 series. Lexus sells it’s share of 6 cylinder GS’s. Acura needs to decide if they really want to sell cars and find an agency that can help them do that.
LL
Great post. Thanks. My bother has an M35x and other than the differences between the M35 and M45, your post is spot on. I also agree with your final statement:
“Many say that the Acura would be much better if it offered a V8. What's missing is the context. It's not that it's a bad car without a v8 any more than the M35 is a bad car. It's that the type of person who would buy an M45 and not an RL might prefer an RL with a V8 to an M45, so a V8 option would offer the best of both worlds. There are still those who would go for the V6, which is still no slouch, and for those drivers, the RL is just fine. But Acura could have covered more bases.”
I don’t think the lack of a V8 is really hurting the RL all that much. I think what’s killing it is Acura’s incredibly poor advertising and promotion. A good advertising campaign would work wonders. Infinity sells plenty of M35’s, and FX35’s. BMW sells plenty of 6 cylinder 5 series. Lexus sells it’s share of 6 cylinder GS’s. Acura needs to decide if they really want to sell cars and find an agency that can help them do that.
LL
09-14-2007, 09:23 PM
#78
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by tatu
sorry about the spelling, i was half dead. Anyway yes the M45 is faster of the line because it's 2 wheel drive. But if you know how to drive your Rl and manipulate the v-tech once in 3rd you pull off,and the fact that the Rl is lighter than the M45.I still think its overpiced & underpowerd, its a 4.5 litre and it's only pushing 330 but so is the chrysler m-hemi!and thats a 5.7!. You can tap alot of power from your Rl boy's,you just have to know how.
In regard's to te m35x havent done it up in a staight,but cornering it doesn't stand a chance. shepsan if youre happy dude, thats all that matters.
In regard's to te m35x havent done it up in a staight,but cornering it doesn't stand a chance. shepsan if youre happy dude, thats all that matters.
Whether or not it is overpriced is moot when discussing performance attributes.
09-14-2007, 09:44 PM
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Originally Posted by F23A4
A couple of points need to be made here: first, the M45 will have an M45X model for the 2008 model year; second, VTEC or not, any competent M45/M45X driver should make short work of an RL...if not, he needs to turn in his Intelligent keys to the nearest Nissan or Infiniti dealer because he will have just shamed that model.
Whether or not it is overpriced is moot when discussing performance attributes.
Whether or not it is overpriced is moot when discussing performance attributes.
09-14-2007, 10:43 PM
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performance comparison acura rl vs M35 x
This is from an edmunds comparison test of awd sedans,
Acura RL Audi A6 3.2 BMW 530xi Infiniti M35x Lexus GS 300 AWD
Zero-to-60-mph acceleration, sec. 7.4 7.8 7.4 6.9 7.7
Quarter-mile acceleration, sec. 15.2 15.4 15.2 14.9 16.3
Quarter-mile speed, mph 92.6 91 92.6 90.1 90.1
60-to-0-mph braking, feet 123 131 130 119 130
600-ft slalom, mph 63.7 61.5 62.4 62.2 61.1
Acura RL Audi A6 3.2 BMW 530xi Infiniti M35x Lexus GS 300 AWD
Observed Fuel Economy City/Hwy, mpg 17.5 18.4 20.5 17.5 20.4
EPA Fuel Economy City/Hwy, mpg 18/26 19/26 20/27 17/24 21/27
here's the link for better formatting
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...5/pageNumber=1
Acura RL Audi A6 3.2 BMW 530xi Infiniti M35x Lexus GS 300 AWD
Zero-to-60-mph acceleration, sec. 7.4 7.8 7.4 6.9 7.7
Quarter-mile acceleration, sec. 15.2 15.4 15.2 14.9 16.3
Quarter-mile speed, mph 92.6 91 92.6 90.1 90.1
60-to-0-mph braking, feet 123 131 130 119 130
600-ft slalom, mph 63.7 61.5 62.4 62.2 61.1
Acura RL Audi A6 3.2 BMW 530xi Infiniti M35x Lexus GS 300 AWD
Observed Fuel Economy City/Hwy, mpg 17.5 18.4 20.5 17.5 20.4
EPA Fuel Economy City/Hwy, mpg 18/26 19/26 20/27 17/24 21/27
here's the link for better formatting
http://www.edmunds.com/apps/vdpconta...5/pageNumber=1