lumpulus

After being quoted $240!! to replace the plugs on my '06 RL with 98k miles on it, I ordered 6 Denso IK20s for $48 online.

Is it as easy as popping off the decorative engine cover, removing the Acorn nuts hold on the coil packs and changing? The fronts are obviously easy..how are the rear 3 to do?

Also, do the plugs have torque settings, or just snug them down?

Thanks!

tlmaster1

Just a little snug is what i usually do. Are u sure they are Denso, cuz i thought they were NGK Iridium.

getakey

But you are due for the timing belt at 105K miles
Why not do at the same time

Zelaya

iTrader: (1)

Where did you purchased the plugs for that low price?

lumpulus

Did you read my post?? $240 to change plugs, THAT'S why.

Zelaya....got them here... just googled Denso IK20

getakey

I was assuming that you might tackle the timing belt yourself as well.

That said, my Dealer had a "special" on the Timing Belt service. Knocked several hundred dollars off the total service which included the plugs.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

Denso plugs go out faster than NGKs. Also the plugs do have a spec but usually snug is a good measure. Its really that easy. With the rear you'd need a 6 or 9 inch extension to help you out.

Zelaya

iTrader: (1)

Interested I was about to order the Densos today.

andrewmr

I have not done the plugs in my car (yet) but I have to assume it's pretty straight forward and would work like any other COP (coil on plug) setup.

The torque on the plug is 13ft pounds (18n-m) with anti-seize on the treads.

If you've never used anti-seize, you'll want to put a small amount on the tread surface only. A little goes a long way.


Do not get any on the electrode.




BTW, I'm not sure what IK20's are but the manual calls for SKJ20DR-M11. If the IK20's are a new and improved version of the OEM plug then saving 2 bucks a piece is a great thing. Otherwise, $12 extra for the recommended parts might not be a bad idea.

Professor

IMHO, spark plugs at 90K miles are overrated. I replaced the plugs on a '97 Accord EXL with about 172K miles. I thought they'd be shot... black and burnt.

It was hard to tell the old plugs from the new ones. I even took a gap meter and they were practically the same. After then, I decided to never change plugs again. The car will have enough miles to be sold before the plugs go... unless you are using oil.

lumpulus

Interesting answers...I chose IK20s because of what other RL plug threads here had said, but started this thread because I didn't find one where someone actually turned the wrench and talked about it here.

As Professor says, I will check each and every plug and may save them for another time.

andrewmr

I go way back in time and remember the good old times racing two stroke bikes. We were always cleaning plugs but after a time they just didn't work as well as they did when they were new.

I know today's engines (and more importantly, fuel management) are easier on plugs but I just couldn't understand reusing something that was "used" for 90K miles.

If it were a matter of saving a $8,000 rotor just in case but an $8 spark plug.


Of course, it's your call.

lumpulus

I have completed replacing all 6 plugs...now that I've done it, it's no big deal.

For the front 3, it's best to remove the front trim piece that covers the radiator and coolant tank. After that it's really easy.

The back 3 are more difficult, but as long as you have 2 short extensions you can piece together you'll be fine.

The old plugs were definitely worn, so it was good to replace them. I had to relocated the power steering hose from it's bracket to do the rear 3, but it was no big deal.

So save yourself $200 and take 45 minutes to do it...it's worth it!

lumpulus

Since I can't edit my previous post now...

Did some driving yesterday...didn't see any performance difference, will take a week to see about gas mileage, though I suspect if there is an improvement, it won't be much.

Zelaya

iTrader: (1)

I installed the spark plugs last night, it was a bear trying to remove and install new plugs on the back one. I drove it this morning and I've to agreed with OP , I didn't see a huge improvement but I'm happy I saved money.

lumpulus

Having done it now, with the right tools, I could get the install time down to 30 minutes.

The key is having two short extensions as opposed to one long one.

rl man05

anyone use e3 spark plugs?

theNHBRL

thanks for this will have to tackle this soon and use op's method of two extensions.

what about Bosch Platinum+4 Spark Plug

hondaxacura

Go with the factory recommended spark plugs, can't go wrong with Denso or NGK.

Bosch in general has been a let down for me, well that's for another time. I have tried the Bosch Platinum tested on F22B1, +2 on F23A4 and +4 on K20A3. All of them, MPG went down, and so as power and response.

Switched to factory recommended NGK's and it felt like the car was like new and i've been getting good consistent mpgs.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

NGK is the way to go, Denso will start to foul much sooner than NGKs

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

Champion baby.... all day.













in my lawn mower.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

lumpulus

You have documented proof of this?

EL19

iTrader: (4)

Yes, the fact that I had to change my Denso's out (fouled) after 30K on my TL before the supercharger and after. Honda uses Denso for many of their oem parts but chooses not to use their spark plugs. I'm sure their reason behind that is the same reason as mine. Ive run NGK on my Accord and my buddy's CLS for 100K+miles still pumping strong. a resident Honda/Acura guru NVA-NV6 also believes the same.

I think the only car Honda ran Deno plugs in was the RSX-S because they used a colder Iridium plug which NGK doesnt make or at least didn't at that time.

lumpulus

You'll understand if I don't take just one person's opinions as gospel.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

LOL I comepletely understand. Makes no difference to me.

thenewblack

Hey I changed the plugs on my '05 the other day. Went with NGK Laser Iridium plugs which were about $12/each on amazon. The old ones were the same plug, apparently.

With 95k the plugs looked pretty shot to me, some carbon marks (or something) at the spark point on the larger metal conductor. There was quite a bit of general discoloration as well.

It took me about an hour to do this. I'm sure you could go faster but I was taking my time. We don't get that many beautiful days in Seattle and I like to be out as long as possible when they come around

The front three plugs are a cinch once the front radiator cover comes off. The back three are an adventure in trust. I couldn't see most of what I was doing back there, but there's JUST enough room to remove the coils and plugs. One thing that confused me was the suggestion a few people made in this forum about using two 3 inch extensions instead one six inch. I used two 3 inch pieces but never needed to separate them. Hmm.

My seat of the pants dynometer says the car has a little bit more juice now. It seems quieter too, perhaps that's due to me not having to rev it as high to get up to speed.

I was hoping for some additional MPG's out of this, but I haven't seen a big difference so far. It's possible I'm just driving faster and using more fuel though. I'll report back if I ever figure this out.

BTW, this saved me $200 dollars and was definitely worth the time. Probably a better job to do yourself than an oil change. No need to get under the car!

wackjum

Just be careful when it comes to working on these cars since it is an aluminum cylinder head.

I always hand start the plugs for a few turns before switching to the ratchet when installing on aluminum block cars (which are all of them now).

lumpulus

So true...I was debating on starting a new thread about what just happened to me, but decided to continue on with this one.

I replaced my plugs almost 1 year ago. I was super careful and did exactly what wackjum posted about hand turning to start due to the aluminum head, and even had the torque specs, though i can't find them now.

Fast forward to today....My car is an 06 Non Tech with 113k miles..plugs were changed at 95k by me. When I started my car for work this morning, it was obvious I had a misfire, and the engine light was flashing, which then disappeared after about 10 seconds, and the engine smoothed out and seemed to be fine. I drove 20 miles to work with no incidents or issues.

I had to leave my office to go to another site, but when I started the car, this time, I had a flashing engine light that didn't go out, and also EMISSION in the MID followed by AWD. Luckily(I think) I have a dealership about 1 mile from my work, so I stopped in there, got a loaner, and went about my business.

An hour later I get a call from the Service person telling me they could not get 2 of the plugs out without stripping the threads, and if that happened I needed a new head.

They showed me the plugs and the stripped threads on the sleeves. I talked with the Senior Mechanic, who I trust, and he said it was because the plugs weren't snugged down tight enough. When I told him I torqued them all to Acura Manual specs, he just shrugged and said that he tightened them down as much as possible to make sure the crush washer "took hold". Wish I had known that sooner.

He also said that usually RL engines are "bulletproof" and this is the 1st head repair they have ever had on an RL, while the MDX is really bad for that.

You don't want to know what it will cost....

EL19

iTrader: (4)

^^ That really sucks man I'm sorry to hear that. Just out of curiousity, what kind of plugs were they?

lumpulus

I think you know what kind they were.....not nice to kicka guy when he's down...

EL19

iTrader: (4)

I never followed what brand you went with. Having blown an engine (on my 03 TL-S) I don't wish that on anyone so I'm sorry if you feel I was trying to make you feel worse or anything. That wasn't my intent. I'm just wondering if the threads on the plugs you replaced with (whether it be NGK, Denso, etc) could have been defective or something. Maybe something the tech's could look at?

EDIT: Just realized you said it in the OP my apologies man

oo7spy

Sorry to hear. If you have not already started on the rebuild, there is a chance that a used motor swap may be cheaper (since I have no clue what they quoted you).

lumpulus

LOL no worries. I assumed you read the whole thread, so my apologies as well.

I have opened a case with Acura Customer relations just in case the negotiation with the service manager goes South. Waiting for the callback now.

lumpulus

Has anyone had a cylinder heard replaced? If so what was the cost? When I heard the original quote, I literally had to sit down in shock. It's the front head so labor should not be as much if it were the rear. I have asked to see an itemized quote, and talked with a very accomodating service manager who has already discounted some parts. I went in armed with prices of OEM parts, but I need to know the dealership labor rate, to be able to make an educated estimate.

Anybody out there have a head replaced?

HEAVY_RL

iTrader: (1)

I know we had a few techs on here...

oo7spy

If memory serves me right, Acura dealers charge ~ $110/hour whereas Honda dealers charge $70-90. That's why many go to Honda dealers for timing belt service.

EL19

iTrader: (4)

I hope they work with you and they can bring the price down.

I had the heads removed and machined when I blew the motor on my TL-S and if memory serves me correctly (about 5 years ago)it was ~$2300 from Acura. But that was mostly labor as opposed to needing a whole new head.

lumpulus

Update:

Got a written estimate with part #s labor is $126\hr with 21 hours needed.

Here's the interesting thing....the prices they quoted for some of the parts are ABOVE Retail!

For example for part 12251-RJA-004 Gasket set...

Best price I found with Google...$43.21
Retail price for the part............$59.60
Dealership quoted price............$76.88

They want $21.69 per spark plug....

I know businesses need to make some profit...but come on!

white05rl

That's downright sad! Perhaps they feel that it's unlikely you'll get a competing quote, since your car is "stuck" at their dealership. Since I just did my own plugs about a month ago, you've got me a little concered!