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Michael Jackson -- Dead

 
Old 07-26-2013, 12:42 PM
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We're not sure...
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Old 07-26-2013, 01:40 PM
  #922  
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Originally Posted by 97BlackAckCL View Post
Better?
Thanks!

Originally Posted by AZuser View Post
MJ's dead? Has this been confirmed?
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Old 07-26-2013, 02:39 PM
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Thriller and Whitney
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Old 07-26-2013, 03:02 PM
  #924  
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Jeez, the poor guy is dead, just let him live with Whitney in peace.
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Old 07-26-2013, 08:27 PM
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Originally Posted by Whiskers View Post
Just let him live with Whitney in peace.
He's alive now? Whitney too?
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Old 07-26-2013, 08:39 PM
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Michael Jackson died??
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Old 03-10-2019, 03:21 AM
  #927  
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This shit is so fucked. It's rough to watch but you should watch it.
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:54 AM
  #928  
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Cash grab
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Old 03-10-2019, 11:30 AM
  #929  
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Is it wrong that I still like his music?
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Old 03-10-2019, 08:44 PM
  #930  
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Originally Posted by Costco View Post
Bruh, seriously? That video is trash. The claims and weak logic are discussed in Leaving Neverland, and much more in After Neverland. The claims that he's after money is the same tired claim that comes up anytime some charges a celebrity with something. It's the same claim that MJ used back in the 90s.


Do you think Bill Cosby, R Kelly, Harvey Weinstein, and Trump are all innocent of the charges against them too? It's all a cash grab?
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:26 PM
  #931  
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Originally Posted by #1 STUNNA View Post
Bruh, seriously? That video is trash. The claims and weak logic are discussed in Leaving Neverland, and much more in After Neverland. The claims that he's after money is the same tired claim that comes up anytime some charges a celebrity with something. It's the same claim that MJ used back in the 90s.

Do you think Bill Cosby, R Kelly, Harvey Weinstein, and Trump are all innocent of the charges against them too? It's all a cash grab?
I feel that all the aforementioned are guilty, as there's damning evidence and testimonies against all of them.

I'll have to watch it then. I'm not someone who victim blames, but on the surface the claims seemed dubious. Against somebody who was no longer alive to speak for himself. Yes, they were children at the time and were more easily influenced. Not saying the parents didn't turn a blind eye to it either because of bribery, in essence. When someone makes a serious accusation, then flip flops on it (or vice versa) it calls their credibility into question.

I once firmly believed that he was a molester, then had a discussion long ago with a social worker who changed my mind. I'm not an MJ fan by any means. If anything I grew up listening to R Kelly, but I was much quicker to change my mind with him as parents of the victims condemned him from the start and there's video evidence - admittedly uncommon, but still.

After some more research, this is pretty damning: https://www.vanityfair.com/hollywood...se-allegations
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:48 PM
  #932  
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1. There is no dispute that, at age 34, Michael Jackson slept more than 30 nights in a row in the same bed with 13-year-old Jordie Chandler at the boy’s house with Chandler’s mother present. He also slept in the same bed with Jordie Chandler at Chandler’s father’s house. The parents were divorced.

2. So far, five boys Michael Jackson shared beds with have accused him of abuse: Jordie Chandler, Jason Francia, Gavin Arvizo, Wade Robson, and Jimmy Safechuck. Jackson had the same nickname for Chandler and Arvizo: “Rubba.” He called Robson “Little One” and Safechuck “Applehead.”

3. Jackson paid $25 million to settle the Chandlers’ lawsuit, with $18 million going to Jordie, $2.5 million to each of the parents, and the rest to lawyers. Jackson said he paid that sum to avoid something “long and drawn out.” Francia also received $2.4 million from Jackson.

4. Michael Jackson suffered from the skin discoloration disease vitiligo. Jordie Chandler drew a picture of the markings on the underside of Jackson’s penis. His drawings were sealed in an envelope. A few months later, investigators photographed Jackson’s genitalia. The photographs matched Chandler’s drawings.

5. The hallway leading to Jackson’s bedroom was a serious security zone covered by video and wired for sound so that the steps of anyone approaching would make ding-dong sounds.

6. Jackson had an extensive collection of adult erotic material he kept in a suitcase next to his bed, including S&M bondage photos and a study of naked boys. Forensic experts with experience in the Secret Service found the fingerprints of boys alongside Jackson’s on the same pages. Jackson also had bondage sculptures of women with ball gags in their mouths on his desk, in full view of the boys who slept there.

7. According to the Neverland staff interviewed by the Santa Barbara authorities, no one ever saw or knew of a woman spending the night with Michael Jackson, including his two spouses, Debbie Rowe or Lisa Marie Presley. Rowe, the mother of two of Jackson’s children, made it clear to the Santa Barbara authorities that she never had sex with Jackson.

8. The parents of boys Jackson shared beds with were courted assiduously and given myriad expensive gifts. Wade Robson’s mother testified in the 2005 trial that she funneled wages through Jackson’s company and was given a permanent resident visa. Jimmy Safechuck’s parents got a house. Jordie Chandler’s mother got a diamond bracelet.

9. Two of the fathers of those who have accused Jackson, Jordie Chandler and Wade Robson, committed suicide. Both were estranged from their sons at the time.

10. In a 2002 documentary, Living with Michael Jackson, Jackson told Martin Bashir there was nothing wrong with sharing his bed with boys.
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Old 03-10-2019, 10:50 PM
  #933  
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FYI, the documentary is pretty graphic. I yelled WTF quite a few times while watching it
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Old 03-11-2019, 07:46 AM
  #934  
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Wow.
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Old 03-13-2019, 10:23 PM
  #935  
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Old 03-14-2019, 01:01 AM
  #936  
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Now I'm thinking this dude is full of shit
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Old 03-14-2019, 10:07 AM
  #937  
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Originally Posted by Yumcha View Post
Is it wrong that I still like his music?
You play with toy robots... so.........
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Old 03-14-2019, 12:07 PM
  #938  
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Originally Posted by Costco View Post
https://mobile.twitter.com/santikapo...963479042?s=19

Now I'm thinking this dude is full of shit
It all the same that Inside Edition made a “short movie” about. Let’s stack all the facts we have against Wade up, ignore everything else that is known, and then judge him. Very unbiased.
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:09 PM
  #939  
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Originally Posted by oo7spy View Post

It all the same that Inside Edition made a “short movie” about. Let’s stack all the facts we have against Wade up, ignore everything else that is known, and then judge him. Very unbiased.
I haven't had time to watch Leaving Neverland yet, but from all accounts it sounds biased too.

Facts are facts, dude testified under oath twice defending MJ. Then later on he basically recanted on everything he has said in the past, and worked to release this documentary in the midst of a court case appeal.

You don't this this is suspicious, at all?

https://www.showbiz411.com/2019/03/0...ving-neverland
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:28 PM
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I’m not taking a side either way for now. I am open to the idea that people can be brainwashed by people who seem invincible. While adults are susceptible, children can be manipulated far more easily. I am also open to the idea that the threats against these guys for coming out were real. Hasn’t them coming out validated that they would be “in trouble” simply by the attacks (death threats) they have received? It’s not like their “cash grab” is without consequence.

My understanding of the court cases is that they were thrown out due to statute of limitations, not for false or lack of premise.

My understanding is also that Michael was a proven pedophile. I’m inclined to side with the accuser on this one, but I can’t defend them.

The After Neverland discussion is a lot less about what made Michael a pedophile. It was a lot more about how children become groomed and trapped into sexual relationships they don’t actually want but don’t understand how to process. People who watch that and can only take away the “slights” against Michael are missing a much bigger picture. The only parts about him are people explaining memories of him while they explain their own story.

Last edited by oo7spy; 03-14-2019 at 06:30 PM.
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:59 PM
  #941  
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Didnt even know there was a documentary out, until a body language video popped up in my youtube feed.
The video tries to analyse MJ's deposition regarding Jordy chandler,but the interviewer doesnt ask the right questions.

interesting stuff

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Old 03-14-2019, 07:01 PM
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I'm not taking a side either. There's way too much involved, and there are other people who have accused him and I haven't looked into all the details, nor do I care that much. And that's not to belittle victims at all, I've always believed that egregious, repeat sex offenders deserve life in prison or maybe even the death penalty.

I'm not an MJ fan or hater either way. There is plenty of doubt around the circumstances in which he kept young kids around. Why do they seem to be mostly, or all young boys? There's no way in hell I would allow my kid to sleep in a bed with a grown man that I didn't know or even hang out with them all day without other adult supervision.

I was adamant over a decade ago that he was guilty, then a social worker who had worked with both children and adults make me think critically about it a little more. I'll have to talk to her again to see what she thinks. In more words, she explained that MJ didn't get a chance to truly live out his childhood, and he was betrayed by adults all around him. They used him for his fame and money for their own selfish reasons. He maybe found that the only people he could trust are kids.

What she said didn't convince me fully, but parts of it made sense. No, she was not an MJ fan either - she actually doesn't listen to music at all, hard to believe as that may sound. I'm not convinced one way or the other, but at least in Robson's case, it seems very shaky.
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Old 03-14-2019, 07:42 PM
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:22 PM
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Are you aware they weren’t paid by HBO to do this documentary. How can you say his story is shaky when you haven’t even seen the documentary?
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:32 PM
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Regarding the part about Michael not having a childhood, THAT seems awfully convenient. Lots of people grow up fast and don’t act that way. I can name a few.


What I would be interested in is the social worker’s take on the evidence of a porn collection next to the bed these “sleepovers” were occurring in. Pictures of young boys too? If the claims of evidence are true, that completely undermines the “youthful innocence” argument.



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Old 03-14-2019, 08:36 PM
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and the freaky ass proximity doorbell to the King's room.
"ding dong ding dong"
MJ wired it up so he would know when people approached his room.

I remember when my mom caught me with porn for the first time...56k pictures were loading, slowly.

wish i had a proximity doorbell to my room
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:48 PM
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Originally Posted by #1 STUNNA View Post
Are you aware they weren’t paid by HBO to do this documentary. How can you say his story is shaky when you haven’t even seen the documentary?
Both plaintiffs's lawsuits were dismissed a couple of years back, and now they have appeals pending against MJ's associated companies.

There is a long history of Robson praising MJ, defending him in public against allegations, and in court under oath, over the course of almost a decade. Then this happened:

April 2013 Wade Robson “realized” Michael Jackson abused him for 7 years and slaps MJEstate, the ones who didn’t gave him the Cirque Du Soleil job with a lawsuit. Claims MJ molested him for seven years and his companies ran 'world's most sophisticated' sex-abuse ring in history.
He had applied for the job, then wanted to sell his MJ memorabilia anonymously, but couldn't. Very suspicious to me.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:25 PM
  #948  
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If he were alive, Michael Jackson would almost certainly be on his way to prison. The only reason he's still on the radio today is he can't be put on trial for anything.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by kurtatx View Post
If he were alive, Michael Jackson would almost certainly be on his way to prison. The only reason he's still on the radio today is he can't be put on trial for anything.
Which is why they're suing for money. What other way can you legally seek justice when someone is dead?
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