Dave_B

Rut ro.....

Dave_B

EXACTLY! Build tolerances are tight and motor quality control is high. This isn't the 1970s.

There are good drivers, fast tracks, and stellar conditions. When all those factors come together, you get stock cars running freak times. Period.

BEAR-AvHistory

Humbly suggest you get a Vbox & lose the phone app because there is no way a TL will run with a ZR-1 or Z06 in a 40-80 sprint which is what you would need to do to run a sub 4 second 40-80mph. A base stock Corvette Z-51 can't break 4 seconds & is about 4.2 on a good day. The new StingRay Z51 will run a sub 4 second time but its competitive with the last version ZR-1/Z-06.

I don't believe you can run with me in that sprint even if I use the slower car & a Z06/ZR-1 will bury me in either car. Base on my track times I would estimate 4.1/4.2 for the 335is

The 13.8 @ 101mph TL 6MT in C&D took 5.8 seconds to go from 40 to 80mph & it took 10.8 seconds to get to 90mph.

For my faster car @ the 1/8 mile point is 7.8/8.0 seconds @ 90/92mph . The one I have listed at Drag Times is on the 335i section page 7 #135

12.583*^ 114.529 8.062 90.430 2.070 BMW 335i 335IS 2011 BEAR-AvHistory

anx1300c

iTrader: (2)

3000 DA doesn't represent stellar conditions though, and this is the same track where a Type-S 6MT recently trapped only 98 mph in 900 DA.

bouncer07

Well... there's too many variables here and what I've seen at my track will benefit me while others benefit your track and conditions. People seem to deflate their tire pressure to grab more traction, while some people inflate them with more air to gain more MPH trap speed on stock tires. Slicks to summer tires will improve trap speed as well as long as you are gripping with little wheel spin.

Sonnick

I heard winter tires give you an extra 1-2mph...

Dave, my point is simply this: The TL has been out since late '03. There hasn't been 1 6spd to trap even 100mph, let alone 101 in almost 10 years. The fastest stock Type S 6spd went 100.x with 30 more HP/TQ. I just don't think it's feasible. Trust that I have a good grasp on DA, but I just don't buy it. I have nothing against Ju1ce, it just doesn't seem probable to me. If he has the car and goes back in the fall and traps 100, then I will admit I was proven wrong. I just don't think it will happen unless the DA is negative.

Dave_B

I think it's definitely feasible. Again, the mags consistently got 98-99mph traps out of the 6MT 3g TL cars. Some tracks are quicker than others. This particular TL 6mt did nearly 98mph is 3,000+ DA weather. That certainly has an impact. You guys are off your rockers if you think that car isn't going to pickup 2 to 3mph in much better conditions.

It's surprising that you of all people are debating this as your Accord was stuck in the sub 102mph range for a long time until you ran under far better conditions and busted out much quicker times and faster mphs. Your car's performance is way far from norm too. You've got that stellar ET/MPH in your sig but the runs were under negative DA conditions. Your car was making about 103% it's normal power compared to running at sea level. Why not correct back to sea level conditions if your having such a problem with this TL running decent times in crappy air?

Dave_B

Deflating radials (none-drag radial tires) goes not work to improve 60 foots. The only way you're going to gain MPH with an improved 60 foot is if you had been completely smoking through 1st and hitting 2nd at way too low an MPH or were doing something similiar like hitting 2nd hard and then the tires spinning for an extended period of time and grabbing 3rd at too low an MPH.

Dave_B

Gonna have to agree with the others, I don't see your fairly modded lightweight TL pulling these types of numbers. You can't rely on Torque either. It's not very accurate for acceleration runs and things like shift shock cause a lot of noise and influence. I did a 4200rpm clutch slip launch in my WRX and Torque said the car did a 3.3 second 0-60mph. Yeah right.

I'd recommend going to Test and Tune at either Heartland Park Topeka or MoKan Dragway down near Pittsburgh, KS to get some 1/4 mile runs to back up the claims. Also, why not go to one of the many dynos in Kansas City and get a few runs?

ju1ce

Dave you've got it on the nose.
Mags were getting 99mph out of these... Magazines!!!

Sonnick

That's exactly my point, Dave. My Accord was going 102 with I/PCDs/Jpipe/E/Ported intake manifold in 1,xxx ft DA, yet his heavier, stock TL making less power is going to pull 100-101? It's not like I can't drive...lol. I know he will pick up 2-3 mph, but that's awfully high for a stock car, that's all I'm saying. Maybe he has a Jpipe and doesn't know it...that would make perfect sense since JUST a Jpipe on a stock car makes good power.

I won't put DA corrected numbers in my sig, either positive or negative, that's silly. Instead, I put a disclaimer noting the run was done in negative conditions. You don't see "C6Ranger" or whatever his name is that has the record(s) for the Z06 and ZR1 @ MIR in December air quoting DA corrected times. The funny thing is, I went 13.57 in +1,300 ft missing 4th @ Island...

ju1ce

The car is bone stock, I'm not sure why it needs to be reiterated so many times lol
Sonnick you should come up to CT and run this...



I think that'll be a good race.

Sonnick

^ Details? 3.8/2.0? 8AT/6MT? Stock? I was slated to run against an I/E 3.8 8AT but he was having issues at the track after a couple runs. I think he went 14.1 @ 101 before leaving the same night I went 13.7 @ 104. I know the 3.8 is quicker than that though.

Not sure if I'd make the trip up just for a fun run to be honest.

ju1ce

Bone stock automatic 3.8

Sonnick

Meh. Meet me @ Island drag in the fall lol.

ju1ce

Just for funzies tho.
I drove it to a 13.53 @ 104.55, +500 DA at Atco.

Sonnick

Nice, would be a good run then. Was that the Blue one I saw on Youtube running 13.5 @ 104? That's a far drive, Island would be much closer to you.

ju1ce

Thats likely my video, yeah.
A bunch of my friends were going to Atco. My 'home' track is usually LVD.
I try to stay away from driving in and around NYC at all costs.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

Common reply....

I agree with both of you and hence my comment of having a magical car

I will look into a vbox and go from there...

Dave, we are having a local dyno day and I am hoping am in town for that....I remember a guy's STI fell off the dyno locally and I just am very very nervous

Dave_B

ATCO....where the air is 30% nitrous. Anything and everything is crazy fast out there in most any condition. I really don't understand why everything is so damn quick and fast out there.

ju1ce

It's a fast track for sure, their prep is phenomenal.
That's why I said 100mph in my TL would be easy.

Yonkersracing

LOL doubtful.

BEAR-AvHistory

You can get a "good enough for government work" time with a passenger & a stop watch.

You call mark when you hit 40 to start the watch then call mark when you hit 80 to stop it.

The reaction time delay at the start & finish will pretty much cancel each other out so you should get a pretty good time. Its to much work load to do it yourself so a second person in the car is a good plan.

You can always throw out a few tenths for the extra weight.

ju1ce

Where's my money?

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

Loved in the other thread; how you baited!!!!
and yonkers took it, hook line and sinker.


okay, carry on.
(not trying to attack or derail)

Dave_B

I wouldn't waste the money on a VBOX. There's just too much risk on the street and driving like a jackass. Why risk going to jail for life killing some family because you were trying to see how quick your car was. Take it to the strip. Pay attention to the trapspeeds as those will tell you the ultimate potential of the car. ET could be hit or miss depending on your experience at the strip. MPH (trapspeed) is nearly impossible to screw up assuming you use close to ideal shift points which in these cars would at or near redline on each shift.

ju1ce

You know what they say when you assume

Back on topic, I'm not sure why people here think a stock TL has never trapped 100mph... a friend of mine had one like 5 years ago and he tells me he was trapping 99-101, bone stock.

Sonnick

IMO, Atco is just as fast as the next track. Only reason Atco is actually fast is because of the conditions. In sea level conditions, it's just like any other track. My buddies I/H/E/Clutch/Fly RSX went mid to low 14s @99-100. I believe it was only his second time at the track, but he shifts very well. New 5.0s & Camaros were going high 12 - low 13s @ 110-112 (some modded), C5 Vette went 13.6 @ 105 against me, and a 350Z was going low 14s @98-100mph. Sounds about right to me...

I've never seen it done, Ju1ce. Maybe your boy went to the track in optimal conditions. As I said before, in negative DA, 101 is totally possible.

Dave_B

Ok, on July 3rd in West Lebanon, NY at 900pm (14.595@97.70mph run), the conditions were this:

75 degrees
70 degree dew point
30.12 baro pressure
600 track elevation

http://www.wunderground.com/history/...q_statename=NA


Calculated DA for the conditions at 900pm was 1,867'.

http://wahiduddin.net/calc/calc_hp_dp.htm


The NHRA correction factor adjustment for the 14.595@97.70mph run under sea level conditions:

14.595X.9783 = 14.27
97.70X1.0227 = 99.92mph

There you go.

ju1ce

Atco prep is the best, period. Their track is fast.
I know you're advocating that Atco is nothing special because of that 106mph trap speed in your car... but the fact is, you run at LVD at 500-1000 DA and you'll be lucky to go 102.

ju1ce

The DA and weather conditions are right on the slip... wunderground gets its weather info from an airport thats 20 miles away from the track.

According to the slip, DA was 2411.
But I get what you're saying

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

common reply again?

BEAR Vhistory....I have a better idea, I might just dock my phone on the sunroof and have it take the video of the speedo, then just get home and get an idea of the time taken

Dave, I doubt I will be visiting the track....I hate letting off from a standstill in my 5AT car LOL....but I dont drive like a douche at all....recently I have started hating people who do....

when I see the road is empty, I simply slow down to 30mph, downshift and get upto 90mph to get the timing I am looking for

BEAR-AvHistory

That's good too Agree on your testing. The speed Nazis get all bent out of shape but our local speed limits run to 75mph & traffic flow is about 80. A bit further out of town it goes up to 80mph. No real danger in hitting an on-ramp from 40 to 80 to get a timing.

I have a lightly used 1/2 mile on ramp in Mexico that I use for beta testing. VIR & Rockingham are my two regular tracks but they are just to far away to do any quick turnaround software testing.

swoosh

iTrader: (5)

^^^ most of the ramps around here are kinda down hill....none are flat....

I remember I was driving with Matt (McCollins) and the ramp was downhill and a tad bit longer than usual....we started at the light, made a left onto the ramp and I gunned it in 2nd....by the time I was on the highway I was doing 110 mph LOL....

he was like "how fast we going" I was like "110"....all he said is "damn"

Sonnick

Lol. As stated numerous times, I know that 106 is far fetched. Time and time again I've repeated that fact, and have gone even further by saying my car is not a 106 car by any means. The only reason I went 106+ that night was because of the conditions, not the track.

By your last sentence, it seems you're alluding to the fact that my car is barely any faster than yours.

Dave_B

You are right and considering LBV is a pretty decent track and track temps will always be a bit higher than ambient so I'd trust their onsite weather station. It's nice they do that.

There's no doubt in my mind your car would go 14.1-14.2@99-100mph in sea level conditions. If you went out there in negative DA, you run the real possibility of going into the 13s@101+mph.

Your car seems to be running exactly the same way as most every 3rd gen TL tested in the mags (low 14s at 99mph).

ju1ce

Didn't you learn from Yonkerboyracer's train wreck not to assume anything?

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

?? what train wreck? what happened?

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Sounds like he's implying that someone assumed he was or wasn't faster and probably got their ass handed to them.

either way, I really enjoyed watching the vid! Thanks for sharing.

paperboy42190

iTrader: (7)

oo i just read that thread...interesting lol

good thing the TL never has to hit 4th gear in the 1/4 mile, otherwise the et and trap speed would totally suck at the end. but that makes me wonder, if someone modded the 5at enough that it was hitting 110+ at the 1/4, then they'd definitely be in 4th gear.