TLS_TXKing

I'm looking to finally beef up my baby. I've had my 07 TL-S for about a year now and finally have a good enough job where I can have some extra spending money!

I'm looking at the K&N Cold-Air Intake kit. But for around $250ish... I wanna make sure I'm getting the best bangs for my buck. Wouldn't you?

Does anybody have this installed or know of any better kits? Everything is stock....so I haven't upgraded anything yet.

314_04TL

I don't have this kit installed but I do have the AEM V2 and I absolutely love it. It seems to be the choice of most 3rd GEN owners

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

i've owned mine for 5 years now and still have stock intake.
I think it's silly to spend 250ish on a tube that doesnt make power.

Aman

Value is in the sound, not power gains.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

$250 for sound!?

baddestm0nkey

I just got a cheap tube off ebay for $50 or so then added a K&N Filter. A lot less expensive than AEM or Injen.

Aman

Come on man - we both know $250 really isn't much when it comes to engine stuff!

That said I wouldn't pay $250 for one either when what baddestm0nkey said is also an option. Heck, mine was free.

Bruce Banner

iTrader: (2)

Take off the oem resonator and you have sound for free.


If sound is what you are after, then..blow off valve baby!

FamilyGuy

I'd go for the AEM V2, but I'd also start at the exhaust instead, you'll free up more power there than on the intake side. Look at high flow pre cats (HFPCs) or pre cat deletes (PCDs), then J pipe then cat-back exhaust.

Search and read there are many threads on this already. Also check out our top vendors:

RV6 performance
XLR8 performance
Heeltoe automotive

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

just checking!!!
I just want the OP to know $250 is a lot for sound..

when you can do things like what baddestmonkey stated or by removing the factory intake resonator to have a more throaty sound for free

baddestm0nkey

I actually did a stage 3 exhaust with the eBay intake. Total investment is slightly less than $200 with parts and labor. If you want a throaty, beastly sound, go that route. You won't be disappointed!

n3o

iTrader: (2)

Since when does a CAI not show gains? I've seen several dynographs showing 10+ who gains, as well as personally feeling it on my 3rd gen way back when I added a Fujita CAI.

FamilyGuy

Shhhhh not too loud, people here don't believe in any of that mambo jambo, unless you're talking about a 4" intake tube, or a whopping 4mm port and polish job on the stock TB, manifold and runners, or slightly larger units from the 3.7L. Then it's totally ok

They do post some entertaining YouTube videos though

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

in a 3500lb car it takes at least 30 hp to actually FEEL.
so, what you were "feeling" was your brain playing tricks on you...some times our brains equate MORE SOUND to MORE POWER!

also, those dynographs you saw were probably the CAI manufactures graphs.
one can easily manipulate a dyno to show gains in favor of their product.

the real test would be to race.
either illegally (not condoning this) or on the track to see if you picked up more trap speed.

another great indicator that it doesnt add horsies is that the throttle body will be the limiting factor or bottle neck.

you can have the largest diameter cold air intake, but if the throttle body ISNT letting any more air in....you didnt gain anything.

and at WOT, our stock filter OUTFLOWS the throttle body.

this means; you would need to upgrade the throttle body to a larger diameter opening in order to see gains.

314_04TL

I agree 110%

FamilyGuy

I don't agree with this. Air intake system design can certainly affect hp output by itself. Heck, even just adding a velocity stack can help optimize the air flow.

In today's high CR engines, it's not just about area of the filter or pipe diameter anymore, you also have turbulence (elimination of) and pressure waves. Yes, the OEM stuff can handle additional power just fine, but that doesn't mean you can't get more out of it by improving it.

The OEM design is good, but at the end of the day, it's still designed to pass EPA and DOT noise regulations, and that means engineers leave some hp on the table.

Unfortunately, it's not like the old days where you can get 20hp or 30hp just by adding an aftermarket CAI and a cat-back exhaust. These days, OEM engineers have squeezed as much as they can within their regulation limits and with today's efficient engine technologies, there isn't much left on the table. The OEM design has a velocity stack, and a dual stage manifold, good flowing heads and cats close to the heads, all of which help. We're just trying to squeeze some more out of it, and it's there - just full bolt ons on a type s add ~50whp.

How much does an aftermarket CAI do by itself on a completely stock car? That's a good question, and there's lots of controversy now a days...since the OEM intake and exhaust are decently designed, probably not much, esp if the aftermarket CAI is just a larger pipe - and in some cases, you can even lose power, esp at low RPMs. The AEM V2 appears to have the best aftermarket design so far, with its pipe within a pipe design, for pressure waves, I wonder if it has a velocity stack as well (anyone cut one open yet?). In any case, I've seen dynos from Azine members on lightly modded TLs with >10hp gains, but since no one believes it and the whole controversy over how effective a dyno is at testing an air intake system (fans vs actual volume of air while moving at 80mph) and the nature of the ECU on a dyno who knows...but then people post a youtube testing a CAI on a dyno like the one above...and still when they do pull the CAI out of the car they measure a gain, but it doesn't count, or it's within tolerance...lol

Bottom line is, I think enough people here on azine and v6p have proven that opening up both the intake and exhaust on our cars adds power - period. And once you start to do that, the OEM design "balance" starts to go out the window, so the more you do the more each mod supports one another. Only downside is we really don't have a properly designed aftermarket CAI...the AEM V2 is as good as it gets (I think), and even that one was designed for the 3.2L v6 if I'm not mistaken, plus they probably didn't design it with supporting mods in mind, , or who knows, maybe they did, expecting at least a better flowing exhaust...

Is it a waste of money? Well, since we avg what, bout a ~$100/hp ratio, then if a $250 CAI gets you 2.5hp, you're there. If you end up getting 5-10hp with supporting mods, you're over that ratio, so who knows - your call. If you're just looking for air intake noise, then yes, I agree don't waste any money at all and just remove the air intake resonator. But please, let's be a little more supportive of members who do want to squeeze a little more out of their TLs, instead of just shooting it down and saying "don't do it, it's all BS yada yada yada", my

intel_908

Check out the dc sport intake, around 150$ shipped

Yvuru

for naturally aspirated engines

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

Familyguy; the key is supporting mods.

FamilyGuy

Yup

Pegon95

I always wondered why everyone on acurazine keep "recommending" AEM V2? i mean i been looking at the injen cai for a lonngggg time now and im thinking of going with that once summer comes, but i can't help but notice that people keep saying aem v2 because they see other memebers talking about it..

isn't it confirmed by AEM that AEM v2 is actually NOT a cai but actually a short ram intake?

Bruce Banner

iTrader: (2)

It's for the sound and the fantasized HP gains

pplcrew

I was wondering the same question as "pegan95" have mentioned.
Is the AEM V2 'BEST'CAI out there in general in the aftermarket products or is it just best match for the TLs ?

My friend has Injen installed in his BMW 135i, and he keeps telling me that InJen & K&N's are the best CAI out there in the aftermarket and i need to get either one between those two choices.

sockr1

iTrader: (5)

People recommend aem v2 because of the design. all CAIs are a single pipe with a constant diameter and you can make your own very similar. The v2 has a pipe within a pipe with different diameters and lengths to provide throughout the entire rpm range. I'm not here for an argument on if the benefit is true or not, just stating descriptions. I have an aem v2 and it works great with all my supporting mods, it looks like some r&d went into it and I wouldn't buy any other.

From their website:
AEM V2 Air Intake System
AEM Version 2 Air Induction system. The AEM V2 Cold Air utilizes a dual chamber (using two different diameters and lengths of piping), to create multiple frequency sound waves that help charge the cylinders with air throughout the entire rpm range.

TLS_TXKing

Thank you for that info. Being the OP I'm just trying to make sure I get good stuff. So for now I'll just replace the filter on it and save up for looking at a better CAI or whatever else can help. Because also with the new filter it adds like 10-12hp. But also it helps with mpg. And with gas prices fluctuating the way they are, I wanna get more than 300 miles per tank!

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^




you're not gonna gain anything with a filter....

the stock filter is the best.


save your money and keep the stock filter in there until you are ready to buy a cold air intake.

FamilyGuy

I usually recommend the AEM V2 over others because it's not just a pipe and a filter. AEM seems to have some design features going on here to try and hit resonance frequencies in order to create pressure wave effects, or so they claim. Very similar to what Acura claims on our dual stage manifolds:

DUAL-STAGE INTAKE MANIFOLD
The TL and TL Type-S feature lightweight magnesium dual-stage intake manifolds. Working in concert with VTEC®, this manifold improves low-speed torque without sacrificing high rpm power. The manifold is divided into two banks with three cylinders fed by each bank. The powertrain control module (PCM) controls butterfly valves between each bank. At low engine speeds the valves are closed; each separate bank of the manifold is tuned to maximize the resonance effect of the incoming air. This creates pressure waves, which are amplified within each half of the intake manifold at certain rpm ranges. These waves increase cylinder filling and torque through the lower part of the engine's rpm range. On the Type-S, funnel-shaped intake ports-similar to those used on racing engines-are built in at the uppermost end of the intake runners to improve airflow.
Since the benefits of this resonance effect fade as engine speeds rise, the butterfly valves open at 4,000 rpm to interconnect the two halves of the intake manifold plenum, thereby increasing its volume. With each cylinder drawing intake air from the full plenum chamber, the inertia mass of air rushing down each intake passage helps draw in more charge air than each cylinder would normally ingest. The effect greatly enhances cylinder filling and torque produced by the engine at higher revs.



By definition, a CAI having its tubing take the filter out of the engine bay vs a short ram, which keeps the filter in the engine bay, the AEM V2 is a CAI, not a short-ram, at least the model we use on our TLs.

Many don't like short-rams because they draw in warm engine bay air. I *think* short rams can actually be better in low RPMs, and cold airs are better mid-range, and a slight edge on the top end. Overall, I like cold air systems better, that's just me. At high speeds or anything over ~1/2 throttle, enough air moves through that after a few seconds the heat soak effects go away, because there's just not enough soak time to make a significant diff in the air temp, but in heavy traffic and hot areas, that's where you suffer. Of course, short rams intentionally use warm air for better gas mileage and low RPM power so who knows...may differ from one car to the next or between different CAI / short-ram systems, and also if you live in open areas / spend time in upper RPM range or heavy city traffic / low RPM land. Your choice. Our engines are designed for high RPM power, so I favor a CAI.


I'm with justnspace on this one, I think a lone filter is a waste of $$...just stick with the OEM filter here. Most I've ever seen on a K&N drop in filter is 2-3hp, which is debatable, and for what they charge, ~$25-$50 you might as well save your money for a whole system or nothing at all. It really depends what you're looking for - power (CAI) or just noise (remove stock air resonator, free).

I think oiled filters are kind of falling out of popularity these days...dry filters are in. No mess and no worries about sensitive sensors getting screwed up with the oil bath that they might be exposed to.

Pegon95

Idk I still don't think AEM V2 is a Cai, it's advertised as a intake system, even AEM doesn't put the word "cold" in their item description because it could be misleading and they can get sued I think...

So again I think they do have intersting design but not really a "cold air aystem"

FamilyGuy

Don't get so fixated on what their marketing dept comes up with for this new style of product, they're just trying to differentiate it from a "normal" pipe + filter CAI system, so they came up with "AEM Dual Chamber Intake System" I don't think there's any liability (getting sued) since I don't think anyone has any copyright on "cold air intake". They're just advertising a new design of systems that's all. Marketing depts love to come up with new terms and shit.

It's still a CAI. Their own definition of a CAI, same as others: A Cold Air intake system relocates the filter outside of the engine compartment to deliver the coolest air inlet temperatures possible. This is exactly what the V2 does.

A short ram is just that - a short tube system that usually keeps the filter in the engine bay, as close to the TB as possible. Also helps against those afraid of hydro lock on a regular CAI, since the filter isn't so close to the ground. The "ram" part of the name is a bit of a sham, since there's no ram effect whatsoever.

Then there's also the real ram air systems, which are also CAI systems, but designed to not only draw outside air but do it in a way that uses the speed of the car to "ram" the air into the system. One of the most famous to use these are the Pontiac Trans-ams. How effective they are is a debate of its own.

Come to think of it, there's a debate on just about every damn type of air intake system out there lol. Maybe because they don't make a huge difference, and sometimes they work sometimes they don't, all depends on the car, and each specific aftermarket system vs OEM, supporting mods, etc. plus since they don't make a big difference, it's hard to measure it, so always an argument.

Pegon95

I guess it makes sense, Idk why AEM doesn't advertise the V2 as much then ? Where's v3 lmao? I just have a feeling like AEM kind of abandoning it because not a lot of retailers are selling it and you can only find it at select online stores.

Which comes to my conclusion that their design was kind of an expirement

sockr1

iTrader: (5)

why would they keep trying to improve or market a product for 2003-2007 model cars (accord)?? they shift focus to new cars that are coming out and make products for them.

same with general retailers. they're going to stock parts for more recent cars, not products for cars that are 8-12 years old.

now talk to our car specific vendors, and they'll tell you that aem v2 is the most popular intake for our cars, and they still stock them because the vendors sell for our specific cars

ExcelerateRep

The XLR8 AEM V2 is definitely the way to go. It is a true CAI for colder intake temps which equates to more power. It also features great fitment, is carb legal, and is made in the U.S.

XLR8 Intake by AEM - Excelerate - HOA - Japanese Performance Specialist

Pegon95

How does it compare to the injen Cai in form of dynos and sound? if the performance difference between the two is neglible but the injen sounds better from what other people have said then I rather buy the injen Idk

ExcelerateRep

I think you'll get a little more power from the AEM, although I don't have a dyno sheet from Injen to compare to. AEM does all of their own dyno testing as well. Sound wise, its a matter of preference. I'm not sure if the Injen is CARB legal yet either. I know the AEM is.