German GP
#1
German GP
Since no one else has put it up yet,.................
Pos No Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3
1 3 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.214 1:14.410 1:14.070
2 5 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 1:14.904 1:13.778 1:14.205
3 6 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:14.412 1:14.094 1:14.569
4 12 Jenson Button Honda 1:15.869 1:14.378 1:14.862
5 2 Giancarlo Fisichella Renault 1:15.916 1:14.540 1:14.894
6 11 Rubens Barrichello Honda 1:15.757 1:14.652 1:14.934
7 1 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:15.518 1:14.746 1:15.282
8 7 Ralf Schumacher Toyota 1:15.789 1:14.743 1:15.923
9 4 Pedro de la Rosa McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.655 1:15.021 1:15.936
10 14 David Coulthard RBR-Ferrari 1:15.836 1:14.826 1:16.326
11 9 Mark Webber Williams-Cosworth 1:15.719 1:15.094
12 15 Christian Klien RBR-Ferrari 1:15.816 1:15.141
13 8 Jarno Trulli Toyota 1:15.430 1:15.150
14 17 Jacques Villeneuve Sauber-BMW 1:16.281 1:15.329
15 10 Nico Rosberg Williams-Cosworth 1:16.183 1:15.380
16 16 Nick Heidfeld Sauber-BMW 1:16.234 1:15.397
17 20 Vitantonio Liuzzi STR-Cosworth 1:16.399
18 19 Christijan Albers MF1-Toyota 1:17.093
19 22 Takuma Sato Super Aguri-Honda 1:17.185
20 18 Tiago Monteiro MF1-Toyota 1:17.836
21 23 Sakon Yamamoto Super Aguri-Honda 1:20.444
22 21 Scott Speed STR-Cosworth No time
Pos No Driver Team Q1 Q2 Q3
1 3 Kimi Räikkönen McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.214 1:14.410 1:14.070
2 5 Michael Schumacher Ferrari 1:14.904 1:13.778 1:14.205
3 6 Felipe Massa Ferrari 1:14.412 1:14.094 1:14.569
4 12 Jenson Button Honda 1:15.869 1:14.378 1:14.862
5 2 Giancarlo Fisichella Renault 1:15.916 1:14.540 1:14.894
6 11 Rubens Barrichello Honda 1:15.757 1:14.652 1:14.934
7 1 Fernando Alonso Renault 1:15.518 1:14.746 1:15.282
8 7 Ralf Schumacher Toyota 1:15.789 1:14.743 1:15.923
9 4 Pedro de la Rosa McLaren-Mercedes 1:15.655 1:15.021 1:15.936
10 14 David Coulthard RBR-Ferrari 1:15.836 1:14.826 1:16.326
11 9 Mark Webber Williams-Cosworth 1:15.719 1:15.094
12 15 Christian Klien RBR-Ferrari 1:15.816 1:15.141
13 8 Jarno Trulli Toyota 1:15.430 1:15.150
14 17 Jacques Villeneuve Sauber-BMW 1:16.281 1:15.329
15 10 Nico Rosberg Williams-Cosworth 1:16.183 1:15.380
16 16 Nick Heidfeld Sauber-BMW 1:16.234 1:15.397
17 20 Vitantonio Liuzzi STR-Cosworth 1:16.399
18 19 Christijan Albers MF1-Toyota 1:17.093
19 22 Takuma Sato Super Aguri-Honda 1:17.185
20 18 Tiago Monteiro MF1-Toyota 1:17.836
21 23 Sakon Yamamoto Super Aguri-Honda 1:20.444
22 21 Scott Speed STR-Cosworth No time
#3
Get outta here Chief,............nonsense comments.
Ferrari 1, 2
JB 4th (kimi stole 3rd with like 10 or so laps left,...too bad no 3rd for JB, but 4th is good)
Too bad about Rubens engine failure or whatever
Ferrari 1, 2
JB 4th (kimi stole 3rd with like 10 or so laps left,...too bad no 3rd for JB, but 4th is good)
Too bad about Rubens engine failure or whatever
#4
whatta snoozefest. McLaren goes out on 9 laps of fuel just to get pole at the home race for Mercedes. At least the Kimster got on the podium. I laughed when Massa was saying in the post-race interview that it's good to be on the podium. I thought, don't get used to it b/c you probably won't be around next year. Poor bastard. Michelin have obviously fallen behind in tire development.
#6
Revenge of Honda. I never lost faith.
Kudos to Button and the whole team. Too bad they couldn't get the podium spot from Raikkonen, but considering the fiasco from two weeks ago, it's almost a miracle.
Kudos to Button and the whole team. Too bad they couldn't get the podium spot from Raikkonen, but considering the fiasco from two weeks ago, it's almost a miracle.
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#8
Originally Posted by dom
Ya they did well considering but why did the performance of the car fall off so badly after their final pit stop? He was at the mercy of Kimi, he went by him far too easily.
#9
Originally Posted by F-C
That was very strange. Button got out in front of Raikkonen and I was sure that he would stay in front for the podium spot. My guess is that it was just a bad set of tires?
#10
Originally Posted by kurt_bradley
Kimi was on the same Michelins.
Originally Posted by kurt_bradley
It's sad how bad the tires are doing against the Bridgestones. It's not fair to the teams being supplied Michelins that they're just throwing the rest of the season because of the departure.
#11
Originally Posted by F-C
Do you really think that is the case? I don't believe that Michelin has given up, because they won't be back next year. OTOH, I'd imagine that they would be throwing everything they have to go out on a high. IMO, Bridgestone has finally stepped up.
#12
I still think Fernando is lock for the championship. MS would have to win all remaining races to secure the title or have Fernando have a few more results like yesterday. That just isn't going to happen. Look for Renault to win at least 1 to 3 more races this season.
#13
Originally Posted by dom
I still think Fernando is lock for the championship. MS would have to win all remaining races to secure the title or have Fernando have a few more results like yesterday. That just isn't going to happen. Look for Renault to win at least 1 to 3 more races this season.
#14
Not sure what feed you guys got in the US but the British announcers we get here made a point of mentioning that Renault had put the Michelins they'd just taken off Alonso's and Fisi's car after the last pit stop out the back behind the garage for everyone to see. Appatrently they don't usually do that. But they were so blistered they decided to make a statement to Michelin.
#15
Originally Posted by dom
Not sure what feed you guys got in the US but the British announcers we get here made a point of mentioning that Renault had put the Michelins they'd just taken off Alonso's and Fisi's car after the last pit stop out the back behind the garage for everyone to see. Appatrently they don't usually do that. But they were so blistered they decided to make a statement to Michelin.
Man, it's dead today. There's more action in Motorsports News than there is in Ramblings.
#16
I'm surprised no one is mentioning the mass damper system in the Renault.
Renault using mass damper system: Class of the Michelin runners
Renault not using mass damper system: Behind McLaren and Honda
I have a feeling that unless Renault returns to using the mass dampers, Alonso will lose the championship. The difference in performance is just so great.
To me, Alonso's stock has greatly fallen. He was pretty much nowhere yesterday, even being outclassed by Fisichella. Was his great performances in the past just due to Renault using an "illegal" device?
Renault using mass damper system: Class of the Michelin runners
Renault not using mass damper system: Behind McLaren and Honda
I have a feeling that unless Renault returns to using the mass dampers, Alonso will lose the championship. The difference in performance is just so great.
To me, Alonso's stock has greatly fallen. He was pretty much nowhere yesterday, even being outclassed by Fisichella. Was his great performances in the past just due to Renault using an "illegal" device?
#17
Originally Posted by F-C
I'm surprised no one is mentioning the mass damper system in the Renault.
Renault using mass damper system: Class of the Michelin runners
Renault not using mass damper system: Behind McLaren and Honda
I have a feeling that unless Renault returns to using the mass dampers, Alonso will lose the championship. The difference in performance is just so great.
To me, Alonso's stock has greatly fallen. He was pretty much nowhere yesterday, even being outclassed by Fisichella. Was his great performances in the past just due to Renault using an "illegal" device?
Renault using mass damper system: Class of the Michelin runners
Renault not using mass damper system: Behind McLaren and Honda
I have a feeling that unless Renault returns to using the mass dampers, Alonso will lose the championship. The difference in performance is just so great.
To me, Alonso's stock has greatly fallen. He was pretty much nowhere yesterday, even being outclassed by Fisichella. Was his great performances in the past just due to Renault using an "illegal" device?
The announcers did say that the FIA has allowed Renault to again start using "something" next race. I didn't hear exactly what it was but I think that was it.
What is it anyway?
#18
Originally Posted by dom
The announcers did say that the FIA has allowed Renault to again start using "something" next race. I didn't hear exactly what it was but I think that was it.
What is it anyway?
What is it anyway?
#19
Originally Posted by dom
I still think Fernando is lock for the championship. MS would have to win all remaining races to secure the title or have Fernando have a few more results like yesterday. That just isn't going to happen. Look for Renault to win at least 1 to 3 more races this season.
#20
Originally Posted by F-C
AFAIK: The mass damper system is a mechanical device that is situated in the front nose of the Renault. It seems to be a moveable weight system. It helps the front balance of the car, by moving the weights to react to the cornering of the tires. Renault seems to have been using this since last year. I believe this is why the Renaults handle so well. Remember how well the Renault went, especially at the start of the year, when all the teams were struggling with front end grip? Anyway, the FIA appears to have been aware of this device for a few month, but has finally come out to ban it starting with the German GP. The FIA claim that this is an illegal AERODYNAMIC device, because it helps the front end of the car balance. Seems kind of weird that a mechanical device is ruled an illegal aerodynamic device.
Think,..........a coke can filled with oil, with a weighted puck inside, that moves up and down in opposition to the way the front end of the car is moving (ie car bounces up because of a bump, the weight will move down within its coke can to counter the upwards motion of the front end).
Last edited by West6MT; 07-31-2006 at 02:37 PM.
#21
Mass dampers to return...for now.
After choosing not to run its controversial mass dampers in the German Grand Prix to abide to an FIA ruling that deemed the device illegal, Renault is now set to refit the system to its R26s at this weekend's Hungarian GP.
The French squad appealed from the governing body's decision and indeed the dampers were considered legal by the Hockenheim race stewards. According to autosport.com, the FIA has now confirmed that the appeal won't be heard until late August, and the squad will be allowed to race the device in the meantime.
Renault was initially wary that it could be punished retrospectively for previous races should it run the mass dampers then lose the appeal, a scenario the FIA assured the team it won't happen.
The device consists of a weight of circa 20 pounds attached to the dampers which serves to counteract a car's suspension movements, thus making it more stable. Without the equipment, Renault struggled for competitiveness at Hockenheim, with Fernando Alonso and Giancarlo Fisichella finishing fifth and sixth respectively. The FIA contests its legality claiming they're a movable aerodynamic part, which is not allowed by the sport's regulations.
The French squad appealed from the governing body's decision and indeed the dampers were considered legal by the Hockenheim race stewards. According to autosport.com, the FIA has now confirmed that the appeal won't be heard until late August, and the squad will be allowed to race the device in the meantime.
Renault was initially wary that it could be punished retrospectively for previous races should it run the mass dampers then lose the appeal, a scenario the FIA assured the team it won't happen.
The device consists of a weight of circa 20 pounds attached to the dampers which serves to counteract a car's suspension movements, thus making it more stable. Without the equipment, Renault struggled for competitiveness at Hockenheim, with Fernando Alonso and Giancarlo Fisichella finishing fifth and sixth respectively. The FIA contests its legality claiming they're a movable aerodynamic part, which is not allowed by the sport's regulations.
#24
Originally Posted by F-C
I just don't understand the logic here. If the device is illegal, then the points gained should be retroactively deleted.
#25
Maybe b/c it's the FIA's way of saying we fucked this one up by disallowing a clear ruling on the use of dampers in spite of there being an indication by the stewards at the German GP they could be used. I don't understand the logic that says it's an aerodynamic device either. Springs, shocks, anti-roll bars all have an effect on aerodynamics yet the FIA has not banned those.
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