Buying my first house...
04-04-2008, 01:15 PM
#41
I now drive an accord....
Originally Posted by moeronn
The only real downside to it is that you cannot accurately guage the market when people do this.
04-04-2008, 01:25 PM
#42
is learning to moonwalk i
Originally Posted by Will Y.
In CA, it is fraud on the lender[s] not aware of the arrangement.
The lender is funding based upon representations as to the price of the home and the risk it is taking- the lender's risk is increased if it is NOT aware that the parties and agents are agreeing that the loan for the principal is also going to pay part of the closing costs. Also, the purported sale price of the property may also inflate the comps for other properties, leading to various effects down the line.
The 80/20 loans are fine IF the lenders are aware of the arrangement. The problem comes when the parties try to conceal a minimal down payment or tell the holder of the 80% that the 20% [or insert other percentage here] is from some other source other than another lender.
The lender is funding based upon representations as to the price of the home and the risk it is taking- the lender's risk is increased if it is NOT aware that the parties and agents are agreeing that the loan for the principal is also going to pay part of the closing costs. Also, the purported sale price of the property may also inflate the comps for other properties, leading to various effects down the line.
The 80/20 loans are fine IF the lenders are aware of the arrangement. The problem comes when the parties try to conceal a minimal down payment or tell the holder of the 80% that the 20% [or insert other percentage here] is from some other source other than another lender.
Originally Posted by spdy0001
When my realtor was showing me comps for the house I am closing on there was a listing for LIST price, SELL price, FINAL price, and amount of Concessions. So if you can actually see the 'real' comps you will know what the correct price is and can bid accordingly
04-04-2008, 02:51 PM
#43
I still don't see how it constittes fraud.
It's the lender's responsibilty to create mortgages that are not valued at more than the property.
So is Subprime Crisis fraud created by the lenders, since they created extremely high risk out of pure cread?
It's the lender's responsibilty to create mortgages that are not valued at more than the property.
So is Subprime Crisis fraud created by the lenders, since they created extremely high risk out of pure cread?
06-10-2008, 07:52 PM
#44
so a quick update... i close tomorrow afternoon... will have my final walkthrough in the morning and meet at the attorney's office after lunch... will have pics up...
man it has been a 2 month ordeal. i even had to pay to extend the lock on my mortgage since the rates went up since then... but money well worth it... closing costs are coming out to about $4.5-5k... the reserves however to set up the escrow account are killing me though... 2 months worth of taxes plus three months insurance... doesn't help my property taxes are $9100+/yr
man it has been a 2 month ordeal. i even had to pay to extend the lock on my mortgage since the rates went up since then... but money well worth it... closing costs are coming out to about $4.5-5k... the reserves however to set up the escrow account are killing me though... 2 months worth of taxes plus three months insurance... doesn't help my property taxes are $9100+/yr
06-11-2008, 01:00 AM
#46
05/5AT/Navi/ABP/Quartz
Originally Posted by korrupted
I still don't see how it constittes fraud.
It's the lender's responsibilty to create mortgages that are not valued at more than the property.
So is Subprime Crisis fraud created by the lenders, since they created extremely high risk out of pure cread?
It's the lender's responsibilty to create mortgages that are not valued at more than the property.
So is Subprime Crisis fraud created by the lenders, since they created extremely high risk out of pure cread?
Now, fraud in all states for federal transactions if you conceal material facts in dealing with the lender on you application. Lenders make their decisions based on information provided by others. Lots of real estate agents and loan officers are not properly trained and supervised. All of their objectives is to get a commission. For some, if they have to tell a lie to get paid then so be it. Others just don't know any better. Lots of these agents were in a hurry to start making money and didn't want to take time to learn all of the details of their new jobs.
People looking to purchase homes go to these 'experts' for advice. The purchase is emotional and sometimes all we hear is yes, you can qualify. Some people know their applications contain falsehoods, some don't.
Every applicant should at least sign the applications and read and understand them first. If you don't understand it, don't sign it. There is enough blame for everybody to have some fault.
Lenders sometimes looked the other way because most loans were packaged and resold. Placing all of the blame on the lender does not make sense. Individuals of adult age with supposed reasonable intelligence willingly entered into agreements where they took responsibility for providing accurate information.
Some were betting that they could sell and make money or refinance before their loans blew up. Almost everyone was motivated by greed and thought values would continue to rise until they profitted. Almost everyone was wrong.
IMHO, everyone that misrepresented any facts or signed a document they didn't understand helped to create the crisis. This does not mean that I'm without sympathy. I just find very few innocents. I am not an attorney and simply shared my understanding of the situation.
Sorry for the long post but you asked the question.
06-13-2008, 06:19 PM
#47
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
so a quick update... i close tomorrow afternoon... will have my final walkthrough in the morning and meet at the attorney's office after lunch... will have pics up...
man it has been a 2 month ordeal. i even had to pay to extend the lock on my mortgage since the rates went up since then... but money well worth it... closing costs are coming out to about $4.5-5k... the reserves however to set up the escrow account are killing me though... 2 months worth of taxes plus three months insurance... doesn't help my property taxes are $9100+/yr
man it has been a 2 month ordeal. i even had to pay to extend the lock on my mortgage since the rates went up since then... but money well worth it... closing costs are coming out to about $4.5-5k... the reserves however to set up the escrow account are killing me though... 2 months worth of taxes plus three months insurance... doesn't help my property taxes are $9100+/yr
06-13-2008, 08:22 PM
#48
i was lazy and didn't stop by the house today... i managed to dig up the pic i took of the house when i went to see it a few months ago and put in an offer... i will be there tomorrow with the cam...
$9+k a year for taxes for this it just disgusts me... but it is all mine...
$9+k a year for taxes for this
it just disgusts me... but it is all mine...
06-16-2008, 01:23 PM
#55
Originally Posted by LuvMyTSX
Congrats! The bf and I went to look at houses this past Saturday. Hopefully he will buy something in the next couple of months. 
06-16-2008, 02:13 PM
#56
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
lolz... for a sec there i thought you were going to say that 'we' will buy in the next couple months... so are you two going to look for him to buy??? where abouts are you looking???
Anyway, he's looking in Orange County in NY. Rockland would have been nice, too, but it's too expensive and also a little farther from his work.
06-16-2008, 04:50 PM
#58
Everyday Joe
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Originally Posted by hornyleprechaun
Congrats!My taxes are only $2000
06-16-2008, 06:49 PM
#59
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by keg1997
No joke....we pay less than 3K on a 3600 sq ft house on .5 acre
Holy crap. Must be nice. The houses my bf is looking at are around 2000 sq ft and taxes are $9k-$12k on average.
06-17-2008, 07:21 AM
#60
I now drive an accord....
Originally Posted by LuvMyTSX
Holy crap. Must be nice. The houses my bf is looking at are around 2000 sq ft and taxes are $9k-$12k on average.
My house is about 1500sq ft and taxes are about $1300
06-17-2008, 08:09 AM
#61
sorry everyone... i promise to have pics tonight... yesterday after work i had to run up to woodbury to help my cousin install a wall mount for his LCD HDTV... he is opening up a salon... so i will be able to go over the house today after work...
yeah my house is only 1600+ sq ft... but since it is a corner lot, that is what skyrockets the taxes... my uncles house is across the street and his is about 1300 sq ft, but his taxes are still approx 8k a year... his is more renovated than mine though... i should have bought a house in Dallas when i was down there... $220k for a 3k sq ft house with property taxes at approx 3-5k a year...
luv - what is funny is that you would think that up in upstate ny, the prices should be a bit cheaper but they aren't... my friend bought a house in middletown last year...
yeah my house is only 1600+ sq ft... but since it is a corner lot, that is what skyrockets the taxes... my uncles house is across the street and his is about 1300 sq ft, but his taxes are still approx 8k a year... his is more renovated than mine though... i should have bought a house in Dallas when i was down there... $220k for a 3k sq ft house with property taxes at approx 3-5k a year...
luv - what is funny is that you would think that up in upstate ny, the prices should be a bit cheaper but they aren't... my friend bought a house in middletown last year...
06-17-2008, 09:06 AM
#62
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
luv - what is funny is that you would think that up in upstate ny, the prices should be a bit cheaper but they aren't... my friend bought a house in middletown last year...
This is going to be harder than I thought.
06-17-2008, 10:12 PM
#66
56K go take a coffee break... actually walk to columbia,get your beans then come back
for reference for my pool thread...
there was another shed here... now the concrete foundation was left behind... plan to break it up and remove it and either build a wooden deck for a sitting/bar area, or just section it off for a vegetable garden...
the ancient A/C unit...
lets go inside... from the front door... living room... the wallpaper has got to go... i have started to research steamers... not sure if home depot rents them...
and the floors are a bit beat up too...
formal dining room
kitchen... this is actually an extension... originally, the dining room was a kitchen/dining room combo... i only know this because my uncle lives across the street and i also looked at a few other houses on the block... this is the only house on the street that has a separate kitchen like this, so the house has 9 rooms versus 8...
previous owner was a hardcore italian family and the mother loved to cook... so dual ovens... i have no idea what to do with this... i am thinking take out the oven on the left and make the space into a pantry???
go upstairs... carpet is getting removed...
bedroom 1, the smallest
hardwood peeking underneath... i plan to strip all the carpet from all the bedrooms and just refinish all the hardwood floors... i have heavy allergies so carpet really doesn't work for me and they used to have a dog too...
bedroom 2
bedroom 3
full bathroom upstairs... it currently does not have an exhaust fan (so another thing to add to the list)
and here is the access closet to the attic... one of my friends that also has a split level house built a complete master bedroom up here... i think it ran about 60k... not ready for it yet... maybe if i outgrow the house in the future...
attic fan... this thing kicks ass to pull cool air into the house... it will help me not have to run the A/C so much... here you can see another one of my problems... on the ceiling all over the house is that plaster like fan-like design... to me it is ugly... there is no way im gonna sand it all off to make it ready for paint... i guess i could just take sheet rock and cover over it... but i would rather gut it and put up new drywall... anyone have any other ideas???
okay back to the main level... back to the formal dining room... let's go down to ground level...
here is the family room... ugly carpet again... but no hardwood underneath this carpet... looks like linoleum tiling... but when the inspector spoke with me, he said a house this old (built in 1959) most like has asbestos in the tiles... so would be better for me to just lay hardwood over the tiles after removing the carpet... not worth risking pulling it all up...
from there if you turn around, there is access to the attached garage...
there is also a half bath on this ground level... but too small for me to get a decent pic of it... i would like to expand it to a full bath since there is a back door here and people would be able to just jump right into shower down here, rather than have to go all the way to the second floor... what i may do is use the extra space in the garage
and see what needs to be done to move the bathroom there... but then again i wanted to use that area for my tools, etc... ideas???
okay back into the ground floor... lets go to the basement...
if you go to the right after getting to the bottom... the previous owner had a lab down here... he made dentures... there are gas lines for burners all over the place... and there was a stove down here, but the municipality doesn't allow cooking underground anymore, so i plan to remove all this and clean it up and make this side a entertainment/game room...
looking down the hall the other way... both of these are false walls... i would really like to just take out the walls to open everything out and use pillars as support...
so first room after the stairs on the left... the ancient furnace, hot water heater.. there is also a ultility sink and washing machine here...
across from there is another room... currently has the dryer... makes no sense why it was split up, but then i realized they put the dryer here for the exhaust vent... ideally i want to move the dryer to the other room with the washer to make that the utility room... then after i open up the floor make this area into a bar, complete with counter and sink...
there is a slight problem with my open floor proposal though... if you look at the pic with the dryer, you will see that is a concrete foundation wall... this was the original wall before the extension... don't think i can break that down... not sure if i want to...
okay so the last section of the basement that was on the opposite end of the 'lab' is a partially finished sitting area... fireplace on one end...
and here is the other side...
this section has a sump pump and french drains...
and thank god since i have a moisture issue... on the outside, right on the concrete patio side of the pool, it looks like the foundation has settled... you can kinda see it in this pic...
so the concrete patio is sloping inward towards the house instead of outward... which means, when it rains, the water collects against the house, and most likely is seeping below into the basement... i already had someone come out to estimate how much it will cost to break up all the concrete, re-grade the area, and lay stone pavers down all the way around the side of the house to the front... i am guessing about 7-8k, but should hear back at the end of the week hopefully... if it wasn't so much concrete to break up, i would do it myself.. there is no way im doing all that with a sledge hammer...
06-18-2008, 09:00 AM
#67
Senior Moderator
Looks like you have some solid bones to work with there, and should look nice once updated. It's great that there's hardwood flooring under most of the carpet. I too have bad allergies and would prefer hardwood in most places.
I assume you have made a running list of all the improvements/repairs you need to make, and another for ones you WANT to make. Good luck with everything, and have fun!
I assume you have made a running list of all the improvements/repairs you need to make, and another for ones you WANT to make. Good luck with everything, and have fun!
06-18-2008, 10:05 AM
#68
yeah what attracted me was the potential of what i could do with it... so yeah defenitely have a long list of items i want to get to... and more... wish list items would be to upgrade the kitchen to SS appliances, new cabinets and granite countertop... but everything is still working fine right now so that can wait!!! i think step one will be to get off that god awful wallpaper and figure out about the plaster spackle fan design BS...
06-18-2008, 10:56 AM
#69
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
yeah what attracted me was the potential of what i could do with it... so yeah defenitely have a long list of items i want to get to... and more... wish list items would be to upgrade the kitchen to SS appliances, new cabinets and granite countertop... but everything is still working fine right now so that can wait!!! i think step one will be to get off that god awful wallpaper and figure out about the plaster spackle fan design BS...
Dif + scoring tool has always worked for my dad to get wallpaper off.
It should be fun for you to see the transformation of the house as each project is finished. Sounds awesome.
06-18-2008, 03:44 PM
#71
Racer
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Look into "mud jacking" to fix the slope of the slab out back if it's in good shape otherwise. They drill holes and pump in concrete to float the slab up the height/angle you need. Way cheaper than replacing.
06-18-2008, 03:50 PM
#72
Senior Moderator
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
i plan on putting together an album... and take pics of the total transformation of the house... and then ill leave it on my coffee table for any guests that come by... could be a good topic of convo??? i'm cheesy like that!!!
06-18-2008, 06:55 PM
#73
Everyday Joe
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Congrats again...no doubt that your house has plenty of "projects" to keep you busy. But, the definite upside is that you'll significantly increase the value of your house by doing much of the work yourself.
Good luck and keep us posted with your progress!
Good luck and keep us posted with your progress!
06-19-2008, 09:23 AM
#75
thanks!!! closed exactly a week ago... will finally tackle the pool and get the filters running this afternoon... all this rain this week has been killing me. i think i have to cut the grass this weekend.. i have never done that before... 
will finally tackle the pool and get the filters running this afternoon... all this rain this week has been killing me. i think i have to cut the grass this weekend.. i have never done that before...
06-19-2008, 09:34 AM
#76
I now drive an accord....
Originally Posted by KaMLuNg
i think i have to cut the grass this weekend.. i have never done that before...
i have never done that before... no grass, or someone else did it?I have fond memories of sweating my ass off mowing grass over the last 20 or so years. Its soo much different mowing my own yard instead of my parents. I don't mind doing it at all.
06-19-2008, 09:53 PM
#79
Suzuka Master
Wow Kam, looks like you got your work cut out for you. Welcome to home ownership. I bought my home in January 08 and moved in February. I made a laundry list of things to do and basically have spent most of my free time working on the home. Thankfully, my mother and uncle have helped tremendously by coming over and working on my home on weekdays since i'm seeing patients from 8 until 5 pm.
In a nutshell, i
1. repaired gutters with silicone
2. reconstructed wood rot in eaves beneath leaking gutters with bondo, primed, and painted
3. repaired all the cracks in the concrete in my driveway, concrete walkway around home, and in front walls with sealant, painted over when needed
4. installed new over-the-range microwave, garbage disposal, and water heater timer
5. installed heavy duty security screen door for garage so i can keep an eye on my porsche when my garage door is open
6. completely repainted interior and exterior of home after spackling all the little nail holes left by the previous owner's 3 children used to put up sanrio decorations lolz. i even went with silver metallic ralph lauren paint for master and guest bathrooms since i had gray tile backsplash and this kinda speckled gray countertop which was popular amongst japanese homebuilders in the mid 1990s when my home was built
7. rechanged all the shower heads
8. replaced old bulbs with cfls
9. replaced 60+ drawer handles in washroom, kitchen, and 2 bathrooms which were previously white plastic with brushed satin chrome handles
10. power sanded hardwood floor in hallways and dining room with 36 grit, 60 grit, than 100 grit sandpaper using an electric belt sander the size of a lawnmower. stained twice, varathaned twice, and will varathane again this weekend. there were scratches previously in the hardwood from chairs and tablets, now it is smooth like a baby's behind.
11. last weekend purchased a ton of new lighting (swarovski chandeliers for living and dining room), new sconces, outdoor lighting for garage and sidedoor, electric fan lights for master br, guest br, study, family room, and new bathbar lighting. going for a modern, satin chrome, metallic look with the lighting which will complement the bathrooms and stainless appliances in kitchen
12. will order new dining room set today.
13. ripped out the fiberboard over my enclosed patio which had some cracks from a small leak in the roof, fortunately the underlying wood structure and insulation demonstrated no rot or termites. will wait for the next heavy rains and observe for any leaks.
14. having a contractor come over to look at ripping out the columns separating my dining room from kitchen and hallway. previously had shoji doors which i tore out because they made the dining room too dark and gloomy.
anyhoo, pm me if you have any questions. i'm far from an expert but i figure if i made it through 12 years of schooling, i should be able to do some crap around the home. now they know me by sight at home depot lolz. i'd just be careful about the electrical stuff, i'm having someone else install the chandeliers and lighting fixtures.
In a nutshell, i
1. repaired gutters with silicone
2. reconstructed wood rot in eaves beneath leaking gutters with bondo, primed, and painted
3. repaired all the cracks in the concrete in my driveway, concrete walkway around home, and in front walls with sealant, painted over when needed
4. installed new over-the-range microwave, garbage disposal, and water heater timer
5. installed heavy duty security screen door for garage so i can keep an eye on my porsche when my garage door is open
6. completely repainted interior and exterior of home after spackling all the little nail holes left by the previous owner's 3 children used to put up sanrio decorations lolz. i even went with silver metallic ralph lauren paint for master and guest bathrooms since i had gray tile backsplash and this kinda speckled gray countertop which was popular amongst japanese homebuilders in the mid 1990s when my home was built
7. rechanged all the shower heads
8. replaced old bulbs with cfls
9. replaced 60+ drawer handles in washroom, kitchen, and 2 bathrooms which were previously white plastic with brushed satin chrome handles
10. power sanded hardwood floor in hallways and dining room with 36 grit, 60 grit, than 100 grit sandpaper using an electric belt sander the size of a lawnmower. stained twice, varathaned twice, and will varathane again this weekend. there were scratches previously in the hardwood from chairs and tablets, now it is smooth like a baby's behind.
11. last weekend purchased a ton of new lighting (swarovski chandeliers for living and dining room), new sconces, outdoor lighting for garage and sidedoor, electric fan lights for master br, guest br, study, family room, and new bathbar lighting. going for a modern, satin chrome, metallic look with the lighting which will complement the bathrooms and stainless appliances in kitchen
12. will order new dining room set today.
13. ripped out the fiberboard over my enclosed patio which had some cracks from a small leak in the roof, fortunately the underlying wood structure and insulation demonstrated no rot or termites. will wait for the next heavy rains and observe for any leaks.
14. having a contractor come over to look at ripping out the columns separating my dining room from kitchen and hallway. previously had shoji doors which i tore out because they made the dining room too dark and gloomy.
anyhoo, pm me if you have any questions. i'm far from an expert but i figure if i made it through 12 years of schooling, i should be able to do some crap around the home. now they know me by sight at home depot lolz. i'd just be careful about the electrical stuff, i'm having someone else install the chandeliers and lighting fixtures.
06-19-2008, 11:04 PM
#80
Originally Posted by surfer rick
Wow Kam, looks like you got your work cut out for you. Welcome to home ownership. I bought my home in January 08 and moved in February. I made a laundry list of things to do and basically have spent most of my free time working on the home. Thankfully, my mother and uncle have helped tremendously by coming over and working on my home on weekdays since i'm seeing patients from 8 until 5 pm.
In a nutshell, i
1. repaired gutters with silicone
2. reconstructed wood rot in eaves beneath leaking gutters with bondo, primed, and painted
3. repaired all the cracks in the concrete in my driveway, concrete walkway around home, and in front walls with sealant, painted over when needed
4. installed new over-the-range microwave, garbage disposal, and water heater timer
5. installed heavy duty security screen door for garage so i can keep an eye on my porsche when my garage door is open
6. completely repainted interior and exterior of home after spackling all the little nail holes left by the previous owner's 3 children used to put up sanrio decorations lolz. i even went with silver metallic ralph lauren paint for master and guest bathrooms since i had gray tile backsplash and this kinda speckled gray countertop which was popular amongst japanese homebuilders in the mid 1990s when my home was built
7. rechanged all the shower heads
8. replaced old bulbs with cfls
9. replaced 60+ drawer handles in washroom, kitchen, and 2 bathrooms which were previously white plastic with brushed satin chrome handles
10. power sanded hardwood floor in hallways and dining room with 36 grit, 60 grit, than 100 grit sandpaper using an electric belt sander the size of a lawnmower. stained twice, varathaned twice, and will varathane again this weekend. there were scratches previously in the hardwood from chairs and tablets, now it is smooth like a baby's behind.
11. last weekend purchased a ton of new lighting (swarovski chandeliers for living and dining room), new sconces, outdoor lighting for garage and sidedoor, electric fan lights for master br, guest br, study, family room, and new bathbar lighting. going for a modern, satin chrome, metallic look with the lighting which will complement the bathrooms and stainless appliances in kitchen
12. will order new dining room set today.
13. ripped out the fiberboard over my enclosed patio which had some cracks from a small leak in the roof, fortunately the underlying wood structure and insulation demonstrated no rot or termites. will wait for the next heavy rains and observe for any leaks.
14. having a contractor come over to look at ripping out the columns separating my dining room from kitchen and hallway. previously had shoji doors which i tore out because they made the dining room too dark and gloomy.
anyhoo, pm me if you have any questions. i'm far from an expert but i figure if i made it through 12 years of schooling, i should be able to do some crap around the home. now they know me by sight at home depot lolz. i'd just be careful about the electrical stuff, i'm having someone else install the chandeliers and lighting fixtures.
In a nutshell, i
1. repaired gutters with silicone
2. reconstructed wood rot in eaves beneath leaking gutters with bondo, primed, and painted
3. repaired all the cracks in the concrete in my driveway, concrete walkway around home, and in front walls with sealant, painted over when needed
4. installed new over-the-range microwave, garbage disposal, and water heater timer
5. installed heavy duty security screen door for garage so i can keep an eye on my porsche when my garage door is open
6. completely repainted interior and exterior of home after spackling all the little nail holes left by the previous owner's 3 children used to put up sanrio decorations lolz. i even went with silver metallic ralph lauren paint for master and guest bathrooms since i had gray tile backsplash and this kinda speckled gray countertop which was popular amongst japanese homebuilders in the mid 1990s when my home was built
7. rechanged all the shower heads
8. replaced old bulbs with cfls
9. replaced 60+ drawer handles in washroom, kitchen, and 2 bathrooms which were previously white plastic with brushed satin chrome handles
10. power sanded hardwood floor in hallways and dining room with 36 grit, 60 grit, than 100 grit sandpaper using an electric belt sander the size of a lawnmower. stained twice, varathaned twice, and will varathane again this weekend. there were scratches previously in the hardwood from chairs and tablets, now it is smooth like a baby's behind.
11. last weekend purchased a ton of new lighting (swarovski chandeliers for living and dining room), new sconces, outdoor lighting for garage and sidedoor, electric fan lights for master br, guest br, study, family room, and new bathbar lighting. going for a modern, satin chrome, metallic look with the lighting which will complement the bathrooms and stainless appliances in kitchen
12. will order new dining room set today.
13. ripped out the fiberboard over my enclosed patio which had some cracks from a small leak in the roof, fortunately the underlying wood structure and insulation demonstrated no rot or termites. will wait for the next heavy rains and observe for any leaks.
14. having a contractor come over to look at ripping out the columns separating my dining room from kitchen and hallway. previously had shoji doors which i tore out because they made the dining room too dark and gloomy.
anyhoo, pm me if you have any questions. i'm far from an expert but i figure if i made it through 12 years of schooling, i should be able to do some crap around the home. now they know me by sight at home depot lolz. i'd just be careful about the electrical stuff, i'm having someone else install the chandeliers and lighting fixtures.
Geez...