3.2cl-s

A few of my friends have been on steroids for about a year now, and they are pretty big. I've been working out for the past year, but i am no where close to them in muscle mass and i obviosly have never tried steroids.....but i was wondering what most people on this board think about it, any stories (good or bad) about em'

just kinda curious as I would love to get bigger.

gavriil

Let me ask this: It sounds like ultimate muscle mass addition is your goal when you go to gym. If correct, what do you do at the gym? Where I am going with this is that you dont need steroids, unless if you're gonna make lots of money off of your body and even then you gotta know exactly what you're doing. There is a lot you can do without steroids.

3.2cl-s

well i dont plan on making money off of it obviously, just kind of curious of some stories.....even if i did do it, it wouldn't be a long term thing, more like a summer thing, well march through september at least (when its hot)

Red-CL

Dude,

Not worth the risk.

I'm 26 now but in high school a couple of my friends started to use steroids. They got pretty big pretty fast. Of course I wanted to be as big if not bigger but didn't wanna assume the risk. Things looked good for them then but now they have all kinds of health issues.

It's only been 8 years!!!!!!

Go for it. (If you're not worried about the rest of your life)

I personally wouldn't though.

BEETROOT

exactly what I was gonna say.

unless steroids are going to get you into professional sports or something where you can make millions, why the hell would you do that to your body?

do some research into what they will do to you...acne, hair growth, ball shrinkage, irregular heart beat, etc etc

bad stuff man.

Red-CL

What are you doing out of Automotive News?


Get back in there
















j/k

gavriil

OK. So what do you do at the gym?

gavriil

Hehehe... I know. I am never here.

Red-CL

Also what people never realize is that steriod build muscles fast.

All muscles!!!!!!

Your tongue, heart and intestines are all large muscles that also get built up during steroid usage.

3.2cl-s

umm....work out to get bigger

3.2cl-s

too bad my shlong isn't a muscle..

3.2cl-s

what kind of health problems does he have?

gavriil

Surely. How do you work out. What exercises do you do, when, reps, sets, how long do they last, what do you train on a weekly basis, etc.

Also, do you take any supplements and if yes, what.

gavriil

Where I am getting to here is that, you have to make sure you exhaust all other "ways" to get bigger. The way you work out and what you eat is what makes the difference in the end, even if you take steroids. Steroids are only a helper to get to the...next level. And that is always a professional level.

3.2cl-s

i work out Tues, Thurs, Sat and do cardi Mon, wed, fri....though the cardio part im usually not that religious on. Do one day of chest, flat bench, incline, decline.etc. usually 3 sets each, 12x10x8...one day of arms- barbell curl, superset with behind back tricep extension, dumbell curl, reverse bench press (whatever its called), pull downs, reverse barbell curl, and one day of back and sholders ( i know what i do, just not real good on the names)

Dont get me wrong, over the past year i have noticed a difference, but i was just looking at something that could give me a little edge.

3.2cl-s

o, and i used to take supplements, i took andro, creatine, and i take protein shakes currently.

gavriil

OK let's talk reps and sets.

Principle number one Between 4-6

Muscles grow because there is a reason. You've got to push a muscle for it to grow. Nothing new here.

Studies have shown that the most efficient way for a muscle to grow is between 4 and 6 reps. If you can do more than 6 reps, raise the weight, if you can do less than 4, lower the weight.

Now let's talk sets and reps so that this makes sense.

There are 3 kinds of sets:

1. Warmup sets
2. Acclimation Sets
3. Overload sets

The 4-6 rep principle above is the overload set. But here is the mistake most people make at the gym:

They go and reach muscle overload at pretty much every set they do. You cant imagine how much difference this makes. Doing it right that is. What's right?

Warmup sets and Acclimation Sets are there to prevent you from injury and prepare the muscles and joints, etc for the overload sets. What does that mean?

Example:

Let's say you do chest and you start with bench press. A key word here is "start".

Let's assume your max bench press in poundage is 200 pounds and 5 reps. Let's call that maximum overload. MO.

Set 1: Warmup set 12 reps of 40% of MO (I will use % instead of pounds)

Set 2: Warmup set 12 reps of 45% of MO

Notice we are nowhere near muscle exhaustion or fatigue.

Set 3: you could have a 3rd warm up set here because this is your first chest exercise, or go into the first acclimation set.

Set 3 or 4: First Acclimation set. 3-4 reps of 65% of MO

Acclimation sets are there because research has found that upping the weight slowly to reach MO, minimizes the chance of injury. By a TON! Plus it helps the muscle to lift more weight during the MO sets.

People go and start reaching MO at this point and do 8 or more reps and they still have 3 more sets to go. Big mistake. You still gain muscle this way, but that's not the fastest way to add muscle.

Set 4 or 5: Second acclimation set: 1-3 reps of 85% of MO Yes 1 rep. That's all you need. Stay away from feeling overload.

Now it's time to add some muscle. All this work has ben done to reach the 2 final sets which will be the ONLY sets that will add muscle. The Overload sets. So 2 sets of 4-6 reps at 100% of MO. No matter what the weight is, reps is what counts. That's where you build muscle.

Note that muscle fatigue is bad. Fatiguing the muscle does not add muscle, it only fatigues the muscle and that's all. Same with muscle burn. Muscle burn is a result of too many reps usually and it happens because of lactic acid accumulating around the muscle area as a disposal from chemical reactions within the muscle. The key to the most efficient and quick way to add muscle, as far as sets and reps go, is muscle OVERLOAD and INTENSITY. Everything else is a waste of your time and pain with no gain.


No, when you go to the second chest excersice, you do not have to do warmup sets again. Going right into the acclimation sets is fine. Sometimes doind one acclimation set and 2 overload sets is enough. Hence my statement about the word "start" above.

Principle two on the way...

gavriil

Principle number 2. Short one:

Wait between 2 and 5 minutes between sets. I wait 2 min. between warmup sets, 3 min between acclimation sets and 4-5 min between overload sets. It's very important that you recover as much as possible so that you lift as much weight as possible during the MO sets. You CANNOT start a MO set unless if fully recovered. The trick here is to make sure you do not wait too long and have your muscles go cold which defeats the purpose of warmup sets.

I see people waiting for 20 seconds before they go and do the next set. Bad. All that's doing is add to the benefits that cardio has and fatigues the muscles. Muscles wont grow if you fatigue them. Rather, they will grow MUCH slower.

gavriil

Principle number 3. Another short one:

Do 6-9 MO sets per muscle group.

So if you do chest on Monday and if you do 2 MO sets per exercise, you do between 3 and 4 exercises for chest that day. Doing more fatigues and overtrains the muscle. In the most efficient way to build muscle, more is not always better. Many times less is more. More on that later.

gavriil

Principle number 4:

Train only 1 or 2 muscle groups per workout each day

Part of more is not always better.

By pre-establishing in your mind that you will only be training 1 muscle group you are able to generate much greater mental focus and intensity.

I see people in the gym that split the body into 2 days and they keep rotating that.

I do:

Day 1: Legs (and thinking of spliting that into 2 days actually)
Day 2: Chest
Day 3: Back
Day 4: Arms and calves
Day 5: Shoulders and abdominals

Due to travel, I dont exersize at least 1-2 days a week.

And start all over again.

gavriil

Principle number 5:

Recuperation is when muscles build.

Muscles dont build at the gym. They build when you dont use them. It's so simple, yet so many people cant understand this and implement incorectly.

Do not use the same muscle group more than twice per week. I try to be at 1.3 times a week timeline.

You do chest Monday, the sooner I would do it again would be Friday night or Saturday, if not next Monday.

Some people just have to train their chest every other day. What that does is overtrain the muscle. What does that do? Initially it makes the muscle to stop growing as fast. Then the muscle completely stops growing. In severe cases, the muscle actually loses strength and starts to get smaller. Yes you can overtrain to the point where you lose muscle. So more is not better, again.

Rest at home to rebuild muscle bigger and stronger.

Also, every 6-9 weeks, take a week off. Completely off. Dont think about the gym. That will help you mentally. Mental focus makes a difference since muscle will grow during the MO sets which are a lot about focusing and mental strength overall.

gavriil

Notice we have not even gotten to the point of discussing what exercises to do at the gym. The way you work out is as important.

Principle number 6

This is probably the hardest.

Believe it or not 40 min of weight lifting per day is enough even for bodybuilders. I know it sounds crazy, though, if ultimate muscle growth is the intend, then that's all you need. Why?

It's much more feasible to maintain maximum mental and physical intensity for 30 to 40 minutes than for 90 minutes. In fact, after 30 minutes mental focus and intensity start to decline rapidly.


Training for 30 to 40 minutes maximizes hormonal spikes related to high-intensity training.

Training for 30 to 40 minutes optimizes the "anabolic-window" high-intensity training provides. Going beyond the 40 minute threshold places you outside the optimum hormonal response time. More on this later.

Training beyond 40 minutes increases the risk of over-training and increases catabolic hormone secretion. As you drift outside the "anabolic-window" you enter a detrimental "catabolic" phase. Training beyond 40 minutes decreases anabolic activity.

gavriil

Now, I am gonna skip the exercise-related principles and jumpt to the Anabolic Window Principle. Principle number 7

So doctors found that the first 45 minutes after you're done exercising, the protein absorbtion rate is as much as 4 times higher than any other time in the day. Now think about that. No matter how much protein you eat, your body will use as much as it needs and as much it can absorb at that point and the rest goes in the toilet.

Bottom line. If you drink protein mix, there is no other more important time to get it, as right after a 30-45 min workout. That's when it counts. Just this principle in itself if probably worth visible results in a year's worth of weight lifting at the gym. If I do it and you dont and we do the same things at the gym, I will look bigger in a year's time than you. It's that important.

Note that if your workout lasts 90+ min like many do, the anabolic window is close to being closed after you're done and it's not as intense. As all these principles are interrelated, this one is more related with the previous one which suggests max training of 40 min per day.

What I do is prepare my mix at home and leave it in the car. So I start drinking it right after I get in the car, after I am done at the gym. For better results, use water to mix the power so it's aborbed by your body quicker since it's digested much quicker.

KavexTrax

keywords: anabolic steroids side effects :search:

BEETROOT

holy chist gavril

thats a helluva lot of typing.

I'm going to cut and paste this and try to read it over the next few days, looks like some good info in there.

didn't know you were into lifting so much.

gavriil

Principle number 8. Short one.

Always warmup on a treadmill or other device before you start lifting weights. It helps prevent injuries big time. Though people warm up the wrong way. Some take 15 min on the treadmill. Some go 9mph for 8 min, etc. Bad.

It's very important to have as much energy as possible for your MO sets later. So it's important to find the balance between warming up and wasting that energy you will need later.

What I do is run for 4 minutes at 6 mph on the treadmill and walk for 2-3 min during a cool down. I go down to 4 mph for a 1.5 min and then to 3.5 for another min and then to 3 mph for a few more seconds. That's it. You're warmed up. Time to start lifting.

Note: The above warmup is not a substitute for the warmup sets discussed earlier.

GOT PSI?

gavrill = knows his shit

Thank you for the useful info!

gavriil

Number 9. Another short one.

Before we start lifting it's important we stretched. But not everything. That would take for ever and distroy your anabolic window principle above. I target the muscles that I wil be working out and secondarily the synergist muscles. The helper muscles.

So if it's chest day and I am ready to do bench pressing, I target the chest, the triceps and the shoulders. That's it. It takes 4 minutes.

Now why stretching. Let me be clear. There is no study that backs up the myth that stretching prevents injuries. There's none. I stretch for the facts we know about stretching. And those are, because:

1. It enhances my lifting. Stretching makes more muscle fibers get involved in the process of lifting later. And that's a good thing. You add muscle faster when you involve more fibers during your MO sets.

2. Stretching has long term durability and reliability effects on joints, tendons, etc. It's not all about muscles. When you grow, many things grow.

But, here is the problem. Some studies have found that if you strech the hell out of a muscle, for some muscles it takes up to an hour for them to recover (that is, be fully prepared for those important MO sets). So what do you do to balance this? I do a light stretching before the excersise and a full stretch after. It takes a little bit more time, but it's worth it.

Now how to stretch is the other thing that most people do wrong.

I see people, they stretch their muscles for like...what...4 seconds. That did not do anything. I see other people, they are almost screaming in pain while stretching. That's actually breaking things more than anything. You could get an injury from over stretching. More is not better again.

To fully stretch a muscle you have to keep it stretched for minimum 20 seconds, up to 45 seconds. And the bigger the muscle the longer it takes to stretch. Also, you stretch to MINOR DISCOMFORT. Not where is hurts like a bitch. That's stretching for injuries not for good. Though, CONSTANT dicomfort is key as well. That's because your muscle is actually...stretching as you're holding your...lim for example in the...appropriate stretch position. I feel my muscle stretch and the discomofrot goes away after a few seconds, now you pusch your lim a little more till you feel it again. 20-45 seconds later, you're done. Next muscle. It's also important to keep breathing normaly duirng stretching. Finally, if you try and conentrate to relax that muscle while you are stretching it, you will see that it will stretch even more.

Note: There are 3 main types of stretching. The one I and most use is the static stretch method. You stretch a muscle and you hold it there for 20-45 seconds. No bouncing, etc.

Doc.Booty

Steroids are the last thing you want to use. Though some people claim they're healthy if used properly, they still have negative effects. Stay away from them, especially if you're just starting out - you'll learn to appreciate the hard work and dedication that building mass requires. They're close to the "magic pill" as far as quick results go, but anything more than those initial results - and even keeping those initial results - requires just as much hard work as putting on mass naturally.

gavriil

I am going to leave this series with only ONE principle (number 10) related to actual exercises.

Most people have 10 principles about what exercises to do in the gym, though one is enough. The rest is about how you train.

This principle is the myth of the benefits of isolation.

Let me be clear. If ultimate and most efficient muscle growth is the goal, then there is no better thing you can do than COMPOUND exercises. What are those?

Compound exercises are those who involve a large number of muscles and do not target one or two (isolation). Isolation is BAD if you want to build muscle quickly with as little work as possible. The trick is to separate between muscle isolation and form (while executing the exercise).

Examples:

If you're gonna do legs, there is simply no better exercise than SQUATS. If you want your legs to grow, nothing will grow them faster than squats.

I see people do leg extensions on the machine like there is no tomorrow and no one will touch a bar and put it over their head. Actually, I do Smith Squats, which is second best, but I prefer safety since I ant going to the Olympics any time soon.

Same with chest. Bench Press.

Shoulders= Military Press for example.

Back= Dead Lifts. Yes dead lifts. The myth of squats and dead lifts being bad for your back and your knees is bullshit. No exercise is bad, unless if you're doing it wrong. Every exercise is bad if you're doing it wrong. If anything, dead lifts build a stronger back so you avoid injuries. Same with squats.

I have a site you can link that shows how to execute exercises by avoiding injury It's animated so I like it for that:

http://www.exrx.net/

Now, do I do non-compound exercises? Sure. But never first. If I do chest, I will start with flat bench pressing, then do decline, then incline, then go and do one set of dumbell flies. I avoid machines, though I love the Smith. I rarely touch the cables. Nothing like free weights. If you're gonna do compound exercises, you're pretty much bound to use free weights.

The following could be its own principle, but I will put it as a sub-principle to this 10th one:

Avoid using single-lim exercises. Like concentration curles here:

http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/...ationCurl.html

Why? It goes agains one the most fundamental principles of building muscle the most efficient way possible: INTENSITY If you do one lim at a time, you take twice the time, energy, you lose intensity as a result and do not get the most benefit from overload.

The mother of bicepts exercises is the Barbell Curl (note this is another compound exercise)
http://www.exrx.net/WeightExercises/Biceps/BBCurl.html

That's what I start with, before I go into the dumbells.

So do compound exercises first before coming down to more isolation type of exercises.

Finally, when you reach a platau, all you need to do is surprise your body with either a different order of the same exercises or add a new exercise to the routine. Never do different exercises every time you go to the gym, or every so often. Muscles wont grow as quickly if you dont have a routine they get used to. Then platau is reached and you change your routine a bit and there's your new burst of growth and strength.

gavriil

I knew I forgot an important one:

This is related to the warmup on the treadmill principle.

Many people do cardio sessions. Most do them before or after weight lifting. Like right after. VERY VERY bad! I wrote about the anabolic window and I wrote about the hormonal events that happen in a 30-45 min workout. So just for those reasons you can understand why it's bad.

Though, even more, because cardio depletes a lot of energy, it's bad for muscle growth overall, even if it's done after weight lifting. After weight lifting, the recuperation window opens and that's what you need to give to your body. I am not saying go to sleep, though for sure I can tell you doing a cardio session is not what you should do.

Bottom line, a cardio session has to be at least 10 hours away from a weight lifting session for you to get all the benefits of the hormonal events that happen after a weight lifting session that has as its goal the fastest muscle growth possible with the least amount of work possible. So you either lift weights in the morning and do cardio at night, or separate them in different days.

Doc.Booty

Lots of great info Gavril. Should help him get started in the gym, and then some. Covering diet tomorrow?

gavriil

Thanks. Time to go to sleep now. Recuperation Actually I have been at the gym 2 days this week with all this travel. Hotels have gyms where compound exercises are almost not permitted. Sigh!

Doc.Booty

Ii've been warned/thrown out of my fair share of hotel gyms for squats

I haven't been for a week, been sick with this damn flu going around school

God

www.thepumpingstation.com

dallison

too bad steroids makes your shlong smaller.
steroids will also shorten your life expectancy depending on how long you take them.

you also need to remember and look at some older lifters who are big, just like the saying, what goes up must come down.
in short the big guys need to keep up the workout when you get old b/c shit will droop. you'll look like you have titties.

Sdog2012

what it comes down to is that if you use steroids, your a pussy.

Bulldog01

Good grief, gavriil! Thanks for sharing all that info.

TypeSKid

Steroids shrink yo weinie. not 4 me.

anothercls

^^^^ Sometimes things just cant get smaller...