Garve

Hey Guys,

Happy New Year to you all! I'd like to ask for your help on deciding on what rims to get. I'm going to get some quotes tomorrow for a set of 19 x 8.5 +38 offset in Gun Metal for my BWP 2013 SH-AWD base.

I've narrowed it down to the following three choices, all within my budget:

1. Vossen CV3 - always my preferred choice, however seems all too common as we know on 4G's but still a very nice look;

2. Forgestar CF5V - this became an affordable option from my supplier lately, never thought it could be. Haven't seen these on any TL's only European cars so not sure how the look might be but nonetheless I don't think I'll be disappointed;

3. Avante Garde M510 Bespoke - liked the look, not sure how they'd go with the TL as I've seen them only on Audi's and BMW's and not sure if they'd be as concave as my other two choices. But I like the fact that they are now customizable to my preferred color and specs, plus they're the most economical of the three.

I'll also be getting some Tein SS Coilovers this month to complete the look. I'm debating between the Bridgestone RE760's and the Falken FK453's. I was going to invest in Pilot Super Sports but decided to spend more on the rims vs the tires.

Love your input!

Thanks,

Norm

weather

Hey Norm.....Happy New Year to you too. As you may have read many of my posts, I am not huge on aftermarket rims or accessories as I find the OEM equipment more elegant and fitting for the vehicle. That being said, I am fully aware that I am the minority here, and more than likely, a reflection of my age than anything else *lol*

Out of the 3 choice you have quoted, the one I like the most would be #3....the Avante Garde M510 Bespoke.

I am aware that I am one voice in many that will chime in but thought I'd be the first to the race

Mjcanton

I really like option 1 and 3. All in all, I think you could slap any of the wheels on and they'd look great as long as they had the proper offset.

AlexG_6MT

iTrader: (1)

Avante Garde 510 are the best looking IMO. Whatever you do, stay far away from Vosssens. Cheap ugly wheels which are way to played out right now, especially on the 4G TL.

C8N

Does no one like the OEM 19" diamond cut wheels?
I don't think I have seen too many TL's with these.

Perhaps I am the odd man out but I like these.

weather

^^ I like them....as I said, I tend to much prefer OEM wheels (or their accessories)....they look classier in my opinion.

potmilkz

none are good,

vossens are cast wheels.. low pressure cast wheels.

so are avante garde's... forgestar would be the best out of the 3 but still many people have issues with hairline cracks on the inner barrel...

go with forged wheels.. they are the best imo.. and you should not cheap out on wheels as they are the the only thing keeping you to the ground..

remember cast wheels shatter, forged wheels bend during impact.


oem wheels are good as well, they are certified by manufactuer

AlexG_6MT

iTrader: (1)

OEM wheels are cast using the same process as the manufacturers that you just called cheap and dangerous. They are also certified to the same standards as any reputable aftermarket cast wheel manufacturer.


If you are not using your vehicle on the track or trying to squeeze every last ounce of performance out of your car, forged wheels are way overkill.

wreak

I couldn't agree more. I'd focus more on investing in better tires over forged wheels on a dd street car.

Timmy18

I'd go for OEM's 9/10 times.

potmilkz

Where are you getting these info from? or is this straight opionion? how do you even come up with the "oem wheels are made the same"?
these are china wheels you are buying!

Are stance wheels jwl cerftified? VIA? TUV? show me some proof they are..

because from what i know and have seen OEM wheels are jwl certified.. also via as well... you at least need 2 of those certifications to deem safe..

When a factory wheel is made, the primary goals the wheel manufacturer has are as follows:

1. durability from road hazards (potholes, etc.).
2. durability from road salts, car wash acids, chemicals, etc.
3. durability in order to minimize warranty claims and/or recalls.
4. ability to properly support the weight of the vehicle and it's passengers + cargo with a huge safety margin.
5. proper fitment to ensure vehicles suspension and brake systems operate as designed and without vibrations.


These mfg that make these vossens/stance/replica wheels do not factor these things when making wheels.. shit they are not even certified..

you are not in a cheap 2800lb car.. you are in a car that is 4000lbs.. and when your car hits a pothole or anything you better be sure your wheel can take the beating or else you will be ending up in a curb or in a ditch somewhere.

there is no such thing as overkill on wheels, you want to be as safe as possible.. go ahead, buy some cheap $700 cast wheels, 90% of them are made from china with no regulations anyways.. also you do not need to track your car to crack these cheap low pressure/gravity cast wheels..

this is why you see more stories of cast wheels failing then forged wheels. Forged is not perfect, there are some that fail, but very low chances of it failing on you.

better tires? shit, it wont help if you are puttin on some cheap wheels

did you know vossens are actually made in china... using gravity cast process?

you can order your wheels here directly from china

http://vesteonchina.en.made-in-china...18-20inch.html

Kahta

Not real vossens

This place also sells BBS wheels...

potmilkz

think what you want, there is no mfg proof that vossens are made in the US.. many of asked vossen to provide proof pictures or even video of mfg process.. no fucks given.. because if it was ever confirmed, it will ruin them.

adv.1 provides many videos of their wheel making process, that is a true wheel company. HRE as well.

oh and that 2000 price tag for cast wheels.. LOL

Kahta

I'm not saying they were made in the US, but it's ridiculous for you to post a link to what is clearly a website for fake wheels (and other products) and say that they are the same thing as the wheels from the manufacturer is wrong.

It's also entirely possible to outsource to manufacturers (or not be made in the US) and still get a quality product. As an example, the appliances in your home were probably made by Haier in China.

It's pretty clear that the chinese person took the images directly from the vossen website and those are fakes.

http://vesteonchina.en.made-in-china...E-ISO-DOT.html

http://www.vossenwheels.com/wheels/VVSCV3.aspx



These are clearly not actually OEM BMW pedals...

http://www.made-in-china.com/showroo...s-for-BMW.html


Or polo ralph lauren shirts...
http://inshopss.en.made-in-china.com...eve-Polos.html

or raybans...
http://inshopss.en.made-in-china.com...unglasses.html

potmilkz

Come on.. you really think "QUALITY" wheels are produced in china?

have you seen all the problems people have with vossen wheels? cracks? seperation from barrel?

i work in one of 5 top NVOCC in the world.. i know and have seen vossen book containers from china.. hong kong specifically.. they are cheap made wheels.. Name one good wheel that came from china? cus i dont know any..

here is your proof.. an import shipment


wheels are made in china, it is china wheels, those mfg did not steal those pics from vossen, its china wheels to begin with.. vossen is just a company in the US that distributes their wheels.

AlexG_6MT

iTrader: (1)

Please note that I said clearly in my post that I was referring to REPUTABLE aftermarket manufacturers.

See:
I cannot speak for Vossen, or Stance, or any said 'Cheap Chinese Wheel Companies' but I did not claim to. My statement was regarding REPUTABLE aftermarket wheel manufacturers.

For example, you ripped on Avante Garde wheels and classified them as cheap cast wheels. All Avante Garde wheels are in fact JWL and VIA certified. Enkei is also a very reputable aftermarket wheel manufacturer that produces certified cast wheels.

I agree that you should only buy reputable certified wheels and avoid replica/no name/knock of wheels from China. Do not assume the quality of the wheel based on the process - it is true that a cast wheel cannot achieve the same maximum strength as a forged wheel, but forged wheels can absolutely be of low quality as well. A forging process is far more complicated than casting processes, and just as easy to mess up. $2000 forged wheels from one of the several brand new no name wheel manufacturers that have popped up in the last five years scare me just as much as the $600 cast wheel from China.

Judge wheels by their proven QUALITY, not the process used to make them - anything else is simply absurd.

potmilkz

there you go, i highlighted the only statement anyone needs to hear..

please know that ANYTHING can fail. forged is not exactly bullet proof as i mentioned.. proven quality? maybe under the CAST wheels category.. but forged is better in every way.. straight and lightweight.

Kahta

Wow- that website is pretty neat. Looks like you were right.

http://www.importgenius.com/importers/vossen-wheels-inc

http://www.lensowheel.com/lenso-wheel_corporate.aspx

potmilkz

From what i have read, vossen is now having their precision series line done inhouse.. and is moving towards forged wheels..

their cast wheels that everyone is buying is merely $50 bucks a piece from china..

shipping cost is about 1700 or so to ship it from china..

give or take, 600 wheels can fit in a 40ft/40High cube container. which is roughly at commercial invoice value of 30k per container.

at 150 sets of wheels in a container with the price tag of about 1500 they make roughly about 175k off 1 container.

that is after shipping cost, tax, trucking cost,duties and everything.. not a bad way to make money.

markwon

OP - Obviously, I own Vossen CV3s and am a fan of the look. Aesthetically, here's my rank:

1. Vossen CV3 - Though as you mentioned, there does seem to be quite a lot of 4Gs with CV3s)
2. Avante Garde M510 Bespoke - These would look fantastic, I'm not sure if I've seen these on a 4G.
3. Forgestar CF5V - I agree with your point, my eyes are accustomed to seeing this on Euro cars. I do think the M510s offer a lot of what you're going for with this look at a materially lower price.

If money were no option, forged wheels all day. However, financial responsibility requires compromise. Good luck finding your balance and making your decision!

Thank you for shedding light on Vossen, it will definitely make me think twice before purchasing another set. Vossen is phenomenal at hyping their brand, and just like other luxury niche products, they take a relatively ordinary product, create some mystique behind it, and make a nice margin (if those import details are correct).

potmilkz

trust me my details are correct..

just look at the screenshot i posted.. it shows 598 cartons.. which in turn means 598 boxes of wheels.. divide that into 4 and you get rougly 150 sets and how much is each set of vossens??? around 1500.. total sell value is 225k.. deduct lets say 30k for product and you get 195k, with tax, duties, trucking cost, shipping cost, which should total up to about 10k or so.. and you get roughly 175k-185k profit..

many people are paying 1500 for 200 wheels.. i can understand if these are like 800 bucks.. but to say they are "HIGH QUALITY" when it is made in china and the fact that it is low pressure cast is just wrong.. low pressure cast is only step up from gravity cast and gravity cast aint shit.

markwon

OP - Really looking forward to seeing what set you decide on!

AlexG_6MT

iTrader: (1)

Sorry man, this is ignorance at its best. You talk up the importance of JWL/VIA certification, make a bunch of false claims and assumptions, then throw it out the window and return to your ignorance. Application is what matters.

Spend your money how you want but there are hundreds of millions of cars in the world today that are driving on cast wheels with very very few catastrophic failures. There is no need to spend three to four times as much on forged wheels to insure safety.

chaqui74

Hey ,

Have you looked into their other wheel line up "Vossen Wheels" ? What i can tell you from my experience with Vossen is that you will be pleased , I've been rocking Vossen for a while now and i have never had any issues. Don't be mislead when you hear people just bashing the brand, No matter what wheel you get if you are going to abuse it isn't going to last.



http://www.vossenwheels.com/Wheels/

ichi d

are the wheels you mentioned are played out. why not go with something different and be different.

potmilkz

very few? where have you been? there are MORE catastrophic failures on cast then in forged wheels. Failures on daily driving as well.. shit even when the car is sitting still the wheels separate from the barrel..

application my ass, your wheels should be good on and off a track.. your logic sickens me...

http://truth-about-vossen-blog.tumblr.com/page/2

see how much problems vossen alone has.. quality wheels.. lol i wouldnt even put them on if they gave them to me for free

all you do is talk, but you have no proof to back it up.. i on the other hand do not need to provide you proof.. its a fact forged is stronger than cast.. i do not need to prove to you that.. and cast does crack ALOT easier than forged. We can go around in circles on this topic but fact remains.. you get what you pay for..

Steven Bell

iTrader: (2)

Don't you guys know how to use the Multi-Quote button?


Plus, you have 5 minutes to edit any post.

AlexG_6MT

iTrader: (1)

Fair enough man. I provided proof that some aftermarket cast wheels are certified to meet the same requirements as OEM wheels. Can't tell you the last time I saw a JWL/VIA certified OEM wheel split, crack, fracture, and cause death and destruction like you claim.

Forged is stronger than cast is a true fact, but it is not true that ANY forged product is stronger than any given cast product. Lets at least try and be somewhat logical here...

You keep referencing Vossen - in my opinion they are not quality wheels, they are not certified to my knowledge, they are hideous, and I would never recommend someone to put then on their car. If you can provide proof that a quality JWL/VIA certified cast wheel has rampant failures during street driving than I may be inclined to see your side of things.

You sure do get what you pay for, but application is everything. By your logic when someone comes on this forum looking for purchasing advice on an 4G TL we should send them on a hunt for a Ferrari that cost three times the price of the TL. We don't do this because that's not what their looking for even though it is probably built at a higher quality level and provides significantly more performance.

telele

Potmilkz means well so it's a good thread but let's don't take things so harsh. I've owned 15+ sets of wheels mostly forged and some cast but decent brands. I would buy forged wheels any day of the week over cast but that does not mean I won't run a nice set of cast wheels. Build quality, durability and looks are a major plus with forged, price tag hell no though lol. Not everyone can spend or afford $3-4k+ at minimum for a new set of forged wheels and that's starting price so there has to be some type of compromise.

I've had wheels bend, crack, chip, etc you name it and it could happen to any type of wheel. Just buy what you like and if you can afford forged get forged if not get a nice set of wheels that works for you and be prepared to fix or replace in case of damage same could be said about forged but not as common and is stronger so less chance of a replacement needed. Another option is to look for a mint set of forged wheels,even though 5x120 pattern is a PITA but some BMW boards have sets from time to time for sale for fair price.

My Racing Hart M5's back in the day saved my life on the 95 doing 70mph when my complete tire came straight out off my wheel and it did not accrue any damage which amazed me because I had to brake on the wheel which was painful doing. Another benefit is forged wheels are much easier to repair. I'm also in the process of looking for wheels and considered Vossen and Avanate Garde and many others but I'm not jumping the gun just yet still looking around doing research so take your time.