KidK

Need some advice;

Last night we picked up a black on black 2012 TL SH-AWD Advance. Getting the car was a bit of a hassle as they claim few are in the state and the VIN number is less than 30, so a very early production car, and it took a week to trade for it an get it to my dealer.

Here are the issues that have me contemplating a return and I would like to know if I am being to picky;

- Once I got the car under the harsh florescent lighting of my garage. I noticed the hood had an area as big as my hand in the front right corner that was repainted. You can still see a "burn mark" on the absolute edge from a buffing wheel and the paint travel (how the metallic flake reflects light) is off, making that area seem lighter.

- Also, while it is a law here, I don't want a front license plate. When I agreed to the price a week ago, I asked that it not be installed. Since it was a dealer trade, the bracket was already on the car. Leaving the dealer, I was given some caps to put in the bumper when I removed it later. It turns out (cost cutting measure?) that on the '12, the design is to screw directly into the bumper. This doesn't allow for a removal without two crappy holes in the paint and plastic.

One last point about me; I keep my cars a long time, wash and wax them myself, and take pride in how good they look ten years later when I give them to a family member.

I know if the dealership repaints the hood it won't match the body. Filling the bumper and painting it has the same issue.

Should I be happy that we have this car (the rest of it is awesome) and leave it alone or should I return it and wait for another in a few months that will most likely have a different issue? I know the car won't be perfect forever, but shouldn't it start that way?

Comments appreciated.

Nexson

My car had a small scratch real tiny) on the hood upon receiving it. I demanded that it get refinished at the affiliated Lexus body shop down the street that i know does good work and not have the "lot lizards" fix it. The dealer supposedly made the appointment with Lexus. I then spied and found my car being worked on in the back of Acura under a tent (no way to paint parts). I then spied again at night to find my hood had been repainted and looked HORRIBLE. I let the dealer know that I knew what was going on and had it out with them. It had a million dust nibs in the hood. Maybe this prompted them to make it look good. Anyway they cut and buffed it so flat that it doesn't match the factory orange peel. Needless to say I left a "nice" answer survey when called about my sales experience.

I got cheated out to save the dealer a few bucks and now every time I see my hood, I am pissed off. No one will notice it but myself but that's the point. I will eventually get it refinished.

There are people at shops that do good quality work and the hood can be refinished correctly, again, but do you really want that? Dealers are all about hiding flaws, and doing it quick. While taking a walk by the used cars at my dealer I can tell from ten feet wether a bumper cover has been refinished or not.

See what you can do, act on it quick, you shouldn't have to live with this.

When I do the 2012 conversion, I will be filling those dimple holes for the license plate.

Oh yea, one last thing, after going back to the dealer a few months later, one of the salesmen that knew me says "still recovering from the survey you gave us." Real professional huh?

I said well the hood peel doesn't match, he goes, do you want to trade it in?

I said no thank you, have a nice day.

Treblig

I would have passed on the car just based on the front license plate holder issue, but that's me. And if the hood has been repainted, could there be other areas that may have been? It sounds like you will never really be happy with car as those issues will continue to bother you everytime you look at the car and every time you drive it.

If you decide to keep the car, I would atleast mention the issue to the dealer and would want to know why it had to be repainted in the first place.

If you choose to return it and wait, I would want to see the new car unloaded off the transport at the dealer.

Nexson

Yea most likely it got dinged in transit. Actually this is normal and brand new cars are getting redone quite often.

krislv

Same here. I already told the dealer if they drill the front for the plate, I walk.

vybzkartel

Me personally, I would take it back!

If you noticed the repainted section now(and it's bothering you), chances are good that when you're walking up to the car in the daytime(I'm assuming that it will be noticable in the daytime, in direct sunlight), you'll be looking for that repainted section, 'cause it will be in the back of your mind and it's gonna bother you.

On a new car(and for the price you pay for it), that shouldn't be happening!

When you buy something new, it suppose to look new. 'Cause you wanna feel good knowing that it is new and looks new, lol!

MrFungo

You live in California it's the law you have to have the front plate on the car. It's a fix-it ticket plus court fees and time wasted to show you fixed thr problem

nj2pa2nc

It is too bad you did not look at this car during daylight hours and also excepted it when you signed all those papers. I have noticed more how on many cars the paint on the bumpers is a slightly different shade than the rest of the car. I think that is due to the different material the bumpers (cover) are made of and not due to accidents. I do suggest you go back to the dealer and show them. Before you do the yelling route, find out what they will do for you. I wish you good luck and everything turns out for you.

crxb

If your not happy talk to the dealer. Then Acura Client Care next (acura client care is on twitter now 2)

nexson- are you saying the dealer could actually make it worse? - if so where do you go instead?

winstrolvtec

I have a CBP and it has what looks like the a lightly faded spot on my hood, that allows a bit more of the pearl to shine through, I assume it's from a buffing wheel as the area has that type of light swirl pattern and it's round. It's hardly noticeable in most conditions only under direct flouerscent lighting and even then I have a hard time finding it. It doesn't appear to have been repainted as I checked the edges, the clear coat pattern and overall color matches and even had a paint meter to it, compared to other TL's, so I am fine with it. Is that what you have?

I think the most important thing is that it hasn't been painted and it's not overly obvious. Eventually you will get a stratch, a ding, and dent, or two so. As for the plate if you are required to have one then it doesn't matter, no one will ever know the difference and you will forget about it.

Either way if it bothers you that much see if they will take it back and get another one as there is a grace period, if your past that then there is a big process you have to go through, the dealer will give you the run around you will need to talk to Acura corporate and even if they decide to get you a new one there is no garauntee that another one will be any better, it could be worse.

You should try to find out for sure if it was painted, if you can prove it has been they should get you a new car or you should be compensated. You bought a new car and it should not be devalued by a paint job.

Nexson

My acura dealer has a couple of guys in the back that fix the used cars before they go out. They also work on the new ones should they get dinged in transit.

They do it out in the open under a tent. By no means is it a body shop. They are refered to as lot lizards.

CarCzar

i would honestly make 100% sure it has been repainted before you go through the hastle of trying to return it. the dealerships in Cali are required by law to put front plate brackets on.

KidK

[QUOTE=winstrolvtec;12854042]I have a CBP and it has what looks like the a lightly faded spot on my hood, that allows a bit more of the pearl to shine through, I assume it's from a buffing wheel as the area has that type of light swirl pattern and it's round. It's hardly noticeable in most conditions only under direct flouerscent lighting and even then I have a hard time finding it. It doesn't appear to have been repainted as I checked the edges, the clear coat pattern and overall color matches and even had a paint meter to it, compared to other TL's, so I am fine with it. Is that what you have? [QUOTE=winstrolvtec;12854042]

Yes, same issue, but with a burn mark on the corner of the hood.

Thank you all for the advice; just drove the car again and it is better than I thought it would be - from a driving perspective. I will deal with the issue and now that I remember, my 650 BMW had the same blemish on the hood, just without the burned corner. I was able to live with that.

With regards to the front plate; while it is a law, the ticket is cheap and I don't mind paying it. Need to figure out if I can fill the holes without needing to paint the bumper.

Thanks again.

Nexson

Where do you plan to put the plate? I mean doesn't it have to go there regardless?

winstrolvtec

A burn mark is a different than a slightly hazy area from buffing, depending on the severity I might be really pissed by that, now if it's kind of on the very edge sort of in between the seam then maybe not so much.

And if they gave you plugs then there should be no issue with bumper holes. I assume at the worst, Acura might have done away with the brackets but still have preinstalled screw holes with options for plugs. Take it off and check.

There may be a chance to return the car and get away clean since delivery was only last night. There are some legal issues and the contract invloved but it might not be submitted yet and no one expects this when they buy a new car.

They can get you a new one and in the meantime can give you a loaner. If there is any doubt in your mind go back to the dealer by the end of today or you might regret it.

6SpdTerror

I work for a dealer and a lot of people dont know that most cars arrive filthy with plastic and glue and sometimes they do get scratched or dinged in transit. If its a big deal to u have them switch your bumber with another one of their black TLs that they have in stock.
I cant say youre being too picky because to each their own. Some people look at cars like a point A to B device and treat it as so, while others like myself........take our cars very seriously. If u have a good relationship with the dealer they should work with you.

Mr Marco

Easy fix. ^ You can easily have the entire hood redone, I have had to have the paint redone from even the best body shops. Not a big deal.Front plates are manditory here in Oregon. Our largest Honda dealer has stack of new plates and every new car must go out with front plates.
Again, this is also an easy fix. The dealer should be able to accomodate your request to fix the screw hole in the bumper.
OP, are you going to return a car that needs minor work?

Nexson

Can't switch body parts due to vin numbers unless the bumpers aren't vin-ed, I thought they were, at least on my accord.

deuce415

iTrader: (1)

This must be a new law in CA for dealers because I drove my 2010 shawd off the dealer lot without a front plate bracket back in September 2010. I guess it depends on how and where you drive in CA for you to get a fixit ticket. I can say that half the cars in orange county are luxury cars without front plates.

Sucks to hear that you need to drill holes in the bumper of the 12 for the bracket. I wouldn't accept delivery of the car if it had noticeable imperfections.

KidK

No plan to utilize a front plate. I'm willing to just pay the fine instead of messing up the look of the car. I have the front plate on my MDX, but haven't had one on the S2000 since September 1999 - no issues. Also didn't have on one the 650 - but the dealer made me sign a letter stating I knew it was against the law.

Thanks again for all of the advice. I love the car overall and can deal with the balance of the issues. Needed some time to cool down.

KidK

Yes, the burn mark is on the edge and blends into the seam, but it needs to be fixed.

The 2012 model doesn't have bumper holes that can be capped. The screws that hold the bracket on are self- tapping, right through the paint and plastic.

Nexson

That is the downside to the 2012, which are those bumper holes.

Don't let the burn mark ease over on you, go back to the dealer and at least see what they say.

VQPower37

i would say keep the car, but go back to the dealer and stay calm and level headed. speak with them to c what they can do for u. maybe they will resolve everything. if not keeping going up the chain of command til you get someone who will do something for you

Cap'n Preshoot

I agree, keep the car but go back to the dealer and insist that you be made whole on the deal. Are you sure you're not also suffering a little buyer's remorse? (Just asking).

Once the MSO (Manufacturer's Statement of Origin) has been surrendured and the car has been titled, it will forever thereafter be a "used" car for any subsequent buyer, hence you're probably going to take a financial hit by returning it, even with mitigating circumstances. The time to have returned it would have been immediately, i.e., within 24 hours and without putting any more miles on it.

If for some reason you can't return it, you're still entitled to be "made whole" - meaning a proper repair which you're unlikely to ever get from a dealership's body shop. I'd consider having them pull a hood off another car & give it to you because that's the only way you'll ever have the quality of a factory paint job. If they won't do that for you, personally I'd sue them in small claims court. The "expert witness" you'll want to have with you is something called a gloss meter. Absent a proper fix, I'd go in asking for $1,000 settlement.

boomvader

I would definitely contact Acura Client Care. Would you accept the car if they gave you a check for 3k or something of the like? This could possibly be arranged, in my experience. They would rather you be happy in the end. They may also be able to swap cars for you. Don't give up at the dealer level, if they give you the cold shoulder on this. You bought a new car and the expectation is as close to perfect as possible, in my eyes. Good luck with this.

KidK

Good question, but no buyer's remorse. As a matter of fact, after spending a day driving the car, I like it even more.

While I was frustrated with the purchase process (getting the car to the dealer), I really find it to be a great value.

vinnier6

iTrader: (1)

i would go back asap, and demand they take the car back and give you a different one...if you have had it less then 24 hrs, i would think its possible...

i would try and stay as cool as possible, and i also wouldnt bitch about the front license plate holes, but focus all of your attention to the hood...

helijoe

I have had to deal with something similar to yours. Im not allowed to say what brand or what dealer due to paperwork I signed. Lets just say certain customer service departments only want to help so much. I did get what I wanted in the end but it took a lot of legal threatening, and demanding to be happy in the end, I would request a repaint of the hood, and move on. Dont let it get to you, its not worth the hassle. Since the dealer is independent its the dealers choice on what to do. Ask them for a repaint, and maybe throw in some free service or any other free goodies to make things right.

Nexson

Let's see some pictures of the hood, I would be able to tell you what happened if they are good enough pictures.

KidK

Nexson,

Thanks for the offer. I took a few pictures, but in order to really see the issue, the reflection from the required lights is all that shows. I will attempt to describe the area with the attached photo. I took this shot with the hood about 12 inches above the closed position.

While I am not a painter, I understand enough about metallic paint, light travel and orange peel to know this wasn't part of the initial painting of this car.

The rectangle in the picture is the area that has light travel issues. Depending upon the angle, the area can look whiter and foggy. The oval is the actual edge that has a "lighter burn mark" on the corner of the hood. It looks like it has clear coat over it, but clearly the base coat doesn't look the same as the rest of the hood.

Hope this helps. Still really leaning towards seeing what the dealership will do, but not sure I want them to start messing with the Factory paint in 99.99% of the vehicle that looks fine.

Linmk2

Knowing you are not happy with the car, I would try to return it to the dealership. It's been my experience that if someone is unhappy with a car at delivery, than no matter what is done, they still have lingering issues. After all you are paying a great deal of money for your new car and you should be comfortable in your purchase. At the moment you are not.

acurator99

Just take it back and get your money back. Its not worth it.
You might have also noticed that:
1. There is no foot space for rear passengers.
2. The rear seat does not fold down for longer storage through the trunk. Even the $10 K cheaper Honda Accord has rear folding seats. Come on Acura ....

Nexson

Got a bigger pic, that is the size of an avatar lol
This has nothing to do with the thread. The owner seems fine with what you think outweigh the positives of this car

Mr Marco

You could try to sue, but dealers have lawyers on retainer just for situations like this.
Also\/

What the hell are you talking about.
There is more room in the back of the 4G than that 2G you drive.

The seats don't fold down
1. Because AWD takes up part of the trunk.
2. Body rigidity is improved by not having a trunk pass though into the rear seats.

acurator99

There is a difference between foot space and leg space. Regardless of what specs say I know that the 2G TL has more of both.

Rear seat not folding down has nothing to do with AWD taking up part of the trunk space.
Where did you hear about body rigidity improving?

Treblig

I believe once you took the Car you own the car. Best bet is to maybe negotiate something like repainting the entire hood and or a bumper replacement.

acurator99

The owner obviously is not fine and is upset so is considering returning the TL in less than 24 hours. What am I missing? I was just helping him make up his mind by mentioning some negatives.

winstrolvtec

It's not that he doesn't like the car, it's that the dealer messed his TL up a little bit. Those might not be negatives to him or everyone else.

Since the 3G when they did away with split fold. Which had the TLS outlapping way more powerful and faster RWD cars at Willow Springs race course as a result.

Same deal with the SH, you won't find a car as large, with split folding seats that handles better. At least not within $40k.

MD-DRIVER

You have no choice but to keep the car unless the dealer has a return policy.
In just about every state, there is no return on a new car once it's titled - some dealerships do give you the options, but most do not.

you will have to work with the dealer to get things fixed.

ferrcad

Is it just me, or is it just stupid that Acura now forces dealerships to drill holes in front bumper of the new 2012 TL for the licenses plate bracket? What happen to the plugs? $45,000 dollar car and you end up a drilled front bumper... There goes the out state purchases...