Glashub

I'm not here to bash Acura. I owned 3 Acura’s in a row. I'm an Acura fan. I'm here to give a bit of a high level amateur review/comparison of my experiences with the 2 cars because I like you guys. You’re feisty, smart and savvy.

I bought the TL in Portland, OR, where the roads are much better than here in LA for the most part. As much as I enjoyed the SH-AWD, the ride just was untenable here in LA where the roads have got to be among the worse in the world. I imagine the ancient Romans had better roads. My 2010 was the most fun I’ve had driving a car….when I was on goods roads. And I’ll go to my grave believing that the SH-AWD TL saved my life one really bad rainy day in Portland when a driver in the next lane did something profanely stupid.

But the ride and lack of sound proofing really became a cause for anxiety down here. I found myself going miles out of my way to avoid certain roads. I was constantly slowing down the gently go over ruts. I could hear and feel everything.

It was hard to trade in the TL (not to mention the 7k I lost over 11 months). I tried to get a 2012 but the dealers wouldn’t budge off of list for a Tech/Advance. So I bought a 2012 4.6 Genesis for $39,500 not including taxes, etc. $6,000 off of list.

The Genesis is rock solid. Really quiet. No rattles or squeaks. Every TL I’ve owned had
rattles. The 2005 was the worse and the only reason I didn’t lemon law it was because Santa Monica Acura did a great job of fixing everything albeit after many trips. The 2010 developed 2 significant rattle by 4k.

As stated the TL is just a great car to toss around. Can’t d that with the Genesis (even the R-spec)…too much body roll.

The TL air conditioner is the best I’ve ever experienced. I don’t know how they do it. Instant on from a cold start. The Genesis takes 2-3 minutes to get to cold air.

The back-up camera in the TL is far superior.

I love the buttons on the TL…simple direct communication…eyes on the road… whereas the Genesis has the DIS knob.

The ELS is crystal clear and rightfully honored as one of the best OEM systems. The Lexicon is more immersive.

The TAU engine is a jewel but lacks the breath taking dynamics, imo, of the 3.7. There is just something about Acura engines that is addictive to me.

The Genesis 8 speed is butter smooth and I never sense it’s hunting a gear. But again I don’t drive it like a TL.

I hate to say it but push came to shove I’d have to give Genesis the gold star for quality of materials and interior construction. It’s beautifully done.

Genesis lack shift paddles and the shifter is kind of like something from a Lexus.

Now here are the key competitive differences in favor of Genesis imo:
Adaptive cruise control – works as advertised but is unnerving in the way the car will accelerate to hard and brakes to hard when near of far from other cars.

Parking sensors – helps so much when one can’t really gauge the distance from the front end and a wall.

A steering wheel that goes up and down electronically. Silly thing I know but I got tired of adjusting the wheel manually every time I entered/exited the TL.

Lane departure, electronic brake, and the fact I can call by name any contact on my list (1100) while the TL only allows 10 voice tags.

The TPS is superior on the TL.

And finally for now…it is quite different going to a Hyundai dealership to do anything. Fortunately the car has been trouble free for 4 months now. Reliability is yet to be determined.

Gotta go to work. Best to you all.

Oswald Vater

Nice post and I'm sure will be helpful to those comparing TL and Genesis. Hyundai is certainly a comer and its quality has greatly improved. Hope you'll keep us updated with your continued ownership experience.

Glashub

Thanks Oswald. Please excuse the typos etc. It's been on mind foy months to share with you folks and tried to get that written hurriedly prior to leaving for work.

I don't know if TL owners even consider a Genesis but thought I'd share my thoughts just in case.

That said, there are times when I really miss the TL.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

Great write up. Congrats on the Genesis. Post up some pics. No need to leave AcuraZine as our Off Topic/ Car Talk sections discuss all car makes/models. Cheers.

Treblig

Thanks for sharing. I have considered a Genesis, but really want the option of AWD. Good luck with your new toy.

Pseudomaniac

iTrader: (1)

I keep wanting to like what Hyundai is doing. I sat in one of those, and found it to be very nice. Hope it works out for you. Before I bought the 07 TL-S for the wife, we bought her an '11 Sonata Turbo. Complete electric failure @ 330 miles. Steering always pulled left. Returned it after 11 days and made the dealer take it back. Needless to say, last Hyundai I'll own.

Glashub

Yes, well there are those on the Genesis forum who have had troubles with the electronics. Most haven't but those who have problems seem to have them big time. Others have commented that the car pulls to the right. Swapping out the tires seems to have resolved that.

BTW, the Acura seats and driving postion are far better. The Hyundai seats are for big butts.

potmilkz

wait.. you traded your acura for a hyundai?

rockstar143

iTrader: (6)

Love to see pics too...

nj2pa2nc

we had use of a fully loaded Genesis as a loaner car while our sonata was being serviced. Very impressed on the way it drove-very solid, rattle free car. Once I got used to the adative cruise control. loved it. When I replace my acura in 2013 just might be getting another Hyundai. despite their tarnished reputation I think they are excellent cars. We have had no problems with our "11" sonata especially the pull others complain about. Test drove a '12' turbo and hybrid sonata-no pull in either car but preferred the turbo-just needs 6MT

Glashub

Very, very solid car. One guilty little pleasure and I hang my head at this sad admission is that no one knows what it is. I have it rebadged so that all it says is "Genesis". I have seen passengers of passing cars hang out of their window as they passed to look at it. My wife has noticed guys in Beemers pulling up and dropping back to take it all in.

Several have asked if its a Bentley or an Aston Martin. Now here in LA Bentleys and Aston Martins are pretty common. It's humbling to be stopped at a red light next to a real Bentley. Kinda feel fraudulent. Immediately all of the rationalizations start such as..."Well, I got a lot of car for the money."

saturno_v

The Genesis is the best luxury sedan for the money at this moment.

I test drove both the 4.6 when it did come out and the new 5.0 which is pretty incredible, especially considering the price.


I drove them to see if I could consider them for my next purchase.

Personally I prefer a sportier ride and I want an AWD, but if you look for a very comfortable, plush ride look no further, the Genesis is a steal....superb fit and finish, fabolous creamy V8 (it beats the BMW V8 in that department, IMHO)

A bit bland on the style (inside and out) but for some people it's a plus.

Very solid choice, congrats.....

jjsC5

I looked very hard at the Genesis when I got my Lexus two years ago. Very impressive car. Thanks for the nice write-up on it.

SeismicGuy

When my wife and I were considering cars to replace her 2000 TL, at first I was really trying to push her towards the Genesis and it seemed to be great bang-for-the-buck. We had not really considered another TL since the styling had gotten a bit weird (at least for my wife). Luckily, I had the good sense to at least test drive the new TL on the same day were were looking at the Genesis and the Honda Crosstour (we eventually also looked at Lexus ES). The test drive was the primary experience that pushed us back (in a convincing way) to the TL. Our old TL was sort of Lexus-feeling and not very exciting but the new TL was very BMW-like (my wife's favorite past vehicle was a 1986 BMW 3-series). In addition to the more sporty driving experience (I realize some prefer cushy over sporty), the Genesis just didn't quite do it for us in the looks department either. Although we are no spring chickens, my wife described the Genesis as looking like an "old person's car". Finally, the pricing on the Genesis 3.8 that we were considering was not all that much better than what we were able to get on the 2012 TL Tech.

Still, Hyundai and Kia are really putting the heat on in terms of offering what appear to be quality products with decent-to-dramatic styling and excellent performance at quite attractive prices.

Flipster23

iTrader: (15)

In for the pics!

winstrolvtec

The Genesis really is an amazing package, full size sedan, V8, RWD, luxury that easily rivals entry level luxury vehicles maybe even some mid levels, doesn't leave much out in terms of checklist features and there is nothing that offers more for the money. Personally, I like a sportier demeanor and slightly smaller overall size but I would consider one if it offered an AWD and 6MT. Congrats and best of luck.

Glashub

Everything you say is valid. But however, the looks of the car were dramatically improved for 2012. The high roof line is probably the reason people saw the 2009-2011 as an old persons car. Wait what am I saying? I'm 60 friggin' years old. I am an old person. Now I might argue that 60 is the new 40 unless I'm talking to a 40 year old. All kidding aside, I had a SH-AWD. I drove the front wheel drive TL. Much more suitable for LA. But I didn't want to go front wheel drive again. Once one has owned an SH-AWD it's tough to go with a front wheel drive. The Genesis gives a taste of what the SH-AWD does while giving a geezer like me an idea of what it's like to own a V-8 again with a lot of luxury goodies for less money than I'd normally have to spend.

Glashub

Thanks! Always enjoyed your posts (especially when you and Saturno engaged with Techno Kitty) and am in awe that you and Saturno are able to write reams of cogent, coherent verbiage without typos.

Oh by the way, I'm using the same car cover on the Genesis. It really is about the same size. It just looks bigger.

Edward'TLS

The Genesis is a very nice sedan, especially the V8 trim which is of excellent value for the $. Just wish that it weren't an economy brand sedan.

saturno_v

You can for sure include some of the best Teutonic V8 midsize sedans in the "easily rivals" column.


In my opinion if the TL is a great value offer in the luxury sedan market, the Genesis is simply spectacular....

When I test drove the 5.0 it had absolutely everything for 46K (only option were sport tires and wheels for 1800).

The salesman proudly did show me some papers that were stating that a similar equipped 550i would require well north of 70K.
And he had a couple of 5 Series in the used car lot (I think two 530) just to dispel the myth that "no serious luxury car shopper would look at the Genesis".


Fit and finish is superb and the Thau V8 engine is creamy smooth.....it lacks the low end grunt of the BMW turbo but I think is smoother across the board.

The only options you could get on a 550 more than a Genesis are really trivial (head up display, night vision and stuff like that).

Granted, I still like the BMW better......more aggressive look and a sportier demenaour (the adjustable suspension setup is great)...but I found the ride in the Hyundai a more "puffy" and cushy...some people may prefer it.


Just different character (the Genesis tries to hit the spot between a 5 Series and an E Class) but not inferior by any stretch of imagination....

Would a Genesis attract a 550 shopper?? I doubt it, no brand recognition and the BMW turbo V8 is addicting but the potential 528-535, E 350 and Audi A6 shopper should do himself/herself a favor and at least check on the V8 Genesis....

Glashub

I don't know how to upload images but you can click on the links below to see the car -

http://www.dropbox.com/gallery/36556...nesis?h=680755

Glashub

Saturno, here are the reason's I didn't get the R-spec:

GDI - As far as I know GM is the only company to have mastered the carbon build up problem. I'm a first mover/beta tester on the 8 speed. Didn't want concerns on 2 fronts. Here is a cool thing about Honda. It will not mass produce a technology before its time. Reliablity is the name of the game and the best way to keep the rep is to use proven reliable tech. When Honda/Acura uses GDI I'll then have confidence that it will work long term.

385 hp is quite enough when you're stuck in LA traffic.

429 hp would be great if the suspension matched it. It doesn't. Too much body roll, no paddle shifters, and pretty numb steering.

The R-spec has a lot of promise but they didn't even upgrade the friggin seats or anything in the interior. If the body roll doesn't get you, your sliding butt will.

The 4.6 suspension is now in a comfort zone where as the R-spec is harsher and a has the negative atrributes of the 2009-2011.

Granted for $2k more you get the 429 hp, the 19" wheels, a leather steering wheel instead of wood inserts, a tighter suspension by 30%, and R-spec floor mats. That's a good deal. But the 4.6 is right where I wanted to be.

BEAR-AvHistory

People used to say a similar thing, (You traded a Cadillac. Lincoln, Chrysler for a Lexus?) not that far into distant the past & look who is trying to make a comeback now. Hyundai is growing its footprint & Acura is retracting theirs

Korea is the home of some really up and coming cars & a rear drive V8 is still the bad boy ticket to ride in luxury land.

To Glashub Congrats on the new car.

winstrolvtec

Ya, those were always a lot of fun and thanks for the compliment, there are many great members here and the whole section is relatively mature and the post are well thought out with lots of substance. It's seems most of us enjoy our time here, especially the deeper discussions but to your other point, I do make loads of typos.

I am constantly reviewing what I type and continuously editing my posts so it might not seem like it. I must have the most edited thread count on the board, just about everyone is edited (this one included).

As far as the exterior dimensions, you're correct. The two are nearly the same, it's the interior and wheelbase that are smaller when it comes to the TL plus it's also lighter on AWD vs a heavier RWD, so it makes for smaller driving feel and I am sure the suspension setup has a lot to do with it. That's what I was referring to as slightly smaller overall. I didn't know how to word it without getting into a specifics.

g37guy01

I've seen the Genesis, not for me no AWD. OP, congrats on the car. The "new" car smell never gets old.

Having said that, years ago the bar into Lexus was much lower than it is today. They are a premium manufacturer and they charge premium prices. Their vehicles represent all of the attention to detail that one would expect.

The Koreans aren't there yet, they might be gunning for Lexus, BMW and Audi, but there is a lot of catch up along with a change in marketing strategy, imo.

Edward'TLS

Agree. An economy brand can only be an economy brand at best.

If they wanna play with the big luxo boys, they must start up a separate brand and market it as a luxury brand. The Koreans have all the basis (V8, RWD) to be a serious luxury brand player.

saturno_v

The attention to detail from Hyundai is already there especially if you consider the incredible price...I agree on the brand and the Genesis style is a bit too bland for my taste...but remember this is their first iteration at real luxury land...I really want to see what they will come up with the second generation....

Glashub

I agree with you guys. It's halo car for an econo brand. There's talk of starting a seperate division now that they have a proof in concept. Sales were around 33,000 in 2011. But then the price goes up. Trust me when I tell you I cring whenever I go into a Hyundai dealership. The people are nice enough and some really know their stuff it's just sort of a degraded experience. Granted a 40k car is not exactly high-end but the Acura people (dealerships) in LA and Portland were all top notch.

My hope is that I'll never have to see a dealership except for mandatory servicing. So far, for 4 months, it's been good.

I will say this...the buying process was better at Hyundai. Did the deal and walked out. No trying to upsell me on this and that like at the Acura dealerships.

winstrolvtec

Glashub, I didn't think to ask before but did you find the 2012 TL to be significantly better with regards to the road noise and ride that it would have sufficed next to the Genesis?

I know you mentioned about possibly getting a 12 tech or advance. Would you have went FWD or another SH?

g37guy01

I disagree, they put great electronics in, but a wallowy suspension has to be corrected. The wallowy suspension is part of attention to detail. The suspension has been mentioned in multiple reviews so you know, it's not one reviewer.

cp3117

Congrats on the purchase Glashub and thanks for the honest comparo.

I have heard nothing but great things from owners of the new Genesis and it seems like you got a great deal. What other vehicles did you look at?? I have seen on some Hyundai forums that a few people where looking at the Taurus SHO and being you wanted to stay AWD/RWD I was curious if you considered it.

Linmk2

Congrats on your new car. While shopping for a new vehicle at the end of 2010, I did look at and drive a Genesis. I liked the way the car looked both inside and out. However, driving the car I was less impressed. The engine propelled the car like a rocket. A good thing! The problem, at least on the car I drove, was the rear end jiggled (the only way to describe it) over rough or uneven surfaces. While many have claimed the Acura TL to have elevated interior noise, I found the Genesis, again at least the one I drove, to have an inordinate amount of road noise penetrating the interior. Perhaps it was the tires, I don't know. I also found the car's handling to be somewhat ponderous. The Acura, on the other hand was a delight to drive over the same road. Powerful, perhaps not as much as the V8 Genesis, agile, just fun to drive. To be honest, I do think the Genesis is a much more handsome car all around, but you don't just look at a car, you drive it, and in that vein, the Acura TL won my heart.

SeismicGuy

From one old geezer to another (recently turned 62--ouch!). I have to agree about the streets in LA. It is really shameful that the streets (even the major ones like Wilshire and Ventura Boulevards) are so bad you feel like you are in a third world country. This state is going down the tubes faster than you can say Hyundai.

Steven Bell

iTrader: (2)

+1

I just check out the pictures too-classy looking ride!

saturno_v

The Genesis is intended to be a confortable cruiser not a sport sedan....the wallowy suspension is wanted....it does not chase only the 5 Series, it tries to be more "flexible".

Edward'TLS

A high-powered comfortable cruiser : that sounds very Cadillac.

saturno_v

...furthermore, the Genesis suspension are not exactly an afterthought or low tech...it has also a rather sophisticated Sachs ASD dampening system....

Glashub

lol Saturno, if everybody in the PNW was a feisty as you I might have stayed in the PNW. But then again Seattle is a very different city than Portland.

saturno_v

Cannot wait to leave Seattle for good.....but the get going is too good here for me and my wife....hopefully one day I will settle in San Diego, my favorite city in North America....

Glashub

Thanks everyone. I xan tell you that the Acura forum is much more interesting and fun than the Genesis forum.

Winston - When I was shopping back during the scarcity period, no dealer would engage in negotiations with me. Therefore I never drove the 2012. I had 2005 TL for 6 years and didn't want to go back to a FWD again. I did want to own a V-8 again.

cp3117 - I swore I'd never buy another American car again because of the atrocities Detroit foisted on loyal Americans in the 70's and 80's. Just my opinion and resentment. So I never considered a Ford.

Linmk2 - I drove a 2011 Genesis and hated the ride. Discovered that Hyundai ships their cars at 42 psi tire pressure and the dealers leave it as is. Plus the 2011 had low grade Dunlops. The 2012 has had the suspension tweaked and now has better OEM tires. I drove it and found it suited my needs in LA.

Again, though...the SH-AWD (the only 4 gen I'm familiar with) is a wonderful car and is superior to the Genesis in many ways. Just the way it handles and responds would be enough. but even the electronics, although sparse, are 1st class.

But having said that, the Genesis is a solid, well built car with gagetry galore. I don't think it's like a Caddy. Haven't driven one in years. The Genesis is interesting in that it's firm (people complain about it on the forums) but it is also a little floaty. The car has a top sway to it. When I switched lanes in the TL it was womp, womp...like on magnets. With the Genesis its womp, womp, amd then a little sea sickness from the subtle but noticable sway.

It took me a month before I felt comfortable with the Genesis. It often felt like it could get away from me.

This decision was driven by the conditioin of the roads in LA and how nervous I would get from the thudding and cracking I would feel and hear in the 2010. I wanted serenity more than cutting edge thrills. The Genesis does that. And the V-8 is fun. It leaves cars in the dust. I can only imagine what the 5.0 must do.

I only wish Acura would get it together and offer the SH-AWD with sound proofing and advanced electronics like the Genesis. I'll be looking hard at the 5G. I'm an Acura guy at heart. Had a 12 year old 1994 that was a great fun car when I was down and out. Had a 2005 for 6 years that never let me down. I like the idea of the underdog company that is the one of the better kept secrets on the streets (the TL). But after looking at what the Genesis offered for the same money, it was hard to justify a 2012....unless I lived somewhere where I could really enjoy the SH-AWD and all that the car is capable of.

Seismic - The roads here...I mean I don't think anybody here can really envision how bad they are. Sometimes I'm tempted to take pics for proof. Hell, even when the repair a pot hole they leave a 6 inch mound.