George Knighton

I'm not sure they care. At the time the car's ready, it'll have to make (internal corporate) sense to them.

They can't get beyond the idea of "logical" luxury and "logical" performance, and "logical" is an internal corporate evaluation that I don't think any of us will ever understand.

At another forum, we were fairly well connected to Honda and Acura, straight through Tom Elliott's time there, and we still never really understood what the hell "logical" meant. Considering how often "logical" was thrown around, it seemed to me that it ought to be quantified a little better.

Mind you...it's 2013 and I'm still driving Acura, and I'm already looking forward to the AWD RLX and 2015 TLX SH-AWD.

So it works for me, even if they cannot quantify it.

I am clearly a minority, however, and that's something they should think about. Only a minority of us "get it" when thinking about what "logical" luxury or "logical" performance really means to each of us individually.

JT4

^^ I agree but will take it a step further.

Everyone has their opinions to why they feel Acura isn’t looked at the same as Lexus. Well here are a few of my opinions as to why they have failed to appeal to the masses in the luxury segment.

As we all know American Honda introduced the Legend in 1986 as a luxury sedan from Acura. But I don’t recall Acura targeting MB or BMW back then as Lexus did in 1989. I could be wrong, and I’m sure someone will correct me if I am, but I don’t remember this.

When the LS400 came out in 1989 it had a V8 and Lexus made it very well known that their intended target was the $63K MB 420SEL and $55K BMW 735. Lexus claimed that for $38K (base $35K) you could get the performance, comfort and features of the MB or BMW but with proven reliability.

Lexus / Toyota knew from the start that they would lose money on every LS400 they sold but their plan was to eventually move the price up slowly after the LS made a name for itself and built the Lexus brand/imagine. Which it virtually did on its own.

In 1986 when Acura introduced the Legend it also introduced the $9,700 Integra, not a bad car but certainly not a car one would associate with luxury. Even today when you think Integra you think “tuner’ car" and not luxury. Acura sold approx 50K each of the Legend and Integra in 1987 so as more and more Integra’s showed up on the street people got used to seeing these little Acura’s as much as the flagship Legend. We have all heard, perception is reality.

On the other hand Lexus introduced the ES250 with the LS400, yes a dressed up Camry in many respects and say what you want but the ES definitely had a more luxurious imagine than the Integra. So when people saw a Lexus on the street it was either an LS400 or ES250, and since the LS outsold the ES in the early years people associated Lexus with the LS400 flagship. Think luxury.

Something else to remember, in 2004/2005 Lexus totally separated from Toyota with dedicated Lexus employees for design, engineering, training etc to further perfect their luxury division and distance themselves from Toyota

Again just my

BEAR-AvHistory

Way back when Toyota guessed right while Honda & Nissan guessed wrong in their marketing approach of their new divisions. Jury is out on Hyundai/Kia but I think not establishing a unique brand is not a good idea.

In public perception Lexus is clearly the pick of the litter among Asian cars & a legitimate alternative to the Euro brands. Honda took its big shot with their early public announcements about Acura moving to Tier 1 then had to back off with the announcements relating to the TLX & the Smart Luxury direction the company is taking.

Smart Luxury is a made up marketing term that sounds good to people who will buy the car but will not mean anything to Luxury car buyers. Its more of a oxymoron since Luxury is a nice to have expensive thing you really don’t need.

I would say the NSX will not do anything, luxury perception will revolve around how the RLX does. The Ford GT did not make Ford a Lux brand, the ZR-1 Corvette does not make Chevy a Lux brand, the Viper did not make Dodge a Lux brand or the GT-R make Nisan A Lux brand.

Ruby

I don't really post much but here is something to consider as well. Luxury features are not unique to only select car brands anymore. That hurts Acura. Acura markets "Smart Luxury." They used to be able to say that they offer features that only pricier luxury brands offer but for less money. But not most companies are offering "luxury" options for even less than an Acura. So now Acura is the monkey in the middle between economy and luxury. Why buy a $35,000 TSX when someone could buy say for example a Ford Fusion or Hyundai Sonata for thousands less with all the same features? Acura needs to differentiate between those other brands by making their cars higher quality while keeping the price low to succeed.

weather

You know, you should post more often! With articulate postings like this, Acurazine would be a great place to be

Devil Dog 21

I forgot all of those cars.

JT4

^^ Very good points..

Oswald Vater

A very good post. That is why the new TLX is so critical. Put in all the features but price it too high and buyers will defect. Price it right with all the features but mess up the exterior design and sales will continue to stagnate if not get worse. Please, Acura, give us at least a few tidbits of accurate info so we know what to expect - my lease is up in November!

TeamAcura

Personally, I think with the new NSX coming out it will help their image. To what degree I cannot specify. Building them in limited production will also boost their image and give it a level of exclusivity. It all boils down to marketing and hype up their products.

George Knighton

We might argue about whether a car like the Cadillac ATS V6 has the same features the TL has, while providing the same kind of Honda reliability the TL provides.

This is fully quantifiable. If you belong to Consumer Reports, have a look at the long term details related to the 4G Acura TL. It's unmatched by its competition. There is a Lexus that competes for reliability...but that Lexus does not have the same features for the money.

Because the Acura will last 200,000 miles and the Ford and Hyundai will not last that long without major difficulties.

The information is out there...it is already quantified and available to anyone who wants to research it.

I get the feeling that you might have missed part of Acura's mission statement, its very raison d'être.

Remember, it's logical performance as well as logical luxury.

Even the Lexus that is its primary competition does not provide the combination of common sense performance that the Acura provides. Even though its 2013, there's no vectoring all wheel drive on cars costing even 20 grand more than the Acura TL 6-6.

If you can't even imagine going through Oak Tree in your TL, or going through Turn 5 at Summit Point next to a Porsche, then maybe the BMW or the Audi is what you should be buying.

Most of us won't be going to the track in our TL 6-6's, and even this old guy has only done it a few times, preferring his ITR track car instead.

But it's nice to know that they *thought* about wanting vectoring AWD in order to increase performance.

I don't know what else to say.

You get it, or you don't.

Acura's problem seems to be that either most people do not get it, or they need a new marketing programme and a new dealership organization that won't put their ILX and TLX right next to VW Jetta on the same property.

g37guy01

If people bought according to the black dots on consumers magazine, the sales figures for car manufacturers would look different. Most modern cars will reach 200k without any major issues these days, some cars like Acura will be much more expensive to fix than ford, when, not if something breaks.

Consumers reports cannot predict the reliability of my car, and I'm not into gambling therefore historical reliability is meaningless to me in 2013.

Torque vectoring is a technology that in my opinion is very narrow, unlike hybrid technology. Average mph in a week is 22 on flat roads. Unless your commute consists of driving the ess turns at your local speedway, or claiming that hair pin turn in a 25 mph zone was taken at 90, torque vectoring is not very useful, at least to me. I would rather the money spent into faster 0 to 60, which is much more useful.

Logical luxury? No wonder I can't relate to Acuras commercials.

George Knighton

Well, I'm certainly sorry you view it in those terms, and it sort of brings the discussion to an end.

You don't have to be on a track to appreciate a big car that refuses to understeer, but I guess the efficacy of such a thing is a matter of opinon.

I guess it really is one of those, "You get it...or you don't" Subaru kinds of things. :-)

g37guy01

That's my point. Don't shoot the messenger, please. If there were something to get, I would have gotten it already. For example, a super performing hybrid at $45k is a technology I could get and wrap my arms around. And would be a bonus in my 20 miles, bumper to bumper 20 mph commute.

George Knighton

I think you're going to see a super performing hybrid in just a couple of months.

Unfortunately, it's likely to start at about 60,000 and climb to 80,000 with Advance, and it's even speculated that if they go for the 420 HP combination instead of the 360 HP combination (are you sitting down?) it could very well be the first Acura to sticker at 100,000.

g37guy01

The Q50 is also about to debut with a super performing hybrid along with a rumored IPL model with a GT-R (like) engine.

I just wonder why Acura has to qualify itself: "smart luxury", "logical luxury", "logical performance"...etc.

BEAR-AvHistory

These logical performance & smart luxury statements are just marketing terms that have no real meaning & can't be defined by anyone. Someone looks at a MB S series & the word luxury easily comes into your thoughts. Someone looks at a $100K Acura & WTF comes readily to mind.

An item is a luxury item or its not. It’s a performance car or its not. As soon as you have to qualify the terms performance & luxury they loose their true meaning. Hey come see my new Zipmobile 1000 its both a smart luxury & logical performance car.

Example a cubic zirconia has the look & brilliance of a diamond but its not a diamond. You can buy a 1 carrot cubic zirconia engagement ring for $150. A quality real diamond will run about $3K a carrot. CZ is smart faux luxury & a pure diamond is a real luxury item.

If you move to cars when Porsche advertises performance, its just plain performance with no marketing weasel words attached to it. Same with luxury, when a company like Rolls says luxury they do not qualify it with terms like smart luxury. They just say luxury & everybody knows what they mean when they look at the car.

This is not a case of anyone not getting IT or getting IT. Its just Acura's marketing people making up slick words to try to sell a product that never really caught on with the general population & certainly not with luxury or performance car buyers.

sleeper24

The 3g was designed by the Japanese. If Acura have had the Japanese design the 4g, I'm sure the sale market for the 4g would have been better. For the TLX, let the Japanese design the car. Simple as that. It's a fact Acura USA can't design the TL base on the 4g. Just IMO. Anyways, I'm hoping to see some concept of the TLX start this fall.

Edward'TLS

Absolutely agree.

Acura has lost it's way and it's brand direction during this last decade.

First the previous Honda president, Takeo Fukui, attempted to use Acura to go after the true luxury brands, by starting up development programs with V8/V10 engines, RWD chassis, and the replacement NSX. This was a good move to elevate the Acura brand to the true luxury level.

Then the global meltdown came, and Takanobu Ito became the new Honda president. He virtually cancelled everything started up by the outgoing Mr. Fukui, including the V8/V10, RWD, and NSX.

After seeing that without V8, RWD and NSX, the Acura brand has no hope of chasing after the true luxury brands; Mr. Ito started inventing jargons such as "Tier-2 Luxury", and in later years "Smart Luxury", just to create distractions and to cover up Honda's failure in bumping up the Acura brand to the true luxury level.

After all, BMW and MB are recognized true Luxury auto brands; but Acura still isn't, regardless of it being "Tier-2 Luxury" or "Smart Luxury".

Now Mr. Ito is bringing back the replacement NSX program. If Acura hasn't lost it's direction and goes around in circle these recent years, I don't know what does.

Remember the Acura motto : Advance.

But Acura Advance(s) no more, when the new RDX has dropped the Advanced SH-AWD and uses the Simple AWD instead. I sincerely hope that this is not the new trend the Acura brand is now pursuing.

jjsC5

The problem is the Acuras do not excel at anything. They don't have the best engine performance in their class, don't have the best economy in their class, don't have the best handing in their class, don't have the best luxury in their class etc.

Pointing to the SH-AWD is picking a very narrow niche feature that appeals to an incredibly small audience and it's not standard on any model. I have one (my wifes car) and while I like it, I was willing on buying the FWD model except that the SH had features not available on the FWD model.

I have owned several Acuras, so I'm not saying it's a bad car by any means, but I do think Acura lost their marketing focus a long time ago, and I agree with others that "smart performance" is marketing hype. In order to have smart performance, you have to have performance and it appears to me that Acura is seeing fit to make performance a low priority compared to other vehicles. Look how long it has taken them to introduce Direct Injection and a Six speed automatic (when even mid level cars have eight speeds and all upmarket cars have 7 and 8 speeds). And now that the $60,000 RLX has Direct Injection, they have dumbed it down to where it only has 5 more hp than the TL with SH-AWD.

Edward'TLS

^^^^^

Don't forget the fact that even the outgoing $45K base-model 2G RL has the "biggest and greatest" (according to some) torque-vectoring SH-AWD.

But the brand new $48K base-model RLX is now FWD only, without even the hybrid-AWD model backing it up for at least the next 6 months !?

Is this the Acura's version of "performance" or "Advance" ?

winstrolvtec

Perhaps and not that you are necessarily suggesting this but I don't think that is to be confused with Acura making products on equal footing that don't catch on. The cars are generally made to a lower price point and undercut the competition by design and that in itself may actually be a part of the problem.

People are free to do whatever they like but the cars Acura makes and where and what exactly they are designed to compete against are not real luxury or peformance cars either so why spend the extra $10k-$20k comparably equipped and still deficient in other areas?

That may be the part that some don't get, although they are free to disagree with that logic or thought process. For the most part, you get something nicer than mainstream products but your not trying to pretend or fool anyone. 75% of the status symbol, fraction of the cost, good buy, great reliability, resale that justifies the extra expense over a mainstream counterpart, safe, excellent crash testing efforts, etc. Makes too much sense and that's the problem, not enough emotional responses and not pretentious enough IMO.

The other issues I see are a limited lineup and a demographic specific product (FWD, SH-AWD). It's not necessarily the total lack of RWD or V8 either. It's not having the one of each in the right spot. A true compact competitor and popular variants are what usually carries the preceived Tier 1 brands anyway. Nothing that special in comparison but people think it is and that's what seems to count.

g37guy01

The bolded is of course what this discussion is about.

- luxury and value are individual and don't go together
- a perceived tier one brand is a tier one brand, period
- that people buy cars to be pretentious,yes some cars, but cars in the typical tier one range are a dime a dozen...can't be pretentious when a hundred of your neighbors has a more expensive car.
- comparing features on paper is a losing proposition...
* Bluetooth check
* LEDs no
"My honda is better than your 535"

Booya4139

Great point

IMO they are competing almost against each other. Luxury is about frivility. Stuff you don't really need that makes you feel good (and potentially makes you feel better than the avg joe schmo)

Value is about creating the greatest disparity in perception of what you receive to what you pay.

I suppose you could combine them in the psychology of being pretentious. That 'value' you receive in feeling all warm and fuzzy and thinking you are better than everyone else because you have an MB star hood ornament. But that isn't really value IMO.

But thats why I drive an acura.

winstrolvtec

I'm not 100% sure what you took from my post in entirety based on the response and not quite sure how to guage the response either but I'll bounce some thoughtd back and forth just for the sake of discussion.

Not sure if I or anyone suggested that luxury and value did go together but at the same time are they always mutually exclusive? Can't one find middle ground between the two?

Only in the extreme sense of the words and how they are applied to autos would they be polar opposites but we have a lot of choices between a top of the line Rolls (and such) and the least expensive car made.

So if all it takes is perception, then why the need for the "label"? Everyone would just take it as they see it and we wouldn't need to throw around vague terminology or brand it.

A perceived Tier 1 brand might also be considered a value, not very luxurious, and not particularly impressive as performance vehicles either. That's a matter of perspective. If Tier one cars are a dime a dozen, should they really be worthy of such a claim?

100 neighbors is better than 200, people want to distance themselves from mediocrity in which ever way they believe they are doing so. Tier 1 can not be materialized as it is an arbitrary belief or regard. Could you please explain to us what exactly Tier 1 actually means.

Back to what I noted above, I see a lot of so called Tier 1's that might easily be called Tier 2's and if they are Tier 1's, there most certainly should be a Tier 0, maybe a 3 and 4 IMO. If we are going to rank it, we should know how to quantify it.

Could you or anyone else please provide examples of what a Tier 1 car is and what range must they exist in to be worthy of the label?

Didn't suggest anything about features. Features is almost a pointless comparison to determine luxury nowadays. Still we should have something to validate it or otherwise we are just saying better is better and this is better or I'm better or we're better, and dont ask how or why.

Glashub

If Tesla can come to market with a gorgeous looking car; Honda could do the same for Acura. If Hyundai can come to market with a V-8 rear wheel drive; so could Acura. I can only think it's corporate stubbornness, hubris, sloth or disorganization from having too many fear based committees and too few take charge visionaries and leaders.

docboy

I think it's how the marketing gurus wants Acura to portray itself.

Is it a good idea? Who knows... probably not b/c the sales figure are not coinciding with "smart luxury" marketing, at least with its sedans. IMHO, though, at the $40-$70k price range I don't think the majority of people spending that kind of money necessarily equate value/low cost with luxury. Kind of contradicting...

At this price range people want something that jumps out; either it be it power, ultra soft/quiet, unique but good looking exterior design, brand image, etc... Acura unfortunately does not currently excel in any of aforementioned qualities, but rather a mixture of many. Something like "jack of all trades, master of none."

Is there a segment of the population who wants luxury with value, or "smart luxury" or "logical luxury?" I'm pretty sure this population exist; I'm one of them, or was one of them, in the past. That's one of the reasons why I bought the TL 6MT in the first place. But I would suspect this buyer segment is pretty small, and is not likely to dominate the automotive buyer's market.

IMHO, for Acura to truly succeed: Acura needs to separate itself from Honda completely AND focus on a marketing angle not related to anything value/bargain. SH-AWD would have have been a good to build off of (like how Audi markets its Quattro system). Ex: The 2G RDX, IMHO, should have continued to offer SH-AWD, which is a mistake IMHO to not have it b/c Acura chooses to gain 1-2 mpg (another "value factor") AND it doesn't continue to push SH-AWD in favor of Acura and build off this performance image and factor.

KeithL

I do not think it is stubbornness, I think it is the numbers. Hyundai decided the investment in RWD was worth it for them, but then they got hurt a bit by not having AWD which they will resolve with the 14 Genesis. I think Acura looks at the market and says for the hundreds of millions they need to invest on RWD how many sales will they get? FWD has not hurt the TL, it only seems to hurt them on the RL/RLX. So if they sell 8K RLXs this year (and at this rate that would be a miracle) how long woudl it take them to return the investment. Where they blew it is not having it be SH-AWD which could have muted the RWD discussion a bit.

And honestly if they had not screwed up the 4G TL initially they would be in a better place overall. They need to fix their designs first and fore most, not the platform. They need to design cars that bring people into the showroom, most people do not care whether it is FWD or RWD. Honda and Toyota are the last 2 hold outs on designs. Toyota fixed Lexus and with the new Corolla is trying to bring some more daring designs back. Honda will be the lone conservative styled cars. Hyundai proved with the Sonata that even the main stream wants a stylish car.

KeithL

I agree in general, but for the RDX I think is was cost as much as 1-2 MPG. They are selling 2G RDXs very well, because they hit a mainstream mark. They give a very good value in that segment when most people that buys RDXs do not care about SH-AWD, they care that up north the AWD will get them through snow. Especially with the more car like handling the RDX now has SH-AWD would be no value unless they tighten up the suspension. I am sure they had their eyes on the Lexus RX buyer and reading the RDX forum there are plenty of people that considers the Lexus first then went with the RDX because it was a far better value.

docboy

Totally agree. The 2G RDX is a better value than the RX, and is selling like hotcakes.

I'll bring up the Audi Q5 as an example. Also a hot seller. It offers Quattro, an Audi signature. Yet the Q5 is able to achieve city/hwy mpg 20/28. There's no "value" in the Q5; people still flock to it. Probably b/c of the Audi badge, and Audi is synonymous with Quattro.

Acura needs to lose the "value" part of its marketing and focus on "performance" or "luxury" or "SH-AWD"... or something else, anything but value. Ramp up its name. Brand itself well with the likes of Lexus, BMW, and Audi. Separate itself from Honda.

In the short term, value is great. But in the long run, "value" or "budget" or "cheapness" weakens the brand. As the economy improves, the luxury car buyer segment could care less about value.

The MDX is a good example of Acura's success. It's not cheap; comparably loaded, it costs almost as much as a RX350 or Q7. But yet it's a hot seller. Why? Not b/c of value. Because of its design, interior space/features, performance, SH-AWD, tech, etc... And its creating a name for itself.

IMHO, in order for the TLX to truly succeed, it needs to follow the MDX formula. Forget value. Bring on performance and design.

JM2010 SH-AWD

I don't disagree with much of what you've said, but have you noticed how "old-looking" the current Sonata has quickly become?

weather

Can you cut and paste this last statement and e-mail to Acura Headquarters please....That encompasses what truly needs to happen. Its plain and simple and well articulated! Surely they aren't too dumb to understand a one liner!!

PS...Please sign my name on the bottom of the e-mail too *lol*

weather

^^ I agree with you, Acura do make designs that age very well but at the same time, recently, they have fumbled a bit with their "off the gate" segment. The 4G took a MMC to have it a bit more accepted although I never was too much against the 4G when it came out....and the Civic needed a quick refresh. The RLX also needs a bit of nip and tuck and better shoes.

The 3G (TL) was a home run when it came out, and the 1G TSX was also really good looking (2G is OK with a body kit on, especially before MMC) but the ZDX was an atrocity. Acura doesn't haven't to do something too polarizing and it has the record to demonstrate it can design amazing cars and offer fun to drive if they want to....they just need to make sure they do with the TLX

Booya4139

FWD is a better overall platform for a daily driven commuter car. Its more efficient in delivering power/MPG, and its more capable than RWD in bad weather. If suffers from traction issues (which shouldn't matter to a commuter car that doesn't push performance limits)

Limits of performance it doens't handle as well, and its an inferior drag racer as noted. So what?

Booya4139

If the design was a head turner it would have sold much better. This is nothing more than design execution IMO... I think jumping ship to state of the art unproven performance systems isn't the right move. People buy acura's because of honda reliability. They lose that, they are seriously behind the 8ball because they already lack the brand cache.

Edward'TLS

This was exactly my point.

What is Tier-1 ? What is Tier-2 ? What is Tier-3 ?

Who is there or what benchmark is used to decide what is the cut-off to be considered a Tier-1, or be considered a Tier-2, or ..... Tier-3, or ..... ?

You're correct. There's nothing to quantify what determines Tier-1, Tier-2, Tier-3, .....

"Tier-1 luxury" and "Tier-2 luxury" were purely jargon invented by Honda to create distractions in order to cover up it's failure to elevate the Acura brand to become a recognized true luxury auto brand even after 20+ years in existence.

BMW and MB are recognized true luxury brands; but Acura is still NOT a recognized true luxury brand. So Honda tagged the Acura brand with "Tier-2 luxury" as a save-face move to sidetrack the fact that Acura still has NOT achieved the true luxury brand status (which presumably is associated with "Tier-1 luxury", invented by Honda) even to today.

The fact is plain and simple. Acura is NOT a recognized true luxury auto brand (like BMW, MB), and also NOT an economy brand (like Honda). Also, the Acura product pricing has gone up by some much over the years (especially the newest RLX) that it's products are no longer in the value buy category.

"Tier-1 luxury" and "Tier-2 luxury" are basically meaningless labels which is only used by Acura and no other auto maker, with the purpose to fool and confuse the consumers.

g37guy01

^^^ Who really gives a hoot about what a particular segment is called; do you think it makes the consumer "feel better" knowing he/she just bought a "tier-1" product?

I buy cars based on what I like most and dislike least. This includes subjective and quantifiable elements. If I like it, it's a good value..don't like it, not a good value. It's a very simple equation. JD Powers, Consumers Reports, Car and Driver, etc...do not enter into the equation.

At the end of the day, I bought a car/suv/xav or whatever. Who cares what "tier" it's in and how many of them are in my neighbors driveways.

Just throwing it out there...

JT4

I agree with you, if I like it I buy it, it’s my money and I don’t care what anyone thinks especially the car reviewers.

But in the big picture we the enthusiasts, car forum members, car mag readers etc. are the minority. IMO the masses looking at a “tier 1” car DO care how they look and what the “Jones” are driving. Not all but the majority would rather drive a bare bones MB E350 or 528i than a fully loaded TL even if the MB is $8K more and the Acura is more reliable.

When you get into the higher price segments the majority of the people care more about the “look at me” factor than the features or value that the car brings. Again, not all but the majority.

Edward'TLS mentioned in his post that Acura is not a recognized true luxury (MB,BMW) auto brand and since Acura’s pricing has gone up so much over the years (especially the newest RLX) its products are no longer in the value buy category. I think this sums it up.

This is why I think a $70K SH-SH-AWD RLX is going to be a tough sell, and why I feel the price point of the TLX is going to be a big deciding factor in its success. If Acura pushes a loaded TLX into the $50-$55K range IMO they are not only going to have a tough time selling it, but they’re going to further lose more of their TL loyalist’s.

KeithL

Not sure I would say old, true it is not as fresh, but it also is still a sharp looking car, I think where Hyundai went wrong was making the Azera look too similar to the Sonata. Cadillac's styling would be very edgy, but I think it is aging well, not in 5 or 10 more years it is hard to say.

KeithL

I agree that a $70K RLX is nuts. I do not think a $50K plus TLX is a problem. A loaded Q50 and IS will be over $50K. I think if they style it right, equip it right they can justify $50K plus for the TLX. I think the bigger problem is offering SKUs to start where the TSX is today and spanning close to $20K.

JT4

^^You may very well be correct, I guess only time will tell.

Another thing, unless the TLX is smaller than the 4G wouldn't a $50-$55K TLX cannibalize some FWD RLX sales and put Acura right back to where they were with 4G TL and 2G RL?

I really wish Acura would give us a few hints already!