RDX10

If you think marketing the TLX as a sports car is bad. You should see them marketing the RDX on the racetrack in their commercials. If you have no experience with the 1G RDX, go drive one. That thing drives AMAZINGLY well. But the 2G RDX is the biggest grandma-mobile I have ever driven. The driving dynamics are so poor they felt dangerous to me. So much wallowing and pitch and roll. It was like riding on a boat.

Acura thinks they can market their snooze-mobiles as race cars and don't stop to think this means people will benchmark their cars against other actually competent vehicles in their respective classes and get OWNED. So I still stand by my initial post, people will not cross shop a Stinger and a TLX (even though the Stinger does EVERYTHING the TLX does, except put you to sleep, better).

rockyboy

Latest update on the kia canada website for the stinger:

GT Limited is priced at $50,000 cdn

GT is priced at $45,000 cdn

That's $2000 less than they announced recently (they did say UNDER $52,000 and under $47,000 though).

That means a fully loaded Kia Cadenza (about $47000 cdn) costs more than the stinger gt...

2012wagon

$8,000 under msrp on a brand new mmc tlx?

fiatlux

Give it a few months, and it'll probably come down to that level (when I visited the dealerships last week, they already had MMC TLXs going for 3K under sticker). I bought my car back in 2016, so just one model year in.

iforyou

iTrader: (1)

Lol wussup with the big fonts man.

I'm not sure how the TLX is CDN$55k. on Acura Canada web site, I see $50990 as the price, plus $2.1k for PDI.

I read the Motor Trend article. It seems like a good grand touring sedan but not exactly a sports sedan?

Things that caught my attention in the article:

• Curb Weight of 4005lb. I guess that explains why this car is cheaper than its supposed competitors. That's substantially heavier than most. Again, it's probably because the Stinger uses steel extensively. Hyundai makes steel, and it's cheaper than some other materials. Drawback is weight.
• 0-60mph in 4.8s, 1/4 mile in 13.3@107mph are respectable numbers. While these fall short of the 340i, Q50 Red Sport, C43 AMG, or Audi S4, they are not bad at all.
• But here's a problem. According to the article, the engine has a fat torque curve but with noticeable turbo lag at low revs. I don't think the best boosted 6-cylinders have such issue.
• It seems like the tranny was okay but seems like it's not as good as the pre-production model.
• Skidpad of 0.85g. That sounds kinda low for a car with the latest Michelin Pilot Sport 4 tires. These aren't the 4S tires but still, these are rated as Max Performance Summer Tires. I would expect a little bit more grip, say 0.9g on these. The pedestrian TLX A-spec SH-AWD which isn't all that sporty managed 0.86g with some Micheline MXM4. And these are just grand touring all-season tires, far, far below max performance summer tires in terms of grip.
• At the limit, it understeers. What interesting is that even with the nannies turned off, they still intervene as you try to do more and more slides. IMO, that's kinda killing the fun.
• It has strong, fade-free brakes. Given that they are brembos, that shouldn't be a surprise.
• It has a luxury, comfortable ride.

So ya, going back to my first comment above - it seems like the Stinger is a capable grand touring sedan that is decently fast in a straight line with great ride comfort. But to me it's a bit disappointing that its dynamics aren't quite up there, given all the hype around it and that aggressive exterior styling.

For the money though, I think it's a good trade off? You save some money, but you do sacrifice a few things.

rockyboy

Looks like Acura has dropped the price. With freight the TLX SHAWD Aspec is $53200 cdn. Before it was listed at a little over $55000. If you compare the specs and capabilities of the stinger vs the TLX, the stinger offers more in many areas such as 365 horsepower twin turbo and 376 lb ft of torque, nappa leather seating, 15 speaker harmon kardon sound system for less than $50000. The Acura has one huge advantage though: it's an Acura. The Kia name still carries a negative stigma, especially for people who don't understand cars. For example, if you told some you drive a kia, she wouldn't be as impressed as if you told her you drove Acura or Lexus. This is a huge oversight on Kia's part. Like in South Korea they should have rebadged all stingers with the new "E" emblem. It looks and sounds better

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^bro, you dont even understand cars....saying that RDX is more advanced than more upscale luxury MB, Jag, BMW suv's.

and I quote "ladies, who are only 10's, look at my general direction when I get into the RDX"

2012wagon

good ole rocky boy finally comes out

we missed you and all your impressing the ladies posts with your fancy Acura

BEAR-AvHistory

In the article they said this car did not have the US spec suspension & Randy expected with it the car will do better.

Car & Driver said this:

"on the 19-inch wheels with their standard Michelin Pilot Sport 4 tires, tenacious grip. Blessed with a stiff structure, the Stinger likes to turn, and it rewards your decision to take it to a German megatrack with precise path control and neutral handling that pushes into understeer none too early."

Well, certainly for the rear-drive Stinger, which can be steered with the throttle through its mechanically locking limited-slip differential and will, we’re assured, make a fabulous drift car once the electronic stability control is switched off.

Think you will also get different numbers with the rear wheel biased AWD & RWD with the Stinger.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

I really don't know what to think. The Stinger on paper is fantastic. Styling obviously is subjective (not really a fan). I'd like to see and drive one in person before passing final judgment. Was just looking at the sales figures for the G80 sedan and they seem abysmal but not as bad as the RLX. I really thought the G80's sales figures would be higher- from what I recall they sold about 6k units in 2017-but are those figures indicative of how the Stinger will do? The good news is it's a buyers market right now and the competition is fierce. Acura really needs to heed the competition and get really competitive.

rockyboy

In my city, Acura's are highly regarded luxury vehicles on par with Lexus, Mercedes, Audi, etc. and in my own experience, driving an Acura doesn't hurt with the ladies...

rockyboy

When the current RDX came out in 2016, the fully loaded Elite model had technology that was equal to or better than many competitors, and in some cases that's still true. After cross-shopping the various brands, I decided on the RDX because of it's overall capabilities, features, and value.

In terms of ladies who are 10's that are impressed by Acura... I used to THINK that back then, that ladies are impressed by guys who drive luxury vehicles and find it hard to resist the attraction. Back then I used to think that because I was less experienced. Now that I've gained more experience, wisdom, and insights, now I KNOW for a fact that this is true. Hence my dilemma with the Kia Stinger (a really great vehicle with a Kia badge).

2012wagon

post your pics with all your "ladies" in your luxury Acura

rockyboy

I'm also wondering how the Kia Stinger will do. It's unfortunate that Kia didn't realize that most people want the "E" emblem (stands for Engineering Excellence) that they use on the stinger in South Korea. The emblem looks better than the Kia one but also separates it from the main brand (and stigmas associated with Kia). Kia has gone a long way, but the average person won't understand how great the kia stinger really is. For example, if you drive a Kia Stinger, people will think the current Lexus ES350 is a better vehicle just because it's a Lexus. The reality is, the Kia Stinger is way better. But we'll see once they come out with the new 2019 ES350 that they're working on now. The Acura TLX still competes well though. For example, the SH AWD system is better than Kia's (which uses braking to reduce power to a particular wheel). But then again, the Acura's SH AWD is probably the best in the business.

BEAR-AvHistory

Interesting, here in the center of the universe, during luxury car conversations Acura never comes up. Most of the chatter is about Audi doing so much better here. The TL's were popular second & third cars but that has dried up over the past ten years.

Most of the luxury non-sport car buzz belongs to Audi. Seeing a lot more larger ones on the road now & some are getting run pretty hard. Think MB & BMW are going to have to step-up their game with the next generation cars.

2012wagon

That is because you live mentally and physically on Earth.

Rocky boy physically lives on earth, and mentally lives in RockyPlanet.

BEAR-AvHistory

They sold 6166 units in 5 months in 2016. 2017 year to date is 10489 sold through August. The trend is toward 15,000 cars for the year. RLX sold 1478 car in 2016. 2017 year to date for the RLX is 729 through August. Trend is 1092 cars.

So I would agree, when the G-80 sells as many cars in I month as the RLX does in one year they are not as bad as the RLX in selling cars. In fact I would suggest the G-80 sales numbers are an RLX product managers wet dream.

2012wagon

No RLX owner on this forum would ever admit this. They will start touting how G80 is an off brand. It doesn't compete with Acuras heritage and is never cross shopped blah blah.

I owned a 89 Legend sedan and a 95 Legend GS Sedan, that is when they were the true standard. After 95, I switched to the LS, and have always had one of those in the garage, latest being the LS600h the wife drives. Acura had been left behind with underpowered V6 and FWD. We all got tired of screaming about it. RL's were relegated to the "5 series competitor" and never could run with the big boys LS/7Series/S Class. Though no self respecting 5 series owner even heard of a RL/RLX.

Of course the RLX-Hybrid guys will chime in how they are faster than McLaren P1 and their cars are gods gift to earth (they are older version of Rockyboy). Acura has marched to the beat of their own drums, and no amount of screaming by ex owners will change that. Market has spoken, as you said, and the results are clear as day.

dmski

Everyone keeps bragging about Audi lately here but take a look at A4 sales numbers. Nothing to brag about really. They are just slightly above TLX year to date and A4 is all new model just released recently where TLX is toward its end of life cycle. So TLX is a disaster and Audi a huge success. LMAO

pyrodan007

TLX is in the middle of it's life, hence MMC... long way to go before it's 'reborn' (aka properly refreshed). Also the A4 costs more, so the TLX should be flying off the shelves if it's that great honestly.

dmski

I knew the cost would ve brought up. A4 is directly competing with 3 series and the C class. Well, its really lagging behind those two. Last month BMW and Mercedes sold twice as much. I don't know how you can call that a success.

​​​

pyrodan007

I don't understand this forum sometimes. You mention the A4 vs TLX, and it's a win for the TLX due to price. You mention that the A4 sales more, then all of a sudden the A4 sucks compared to the Germans. As far as I know as a consumer, Acura directly targets the Germans in its ads using youth and sportiness. So if the A4 is behind the competition, then the TLX is very behind, against itself too using pre-MMC sale stats.

2012wagon

it's an alternate universe here ....

TacoBello

I don't know what it is, but I am seeing more and more and more new audis... everywhere. I know sales numbers don't lie. But shit, unless everyone here loves Audi, I dunno what is going on. I've yet to see the new TLX, anywhere around town. Canada is known for selling shit tons of Acuras- that's why we get better equipped cars. Yet I still haven't seen a new TLX... and it's been months since it's release.

Haters can hate all they want. In my mind, Audi is now what Acura was, when the 3G was on the market. The sporty luxury brand that offered lots, has awesome sport models, and are reliable. Audi might not be hitting those sales numbers (they are positioned to be more expensive, hence lower sales are understandable) that Acura once did, but they seem to be the brand that lots of people want now. Audi's biggest issue was their horrendous reliability, in the past. They've started addressing that, and people are catching on.

BEAR-AvHistory

In 2016 Acura sold about 160 more TLX cars than Audi sold A4's. Win for the TLX.

Trend is Audi A4 will outsell the TLX in 2017 win for the A4.

That said Audi has a lot of overlap with their models. The A5 (now up to 2600 a month from 303 at the start of the year) has pricing overlap with the A4, giving the Audi buyer more choice.

Its a lot like the pricing structure of the BMW 3 & 4 series.

What people are talking about is as a brand in the USA they have put in 6 years of steady growth (100%) while not selling inexpensive cars. This trend looks to continue this year.

Meanwhile Acura as a brand sold 40,000 fewer cars in 2016 then Audi. The trend is the Acura will fall further behind this year.

So as far as bragging rites in sales Audi is kicking Acura butt big time.

kurtatx

That doesn't change the fact that the A4 is a better car than either and the TLX is a worse car than all three. So bad, in fact, that people are legitimately asking if a Kia Stinger is a better car. I'm not sure it is and I genuinely enjoyed the TLX I drove. That being said, you're smarter than this. There are a ton of factors that go into car sales and brand cache is one of them.

2012wagon

but but but ...

acura has brand cache !

It is TRUE luxury

ladies flock to acura owners

Rocky cucky boy said so !!!

kurtatx

It has more than Kia, which is why I don't honestly believe Kia is a threat to Acura, but it doesn't come close to Audi, which is behind BMW and Mercedes.

Invoking sales is stupid. The only things worth comparing among cars are reviews. And none of this matters if you like your car anyway.

2012wagon

...

kurtatx

His city is made out of legos and so are the women

RDX10

I didn't realize Toronto was some sort of micro-chasm with it's own reality. Where I live (in the real world) Acuras are held to the same regard as buicks and lincolns, which is to say complete shit. When I had X5's or even my Touaregs, I constantly got comments or questions from friends and family. With my RDX and MDX not a single person batted an eye. It was like I was driving a Toyota, hell my Sorento got WAY more comments and compliments from friends and family. My Acuras got nothing. So rather than generalize about your area, be more specific and talk about what is in your own head. There is not a chance in hell ANYONE with a brain is putting Acuras and Mercedes on the same level. Ever.

RDX10

This is the best comment I have read on here in well over a month.

MSZ

This is a true threat to the TLX:

2019 Genesis G70 Prototype Drive | Review | Car and Driver

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

bro, acura has been in decline for 10 years or longer.
you are just now, woke?

kinda like when those "10's" take off their makeup and you regain soberneess, you'll be awaken to a 2.

ggesq

iTrader: (1)

I like the way the G70 looks a lot more than I do the Stinger.

Rocky and everyone else- let's stay on topic and not turn this into another I bang 10's in my Acura all day long thread and the lolz that follow from that.

TacoBello

Did anyone look at the photos of the G70 (Besides ggesq)?

I'm not a fan of the C pillar area- but other than that, wow, that is a good looking car. Inside AND outside. I actually went back, to look through the photos again.

Hyundai and Kia don't have much brand cache compared to everyone else, but, consider where they're coming from. Hyundai soiled it's reputation completely when it first came to North America. It had to rebuild from that. And they did, by offering lots, having nice styles (finally.. it took awhile), being reliable and being cheaper than everyone else. But now they are focusing on the brand cache of the business. They seem to have mapped out their course, right since they came back to North America. Did it take a long time? Not really. I remember in around 2001, people laughing at POS Hyundais. 16 years later, it's a different story. And now they are putting out favourable cars that will ultimately build their brand cache, so long as the cars continue to be good... and get better, gen after gen.

TacoBello

This.

Now tell me... what has Acura done?

pyrodan007

Nothing, and that's why I'm 100% moving away from them. Good for Genesis, getting the right attention. Too bad the G70 comes out after my lease is done.
Acura does the shittiest press releases, kinda sad when you compare it to the hyper-kinetic TLX commercials. They scream look at me, but have nothing really to show.

kurtatx

Class leading ground clearance

CheeseyPoofs McNut

The G70 would be on my list of cars - were I in the market. I know someone who leased a Genesis (before they became their own brand) and raved about it the whole time.