neil0311

I've always believed that starting an engine was when much of the wear on an engine and ignition system happens. My TLX with AWD has the auto idle stop feature, and while it can be disabled, it does help save on fuel consumption, and it is on by default.

Has anything been published that discusses the anticipated impact to engine and ignition system life span? I would assume that when you go from one start per trip to many, that has to have an impact.

Anyone have any thoughts?

dezymond

My thoughts are that if it does have a significant impact on the engine over time then it wouldn't be a built in feature from the factory.

Engine technology has changed and come quite a long way. I worried about changing oil within the first 1500mi with my tlx but that's no longer the case.

I admit I'm still a very young driver, only licensed for 9yrs, but I've adopted some of those old school thoughts of our cars. Alot of it doesn't apply with newer cars with how far technology has come.

neil0311

No doubt that technology has progressed since I started driving in the early 1980s. I guess my question for the TLX is speculative, given the vehicle only has a 1 year track record. Having said that, I'm sure other similar features on other vehicles have been around longer and may have some history.

Just because a feature is factory doesn't mean it's reliable long term or that it doesn't have an impact on long term reliability. Acura is only concerned with failure during the warranty period.

KeithL

Audi has been doing this for a few years. There was an article somewhere on how to endure the extra forces and wear the crank bearing and cylinder linings are engineered with stronger materials to hold up. Also the worst start is the cold start as mist lubricant has fallen back into pan. With start/stop the parts are still well lubed and the oil is thinned from warming up si lubricant gets to parts immediately. That in mind I still gate it and disable it, and assume all that extra engineering will help the engine last that much longer.

pmartone

I recall reading somewhere on models equipped with idle-stop employ both a heavy duty battery and a heavy duty starter.

LaCostaRacer

If you think about it, Hybrids have been using this technology for over 10 years now. My guess is the added starts might cause some super long term issue, but its so long-term that most people would not experience it- something else will cause the car to get junked. I imagine the starter and battery will be a little more costly to replace if and when they need replacement.

I would be more concerned about some of the electronic components instead of the start/stop feature.

TSXV6Guy

I read somewhere that there's a counter in the car that counts the number of times the starter was engaged.. At some point, the car declares the starter "no good", cancels the auto idle stop and displays "replace starter".

This will ensure that the starter is still good to start the car normally - so you won't get stuck.

Hoosier_TLX

I don't know a great deal about the longevity of the engine and electronics associated with the extra start/stop cycles, but I know the starter was tested to be able to start twice the "normal" amount. My brother works for Honda R&D and he was part of the team that tested the starter. He states that the starter was tested to endure a longer life of starts so it should be more than capable of performing the task. I can't remember exactly, but I think he said that Honda considered 100,000 starts normal and this starter had to be capable of starting 200,000 times. Not 100% sure about the numbers, but it should last.

neil0311

Interesting. Thanks for the reply.

The way I figure math, most people start their car an average of around 5 times per day. So say that's 2000 times per year to round up. If you think about the life of a vehicle as at least 10 years, that's 20,000 starts for a vehicle without the idle off capability.

So if you assume at least 10 idle off starts per trip, that would be roughly 200,000 starts overall given the other assumptions. I'm fine replacing the starter once during the life of the vehicle if that's what it equates to, but not sure the fuel savings offsets that cost. Would need to see stats on how much fuel is saved over the life of the vehicle, and of course fuel prices factor as well.

carz0159

I get what you're saying, but if those numbers are true, then doesn't that mean that you can only have 1 start/stop per normal trip to have the starter have the same life as it previously did?

carz0159

My dad had a 2004 TL and the starter went in 2012 with somewhere around 120k miles. This was used as a DD to NYC every day, so a lot of sitting in traffic. I have to guess that there would be at least an extra 20 starts a day if it had start/stop technology, but probably closer to 40. I'm sure that if you drive a short commute in light traffic, it's useful, but when the car will turnoff every few minutes while stuck in rush hour bumper to bumper, it will take a toll on the battery, alternator and starter.

neil0311

Yeah, I've decided that the negligible benefit to fuel economy probably isn't worth the impact or inconvenience. I live in the Atlanta area and my drives typically involve lots of lights and stop and go. Having the engine stop at lights might be nice for the savings, but I counted and yesterday the AIS kicked in 26 times on my ride. That's just too many stop/start cycles. I don't care how well they engineer it.

Of course this is in 50-60 degree December weather. Can't wait to experience what happens when it's 95 degrees and the A/C has to keep cutting on and off, both from a comfort and wear factor.

Too bad there is no permanent setting to disable.

E92Vancouver

Hybrid Prius starters last forever. Acura starter will be fine.

E92Vancouver

Yes, a heavy duty AGM battery.

csmeance

FYI, all a starter is, is an electric motor that turns the engine. Build it to the right specs and it'll last a long time, look at tesla's electric motors!

accord1999

Those motors might not be the best example:

Two-Thirds of Earliest Tesla Drivetrains To Need Replacement In 60,000 Miles, Owner Data Suggests (Page 3)

heisnuts

I wonder if these cost the same as a regular battery, and what happens when an owner doesn't realize that it is an AGM battery and replaces it with a regular TL battery.

youngTL

They don't. An AGM battery is more expensive, but it also lasts longer (both in life and in charge). I use AGM gel cells all the time for work in the Canadian arctic and they are amazing. We have ones that are 8 years old that still hold a nearly full charge. Hopefully the Acura branded ones are that good.

blaster

Toyota Hybrids don't use conventional starters. The stop/start system in the TLX and other numerous vehicles use a conventional starter that when energized springs out with great force and engages the ring gear. Essentially 2 gears smashing into each other. Both will wear out. The starter is easy to replace. The ring gear is not. It's a half *ssed effort to save fuel costs up front at the expense of parts and labour down the road after warranty. Doesn't really effect the motor negatively nearly as much as cylinder deactivation.