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Any doubts on 2nd gen TLX for 2020?

 
Old 02-03-2019, 11:58 PM
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Acura is teasing something for Tuesday.

From the Acura Instagram account...

A new era coming. 2.5.19

Something race car inspired so could be Type S related.
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Old 02-04-2019, 01:47 AM
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Originally Posted by MrJames View Post
Acura is teasing something for Tuesday.

From the Acura Instagram account...



https://www.instagram.com/p/Btbeotpgvyd/

Something race car inspired so could be Type S related.
Hmm, maybe we'll see the TLX prototype earlier than expected? At the Chicago Auto Show?
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Old 02-04-2019, 03:53 AM
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I don't know... But I sure as hell want to find out now!
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Old 02-04-2019, 08:39 AM
  #164  
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Looks like an NSX Type-S
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Old 02-04-2019, 08:42 AM
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That's the commercial I was looking for last night during the superbowl, but I guess they saved their pennies and spent them on Instagram. That race car made a S type pattern on that one building
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Old 02-04-2019, 05:02 PM
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The new TLX spied pics will be out soon....just wait and see!

It's a matter of few week
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Old 02-04-2019, 08:17 PM
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Originally Posted by someguy11 View Post
You know, I didnít look up IS sales before adding Lexus to my point. My perception was that the IS was beating up the TLX. It actually appears they were neck and neck until the last year when the IS dropped off. With all my TLX issues, I certainly wish I had an IS in my garage instead, but I digress.

My point was that the Euros have the segment covered and Acura is outclassed and outmatched - and Iím just talking Euro base models here. Euros have a market that Acura and Lexus donít even touch - S4, AMG, M3 and M5. Euros are dropping V8s and biturbos into sedans while Acura tops out at an NA V6. At least Lexus has a V8 In the LS. The reason people buy Euros are for the premium experience and performance. The reason people buy Acura is for a fully loaded Honda that is more reliable than the Euros with almost as much prestige. I think pricing reflects their markets. Acura tops out at whatever $45k for TLX and $60 for RLX while Euros or LS go all the way up to over $100k.
Agree with this, Acura is not competing in that class with the Euro cars but then again cost wise and resale wise Acura has the edge. Have test driven several Lexus models. IMO not anything special.

Originally Posted by ESHBG View Post
I am with you on this, I still love driving my '09 TSX and I push the handling often. If the new TLX can be a better version of this I would be super happy (I have yet to drive any TLX so can't compare the current version at the moment).
Having had that gen TSX the current TLX V6 A-Spec with Sh-Awd out handles the TSX by far. Way better handling than my 07 Type S as well.. I wouldn't say the TLX Paws V6 handled better than my 07 S or the TSX. I will say the trans was better by far in both but handling wise there is no comparison.
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Old 02-05-2019, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by ZipSpeed View Post
Hmm, maybe we'll see the TLX prototype earlier than expected? At the Chicago Auto Show?
It's for the upcoming IMSA season, it has nothing to do with the TLX.
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Old 02-05-2019, 10:30 AM
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"The reason people buy Euros are for the premium experience and performance".

IMHO, the AVERAGE North American buyer of a BMW wouldn't know the difference between the handling of a 3 series and a TLX if it whacked them in the face. They buy it on reputation, prestige, and that famous insignia. BMW, many other car manufacturers, and many reviewers are very good at convincing us that we need a performance vehicle, when very few of us are performance drivers, and too many are poor drivers who don't use turn signals, tailgate, and generally drive like AHs.
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Old 02-05-2019, 10:58 AM
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Acura IG post

I saw Acuraís Instagram post, I donít think it looks like a car release or model introduction. Looks more like an event (in California) that they are promoting or sponsoring.
Just my two cents.
There is no reference to an Acura Model anywhere in the commercial. They usually make
at least one hidden reference to the model they are presenting.
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Old 02-05-2019, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by mapleloaf View Post
"The reason people buy Euros are for the premium experience and performance".

IMHO, the AVERAGE North American buyer of a BMW wouldn't know the difference between the handling of a 3 series and a TLX if it whacked them in the face. They buy it on reputation, prestige, and that famous insignia. BMW, many other car manufacturers, and many reviewers are very good at convincing us that we need a performance vehicle, when very few of us are performance drivers, and too many are poor drivers who don't use turn signals, tailgate, and generally drive like AHs.
I think I am an average NA buyer and not an enthusiast (ok maybe a little bit), but I can tell the difference between a RWD and FWD by driving them back to back. I can also tell the difference in quality, materials, how things put together.

But I agree with your last sentence that we don't need performance vehicles. My prime example is Lexus. I grew up with Lexus being a soft, quiet, comfortable, and reliable ride. We had ES300, ES330, RX300, LS430 in the family. Look at Lexus now. The recent RX rides very sporty with noticeable exhaust noise regardless of trim. The RX300 was the most comfortable moving sofa you'd every buy. Now, all Lexus models have the FSport package available with big rims and summer performance tires
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Old 02-05-2019, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by mapleloaf View Post
"The reason people buy Euros are for the premium experience and performance".

IMHO, the AVERAGE North American buyer of a BMW wouldn't know the difference between the handling of a 3 series and a TLX if it whacked them in the face. They buy it on reputation, prestige, and that famous insignia. BMW, many other car manufacturers, and many reviewers are very good at convincing us that we need a performance vehicle, when very few of us are performance drivers, and too many are poor drivers who don't use turn signals, tailgate, and generally drive like AHs.
this is true, def got some chuckles out of it. The ppl on this forum are most likely more oriented towards performance/enthusiast than the average buyer. I mean we are discussing wish list items for the "upcoming" model. Hopefully we as enthusiasts will get "most" or at least some of the items that make it more performance oriented than what has been put out on current TLX models.
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Old 02-05-2019, 07:16 PM
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Originally Posted by mapleloaf View Post
"The reason people buy Euros are for the premium experience and performance".

IMHO, the AVERAGE North American buyer of a BMW wouldn't know the difference between the handling of a 3 series and a TLX if it whacked them in the face. They buy it on reputation, prestige, and that famous insignia. BMW, many other car manufacturers, and many reviewers are very good at convincing us that we need a performance vehicle, when very few of us are performance drivers, and too many are poor drivers who don't use turn signals, tailgate, and generally drive like AHs.
I didn't say high performance. I said performance. Performance doesn't mean take it to a road racing track or a drag strip. It doesn't mean street race that kid with a riced out Civic. I mean, you could if you want, and probably win, especially with an M3 or M5. Performance is execution or process of carrying out or accomplishing an action, task, or function. I feel like I'm repeating myself, but I'll say it anyway: Audi, BMW and Mercedes have mastered the automobile. Up to around the time the warranty expires, they are pleasures to own and drive. They are well-rounded vehicles. The seats are comfortable. They feel solid when you drive them, yet nimble on their feet. The suspension is firm while absorbing the worst a road has to offer. The cockpit and dash are designed around the driver. Craftsmanship and materials are top notch. The are gorgeous cars inside and out. I drove an A4 and rode a BMW motorrad for a combined twelve years. Loved them both until an airbag sensor on my Audi fried. I took it in and had them look into a knocking from the front end while at it. The sensor alone was $1,000. The knocking was from tie rods. Another $2,000. While I was kicking those costs around, I relied on my motorcycle as a backup, riding rain or shine. Not so fun. In the same week, the clutch on my BMW failed. Leaked fluid into transmission. $2,200 to replace tranny. I traded both in and promised myself never again.

Maybe it's a doctor who wants his wife to have a nice Bimmer. Maybe she couldn't care less. Maybe it's the guy who finally saved enough cash to buy his dream Bimmer. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that every one of them tailgates, doesn't use turn signals, or doesn't deserve the car because they don't drive spiritedly. These people are buying for the reasons you mention: reputation, prestige, and logo. BMW earned those things by being a well rounded vehicle. Car & Drive said it was a great car 22 consecutive times, 1992 through 2014, when it was replaced by various 2-series models. What does C&D know? I'll tell you know they don't know - what the cost of ownership is after 36,000 miles.

The whole "high performance" car discussion is silly anyway. 95% of the time you spend driving, you can only go as fast as the car in front of you. The day you finally find yourself alone on the backroads will hopefully be a day without sheriffs nearby.

Last edited by someguy11; 02-05-2019 at 07:19 PM.
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Old 02-05-2019, 08:38 PM
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The performance legends of the Euro cars lives because each brand actually does produce a walk into the dealer pay the outrageous price & drive out with a performance car. The guy who buys a $35,000 320 lives under those other cars image umbrella. Such is life.

Had a number of them & so far only one long term but it was a performance car of its time. Out of pocket over 10 years & 125,000+ miles was under $1500. My others were 3/4 year deals so covered under warranty one now out of warranty. They as a group have had no unusual issues.

Lots of guys no longer like CR because they have been hitting Acura the past few years but the Germans as a group have been doing great over the past two generations in CR's reliability report & as recommends buys.

Think Audi is one of the top mass produced cars on the report now. As for image even saw a Camry laying down some 11's in a commercial in conjunction with the new BMW powered Supra. Luke, the force the performance image is strong in this one.

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Old 02-05-2019, 10:26 PM
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Originally Posted by hadokenuh View Post
I think I am an average NA buyer and not an enthusiast (ok maybe a little bit), but I can tell the difference between a RWD and FWD by driving them back to back. I can also tell the difference in quality, materials, how things put together.

But I agree with your last sentence that we don't need performance vehicles. My prime example is Lexus. I grew up with Lexus being a soft, quiet, comfortable, and reliable ride. We had ES300, ES330, RX300, LS430 in the family. Look at Lexus now. The recent RX rides very sporty with noticeable exhaust noise regardless of trim. The RX300 was the most comfortable moving sofa you'd every buy. Now, all Lexus models have the FSport package available with big rims and summer performance tires
I work for Lexus and the RX is lifeless regardless of trim. THe MDX hands down is far more tactile and sporty. No contest.
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Old 02-05-2019, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by SuperHandlingTL View Post


I work for Lexus and the RX is lifeless regardless of trim. THe MDX hands down is far more tactile and sporty. No contest.
I drove a new Odyssey and that this was dope!
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Old 02-05-2019, 11:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Sloppy305 View Post
I saw Acuraís Instagram post, I donít think it looks like a car release or model introduction. Looks more like an event (in California) that they are promoting or sponsoring.
Just my two cents.
There is no reference to an Acura Model anywhere in the commercial. They usually make
at least one hidden reference to the model they are presenting.
Turned out to be a big nothingburger unfortunately. A sponsorship for the Long Beach Gran Prix.

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Old 02-06-2019, 06:12 AM
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Agreed. The brand seems to be putting the cart before the horse as most don’t associate Acura with performance. That said, this new relationship isn’t one worth bragging about.

More towards the topic at hand, I really don’t expect the new TLX-S to be substantially more powerful than the current V6. Having a C43/S4 along for testing with the test mule probably has more to do with chassis dynamics than power output. I don’t expect much more than 325hp for any Type S 3.0T model with a 2.0T effectively pulled from the Accord (Not RDX) for the volume trim.

The brand has such a insatiable desire towards being underwhelming and I still think the beancounters at Honda will shape the final decisions here.(Apologies for the slight venting; like a few here, I’m on the cusp of leaving the brand due to its uninspiring offerings.)
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Old 02-06-2019, 06:18 AM
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That's because for whatever reason (bean counters) Acura is content on making family movers with a little leather thrown in.
that's their MO, their Identity. and has been for the last 10 years.

as of 2015, new cars dont really interest me...maybe because my lack of money.. but i feel that auto makers arent bringing the heat like they did in 2015.
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Old 02-06-2019, 08:21 AM
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Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory View Post
The performance legends of the Euro cars lives because each brand actually does produce a walk into the dealer pay the outrageous price & drive out with a performance car. The guy who buys a $35,000 320 lives under those other cars image umbrella. Such is life.

Had a number of them & so far only one long term but it was a performance car of its time. Out of pocket over 10 years & 125,000+ miles was under $1500. My others were 3/4 year deals so covered under warranty one now out of warranty. They as a group have had no unusual issues.

Lots of guys no longer like CR because they have been hitting Acura the past few years but the Germans as a group have been doing great over the past two generations in CR's reliability report & as recommends buys.

Think Audi is one of the top mass produced cars on the report now. As for image even saw a Camry laying down some 11's in a commercial in conjunction with the new BMW powered Supra. Luke, the force the performance image is strong in this one.
I agree with everything here!! On your first, I won't spend any time looking it up, but I'd be very curious to compare sales. I'll use Audi since I know Audi. I would bet that A4 sales crush S4 or RS4 sales in volume, therefore, make more total profit. But the reputation isn't based on A4 FWD. Audi performance is built on S4 Quattro. All the TV ads love to say "starting at 29,900" or whatever. MB did this with the C a couple years ago. And the mass public is all like "Ooh I can afford a base model Benz which is comparable to the loaded Fusion I was about to go buy!" Heck, even I considered a C!

On your second, Euros (at least those around 10 years ago) are very hit-or-miss. You talk to the guy who has a VW or Volvo (pre-Ford era) with over 200k miles and only ever did routine maintenance. Then you talk to the guy with the exact same model who has had nothing but problems with annual visits to the shop. My Euros were on the bad end. The problems I mentioned weren't my only. I was replacing switches and mechanical components leading up to the big repair bill. Routine maintenance on my BMW LT was very costly, but worth the premium riding experience to me.

I noticed CR improving Euro ratings. Especially Audi. I didn't believe them or what they said about Acura until my TLX. In my first year of ownership, I've had tranny replaced, vibration TSBs performed (it still vibrates), rear speaker deck rattle fixed, timing belt pulley shim added, and high pressure fuel pump replaced. I just replaced my 3.5 year old OEM battery two weeks ago (granted these don't last forever). Now my driver door seal is popping and there's a recall on my low pressure fuel pump. I thought buying Honda would insulate me from stuff like this - and it blows my mind how dead wrong I was. My hope is that the original owner left these things to bubble up for me to resolve and more issues don't continue to pop up. If they do, it will be, by far, the least reliable car I've ever owned and I won't own it for long. My warranty is about to expire and I'd rather have a Lexus or Audi in my garage. That Supra has me thinking about my next car after the kids are out. The rumors had always been Toyota rebadging a turbo BR-Z as a Supra, which would have disappointed me personally (I just think BR-Z is small and unattractive), but the Supra ended up being much more than that.

Last edited by someguy11; 02-06-2019 at 08:35 AM.
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Old 02-06-2019, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by someguy11 View Post
I didn't say high performance. I said performance. Performance doesn't mean take it to a road racing track or a drag strip. It doesn't mean street race that kid with a riced out Civic. I mean, you could if you want, and probably win, especially with an M3 or M5. Performance is execution or process of carrying out or accomplishing an action, task, or function. I feel like I'm repeating myself, but I'll say it anyway: Audi, BMW and Mercedes have mastered the automobile. Up to around the time the warranty expires, they are pleasures to own and drive. They are well-rounded vehicles. The seats are comfortable. They feel solid when you drive them, yet nimble on their feet. The suspension is firm while absorbing the worst a road has to offer. The cockpit and dash are designed around the driver. Craftsmanship and materials are top notch. The are gorgeous cars inside and out. I drove an A4 and rode a BMW motorrad for a combined twelve years. Loved them both until an airbag sensor on my Audi fried. I took it in and had them look into a knocking from the front end while at it. The sensor alone was $1,000. The knocking was from tie rods. Another $2,000. While I was kicking those costs around, I relied on my motorcycle as a backup, riding rain or shine. Not so fun. In the same week, the clutch on my BMW failed. Leaked fluid into transmission. $2,200 to replace tranny. I traded both in and promised myself never again.

Maybe it's a doctor who wants his wife to have a nice Bimmer. Maybe she couldn't care less. Maybe it's the guy who finally saved enough cash to buy his dream Bimmer. I wouldn't jump to the conclusion that every one of them tailgates, doesn't use turn signals, or doesn't deserve the car because they don't drive spiritedly. These people are buying for the reasons you mention: reputation, prestige, and logo. BMW earned those things by being a well rounded vehicle. Car & Drive said it was a great car 22 consecutive times, 1992 through 2014, when it was replaced by various 2-series models. What does C&D know? I'll tell you know they don't know - what the cost of ownership is after 36,000 miles.

The whole "high performance" car discussion is silly anyway. 95% of the time you spend driving, you can only go as fast as the car in front of you. The day you finally find yourself alone on the backroads will hopefully be a day without sheriffs nearby.
Agreed, especially on the prairies where twisty roads are almost non-existent. As for well rounded cars that are comfortable, nimble, handle well, quiet, well designed inside and out, and good looking, and RELIABLE, that would describe exactly my 2.4 Elite TLX...plus almost every safety and convenience feature there is. Could I pay $300+ more a month for a similarly equipped slightly more powerful Audi 4 or BMW 3 - sure. But I would rather travel more, enjoy the car I have, and know that I have a great relationship with my dealer.

BYW, I wasn't suggesting that Bimmer drivers are the poor drivers...in fact I find many drive quite conservatively, which speaks more to my point about people buying for the reputation and prestige without really needing or using the performance gains. THe poor driving habits comment was about drivers in general, whom, btw, I would dread even more if they were driving 400 hp performance vehicles.
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Old 02-06-2019, 11:43 AM
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Originally Posted by someguy11 View Post
I agree with everything here!! On your first, I won't spend any time looking it up, but I'd be very curious to compare sales. I'll use Audi since I know Audi. I would bet that A4 sales crush S4 or RS4 sales in volume, therefore, make more total profit. But the reputation isn't based on A4 FWD. Audi performance is built on S4 Quattro. All the TV ads love to say "starting at 29,900" or whatever. MB did this with the C a couple years ago. And the mass public is all like "Ooh I can afford a base model Benz which is comparable to the loaded Fusion I was about to go buy!" Heck, even I considered a C!

On your second, Euros (at least those around 10 years ago) are very hit-or-miss. You talk to the guy who has a VW or Volvo (pre-Ford era) with over 200k miles and only ever did routine maintenance. Then you talk to the guy with the exact same model who has had nothing but problems with annual visits to the shop. My Euros were on the bad end. The problems I mentioned weren't my only. I was replacing switches and mechanical components leading up to the big repair bill. Routine maintenance on my BMW LT was very costly, but worth the premium riding experience to me.

I noticed CR improving Euro ratings. Especially Audi. I didn't believe them or what they said about Acura until my TLX. In my first year of ownership, I've had tranny replaced, vibration TSBs performed (it still vibrates), rear speaker deck rattle fixed, timing belt pulley shim added, and high pressure fuel pump replaced. I just replaced my 3.5 year old OEM battery two weeks ago (granted these don't last forever). Now my driver door seal is popping and there's a recall on my low pressure fuel pump. I thought buying Honda would insulate me from stuff like this - and it blows my mind how dead wrong I was. My hope is that the original owner left these things to bubble up for me to resolve and more issues don't continue to pop up. If they do, it will be, by far, the least reliable car I've ever owned and I won't own it for long. My warranty is about to expire and I'd rather have a Lexus or Audi in my garage. That Supra has me thinking about my next car after the kids are out. The rumors had always been Toyota rebadging a turbo BR-Z as a Supra, which would have disappointed me personally (I just think BR-Z is small and unattractive), but the Supra ended up being much more than that.
Agree. Was lucky with the 2004. They really started to clean up their act in 2011 after they killed the shi**y fuel pump in the 335's. By 2013 they were pretty solid. Problem still always exists that after warranty parts are expensive & you need a quality BMW 3rd party shop not a dealer for anything you can't fix yourself.
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Old 02-06-2019, 12:46 PM
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Originally Posted by BEAR-AvHistory View Post
The performance legends of the Euro cars lives because each brand actually does produce a walk into the dealer pay the outrageous price & drive out with a performance car. The guy who buys a $35,000 320 lives under those other cars image umbrella. Such is life.
This

The Japanese never understood the luxury car market (Lexus partially does but it does execute it poorly) and probably never will.
After wreaking havoc among mainstream automakers, at the beginning of the 1990s it was widely believed that the luxury brands (Germany dominated) were next especially with the promising start from the just launched Lexus.
Well we know how it ended, the Germans are stronger than ever.
The Japanese mastered the art of selling mainstream cars (appliance-like reliability, good fit and finish) but they do not get the emotional and prestige-seeking aspect of purchasing a premium car. They do not understand heritage.
Any of the German car manufacturers has a product range that appeal to a buyer all along his/her professional career (and disposable income level) with BMW being the only brand still not offering an extreme exotic.

Got your first "important" job out of college?? Hop in a 320i or A3 or CLA....you can celebrate your middle management promotion with an A7, a M550i, E43 AMG.....successful partner at a law firm?? That shiny M5, RS7 or E63 is waiting for you.

A high earner with a passion for motor racing? Any of the 4 Germans offer you great cars and also powerful luxurious SUV to tow them at your favorite track.

There is not such thing as a "smart luxury".....smart luxury is buying a nice optioned mainstream automobile...so many to pick from nowadays.

If you rely on discount pricing vs. your intended competition, you are not a real player in this space.
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Old 02-06-2019, 04:51 PM
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Originally Posted by 4G-Lover View Post
This

The Japanese never understood the luxury car market (Lexus partially does but it does execute it poorly) and probably never will.
After wreaking havoc among mainstream automakers, at the beginning of the 1990s it was widely believed that the luxury brands (Germany dominated) were next especially with the promising start from the just launched Lexus.
Well we know how it ended, the Germans are stronger than ever.
The Japanese mastered the art of selling mainstream cars (appliance-like reliability, good fit and finish) but they do not get the emotional and prestige-seeking aspect of purchasing a premium car. They do not understand heritage.
Any of the German car manufacturers has a product range that appeal to a buyer all along his/her professional career (and disposable income level) with BMW being the only brand still not offering an extreme exotic.

Got your first "important" job out of college?? Hop in a 320i or A3 or CLA....you can celebrate your middle management promotion with an A7, a M550i, E43 AMG.....successful partner at a law firm?? That shiny M5, RS7 or E63 is waiting for you.
A high earner with a passion for motor racing? Any of the 4 Germans offer you great cars and also powerful luxurious SUV to tow them at your favorite track.

There is not such thing as a "smart luxury".....smart luxury is buying a nice optioned mainstream automobile...so many to pick from nowadays.

If you rely on discount pricing vs. your intended competition, you are not a real player in this space.
Don't forget that the Koreans with the Stinger and the Genesis G70, G80 & G90 are also now in this market and price range, so there are now more choices than ever before.
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Old 02-06-2019, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by comptr View Post
Don't forget that the Koreans with the Stinger and the Genesis G70, G80 & G90 are also now in this market and price range, so there are now more choices than ever before.
The Stinger is on the short list for my next vehicle. The bang for buck, good looks, RWD bias driving dynamics and practical cargo area with the lift back. My ideal daddy-mobile.
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Old 02-06-2019, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by 4G-Lover View Post
This

The Japanese never understood the luxury car market (Lexus partially does but it does execute it poorly) and probably never will.
After wreaking havoc among mainstream automakers, at the beginning of the 1990s it was widely believed that the luxury brands (Germany dominated) were next especially with the promising start from the just launched Lexus.
Well we know how it ended, the Germans are stronger than ever.
The Japanese mastered the art of selling mainstream cars (appliance-like reliability, good fit and finish) but they do not get the emotional and prestige-seeking aspect of purchasing a premium car. They do not understand heritage.
Any of the German car manufacturers has a product range that appeal to a buyer all along his/her professional career (and disposable income level) with BMW being the only brand still not offering an extreme exotic.

Got your first "important" job out of college?? Hop in a 320i or A3 or CLA....you can celebrate your middle management promotion with an A7, a M550i, E43 AMG.....successful partner at a law firm?? That shiny M5, RS7 or E63 is waiting for you.

A high earner with a passion for motor racing? Any of the 4 Germans offer you great cars and also powerful luxurious SUV to tow them at your favorite track.

There is not such thing as a "smart luxury".....smart luxury is buying a nice optioned mainstream automobile...so many to pick from nowadays.

If you rely on discount pricing vs. your intended competition, you are not a real player in this space.
Well put!

I still laugh at their "smart luxury" slogan whenever I see it.
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Old 02-07-2019, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by ZipSpeed View Post


The Stinger is on the short list for my next vehicle. The bang for buck, good looks, RWD bias driving dynamics and practical cargo area with the lift back. My ideal daddy-mobile.
Hopefully for them, the Koreans will understand this market space better instead of messing up the "last mile" like the Japanese did.

This is a market segment that lives on heritage, motorsport, halo models, advertisement and product placement in the right hands.
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Old 02-07-2019, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by 4G-Lover View Post
Hopefully for them, the Koreans will understand this market space better instead of messing up the "last mile" like the Japanese did.

This is a market segment that lives on heritage, motorsport, halo models, advertisement and product placement in the right hands.
I don't like the upcoming Hyundai design language. Like the Japanese, the vehicle's design is starting to look too busy.



Kia is better with restraint, but even they look like they're embracing the gaping maw in the front.

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Old 02-08-2019, 12:00 AM
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The Hyundai almost makes the Lexus look okay....well....okay, that's a stretch. The Kia is decent....where have I seen that sunburst looking grill?
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Old 02-08-2019, 12:27 AM
  #190  
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Haven't seen that much chrome since watching West Coast Customs. . .
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by F23A4 View Post
Agreed. The brand seems to be putting the cart before the horse as most donít associate Acura with performance. That said, this new relationship isnít one worth bragging about.

More towards the topic at hand, I really donít expect the new TLX-S to be substantially more powerful than the current V6. Having a C43/S4 along for testing with the test mule probably has more to do with chassis dynamics than power output. I donít expect much more than 325hp for any Type S 3.0T model with a 2.0T effectively pulled from the Accord (Not RDX) for the volume trim.

The brand has such a insatiable desire towards being underwhelming and I still think the beancounters at Honda will shape the final decisions here.(Apologies for the slight venting; like a few here, Iím on the cusp of leaving the brand due to its uninspiring offerings.)
The next gen TLX will get the RDXís 272hp 2.0t as a base. I can confirm that going by some info I recieved back in March 2017. The V6T should be in the 360-375hp range.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:35 PM
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Originally Posted by 4G-Lover View Post
This

The Japanese never understood the luxury car market (Lexus partially does but it does execute it poorly) and probably never will.
After wreaking havoc among mainstream automakers, at the beginning of the 1990s it was widely believed that the luxury brands (Germany dominated) were next especially with the promising start from the just launched Lexus.
Well we know how it ended, the Germans are stronger than ever.
The Japanese mastered the art of selling mainstream cars (appliance-like reliability, good fit and finish) but they do not get the emotional and prestige-seeking aspect of purchasing a premium car. They do not understand heritage.
Any of the German car manufacturers has a product range that appeal to a buyer all along his/her professional career (and disposable income level) with BMW being the only brand still not offering an extreme exotic.

Got your first "important" job out of college?? Hop in a 320i or A3 or CLA....you can celebrate your middle management promotion with an A7, a M550i, E43 AMG.....successful partner at a law firm?? That shiny M5, RS7 or E63 is waiting for you.

A high earner with a passion for motor racing? Any of the 4 Germans offer you great cars and also powerful luxurious SUV to tow them at your favorite track.

There is not such thing as a "smart luxury".....smart luxury is buying a nice optioned mainstream automobile...so many to pick from nowadays.

If you rely on discount pricing vs. your intended competition, you are not a real player in this space.
Acuraís issues donít come from lack of talent. The issues stem from Japan. The board members and shareholders are to blame as there the ones who donít understand the luxury market and keep failing to give the Acura brand the resources they need to be fully competitive. Ive head this from the dealer network and several engineers. Erik Bergman (retired unfortunately), John Ikeda have been fighting Japan upper management for years for full control of the Acura brand with limited success. The 3G TL almost didnít get the green light because the Japanese thought the car was too expensive yet it was the most successful Acura sedan to date. The TLX nearly got a CVT instead of the 8DCT and the only reason the 8DCT got apporoved is because of AHM (American Honda).

Iím not sure if anyone remembers this RWD Acura RL test mule that was spotted about a decade ago. This car (and the V10 powered Acura GT coupe) were supposed to reset the brand and take the brand to tier 1 levels of performance/luxury. These cars also were supposed to spawn an all new engine family which consisted of a DOHC iVTEC V6, a V8 and a V10, all from the same architecture. The blocks of these engines were cast on the 4400 ton high pressure casting machine In Suzuka. The heads were made at EGJ in Utsunomyia. These cars would have been game changers for the brand.......UNFORTUNATELY.......Ito overreacted to the recession and canceled these projects in their last stages of development.....






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Old 02-10-2019, 10:47 PM
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Originally Posted by SuperHandlingTL View Post
Iím not sure if anyone remembers this RWD Acura RL test mule that was spotted about a decade ago. This car (and the V10 powered Acura GT coupe) were supposed to reset the brand and take the brand to tier 1 levels of performance/luxury. These cars also were supposed to spawn an all new engine family which consisted of a DOHC iVTEC V6, a V8 and a V10, all from the same architecture. The blocks of these engines were cast on the 4400 ton high pressure casting machine In Suzuka. The heads were made at EGJ in Utsunomyia. These cars would have been game changers for the brand.......UNFORTUNATELY.......Ito overreacted to the recession and canceled these projects in their last stages of development.....






i remember that like it just happened yesterday.

To this day I still believe the 4th gen TL and ZDX were actually intended to fit with this RWD platform (during the early development stages)given their long hood design, and they are loosely based on the AASC which was shown publicly in 2006, and it had a RWD proportion.

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Old 02-10-2019, 11:38 PM
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Thanks for posting, awesome info there!
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Old 02-11-2019, 12:35 AM
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Originally Posted by MSZ View Post
i remember that like it just happened yesterday.

To this day I still believe the 4th gen TL and ZDX were actually intended to fit with this RWD platform (during the early development stages)given their long hood design, and they are loosely based on the AASC which was shown publicly in 2006, and it had a RWD proportion.
Ive always wondered what Acura wouldíve been like if those projects werenít scrapped............
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Old 02-11-2019, 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SuperHandlingTL View Post


Acuraís issues donít come from lack of talent. The issues stem from Japan. The board members and shareholders are to blame as there the ones who donít understand the luxury market and keep failing to give the Acura brand the resources they need to be fully competitive. Ive head this from the dealer network and several engineers. Erik Bergman (retired unfortunately), John Ikeda have been fighting Japan upper management for years for full control of the Acura brand with limited success. The 3G TL almost didnít get the green light because the Japanese thought the car was too expensive yet it was the most successful Acura sedan to date. The TLX nearly got a CVT instead of the 8DCT and the only reason the 8DCT got apporoved is because of AHM (American Honda).

Iím not sure if anyone remembers this RWD Acura RL test mule that was spotted about a decade ago. This car (and the V10 powered Acura GT coupe) were supposed to reset the brand and take the brand to tier 1 levels of performance/luxury. These cars also were supposed to spawn an all new engine family which consisted of a DOHC iVTEC V6, a V8 and a V10, all from the same architecture. The blocks of these engines were cast on the 4400 ton high pressure casting machine In Suzuka. The heads were made at EGJ in Utsunomyia. These cars would have been game changers for the brand.......UNFORTUNATELY.......Ito overreacted to the recession and canceled these projects in their last stages of development.....







This is exactly what I meant...lack of leadership, Honda has definitely the engineering talent to make fantastic cars.

The 4G was the pinnacle of Acura sport sedans in terms of specs, technology and fit and finish, 305 HP and being the only brand offering a true Torque Vectoring AWD in 2008 was quite a big deal. Acura chickened out not only in styling but in tech specs too. A German brand would have never done what Acura did after the 4G.
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Old 02-11-2019, 04:48 PM
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Originally Posted by MSZ View Post
i remember that like it just happened yesterday.

To this day I still believe the 4th gen TL and ZDX were actually intended to fit with this RWD platform (during the early development stages)given their long hood design, and they are loosely based on the AASC which was shown publicly in 2006, and it had a RWD proportion.

I heard this car drove extremely well and its 4.0 V8 was a marvel of engineering......too bad we never saw this come into play.
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Old 02-11-2019, 06:46 PM
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Originally Posted by 4G-Lover View Post
The 4G was the pinnacle of Acura sport sedans in terms of specs, technology and fit and finish, 305 HP and being the only brand offering a true Torque Vectoring AWD in 2008 was quite a big deal.
You are true to your screen name.
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Old 02-12-2019, 02:22 AM
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Deviating further from the original topic, but with an eye towards ta new Turbo TLX, has anyone else noticed that Hyundai just killed the 1.6 Turbo option in its 2019 Tucson. Citing underwhelming fuel economy and maintenance costs. Interesting , is this a crack in the relentless worship of turbos or is Hyundai simply just trying to cut costs and actually improve fuel economy? Going with a 2.0 and 2.4 GDI engines.
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Old 02-12-2019, 03:17 AM
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Really! What is the Tucson's upgrade engine for 2019, then?


I liked the turbo Tucson, but IDK why they dropped the 2.0 for the 1.6 a few years ago.

The 1.6 Optima seems cool, however. Too bad it only comes on the base.
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