SebringSilver

Still confused by why OP is basing his impressions of an A6, or any car for that matter, on a loaner. Those cars tend to be spec’ed to keep costs low. People who actually buy these cars for themselves usually get most if not all the goodies.

Denali05

I'm sure the A6 was deficient in some areas, but the thing that many others are trying to point out is that the A6 with the 2.0T engine was never marketed towards the driving enthusiast's market. Any attempt to review it under such guise will of course leave the person disappointed. Expectations need to be managed when comparing a model that was unveiled in 2011 verses a model that was unveiled in 2015.


The trim is made of real carbon fiber.

4G-Lover

Not always....for example, the BMW 530i I had as a rental few weeks ago was actually well optioned.

Christopher.

Having a car for over a week, and not just driving around town but also taking it on a road trip putting hundreds of miles on the car including big highways and back country roads is a Hell of a lot different than a test drive.

It's worth making the comparison even if they're not a logical match - it's worth providing opinions with reasons as to what I like or dislike about each car.

Would I have even considered buying the A6 in 2018? No, but, to be fair to me consider: shouldn't a 2018 model $50,000 Audi have been more satisfying?!? I found both the experience of using the car, and, the discussion here comparing these two cars to be far more interesting than some other rental cars I've had such as a base model Nissan Altima or the previous mid-level optioned Sentra I had rented before that.

Now that I'm back in my car, I suppose I do feel that the Audi's interior is a little nicer - but it totally sucks if you park it in the hot mid day July sun at a mall parking lot. It actually HURTS to get in, to hold the steering wheel... I now hate black cars with un-perforated black leather seats.

When car companies sell cars to car rental companies, they really should make an effort to "put their best foot forward". I'm left feeling "meh", OK, nice car, but, boring and far overpriced for what you get...

SebringSilver

But every assertion you’ve made is completely subjective based on what you like or don’t like. There’s been nothing quantitative about your “comparison” of the two cars. If that’s how you compare cars then so be it. I mean, in that vein, try slamming the trunk lid on both cars, or take each car up to a sustained 120 mph on an open stretch of highway, and tell me if you don’t see why one car costs $15,000 more than the other (even using your completely subjective method of “analysis”).

Midnight Mystery

This is cool, but what happens when it beaks?

cruiserchuck

You get it fixed? Audi has been ranked higher than Acura for dependability lately, so I am not too worried. Plus, I have not seen any reports of failures on the Audi owner websites that I visit.

Christopher.

My biggest complaints with the Audi were nearly all objective:

It's bigger and heavier yet has less HP and Torque despite costing significantly more, it lacks Lane Keep Assist, Backup Side Collision Detection, Blind Spot Warning System, and Adaptive Cruise Control, it has Auto Engine Off. I don't think it has a forward collision mitigation system (auto breaking).

I suspect a newer A6, with a 3.0T engine would have all those missing features available as well as fix those areas which were subjectively deficient IMO.

Getting back into my car, after having had the Audi did somewhat raise my opinion of my experience in the Audi.

I will give you that I accept, that from what I know about this particular 2018 Audi A6 2.0T model, and the fact that it was a rental car that presumably has been fairly abused, that I would probably prefer a 2020 Audi RS3 over my Acura TLX by a wide margin.

The car that I really want though, is a RWD Honda Coupe w/6 MT + 2.0T engine, tastefully subdued styling, and leather seats.

BEAR-AvHistory

But its a 4 cylinder 248bhp car thats $5,000 cheaper than the 6 cylinder 335bhp car to start off.

BEAR-AvHistory

Christopher if you wanted to deal with cars objectively we would all be driving CIVIC 4 doors. It don't work that way. Audi is a luxury item. Luxury items cost more because they are luxuries. People will pay more for a less optioned Audi then a full optioned Acura & that is objective fact.

This same debate as the ongoing Porsche vs StingRay debate on the C7 & C8 sites right now. Just the cars names have been changed. This debate does not exist on the Audi site & the Corvette debate does not appear on the Porsche site. They always appear on the bottom end cars sites, must be a reason for that.

BTW as a matter of personal preference I do not check the box for Lane Keep Assist, Backup Side Collision Detection, Blind Spot Warning System, and Adaptive Cruise Control, because I don't want them. Someday the government in its benevolence will jam them down my throat but till then I will be a hands on the wheel & head in the game driver.

Midnight Mystery

Hmm.... I'm confused....


There must be more to it than name recognition?

Christopher.

Well, on the subjective side then, when comparing this Acura and Audi, the Acura is more fun in every way.

Some people don't build wealth by wasting money - but, there are those who gain excessive wealth exploiting others and those sorts of people often seem to take pride in wasting money, because of their insecurity they want to make a show of how they have excess and can waste money as they please. I appreciate finely made things, but I also appreciate value. Even my Acura was not that great in terms of value, so, I would not have bought it without thinking it was being paid for by a company car plan - I would have gone with some other car costing under $30K unless I we got another mini van which provides value through how useful it is to someone like me with a couple kids, wanting to go on road trips, and haul stuff from "home improvement" stores to do work on both my home and investment properties.

Those features are either off or irrelevant when I'm taking a ramp so fast that even summer tires start to lose their grip. Most of them are not used on short trips, or on winding back roads - but, if I'm backing out of a space in a parking lot, why the hell not take advantage of something that tells you when a car you can't see is coming towards your car? And when on long highway drives the benefit of the other features such as lane keep assist are that the drive is less tiring, less stressful, and I can actually be more safe than if I had been more worn out after a few hours, so, at those times that I want to be more engaged, I can be and the overall experience is more pleasant. I'm sure you recall that I keep saying I turn traction control off - that is because I hate not being and feeling in control, I want the car to respond to my input and not say "hey, not so fast there, we're going to behave differently than what you're asking for".

I really hate that the Honda engineers seem to have gone crazy in how heavy handed their Traction Control programming was - I wish I could leave it on for the safety it could provide in sudden unexpected situations, but, they've gone SO far as to actually make it DANGEROUS to leave it on! Often I found that I could not make my car respond quickly enough to move my car out of the way of oncoming traffic if it was on! (Well, luckily it was able to get out of the way just in time, but the experience was extremely stressful and frustrating on more than one occasion where I was not even driving particularly aggressively, I simply tried to turn when there was a break in traffic, or tried to merge when traffic was heavy, etc.)

someguy11

Have you ever owned (or driven for longer than a week) an A6, A8, 5, 7, E or S? What about a 911, RS7, R8, M5 or AMG?
I already know your answer is no, because you wouldn't be confused if your answer was yes.

He made a great point. It's practically human nature to do what Christopher did. Compare yourself to those above you. No one with a snowblower envies those with shovels. Nor would those with riding mowers envy those with push mowers. We envy those with bigger homes and better cars. An A6 owner comparing his car to a TLX is like me writing a thread about how my TLX is superior to a Civic. This whole thread is completely subjective and - including my post right here - rather pointless... three pages of why Christopher wouldn't even consider visiting his local Audi dealer for his next car based on renting a base model A6 for a week.

Christopher.

Not true. I own a gas mower, but I use my push mower by choice. I went to a Mercedes dealer and they were happy to let me take their top of the line over $100K car out for a test drive, I went to a Honda dealer, and they were [extremely] rude to me when I wanted to take their $34K Civic for a test drive.

I was in the A6 for more than a week and I was eager to give it back and get back into my Acura.

I liked Japanese whiskey before it was expensive - no, I won't pay $500 for the bottle so I can say: "see, I have this on my shelf", I will appreciate that I was buying that same bottle for $3 a flask at a convenience store in Tokyo years before "look at my shelf" guy even heard about it. There is a certain bottle of wine though, that I would pay $1,000 for just so I could share it with friends so that they could have the same experience of trying it. The idea of having a Porsche 911 in my garage and a cellar of fine wines has some appeal yes, but, I am not driven to be wealthy - I value some things more than material goods - I like not being some kind of psychotic greed driven person who exploits others and uses corruption to gain enormous wealth. I think about the leader of Valenzuela who had the opportunity to do good things for his people but instead was corrupt and greedy and I can't imagine behaving like that - I would have really loved the opportunity to bring increased income equality to my citizens, had I been in his shoes, it would have brought me far deeper satisfaction than hoarding personal wealth for myself, at the expense of The People.

someguy11

I want to be nice, but it's like talking to a brick wall at this point. Why did you buy a TLX and not a Civic, Corolla or some other econobox? You value the enhancements the TLX offers over those others. Just like some people value the enhancements of the Euros over the others. If you don't perceive Euro cars to be better than your car - great! - you saved yourself a bunch of money.

I have several neighbors who aren't disgustingly wealthy, aren't greedy, aren't sycophants, nepotists or capitalists over a serfdom. They saved their money and chose to buy Audi or BMW because it's worth it to them. I don't hate or judge them for it. They also volunteer their time and donate to charity, because driving an A6 doesn't make you greedy or stupid or careless or frivolous or wealthy. Just like you appreciate Japanese whiskey over Makers Mark, so are people willing to spend more on cars.

BEAR-AvHistory

Statement has no meaning as far as I am concerned. Just a standard reaction of some people when dealing with other peoples luxury items. They will always bring out the multi-millionaire who drives a Honda Accord, conveniently leaving out the fact he lives is a $120,000,000 house.

While others who built some wealth like Bill Gates whos favorites cars are from one of the best German car manufacturers in the automotive history. You can probably guess the name already, it's Porsche. He actually owns three of them: 1991 Porsche 911 Carrera, Porsche 930 and a 1988 Porsche 959 Coupe. He uses the 1988 Porsche 959 as his daily car.

People will buy what they like & can afford. Next time you pass any large enterprise how hard us it to determine the owners/managers from the worker bees by just looking at the parking lot? Why do people live in 5,000 Sq ft houses on multi acres of property while other do with 1,900 Sq Ft on 1/2 acre? Why do people buy a Corvette & others buy a Ferrari? Why do some people buy a CIVIC & others an TLX?

Personally nothing against 1,900 Sq Ft houses & Chevys been there, done that, got the tee shirt.

The flow here of people moving on from TLX to AUDI I don't believe are wasting anything. Enjoying what you earn is not wasting money IMHO.

fiatlux

Is that why you stuck a Type-S badge onto your TLX ?

4G-Lover

Yep.....people pay 10 grand for a 3 hand stainless steel Rolex Submariner which is an out of this world ridiculous amount of money for a simple complication watch...but it is a Rolex and people actually wait months to get one....


Not totally true...there is debate even on Porsche forums about the merit of the Corvette and there are people owning them both....I even met some of them at my recent V Driving Academy event...true enthusiasts usually look at the car content, specs and capabilities not at the badge....wealthy people usually have nothing to prove to anyone...

4G-Lover

Depends on the location.....I could buy a castle in a different part of the country with what I could fetch selling my house...location is more important than sq/ft in the RE market...

4G-Lover

The issue is not simple price difference (heck a Dodge Charger feels more solid and more planted at high speed than 3 Series trims costing more) but comparing two different cars with different mission...if you want a sport sedan you are not going to look at an A6 (or a TLX, but that's me).....but as a cruiser the Audi outshine a TLX pretty much under any objective measurement...at certain price point the A6 will have less gadgets but it already offers more in other area...

As I said before, there are indeed cars from time to time capable of punching above their price tag weight but IMHO the TLX doesn't...

BEAR-AvHistory

Understand my old 1,900 sq ft house (my first house ever) in NJ commuting distance to NYC that I paid $32K for is now on the market for $495K.

The sqft compare I was thinking of was as a same town pricing set not a different geographical pricing set. Houses in the South way are less expensive then in the NYC commute range or CA in general. My 3rd Jersey house in Spring Lake NJ which has a rail station for the commute pretty much the same size 5300sqft vs 5100sqft as this one would cost easily twice as much if not more even though our property here is about 3 times the size of the Jersey house..

BEAR-AvHistory

Maybe I should have said with outright envy in the posts like Telepierre, Punky & 5 or 6 others on my ignore list. Been involved in internet cars forums since the beginning of internet car forum & have never added anyone to a ignor list till the C7/C8 site. Was really surprised & will agree a lot of the guys have Porsches, Ferraris etc & none of them are acting out of line like some of the others. I am a car guy & am happy to see pretty much anything. Was early to a cars & coffee last month & got sandwiched between a Ferrari & McLaren. Had to answer a million questions on the build twice. Forgot the company name but the Ferrari owner was involved with the people who made the wheels on the car. Not my thing but very slick the color was translucent red over polished metal & had a very unique look.




We have debates here with strong opinions but for the most part they are very civil & is one of the reasons I still post here. I enjoy the debates especially without a the name calling & cheap shots that takes place on some of the other forums

Christopher.

Funny you say that, I've recently come back to Maker's Mark, among others, as I can't even find the better Japanese whiskeys that I liked the most, and the ones that are available seem mostly not worth it, except one bottle of Hibiki, because on my latest trip to Japan the airport "Duty Free" store had been sold out T_T

Most of my relatives, uncles, etc. are wealthy enough to own multiple houses, one even has his own hanger at an airport with helicopters and a turbo prop plane, several others are doctors, etc. I understand some people are wealthy enough to buy Audi/BMW/Mercedes AMG etc. without being Evil scum - sorry if I came across that extreme. I'm really upset about things happening in this country lately, where it feels like the rich are trying to squeeze the middle class out of existence, as if they want something akin to the class structure of Nobility and Serfs - in a country this wealthy there's no excuse for a situation where the common working man can't support his family comfortably and buy a home, have good healthcare, good schools, etc. I'm not complaing about MY situation - no, not at all, I've chosen to be a "stay at home parent" because I think that's best for our kids, I had been working in the IT field for over 20 years and intentionally made a life choice that cut our family income significantly - partially because my wife works at a Japanese company, she is Japanese, and she follows their work ethic which is something like 6 days a week 10 hours a day.

I really enjoyed some of the older BMWs which had a nice sporty suspension, steering that let you feel connected to the road, and a good power to weight ratio - all without having to choose some special "M" model - I resent loose seeming disconnected feeling power steering, cars that feel like "and yachts" floating on the road etc. I also deeply resent that there has to be some massive premium charge to get a car that has enough power to be fun and a stiff enough suspension to satisfy the driving feel that I want and steering that doesn't feel disconnected.

I wish I could get something like a "Toyota Corolla Sport", except "Sport" meant 2 more cylinders on the engine, stiff suspension, and a 6MT. Why do I basically have to pay $50K for that? Yeah, I like the super quiet interior, comfortable leather seats, and other "premium" features on my TLX, and yes, I think I actually would like an Audi RS3 or S5 very much, I never tried to poo poo ALL Audis, but the through the roof prices on maintenace (to get the same things done to an Audi, that you would do on another brand car seem to cost 4x - 6x as much frequently) is off putting.

Whether I'm paying $4,000 for an old used car, or $35,000 for a new "Premium" car, I want to be getting a good value for my money. I had a VW GTi which I really enjoyed for a few years, but it almost wasn't worth keeping because it felt like maintenance costs were going to be very high - but the real reason I sold it was that I had moved to NYC and just didn't need a car anymore. I know there are people, even magazine and other surveys claiming brands like Audi have surpassed Honda in terms of reliability, but I'm sorry, I just don't believe it yet, it hasn't been true in my experience or with the people I know who've owned VWs etc.

Christopher.

As a car for a person with a personal driver (and you ride in the back comfortably, telling your driver where you want to go), yes, the Audi A6 felt more suited for that than my TLX does.

Being in the driver's seat, I honestly prefer my TLX over the A6 regardless of price. Also, I totally understand that I would probably appreciate almost any other Audi model more than the A6 that I had - just my bad luck that I got perhaps one of the worst power to weight ratio Audi's recently available on the market?

If my kids were grown up and moved out, I suppose I would have a simple, practical, compact 2.0L car - probably a Subaru Impreza, or Honda CR-V w/AWD and in the garage I would have some cheap old Miyata "project car" where I would try to put a Honda 2.0T engine into it. I think a Miyata w/2.0T engine would fill the void for me completely, in terms of the car I want for driving fun - like Bear's red roadster does for him.

Christopher.

That badge only cost me $5 on ebay, they don't actually MAKE Type-S TLXs, and, simply turning off Traction Control gave my TLX most of the performance that I thought was missing from the car. It's still not the kind of car where I can intentionally throw the rear end out with the throttle, like I wish it was, but, maybe I'll get a car like that again before I'm too old to appreciate it, or, maybe not - I'm not sure at this point.

Christopher.

I grew up with a two page magazine spread photo of that car cut out and pasted on my wall. I remember being fascinated by every detail about that car from the adjustible ride height to tire pressure monitoring system. Here's an interesting article on the 959:

https://www.roadandtrack.com/new-car...days-tomorrow/

Edit: Err, well, in my last years as a teenager, as the car started production in my last year in high school and I don't think the first magazine photos would have come out much before then? I kept the photo on my wall through my college years too...

Christopher.

I'm happy with the Seiko Kinetic Titanium (Titanium body and wrist band) with it's sapphire face - I bought it for 75% off at a store closing over twenty years ago and it's still good as new (after a battery replacement, and a special factory lubrication job). My dad found a Rolex [actual Rolex, not a fake] somebody had left on the New Jersey Boardwalk, he turned it in to lost and found and supposedly the owner got it back.

I don't see the Audi A6 maintaining the kind of "timeless" value that a Rolex will hold - if you pick the right model, it may actually go up in value over time, unlike the car.

BEAR-AvHistory

We have 3 Porsches in the family belonging to my daughters that I can drive Cayenne SUV, Boxster 718S (best driver) & 911 Carrera 4S (fastest) but my favorites were the '65 COBRA & '88 Countach 5000 QV .

4G-Lover

Ohh trust me, I will never justify that kind of coin for a Rolex.....it's ridiculous but people still doing it.....and there is no guarantee that it will always pick up value with time...as a matter of fact, many Rolex models don't....

BEAR-AvHistory

My phone is my watch.

Christopher.

If I had a shitload of money there's a slim chance that maybe I'd want a Rolex, but probably not. I'd still wear the same blue jeans and t-shirts, but I would buy some kind of RV, a small second home somewhere close to the ocean and warm weather, and one RWD car that was all about being fun to drive, not too heavy, something that was able to easily do a little "drifting" around corners but still easy to keep in control. I keep thinking that a Miata with a Honda 2.0T "junkyard pull" engine in it would give me 95% of the satisfaction as a $150,000 "super car" would. I mean, Koenigseggs and McClarens are cool of course, but once I'm on the road having fun, it could be a car that I bought from a junk yard for $150 then rebuilt for a few hundred $$$ in parts, as long as it makes cool sounds, has good torque, and is fun to drive and it doesn't matter that it doesn't make the poor people that "only have Corvettes" jealous. ;P I suppose though, of all the cars that I see on the road, some of the Corevettes are the ones that I think: "maybe I could have that some day, I wonder what it feels like to push that car to it's limits on some back roads?" unlike the Ferraris, Lambos, Lotus, etc., where I see it and think "oh that's cool", but, not about me actually getting one for myself.

My Uncle has a Porsche 911 Turbo, and he's fairly fat and getting kind of old, and, he has no kids. But, I don't think he'll leave it to me because his older brother, my dad, used to call him "varmint" (still does he says) and I think he resents it, and thus resents me somewhat too.




Yeah, I "loaned" my watch to my dad, until he dies or gets too old to want to wear it anymore. But you're old enough to remember a time before we all carried phones with us and I'm sure you used to wear watches. My all time favorite was my Casio G-Sport that I got some time around Jr. High. On the other hand, I appreciated the Seiko because it's elegant beauty came mostly from a "form follows function" design using excellent materials - it was surprisingly light because of the titanium body & band and the sapphire crystal window was amazing how it could withstand decades of daily wear without so much a s single fair fine scratch. This was a watch that I could leave on when doing things like yard work, or construction yet still looked sharp when it was time to wear a suit and tie. I used it for about 10 years before I thought about how my father liked it, and how I always had a phone in my pocket. Now I see similar models on eBay for as little as under $200, but, I've kind of filled that void of having a "really nice thing" that I always have with me and carry every day with a pocket knife that I love: the Kershaw "Skyline" model 1760 - I highly recommend it.

BEAR-AvHistory

Back then before the phones I ran an international group out of NYC & traveled a lot overseas. Had a world watch, think it was a Seiko or Citizen, that kept all the worlds time zones. So if I was traveling say from Singapore to NYC I could press on any city like Hong Hong or San Francisco where we had stopovers & the watch would change to the correct time. Also a good plan to check local times before making a phone call to another area.

Corvettes are the best bang for the buck, world class performers. They can pretty much if you move to the $142,000 ZR1 Corvette hold their own with anything made. About the only street legal car in the world that will out perform the ZR1 is the Porsche 911 GT2 RS W @ $333,000.

niray9

I have an A4 Quattro.
Here's my post comparing my earlier TLX to Audi A4 which I replaced the TLX with


https://acurazine.com/forums/fifth-g.../#post16178877

Btw other than the controversial looks, I love the 2014 TL both in terms of driving and build quality, much better than the 2015+ TLX IMO.

Also got a Tesla M3 Long Range replacing my 2nd car @5 months back.