ErikMi

New guy here just looked at the 2018' A-Spec.. It's nice and the price of $45K is also nice.. I still have time on my current 2015 Infiniti Q50 AWD but the TLX is on my list. I'm just really hoping Acura comes out with say an S Spec or just more Power, 290 is a bit weak. My Q50 is 330.. and the other cars I'm looking at are an Infiniti Q60/Q50 RS 400 and the new Jag XE-S 380hp. The TLX could be a big player with say 350hp or so.. I think with the new KIA Stinger and the new Genesis G70 using the 3.3 Twin Turbo V6 putting out 365 hp Acura needs to up the grunt some.. Just my thoughts.

Speed_Racer

All good points, but unfortunately you're going to have to wait for the next gen model to "possibly" address the power concerns. I think about 3 more years, an eternity in a competitive market.

wlkeel

wlkeel

Thanks, Cheesey

neuronbob

A comment about the history of A-Spec in the USA, from an OG Acurazine member: Acura has had an A-Spec package of body kit and suspension changes in the past, on the 3G TL and 2G RL. I know, because I owned both A-Specs. The 1G TSX also had an A-Spec stick on body kit. Acura has never offered more power as part of the package. The suspension changes were significantly better than the base cars. This A-Spec package goes above and beyond by abandoning the stick on body kits, and using actual body parts.

The higher-powered variant, starting with the 2GTL, was the -S model. I won't comment further on power as wlkeel is right.

ErikMi

Ok I get it.. I probably won't see more power.. shame.

AZuser

You cannot just look at the numbers and conclude that since 290 is less than the others that the TLX is slower/less powerful. "Honda hp are much more than other company hp."

If you don't think 290 is enough now, wait to see what the 2nd gen TLX brings in 2 years.. If they put the same 2.0T engine used in the Civic Type R which makes 306bhp, well... "just straight extrapolating to 3.5L will make it 535bhp"

F23A4

290hp is sufficient and in conjunction a 'better' working ZF it should perform better than prior models, which should nullify the cry for slightly more horsepower. Hopefully one of the mags will do a test on the 18 V6 soon.

Although I admit that my tranny reacts a little slow off the line, if it reacted any quicker I'd get even less traction.

RCJD

Yup, 2018 Camry powertrain will be 301 HP for their V6.

Honda Accord and Acura TLX wake up!

SebringSilver

Aside from the obviously taboo topic of "more power" for the TLX, I'd love for a gen-2 TLX to have a couple of USB ports for rear passengers, a panoramic sunroof option, and 2 more inches of legroom for the back seats. Maybe they could combine the aforementioned with individual captain's seats for the rear to make it a 2+2, kind of like what they've done for the MDX, as a further option.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

^the Chinese Market has Long Wheel Base TLX!!! there's your 4" of extra leg room and probably panoramic roof!

SergeyM

A strange statement to say the least. The exactly opposite would be the truth. Honda hp always appeared to be less in real world driving that reported on paper. I still remember when they had to reduce TL hp rating from 270hp to 258hp after people start complaining and various sources confirmed the hp rating to be less than the official number.

We definitely can say that 290hp is sufficient power but when it comes to value, especially leasing the A-Spec at the moment is as much as Q50 Red Sport is and is not really competitive.

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

EPA changed the testing. which changed the horsepower rating. NOT because people complained. ALL cars were affected by the change in testing procedure..NOT just the TL
and AZuser is mimicking another "weird" user, for the lack of a better term...a la inside joke

SergeyM

Sorry, only cheaters were affected. I believe they did not fully fill the engine with oil or something like that. No one ever accused BMW of misrepresenting their cars hp at least not of overrating it.

horseshoez

iTrader: (2)

No, that's not at all what happened. When the EPA changed the rules, virtually all engine output specifications from all manufacturers were affected. Cheating was never an issue.

SergeyM

EPA did not really change the rules. They closed loopholes that allowed some companies to misrepresent their cars horsepower. If your automobile world is limited to Japanese cars then yes, almost all manufacturers were affected.
Honestly I just cannot accept your statement that Honda hp is much more than other cars hp. Honda is no better than as other Japanese manufacturers and Honda horse are much weaker than, for example, BMW horses.
E.g. 290hp TLX is slower than 240hp BMW 328/330 and no one would even think of comparing 290hp TLX to 300hp BMW 335. On paper 290 and 300 are very close. In the real world 290 Honda horses are about 200 BMW horses.

horseshoez

iTrader: (2)

Interesting if true; do you have any supporting references which give more details?

justnspace

iTrader: (1)

he's citing an inside joke, which you arent in the know.
but, yes please cite the source to your information about the EPA

BEAR-AvHistory

C&D & MT both liked the new Stinger at the rings Nordschleife, good power, neutral handling & good brakes for pulling down from 155mph. The upscale version 365BHP turned in sub 5 second 0-60 & mid 13 second quarter miles. LSD, BREMBO'S & MICHELIN PS 4 are all on the 365BHP. Under $48K. That's +10BHP over my new car, might have to add a JB4. The German guys they hired look to be earning their pay.

The market place tightens yet again.

ronricks

290hp is not enough in 2017 with all the technology and tuning available to reach maximum hp from the factory and still have good gas mileage etc. The question should be why didn't Acura properly program the transmission from the beginning? I am not asking for 450hp. But for me to purchase another Acura they are going to need to get closer to what the competition is offering which is at least 350hp. I had a loaner 2017 advance this week while my 2014 SHAWD was being serviced and the 2017 was a dog. Flooring it on the highway even in sport+ mode to pass someone was pitiful. I am sure the Aspec has a little more grunt due to the transmission tuning but still it isn't close to the competition.

Old Guy

I think the reason the Japanese manufacturers had to restate their numbers is simply because BMW is notorious for understating theirs and have been doing it for years. If you make more horsepower than you advertise then is there is a small change you don't have to do a lot of back tracking. US manufacturers used to do this in the 60's all the time (I am Old Guy after all). See this independent dyno done by Edmunds on a 2012 BMW. BMW's numbers are at the wheels so all of the losses due to the transmission and rear end are factored. I read somewhere that this understates BMW's HP by as much as 20%. I believe Acura rates their HP at the flywheel. The article s at the .https://www.edmunds.com/car-reviews/...no-tested.html.

SebringSilver

You don't seriously believe this, do you? There's no way that BMW quotes horsepower at the wheels and not at the crank. If that were the case, all the horsepower figures would be different for the X-drive versions of the same car.

F23A4

290hp is fine for all but those who demand class leading horsepower. While I'm slightly disappointed that Acura didn't offer a token boost in power (as with prior Type S models), it's never wanting for more power when passing is needed. (My 3.5 V6 P-AWS had had little problem dispatching 3G/4G TLs of all variants. ). Any tranny updates along with handling updates, makes the TLX a bit more capable if not a sublime performer. With those whom this won't cut it, they'll just need to consider offerings from other makes.

That said, the 18 model (A-Spec and others) seems to right a few of the 'wrongs' prevalent with the 15-17 models.

alpha0

ry

For precision crafted performance slogans, every 18 model should have corrected "wrongs" of 15-17 models and a Type S should have been in place of A-spec which would compete with S4, 340xi, C43 etc. Let's hope 2nd gen TLX improves further. It all depends whether Acura gets dedicated platform for TLX or will be forced to use new Accord platform.

But i agree, A-spec will help Acura better compete against A4, C300, 330xi etc. Let's see sales number after couple of months..

alpha0

Camry getting more hp than a-spec tlx does not look good on paper, i wish Acura put 310 hp engine in a-specs so that it will be atleast power comparable to IS350 / GS 350.

BEAR-AvHistory

Percentage varies with BMW across different product line but 100% of them are underrated.. They list the 340 as having 320CHP@5500RPM It actually is producing 331WHP @ 5100RPM. A 12% friction & rotational loss CHP TO WHP suggests the engine is producing 370CHP. (15% underrate)

With a number of cars running in the 12 second bracket pure stock would tend to support the higher number.

jhb31

Not sure how you can say the 3.5 V6 P-AWS had little problem displatching 3or 4G TLs of all variants. Having had the 3G TL and a 17 V6 there is no question the 3G type S easily would dispatch the 17 and 18 V6 (same powertrain). The performance times from all publications are clear the 3G type S was and still is a faster car than any TLX made up to this point. When its all said and done the 2018 Aspec is no faster than the 2017 model with the same engine and trans less the piped in exhaust over the sound system. Acura never claimed any performance increase in acceleration on the 2018 model so despite what many may think it may look faster and sound faster but is not faster and still slower than 3G type S models with less HP.

alpha2beta

This is absolute bullshit. Most Honda engines have been under rated over the years especially lately on the newer Honda engines and the TL drop in power ratings had to do with the new SAE measurement standard for horsepower, most manufacturers lost power it wasn't Just Honda Acura, it had nothing to do with people "complaining" about power output.

TacoBello

Proof of Honda engines being under rated? This is news to me. I've never seen any evidence of their NA engines being under rated. Turbo engines? Yes. NA engines? No.

However, you are correct about the change from 270hp to 258hp. It wasn't about people complaining. It was that Honda began following the SAE standards for testing engine output. The key difference is Honda claimed 270hp for the 3.2L V6, which was technically true. However, that power output was for the engine itself, with NO accessories, which is never how you find an engine in a car. When you throw on all the other shit, like alternator, power steering, etc. It resulted in 258hp at the crank.

Honda began following the standardized method of testing for that engine.

F23A4

On the former point, I'm speaking from experience. I've spent some time behind the wheel in both the 3G and 4G. as well as facing off against them. Hence, it is what it is. If anyone with a stock 3G TLS or 4G wants to go for a run in the NYC/Jersey area, we could hit up Island dragway, Etown or Atco (Philly area) for some runs.

But I suspect your latter point (re: 18 vs 15-17 TLX) may be accurate but I haven't driven the A-Spec nor have seen any test data.

jjsC5

There is an aweful lot that goes into this. But a few comments. I agree that the A-Spec never had a HP boost, but there was a S model with more power, and the last generation had two different engines also. So offering more power for certain "trims" would not be without precedent

Lets be clear to on why some cars with less power perform better. For this I'm going to go to the way-back machine since somone already brought up the 60s. While some of the old muscle cars may well have been over rated, there is another factor at work. Horsepower is a calculation using torque at any given RPM. By the very nature of the formula, they make the same torque and horsepower at 5200 rpm.

The 60s muscle cars with big block engines made tons of low end torque, but most of them had very low red lines. Many only redlined at 4600 RPM or so. With the caculation using 5200 rpm, an engine could make 500 lb ft of torque (using the old SAE methods) but with a redline of 4600 RPM, and peak torque coming at a lower RPM, it is literally impossible for the engine to put out anywhere near 500 hp. But it still has 500 lb ft of torque which can still make them a very fast car at legal speeds.

The reason I bring this up is because forced induction can have a very similar effect. That has a lot to do with why an A4 with 252 hp is faster than a 290 hp TLX.

ronricks

I had a 2008 TLS before I got my 2014 TL SHAWD. Both of them are faster than the 2017 and 2016 TLX SHAWD's I have had as loaners. 290 hp is way behind the competition. Which is why so many people have left Acura for other brands that offer more performance. I am a loyal Acura customer but if they don't offer a performance engine for the 6G I am moving on to another brand and from reading on here I am not alone.

BEAR-AvHistory

Would agree to a limited extent but disagree a bit on red line. Most true performance big blocks were mechanical lifter engines while the boulevard cruiser big blocks were hydraulic lifter. Back in the day the hydraulic lifters did not have the rev capacity they have today.

Two that I owned with solids 1962 409/409 2X4 Chevy 409BHP @ 6000rpm 420ftlbs @ 4000. Red Line 6200RPM. In 1963 they did have a boulevard version 340HP @ 5000RPM. 1967 Stingray 427Cu in. 3X2 435BHP @5800rpm 460ftlbs @ 4000rpm Red line 6500rpm.

Most other brands also had big block solid lifter engine with red lines in the 6K range. They also had boulevard verions with hydraulic lifter that typically topped out at 5200/5500RPM.

Same pattern also held true of the various performance line small blocks. Hydraulics in the 5K & soilds in the 6K ranges.

BEAR-AvHistory

Without stepping on too many toes I hope. Have turned in my 435 & will be picking up my 440 on the 28th at the BMW performance center in Greer, SC. They gave me a 2017 330 4 door to cover the spread.. Its a 4 cylinder turbo which turned out to be surprisingly quick..

Was challenged by a dark window tinted TLX @ the 540 six forks north traffic light. The devil made me want t see what would happen. The 330 pulled right from the start & had no issues handling the TLX.

Since that intersection is a 2 into 1 going north he had no chance for a Ricer flyby but did ride my bumper till he turned off pretty much confirming he had run hard. Don't know it the TLX driver is a member here but would be interested to know what version he had..

SergeyM

Have just test-driven 2018 AWD A-Spec and it for sure needs more power.
It definitely felt much weaker than my wife's BMW 328 that I used to get to my Acura dealership. Everything else was great though - the steering, suspension, interior and exterior, even doors sounded good when slammed.

Because of this over-all greatness the car begs for better, more powerful engine. I wish Acura would buy the 3.0 liter turbo from BMW and put it into A-Spec or at least the turbo 4 from Civic SI.

The monthly lease they offered with all fees and 7% NJ tax was $609 and this is a $55K BMW 340 territory.

SergeyM

Sorry, meant Type R engine.

F23A4

Sounds like a fun run up on 78 or 287 may be in order. Granted my 3.5 FWD isn't as laden as the SH-AWD model.

jjsC5

.

I'm very familiar with all the cars you mention. But there were many cars such as the Cobra Jet 428 that was said to be grossly over rated. But truth is that it was a very low tech, low stressed engine. Ditto the 440 Mopars.

neuronbob

With or without down payment? Any incentives given? Assuming the MF and residual are the same as mine (0.0011 and 60%). My "first payment only down" lease payment was somewhat less than that after my even higher 7.75% sales tax and fees. I ask only because it's difficult to compare leases unless most factors are known.

SebringSilver

Not to mention the permitted mileage. That's also an important consideration.