goredcar

A friend of a friend is braging that it would be no contest between a late 90's Z28 and my CLS. I have no idea what the capabilities of the Z are, and I don't want to get into a situation where I am blown out of the water. My mods are listed... do you think I would have any chance?

My big concern is my tires... I am running the Toyo TPTs which break loose really easily.

Suggestions?

65 Fury Convert

Is the Z28 auto or manual? Does he have any mods? If not it'll be very close.

goredcar

This will sound stupid... but I don't know if it auto or manual, but I do know that it is stock. Are these the years that they were dropping the corvette 350 into them? If so, that scares me a little, although I know that they detuned them a bit.

03 CL TypeS

You have no chance.

If he's got a 98-02 Z28, then he's got the 350hp Corvette 5.7L LS1 engine. Those cars run low 13s stock and trap 107ish mph. Stick or auto.

He'll take you out of the hole, and would also destroy you from a roll.

You're wrong about the de-tuning. They badged the 1998 Z28 as a "305 hp" car, but all LS1-powered cars (Camaro's, Firebird's and Corvette's) put down just over 300hp @ the wheels. You would think the Corvette's make more power, but because of their independent rear suspension, they suffer higher drivetrain losses in contrast to the solid rear-axle f-bodies. Bottom line is that an LS1 is and LS1 is an LS1 (regardless of body / model)... and they will all run low 13s with semi-competent drivers.

goredcar

I was afraid of that... thanks for the heads up.

By the way... how is your clutch holding up? I think that mine is done. Was out driving yesterday and after a hard launch in 1st, the shift to 2nd produced lots of revs and no power.

03 CL TypeS

No prob... I owned a 98 Z28 a few years ago so I know a few things about them!

As for the clutch, no complaints nor concerns... mind you mine only has 22K miles on it.

goredcar

I am at a little over double your mileage (56K miles), and I have no idea how the car was driven before I got it. i just wish there was some way to verify that is really a clutch problem.

fiveoh-tl

Not bashing........so don't take offense .........first off most stock LS1s do NOT run low 13s stock.......most are in the mid to high 13 range.

Secondly, I don't think Chevy ever advertised the LS1 @ 305hp......you sure you're not getting mixed up w/ the Mustang Mach 1??? The LS1 was rated @ 325 and 345 w/ the factory SLP kit. Also, ALL LS1s don't run over 300rwhp (manuals are close, autos are more in the 280 range)......the ones w/ the SLP package get just over. LS1s need i/e work to get over 300 to the ground.

Either way, goredcar doesn't have much of a chance...........unless he gets some serious real estate.

chevyjase

AGREED

Considering I've owned 6 different camaro's, firebirds ect. I would say the CL-S 6speed would only have a marginal chance SC-ed, I/E with descent tire and suspension set-up if the camaro was stock.......

But don't pull up beside my '69 with your CL-S unless you have a rocket strapped to your roof

quikcls

i think you can edge out a z28 in stock form if your sc'ed

03 CL TypeS

Hey no offence taken! But they do run low 13 stock. A few guys in my area have done it, and quite a lot of members over at LS1.com. Mind you some of these "stock" cars have gone through their initial set of tires and are surely running something stickier for traction, such as Nitto's. A few guys have even nailed 12.999's with them - stock.

I had an all-motor CRX that ran 13.7 @ 102 on street tires, and when I got my Camaro, it felt like a rocketship compared to the CRX. Though I never hit the track with it, I know it was significantly faster... a low 13 second car without a doubt.

Chevy did advertise the LS1 at 305hp... the 98 Z28 I had for example. The SS / SLP Camaro's had slightly more / but an insignificant amount.

fiveoh-tl

I'm on LS1.com too. The guys running those times are "somewhat" stock - i/e......which are mods nonetheless.

And I'd bet my house that CRX wasn't ANYWHERE near close to stock, running a 13.7 @ 102...........n2o, turbo or heavy engine modification.

I hear what you're saying about the 305, but I don't remember it........I couldn't find it when I did a internet search.

Slees

in regards to the 13.7 at 102 with the crx. looking at the trap speed and the mph that car was most likely all motor. with a goo set of DR's if not slicks. and it was probably a fairly stock motor. maybe a B20 or B18




also to the person who said Ls1' camaros dont run low 13's. my friend went 13.1 at 108 with stock tires and stock ever thing down to the air filter. he has a 2000 which doesn't even have the ls6 intake manifold. after taht he put a fast toys air lid and a cut out and went 12.8 at 112 on nitto's.


a supercharged cls would get handed its ass by that car. roll or dig.

02AV6

13.1 is a miracle on wheels for stock ls1.

When I ran 13.3 it was sort of transmaros event with 7 or 8 of them. I beat majority except those 2 who so far from stock with huge slicks, loud as hell and ran mid-high 11s.

The bone stock who lined up with me ran 13.6 to my 13.3 (street tires) , another 13.7, 13.4 was the best and 13.8 the worst out those 5. I'll see what I can do this season with 3.5L swap

02AV6

goredcar, still just set up a friendly race with camera man

03 CL TypeS

Yeah, I said it was all motor didn't I ? To be precise, a B20 block / B16 head combo (8400rpm rev limit) with 11.6cr (171whp / 141wft-lbs). Falken Azenis tires / 2.1 60' time.

Pic 1 Pic 2 Pic 3

Timeslip (p.s. I know the date is wrong on the timeslip. Click below for video proof.)

Video

I had Tein HA's 20-way adjustable suspension so I jacked up the rear and set it stiff / lowered the front and made it soft as much as possible. This kept the backward weight transfer to a minimum, giving me great traction. I could have easily nailed a mid 13 sec pass that day, if for the only fact that my 1-2 shift took forever. Would have hit low 13s on slicks, if not better.

Would have, could have, should have... but I sold the car to buy my Z28 ... which I wrote-off 2 weeks later ... but I learned my lesson and thankfully no one was hurt.

fiveoh-tl

Your friend is one of the few......most don't see those times stock. he's got himself a factory freak.

Roadmaster

It is true that early LS1 powered base Z28, TransAm and Formula models were rated by GM at 305hp and 335lb/ft of torque. These numbers were then updated to 310 in the base LS1 cars; the 325 and 330 numbers are coming from the SS, WS6 and Firehawk cars.

Regardless the numbers were all way too low as the engines were identical (sans electronic throttle control) to the Corvette which was rated at 350hp. If you don't believe it, look at the 2004 GTO as it was rated by GM at 350hp and 365lb/ft of torque.

Secondly, I get a kick out of how many people say "A car will do this.... A car will run that..."

This is not always true. The driver may have issues, you may be running a badly tuned car, etc...

As a former honda owner that owns a Z28 and now a GTO I say race this guy. My bet is you will get beat at a roll and from a standing start. But hey it will still be fun and maybe you'll just get lucky.

Best, and be safe.

goredcar

Thanks... I know that I am definately outgunned, but it is an older car and, you are right, if not tuned right it could be sluggish, and i could get lucky.

I actually had a friend of mine with a restored 73 Challenger (340 4bbl) come over for a BBQ the other night and we took each car individuallly for a spin. He was startled at the acceleration in the CLS, and I was quite frankly a little dissapopnted in the Challenger, even though it was a car I idolized when I was young. We didn't race (our wives were there), but it would have been a close race... and I think that I would have had him. Regardless, he developed a lot of respect for an Acura V6.