Seattle Cl-S

The STS is due to be scrapped according to the rumor mills. The CTS will occupy it's position and a new, smaller, car will take the place of the CTS.

So, the CTS is competing with the 5-series type cars with a 3-series based price. Bob Lutz claimed the new CTS-V is going to blow the doors off the current M5. Obviously, he wasn't targeting the M3. After all, the CTS weighs 4000lbs and has a very usuable back seat. You can't say that about the 3-series (unless you're really tiny).

charliemike

Umm, oops?

Seattle Cl-S

As far as pricing, I think it is absolutely fair. If you want a sunroof then just buy one. The Navi at $3000 also includes a 40-gig HD and touch screen. I think you just have to get out of the mindset of Acura. Acuras have pretty much everything standard. Very few options. Most other car manufacturers nickel and dime you for options. Go look at MB. Holy crap. A $35k C-class (crap interior, BTW) can easily have $10k in options taked on. I priced out a $68k Audi RS4 and that thing didn't even have a built-in garage door opener or auto-dimming mirrors. You had to get the $5k navi package to get that. $68k and no homelink button. Trust me, the Caddy is a good deal.

mrdeeno

I'm not arguing that cars of similar size can't be compared, because of course they can. I'm arguing that these cars are not in the same class.

Fossil_TL

I'm not so sure about the reason RS4 is being compared here, it target at different target market compared to the CTS. Look at it this way, the XLR-V tops out north of 6 figures, do you think people who normally buys CL or SL would consider a XLR even though it offers similar features but much cheaper.

I think the most money I would spend on Caddilac would be around 60K, anymore than that I'd look at audi or bmw. Cad is getting there with the top players, but just not yet.

charliemike

I think his point is that you can pay a hell of a lot more for a car of the same size and not get something that comes on the CTS. Now true, the RS4 has a honkin' V8 but nevertheless I don't think anyone would pay $21k for 116hp (difference between teh RS4 and CTS DI).

Seattle Cl-S

I was just making a point using the expensive $68k RS4 because it doesn't automatically come with something as simple as a garage door button. I was referring to the post where someone mentioned that they were disappointed that the $35k base CTS doesn't even come w/ a sunroof standard.

The amount you are willing to spend on a Cadillac is obviously just an internal bias you have toward Cadillac vs the German cars. When you say Cad is "getting there" I would have to say that this new CTS just passed them on many fronts... though I've been passing Beamers/Audis/MBs in my Caddy for a couple years now (at the track)

Fossil_TL

I'm fairly certain driving a cadillac does get you the respect and all. In fact I went shopping today, and saw a new red CTS, and it is definately a looker.
The point being that Cadillac has an excellent exterior design team we all agree on that, but based on past trend that their resale value is no where near those Germans.
If CTS does well over its life time, I'd certainly pay the respect it deserves, but we'd have to wait for a few years.
I'd hate to drop 47k large sum of money and wait few years later when my vehicle would only worth 17k at trade in.

carguyrob

I have a friend that is an avid CTS fan and had a new '08 with every option within a week of them coming out (he pre-ordered it). His AWD, 3.6, Navi ran him around $49,600 with NO DISCOUNTS at all. I have ridden in the car and it is nice, but not $50K nice. It also doesn't feel nearly as fast as a TL-S (and it isn't according to the car mags)

It is also not completely well thought out. One thing that concerns him is that the Navi is hard drive based, but there is no way to update the Navi info! That's right...he has talked to Cadillac Product Designers and they didn't design a way to update the mapping information. They are trying to come up with something for 2009, but 2008 owners are stuck. It is also shocking that they don't offer Bluetooth for a cell phone in a $50K car.

I think these are two huge oversights.

Seattle Cl-S

You can get 'em for $1500-2000 off now... I haven't heard about the Navi problem. The bluetooth thing does suck but there is an aftermarket one already.

Seattle Cl-S

Alot of people talk about depreciation. It's true that they don't hold their values quite as well as some other manufacturers - especially the Japanese cars. Look at the E55 AMGs though. New, they're around the $90k mark. You can get 2005s for mid-$40k now. You can get a loaded CTS for the depreciation on one of those. Truth is, it seems that the more expensive a car, the more actual dollars you'll end up losing to depreciation. Percentage-wise, however, the hit isn't too far off of other cars. There are exceptions, of course. The E46 M3 seems to only lose about $4-5k/year.