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I used to love cars...I was truly passionate about them. I followed every make and model to the point that the parents of my friends would corner me at parties and try to quiz me on knowledge. It was really mundane stuff like engine sizes and output for a 1997 Ford Taurus but I knew it like the back of my hand. A year or so ago, a long-time family friend tried to get some information out of me about a new car and I blanked. I honestly didn't know and I felt a bit like Superman the first time he was exposed to Kryptonite...I should know it but I didn't. Several moments later, I realized why I didn't know the answer; I no longer really give two craps about most of what is being made today. Some of it obviously has to do with me no longer being nine years old with nothing but free time in which to brain-gorge on car magazines. The grown-up me realizes cars are expensive to buy and expensive to own and most of the stuff I fawned over as a child is still well out of my price range but earlier tonight, I really got to thinking about the why. Why do I no longer care? It took some time but I finally worked out the answer.
Not that many years ago, people looking for certain qualities in a car bought a certain type of car. You could buy a reliable car, a safe car, a luxurious car, a fast car, or a family car. But unless you were a bit out of left field and shopped for things like Saabs, Subarus, Volvos and VWs, you couldn't get some or all of these things in one package. If you wanted a reliable car, you bought a Camry. If you wanted a safe car, you bought a Volvo. If you wanted a luxurious car, you bought a Lexus. If you wanted a fast car, you bought a Ferrari. And if you wanted a family car, you bought a Dodge Grand Caravan. Modern cars are usually most of these things in one; reliable, safe, luxurious, and practical although depending on the model, that last point is surely up for debate. Of course there are dedicated sporty and family cars but even there, the distinction is blurring. The reason I no longer care about cars is that seems like all the manufacturers are trying to make the same car. Sedans share almost indistinguishable styling cues while minivans and SUVs are cross-breeding into the same androgynous form with only a few well-established holdouts refusing to water down their automotive DNA. The station wagon is essentially gone in the US and the few that remain have taken on the social stigma of a pocket protector...only a certain type buy them.
Another factor is that technology is advancing so rapidly, it no longer takes decades for high technology found in luxury cars bearing six-digit price tags to trickle down to everyday cars. Take airbags for example...first found in the Mercedes-Benz SEL in 1979, they didn't find their way to compact cars like the Civic until the early 90s. I remember when dad bought his RL in late '06, the keyless entry and start, voice commands, rear-view camera and other high tech equipment seemed beyond compare and yet, less than five years later, I was buying a car equipped with all that and even more for around half the price. When I was ten years old, the car I wanted more than anything in the world was the Mercedes-Benz S600. It was stately, luxurious, impeccably crafted and designed with German bank-vault precision and a cost-be-damned attitude to the finances. Compared to family cars of the time (even good ones like the Camry and Accord), the S-Class and 7-Series came from another planet it terms of design and execution. Today, there really is no such thing as a bad car. An Accord is nearly just as well made as an S550 which is just as well put together as a 760Li which is executed in a similar fashion to a Genesis. There are exceptions to the rule, especially when you reach the bottom of the price ladder (Mitsubishi Mirage territory) but even compared to econoboxes of the mid-naughties, these are stellar vehicles not only in their fit and finish but value-for-money.
The list of cars in my price bracket that I honestly desire is so short, it's sad. It's the Mazda 6 and the Subaru BRZ. That's it. Beyond my price range, I desire the Tesla Model S and the Mercedes S-Class but again, that's really all. Twenty years ago this list would have crashed the internet but now....meh. There are cars I like and cars I respect the hell out of but when it comes to making my pulse race, new car shows for me have become the equivalent of staring down the mayonnaise aisle at the grocery store. It all looks and tastes about the same...some jars just cost more than others.
Last edited by PortlandRL; 05-14-2015 at 04:33 AM.
Your complaining about cars being a compromise and blending together? Thats not true. You can get anything from a Miata to a MB AMG G-Wagon today, and thats awesome. Yes, most cars did get safer and more reliable, but they still retain their individual, unique purpose.
I wish we had more station wagons as well, but thats not what the people want, and so we do not get it. You said it yourself.
You state that "technology is advancing so rapidly, it no longer takes decades for high technology found in luxury cars bearing six-digit price tags to trickle down to everyday cars" Why is that a turnoff for you?
Accord being built at the same quality level as an S550? I drive an accord, and I seriously doubt that.
I've always loved cars and still do, there is ALWAYS something to get excited about for me, even if I can't afford it. I don't need to. Theres more to "loving cars" than knowing facts and figures and being able to afford it, its also about working on them and modifying them to your liking. I suggest you try that.
The answer to bland automotive sickness is buying an S2000.
The answer is always S2000
This.
Nothing to get your butthole to pucker up like an S2000 in the rain at full tilt when the rear starts to wiggle around.
OP, I largely agree but there are still cars out there that meet your desires, they just aren't nearly as common as before. IMO, the luxury brands are the ones that are slacking. They are just being complacent in advancing technology which is why a Mustang GT is just as fast and capable as a M4 for half the price and why a M235i costs $50k. They just ask those prices because they can and people will pay them just for the badge.
When I'm looking for a car, I look for something special. Whether that's a special car (S2k) or a special version of a normal car (TLS/330xi 6MT), it's gotta be special to me. Driving a Yukon around is not special, it's an appliance and it does excellent at the work it was designed to do. Ditto for nearly every other car on the market today.
Want something special? Check out FoST, BRZ/FRS, new Miata, etc. They are out there, just gotta find them.
The station wagon is essentially gone in the US and the few that remain have taken on the social stigma of a pocket protector...only a certain type buy them.
You crazy . As was mentioned above, I think you've been looking in the wrong places. Years ago an SUV was vanilla. Now most luxury brands have a performance model. Pickups? Utility vehicles. Now... Raptors exist. And the aftermarket now blows away anything we've seen in the past. Don't believe me... look at the thread in Car Talk about the KIA that has more money spent on upgrades than a used Civic used to go for a decade ago. I think now there are tons more options, much more variety, and in generally, just more support then ever. Challenger/Charger Hellcat anyone? Plus cars are safer and more reliable than ever. 10 years ago people would run from German makes. Now they flock to them...
Of course I'm not as "into" cars as I used to be either b/c I'd rather put my money into investments... but I'm still a car guy... always will be. And when you get older you have more money to spend (generally) which makes it even better
Originally Posted by PortlandRL
The station wagon is essentially gone in the US and the few that remain have taken on the social stigma of a pocket protector...only a certain type buy them.
As for wagons... again, you're not looking in the right areas...
I was gonna say... A Mazda 6 gets your heart pumping? Seriously?
I'd say you're just getting old.
If Ford Taurus specs got you excited back in the day, how can an Audi wagon not do the same, which puts down way more power and is much more refined.
I'd say your philosophy is flawed in a major way. Auto makers are pushing the boundaries with HP and amenities these days like never before. 75k for a 700+ hp dodge? Fuck yeah.
I think you're sad that more and more cars have a shit ton of options, that leaving room for modification is growing smaller or way more expensive.
Another car to get excited about (amongst many) is the new Miata coming out, getting back to its roots and shaving pounds rather than gaining them. 2300 pounds of goodness to flog around with the roof down and a low low starting price. What's not to like?
A lot of it is changing priorities and maturity / age. There are still a tons of options, but your priorities and what you think / feel is "pretty cool" has changed.
Cars today are better than ever IMO. Just look at the McLaren P1 and Porsche 918(boner)... I sold a modded Cyote Mustang to buy the TL-S (new baby) and was totally in love with it. I had a fully bolted BT Mazdaspeed6 prior to that, absolutely loved it too. Out of my price range I could sit here all day and type up cars. My next I'm hoping for is a ~12 Audi A6 3.0t w/APR tune, hello 380/370 AWHP/TQ and in style. There is a lot to choose from out there, just saying.
You've just grown up, that's all. Expectations change, desires change, and reality sets in.
There's still a lot of exciting new cars coming out. It's one hell of a time to be alive right now.
^
What he said.
When you were younger, your priorities were Cars, Eat, Shit, Bitches & Hoes and school.
Now think about what you do everyday and you actually think about your future, house, money, always about money, and most importantly, less energy (lazy).
Not only i was into reading about cars, i was also washing my own car, installing my coilovers, exhaust, CAI, headunit, speakers, fixing rattles.
Now fuck all of those.
So it is not that cars dont get your motor going anymore, rather it is because cars and bitches are not the only things in your life now.
Last edited by oonowindoo; 05-14-2015 at 05:38 PM.
Portland, maybe it's the opposite that is happening... maybe you are being overwhelmed with the choices.
Just a sample from the new and affordable crowd..
Don't forget, we also live in a day-and-age where mustangs, camaro's and challengers can makes over 650 horsepower. Or where the three super-cars flirt with 1,000 horsepower in a hybrid type-of-way.
Or maybe you're a lightweight purist: there's the Ariel Atom, any number of Lotus Elises/Exiges used (and a few new ones for the track), Morgan 3-wheeler, KTM X-Bow, any Factory Five car, Caterham Seven.
Like racing but don't want to spend a lot on consumables/hardware? There's the B-spec racing series (Honda Fit, Fiesta, Yaris, Versa, Mini Cooper, Mazda2, Kia Rio, etc.).
You've mentioned the Mazda 6 - sure, affordable family sedans that are modestly fun definitely exist; Accord Sport, Acura TLX, Nissan Maxima, Kia Optima, Subary Legacy, etc.
And if you wanna pony up for a serious weekend car or affordable 'goal' car?... well a few that come to mind:
Then there's the proverbial 911's, GT-R's, AMG's, Jaaaaaags, S-lines, M-lines, V-lines, blue-lines, red-lines, one-lines, two-lines, etc.
There has literally never been a better time to be a car enthusiast. Manual, Automatic, FWD, RWD, AWD, big power, high handling limits, any combination of the afore.. it's all good!
And the logic also follows: all of the cool stuff you'd have pined for (NSX, S2000, Z3 M coupe, Mazda RX7, Ferrari 355, Supra [ehhh], Corvette Z06, 911 Turbo, etc.) is cheaper today than it was when new.. so.. no excuses! But really, don't claim that cars are homogeneous (jars of mayonnaise?!) - that is simply false. Just because they adapt similar technology does not make them one and the same. All cars have seatbelts but they aren't... see where I'm going with that?
Simply go out and drive some. I don't know if you have driven many but I know it is easy to become jaded with the online arm-chair experts (like myself!) and others rambling on and on and on and on about how nothing feels as good as miata. I like to rent a quirky car every now and then, just for a day and just for fun. See if there is a Sixt or Enterprise Dream Car or Hertz rental place nearby, they occasionally get some really cool cars. Or check out a Carmax - I've driven many sports cars via Carmax. Great way to spend a Sunday.
A difference I've noticed, too, between now and when I was a kid: the rags came out once a month - I ate them up. Top Gear was something to treasure on tape if you knew somebody, information was not as readily available. It's knowledge transfer that kills some of the mystery.. but that's avoiding the car all-together! THEY ARE MADE TO BE EXPERIENCED, not fussed about with wahoos on a forum (oooh the irony!). GO TEST DRIVE THEM and find that spark again. If it's dead, so be it, be fortunate you'll get out much richer than if you stay in
The answer to bland automotive sickness is buying an S2000.
The answer is always S2000
I drove mine to work the last two days. S2000 is the answer to any automotive question.
Originally Posted by oo7spy
Paging Dr. Bob...
You rang? Oh, yes:
Originally Posted by PortlandRL
The station wagon is essentially gone in the US and the few that remain have taken on the social stigma of a pocket protector...only a certain type buy them.
Whachu talkin' about foo?
Back to the OP....what has happened to you, my young friend, is that you have grown up to decide that cars are an A to B appliance. You are just going through a phase. Having a career and a family do that to car guys occasionally because you have to get through each day as best possible, and, as you said, you don't have (meaning you don't make) the time to do as you once enjoyed.
Either that, or you are suffering from anhedonia (the abandonment of pleasurable activities) in the context of depression about said job, driving a plebeian Hyundai, or something else. You just need someone to take you for a spin in a 6MT V wagon to get your spirits up. Or some sertraline.
You'll be back, and your car guy buddies here will be waiting for you to post that you got that Tesla Model S you've been wanting for a while, or a BR-Z/FR-S.
There was a point in time where I felt I could really gauge the opinions of people here. I guess this one was a swing and a miss.
After giving this some thought, I think you guys are right on a few things. I've always owned practical cars because it's something my parents always did and still do. Not once has either of my folks (or ANYONE in my family) bought the slick, sexy car of their dreams...they settled for second-best, the vehicle they can drive for years because it does what they need but they never really feel any connection with. And meanwhile they continue to ogle the car they truly want through the window of the one they're forcing themselves to drive. Mom did just this with her MDX. She's wanted an Audi A5 since they first came out and dad offered to get her one. Nope...she refused. "No room for the dogs." He countered, saying the RX300 could stay and remain the 'dog car' but again, she refused and to this day, every time an A5 goes by, I swear I can almost hear the panting.
Because I'm genetically pre-disposed to buy cars based solely on their price and practical qualities, I suppose I have begun to view them as appliances. Before I bought the Santa Fe, I considered a Genesis Coupe 3.8 Track but stopped because I was still under 25 at the time and the insurance would have been ASTRONOMICAL. I could easily trade my car in on something sexy and fun but I have things I'm saving up for that are more important like a house of my own. Once I have that and my career is on track, then I can think about the fun stuff but until then, I'll stick with my Maytag on four wheels.
you have the option of picking cooler used vehicles that perform in some way, shape or form and is also practical.
i found that this option provides me with a long lasting vehicle while itching my fun side.
Think about it... these days you have lightweight front engine/rear drive cars for under $25k. You can get 400+ HP modern day muscle cars for about $30k and you can push supercar territory with cars like the Hellcat that have over 700HP for ~$60k base. That's just insane.
I mean really, scroll through trackappraiser's post... and that's just the tip of the iceberg. Coupes, sedans, wagons, hatches, SUV's, even pickups... most This is probably one of the best time to be a car guy in recent memory. It's even a great time to not be a car guy b/c so many options are available to the Average Joe...
I think justin kind of nailed it... you need to get out of your Hyundai
Last edited by juniorbean; 05-15-2015 at 09:06 AM.
I understand your prudence, Portland. Get your real-world goals done (especially HOUSE) first, then get the car of your dreams. Completely understandable. As I said above, we'll still be here when you break out of your boringmobile stage, and we will cheer you on.
I understand your prudence, Portland. Get your real-world goals done (especially HOUSE) first, then get the car of your dreams. Completely understandable. As I said above, we'll still be here when you break out of your boringmobile stage, and we will cheer you on.
Agreed.
But Portland, there are a lot of ways to have your cake an eat it too... so don't overlook those! Buying pre-owned is the way to go. Let some other sucker take that first year hit
Last edited by juniorbean; 05-15-2015 at 09:10 AM.
All those cars posted above are all the same. Each company is just copying each other. Each one of those cars has 4 wheels, 2 headlights, 2 tail lights, a steering wheel, windows... wtf. How about some originality here for once!!
There was a point in time where I felt I could really gauge the opinions of people here. I guess this one was a swing and a miss.
After giving this some thought, I think you guys are right on a few things. I've always owned practical cars because it's something my parents always did and still do. Not once has either of my folks (or ANYONE in my family) bought the slick, sexy car of their dreams...they settled for second-best, the vehicle they can drive for years because it does what they need but they never really feel any connection with. And meanwhile they continue to ogle the car they truly want through the window of the one they're forcing themselves to drive. Mom did just this with her MDX. She's wanted an Audi A5 since they first came out and dad offered to get her one. Nope...she refused. "No room for the dogs." He countered, saying the RX300 could stay and remain the 'dog car' but again, she refused and to this day, every time an A5 goes by, I swear I can almost hear the panting.
Because I'm genetically pre-disposed to buy cars based solely on their price and practical qualities, I suppose I have begun to view them as appliances. Before I bought the Santa Fe, I considered a Genesis Coupe 3.8 Track but stopped because I was still under 25 at the time and the insurance would have been ASTRONOMICAL. I could easily trade my car in on something sexy and fun but I have things I'm saving up for that are more important like a house of my own. Once I have that and my career is on track, then I can think about the fun stuff but until then, I'll stick with my Maytag on four wheels.
You have the right mentality so don't think you're wrong at all. A "fun" car should not be your only car. Wait until you have everything set and then get something fun. A car is a tool and as such, you should get the right tool for the job at hand. Having a small two seater as your only car is frustrating and will bring you to not enjoying the car. Having that small two seater in addition to the correct tool you need for your lifestyle is fun.
Buy a house, pay off all of your cars, then buy the toy (preferably in cash IMO). On the flip side, your main DD doesn't need to be a boring POS. The MDX is not a boring car, its comfortable, powerful, luxurious, and reliable. If you want boring, go buy a base model eco box. There are a lot of great cars that function as a DD that aren't expensive and aren't boring (Accord Sport 6MT).
FWIW, now is a great time to get into buying a toy if you have the means. There are a lot of relatively inexpensive cars on the market right now that are poised to appreciate in the near future because these are the dream cars of a lot of younger people that are now able to afford one. Examples: S2000, NSX, Supra, Pontiac G8 GXP, Mustang SVT Cobra from early 00's, etc. The values of the Porsche 993 have skyrocketed for the very same reason and have gone up by as much as 400%-500% in the past two years.
Portland, making responsible decisions is always the right decision. Creating regrets, however, are the wrong ones.
The best way is always a two-car strategy. 1) Reliable, comfortable, practical. 2) fun or whatever you want it to be that the first one doesn't do and vice versa. That way you don't need to compromise on either. Financial stability takes however long it needs to - your experiences in life are your own. No rush, brotha, everyone has their own pace. I, too, made up every financial reason to wait: retirement fund, bigger rainy day fund, nicer apartment with two dedicated parking spaces, traveling, better health insurance, pay more student loans, etc. etc. etc. There'll always be something. At some point I decided to make the toy a priority, as well, for my own sake and saved for that too.
However, there is something to be said regarding motivation... I'm not advocating anyone bite off more than they can chew - but a little fire under the butt can be a fantastic thing. I'm guilty of going out on a financial limb from time to time to get a modest loan for a fun motorcycle to offset that dreadful appliance that ferried me to school & work. It gave me an incentive and greater appreciation for the hard work that was and is always ahead. And it's been my experience that that doesn't stop. Even now, I think about upgrading the house* and/or S2000 to something more.. ambitious. Blame the consumerist mentality & the variety, too many cool cars and only so much time!
I still play the craigslist game.
Set the money cap ($500 - $5,000 or $200 - $2,000 or whatever), clean title, manual transmission, and year and see what pops up. Maybe a 1986 Toyota MR2 with some refurbishing. I'd plant the idea in my head, jump on the forums, immerse myself in MR2's for months - drive one - love it but decide: nah, it just isn't the Goldilocks fit. Back to CL. Maybe a 1979 Fiat Spyder? Maybe a 1969 Karmann Ghia or Porsche 914? Or 1995 Mustang Cobra? Or 1991 VW Gti? Rinse and repeat. Kept me in that wunderlust longer, which is an exciting part of vehicle ownership - anticipation. Playing the game for months also gave me months of time to save for that toy-fund. The longer I played, the bigger the fund!
Just sharing my experience - your sentiment rings an emphatic bell, I've felt it before when I was neck-deep in sensibility.
*Ya mentioned house and this is just a little side-note. I work in CRE so this is NOT the gospel but my Wife and I are looking to upgrade homes, too. In my industry the writing on the walls is there will be a downturn in the next 5 years, cap rates and multipliers are simply not sustainable at their rates. Interest rates will go up, accordingly real estate (fingers crossed residential is impacted as heavily ) will go down 10-15% across the board. Let me rephrase that "it should go down..." Much like the CL game, the longer we wait and window-shop homes, the longer we save, the bigger the down payment, the better the house and hopefully at a reasonable price at that point. Because right now in So-Cal any upgrade to an OC, SD or LA County home with decent sized yard is an absurd amount of money. I'm sure Portland is much the same.
Portland, I'm just busting your bag a little. I see where you're coming from, but I don't think all hope is lost. In all honesty, nice/fun cars are a frivolous waste of money- they likely will never appraise in value and aren't necessary by any stretch of the imagination, however, there's nothing I enjoy more than reading through the Automotive News section here on AZ to see what's new and what's coming.
For what I want, I can't even get these days. A Japanese RWD sedan with a 6mt is a thing of the past, so I'm being forced to adapt to what is available. I too was saying just 1.5 years ago how nothing out there tickles my fancy, yet since, I've bought two cars that make me very happy. I just had to alter my thoughts a bit
Gotta have a weekend sports car of some sort in the stable. I switch out my daily drivers often but my weekend warrior has been in my stable for 10 years now.
You have the right mentality so don't think you're wrong at all. A "fun" car should not be your only car. Wait until you have everything set and then get something fun. A car is a tool and as such, you should get the right tool for the job at hand. Having a small two seater as your only car is frustrating and will bring you to not enjoying the car. Having that small two seater in addition to the correct tool you need for your lifestyle is fun.
Buy a house, pay off all of your cars, then buy the toy (preferably in cash IMO). On the flip side, your main DD doesn't need to be a boring POS. The MDX is not a boring car, its comfortable, powerful, luxurious, and reliable. If you want boring, go buy a base model eco box. There are a lot of great cars that function as a DD that aren't expensive and aren't boring (Accord Sport 6MT).
FWIW, now is a great time to get into buying a toy if you have the means. There are a lot of relatively inexpensive cars on the market right now that are poised to appreciate in the near future because these are the dream cars of a lot of younger people that are now able to afford one. Examples: S2000, NSX, Supra, Pontiac G8 GXP, Mustang SVT Cobra from early 00's, etc. The values of the Porsche 993 have skyrocketed for the very same reason and have gone up by as much as 400%-500% in the past two years.
You are telling him to be financially responsible?
05-14-2015, 04:23 AM
post!
. As was mentioned above, I think you've been looking in the wrong places. Years ago an SUV was vanilla. Now most luxury brands have a performance model. Pickups? Utility vehicles. Now... Raptors exist. And the aftermarket now blows away anything we've seen in the past. Don't believe me... look at the thread in Car Talk about the KIA that has more money spent on upgrades than a used Civic used to go for a decade ago. I think now there are tons more options, much more variety, and in generally, just more support then ever. Challenger/Charger Hellcat anyone? Plus cars are safer and more reliable than ever. 10 years ago people would run from German makes. Now they flock to them...
I like to rent a quirky car every now and then, just for a day and just for fun. See if there is a Sixt or Enterprise Dream Car or Hertz rental place nearby, they occasionally get some really cool cars. Or check out a Carmax - I've driven many sports cars via Carmax. Great way to spend a Sunday.
) will go down 10-15% across the board. Let me rephrase that "it should go down..." 
