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Well...the S2000 needed more doors, more driven wheels, and a lot more torque...

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Well...the S2000 needed more doors, more driven wheels, and a lot more torque...

 
Old 05-10-2018, 12:34 PM
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No they wouldn't. For two reasons: conservatism and safety. Your car is tuned to give a balance of fuel economy, power, and drivability. That doesn't mean it's the best tune. Hell, Hondata claims it improves on Hondas oem tunes and claim they're safer overall.
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by TacoBello View Post
No they wouldn't. For two reasons: conservatism and safety. Your car is tuned to give a balance of fuel economy, power, and drivability. That doesn't mean it's the best tune. Hell, Hondata claims it improves on Hondas oem tunes and claim they're safer overall.
Then they should back it up with their own warranty?

I'd do it in a heartbeat if that were the case...
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Old 05-10-2018, 12:59 PM
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Doesn't VW offer APR tunes via the dealer, with warranty? Or does that not apply on the R?
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Old 05-10-2018, 01:43 PM
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LOL...no fucking way...
I'm almost positive they do not sanction that...
maybe there's a dealer that's specifically tune/mod friendly that partners...but I can't see the brand backing it.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
Doesn't VW offer APR tunes via the dealer, with warranty? Or does that not apply on the R?
VW doesn't offer the warranty, APR does but only sometimes and only on stage 1 tunes and only if done by them and only for 3/36 which is half of the warranty I have now.

IMO, it's not worth it yet.

Edit:
They've changed their tune (lol) on the warranty side, now it just says "to match original factory warranty". Hmm...I might reach out and ask if they match the 6/72 VW now has and if so I may go ahead and do this. They charge $1200 for the tune though so it's not as cheap as a DIY exercise.

Originally Posted by rockstar143 View Post
LOL...no fucking way...
I'm almost positive they do not sanction that...
maybe there's a dealer that's specifically tune/mod friendly that partners...but I can't see the brand backing it.
It doesn't even matter with VW how friendly the dealer is. The software automatically checks and flags the car's VIN for unapproved tunes and unapproved flashes when it's plugged in for diagnostics. The tech does nothing to trigger this so there's no such thing as a tune friendly VW dealer.

Last edited by SamDoe1; 05-10-2018 at 02:14 PM.
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:23 PM
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Good to know. After I posted that, I had to re-think, as I had driven the GTI & Mini a day apart. I had read about the APR+ tune or something like that, but if it halves your warranty, no way.
It was Mini that offers dealer installed/warrantied Dinan tunes. At least that's what the 2 salesguys were telling me
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Old 05-10-2018, 02:27 PM
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1 View Post
VW doesn't offer the warranty, APR does but only sometimes and only on stage 1 tunes and only if done by them and only for 3/36 which is half of the warranty I have now.

IMO, it's not worth it yet.

Edit:
They've changed their tune (lol) on the warranty side, now it just says "to match original factory warranty". Hmm...I might reach out and ask if they match the 6/72 VW now has and if so I may go ahead and do this. They charge $1200 for the tune though so it's not as cheap as a DIY exercise.



It doesn't even matter with VW how friendly the dealer is. The software automatically checks and flags the car's VIN for unapproved tunes and unapproved flashes when it's plugged in for diagnostics. The tech does nothing to trigger this so there's no such thing as a tune friendly VW dealer.
I think that's just it. If a tune is bad, you'll know within 6 months. Maybe even sooner. If not, they could warranty it for the life of the engine. They just match VWs warranty because, meh, why not? Remember, they warranty the engine only if the engine fails because of the tune itself. I think the likelihood of engine failure due to just a modest recalibration is rather small- otherwise you'd be hearing cases of owners and blown tuned engines all over the VW forums (and I suspect that isn't the case).
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Old 05-11-2018, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by rockstar143 View Post
LOL...no fucking way...
I'm almost positive they do not sanction that...
maybe there's a dealer that's specifically tune/mod friendly that partners...but I can't see the brand backing it.
I'm not sure how it works but supposedly there are some Audi dealers that will tune certain models, and by going through the dealer you don't void the warranty..
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:10 AM
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There are a couple different options to tune while still retaining some sort of warranty. As you already know, you can get APR+, which covers stage 1 low torque tune, TCU, intake, catback, and intercooler. All aftermarket parts must be APR and APR will warranty any failure, but you will get flagged TD1 if taken to the dealer. The cost of the tunes are about twice as much, but I've never read anything about people breaking anything with the low output tunes. This is a pretty reliable option, given you properly warm up the oil before going into boost and let the car cool down before turning it off.

Another option is a piggyback setup such as JB4 or Neuspeed Power Module. The JB4 has been proven to make gains as much as any flash tune when on map 6. The problem with this is that you are essentially tuning the car yourself. I don't really care how knowledgeable these people on the forums think they are, I wouldn't feel comfortable going by Joe Blow's settings. You can set the car on map 2, which is probably similar to the gains from APR+. This is a good option since you can remove it before going to the dealer and it doesn't flash the ECU. The downside to not flashing the ECU is that the stock parameters are still in place, which might detect overboost, torque targets, and top speed limiter.

The MK7's are worlds above the previous generations. The motors/trans are strong and reliable. There aren't any electrical gremlins popping up. The only weak point on the car that I'm reading is the turbo. When people blow their turbo, I believe they aren't warming up/cooling down their cars properly. I think they are running very aggressive tunes, or even stacking JB4 on top of their flash tune to make even more boost. I had full intentions on waiting to tune my car, but everything I'm reading shows they are reliable. Keep it stock for 6-12 months and see if any issues pop up. I'm sure once you go for a ride in a modified R, you'll rethink waiting until your warranty is up.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:14 AM
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In this day and age, you shouldn't have to cool down your turbo car, unless highly modified. That was from the 80s and early 90s... unless they're using some seriously archaic turbo system.

I do agree with the warm up, though. I mean, you should let any engine warm up before romping on it... but cooling down? There's a reason turbo timers aren't all that common anymore.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:28 AM
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Originally Posted by TacoBello View Post
In this day and age, you shouldn't have to cool down your turbo car, unless highly modified. That was from the 80s and early 90s... unless they're using some seriously archaic turbo system.

I do agree with the warm up, though. I mean, you should let any engine warm up before romping on it... but cooling down? There's a reason turbo timers aren't all that common anymore.
The reason I say this is because the engine oil runs through the turbo, so if you're romping on your car and then shut it down, the hot oil is probably not good for the turbo's longevity. Maybe it's a little overkill, but I feel better sitting at idle for a min or two if I was just going WOT.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:35 AM
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Or just coast for your last ~1 minute of driving. I assume most would already be in a neighborhood, or just entering one, so letting the car coast as much as possible, or just staying out of boost should net the same. I believe it was mandatory in the past due to the turbos using steel ball bearings, where they now use ceramics? Jeez, I remember reading about this stuff a few years back, but it's slipping my mind these days.

I tried doing the same when I had my turbo sonata.. did it for about 2 weeks and then said F-it Ain't nobody got time for dat! Also did some digging and it was stated that the cool down was unnecessary [specific to that car] due to how the system operated.. I think the turbo was cooled by coolant lines? I don't remember.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:40 AM
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Originally Posted by Predatorbird View Post
There are a couple different options to tune while still retaining some sort of warranty. As you already know, you can get APR+, which covers stage 1 low torque tune, TCU, intake, catback, and intercooler. All aftermarket parts must be APR and APR will warranty any failure, but you will get flagged TD1 if taken to the dealer. The cost of the tunes are about twice as much, but I've never read anything about people breaking anything with the low output tunes. This is a pretty reliable option, given you properly warm up the oil before going into boost and let the car cool down before turning it off.

Another option is a piggyback setup such as JB4 or Neuspeed Power Module. The JB4 has been proven to make gains as much as any flash tune when on map 6. The problem with this is that you are essentially tuning the car yourself. I don't really care how knowledgeable these people on the forums think they are, I wouldn't feel comfortable going by Joe Blow's settings. You can set the car on map 2, which is probably similar to the gains from APR+. This is a good option since you can remove it before going to the dealer and it doesn't flash the ECU. The downside to not flashing the ECU is that the stock parameters are still in place, which might detect overboost, torque targets, and top speed limiter.

The MK7's are worlds above the previous generations. The motors/trans are strong and reliable. There aren't any electrical gremlins popping up. The only weak point on the car that I'm reading is the turbo. When people blow their turbo, I believe they aren't warming up/cooling down their cars properly. I think they are running very aggressive tunes, or even stacking JB4 on top of their flash tune to make even more boost. I had full intentions on waiting to tune my car, but everything I'm reading shows they are reliable. Keep it stock for 6-12 months and see if any issues pop up. I'm sure once you go for a ride in a modified R, you'll rethink waiting until your warranty is up.
Yeah, let me keep it for more than 2 weeks before tossing a tune on lol. If I do it, it'll be APR+ to retain warranty. I'm not going to take that gamble for a couple hundred dollar savings. I know a lot of people have no issues with APR1 tunes but all it takes is be being the one stuck with a $10k bill for a new motor for any reason to make me regret everything.

Originally Posted by TacoBello View Post
In this day and age, you shouldn't have to cool down your turbo car, unless highly modified. That was from the 80s and early 90s... unless they're using some seriously archaic turbo system.

I do agree with the warm up, though. I mean, you should let any engine warm up before romping on it... but cooling down? There's a reason turbo timers aren't all that common anymore.
Electric water and oil pumps (as well as radiator fan) run after the car is shut off to cool the turbo if needed. Drive it hard and shut it off, then go pop the hood and see what's going on. Fan runs and you can hear the coolant and oil pumps working. No need to do manual cool down periods.

Originally Posted by Predatorbird View Post
The reason I say this is because the engine oil runs through the turbo, so if you're romping on your car and then shut it down, the hot oil is probably not good for the turbo's longevity. Maybe it's a little overkill, but I feel better sitting at idle for a min or two if I was just going WOT.
See above, you're just wasting gas. Back when those pumps were engine driven and not electric, I'd agree but that's not the case anymore.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by TacoBello View Post
Or just coast for your last ~1 minute of driving. I assume most would already be in a neighborhood, or just entering one, so letting the car coast as much as possible, or just staying out of boost should net the same. I believe it was mandatory in the past due to the turbos using steel ball bearings, where they now use ceramics? Jeez, I remember reading about this stuff a few years back, but it's slipping my mind these days.

I tried doing the same when I had my turbo sonata.. did it for about 2 weeks and then said F-it Ain't nobody got time for dat! Also did some digging and it was stated that the cool down was unnecessary [specific to that car] due to how the system operated.. I think the turbo was cooled by coolant lines? I don't remember.
They may use coolant to cool it but they still use a thin sheet of oil as a bearing surface and that's the bigger problem. There's only a very small handful of consumer applications where they use ball bearings instead of hydrodynamic bearings for supporting the turbine shaft because of the longevity reasons.
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Old 05-11-2018, 09:58 AM
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There's some cool tech coming forward with turbos these days... a kit I was looking at for my Z features an oil less turbo... and guys have been having good success with it for a couple years now.
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Old 05-11-2018, 02:49 PM
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I meant a dealer that backs it themselves, not backs it on behalf of the manufacturer. It was also conjecture based on what he had heart.
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Old 05-11-2018, 02:59 PM
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Warranty ...

Just send it.
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Old 05-14-2018, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by TylerT View Post
Warranty ...

Just send it.
Not as adventurous as you with cars lol. Especially not with new ones that someone else will fix for me for the next 6 years.

Also, hatchbacks gonna hatchback.
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Old 05-14-2018, 08:04 PM
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You're a dork, and I love it.
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Old 05-15-2018, 11:02 AM
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J ... I see a pineapple in there.

He gets it!

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Old 05-15-2018, 11:39 AM
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that pesto is so good.
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Old 05-15-2018, 12:05 PM
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Sam's setting up his grow op again, I see...
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Old 05-15-2018, 12:38 PM
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Originally Posted by gnuts View Post
that pesto is so good.
Kirkland FTW on just about everything lol.

Originally Posted by TacoBello View Post
Sam's setting up his grow op again, I see...
Gotta pay for the car somehow...
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Old 05-15-2018, 01:15 PM
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I wasn't judging. Just making note
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Old 05-21-2018, 08:50 AM
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I saw this car listed in your signature but somehow looked over the thread

Congratulations! I'm in love with the new R and would love to drive one. I look forward to seeing more pictures
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Old 05-21-2018, 10:16 AM
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Sam, one thing I've noticed in my 2 test drives in the GTI (took an Autobahn for a spin on Friday).
The seat belt buckle has no flex to it & seems to stick up higher than it should
Just doesn't seem to cinch the lap belt down as well as just about every other car I've ever driven. Maybe it's just me?
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Old 05-21-2018, 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
Sam, one thing I've noticed in my 2 test drives in the GTI (took an Autobahn for a spin on Friday).
The seat belt buckle has no flex to it & seems to stick up higher than it should
Just doesn't seem to cinch the lap belt down as well as just about every other car I've ever driven. Maybe it's just me?
I haven't noticed anything strange about the seat belt buckles in mine... They fit me just fine and cinch down no problem.

I can snap a picture later but I'm 99% sure they are the exact same as in the GTI.
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Old 05-21-2018, 12:13 PM
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No issues with my seat belts either.
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Old 05-21-2018, 12:59 PM
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Thanks, it definitely stood out to me on the 2 drives I've had, like the arm that the buckle is mounted to has no flex & held it out just a bit too far.
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Old 05-21-2018, 07:04 PM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
Thanks, it definitely stood out to me on the 2 drives I've had, like the arm that the buckle is mounted to has no flex & held it out just a bit too far.
Looked at them for my drive home and they are the same. Not totally rigid but not a ton of flex. That said, I didn't notice any issues even though I was paying a ton of attention to it from your comment. Maybe you had the seat too low?
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Old 05-21-2018, 08:54 PM
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Hatchbacks>>>>>>Sedans!
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Old 05-22-2018, 10:03 AM
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Originally Posted by SamDoe1 View Post
Looked at them for my drive home and they are the same. Not totally rigid but not a ton of flex. That said, I didn't notice any issues even though I was paying a ton of attention to it from your comment. Maybe you had the seat too low?
I did have the seat fully bottomed out, maybe that was it.
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Old 05-22-2018, 10:07 AM
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Maybe you're too skinny? Cram a few Christmas hams into your waist band...
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Old 05-22-2018, 10:08 AM
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6'0" 150lbs
#weightreductionbro
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Old 05-22-2018, 10:41 AM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
I did have the seat fully bottomed out, maybe that was it.
Probably. They do need to accommodate all sizes of people in the car, some concessions need to be made. In any case, it isn't even an issue IMO.

Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
6'0" 150lbs
#weightreductionbro
Holy shit, eat a sandwich dude.
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Old 05-22-2018, 11:24 AM
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yeah, seriously...
my audi has tall seatbelt straps too...
I honestly think it's the way the Germans designed it so you can buckle up with one hand...semi firm and stiff and tall enough to be over your leg...
ease of use.
that's actually the easiest seatbelt I have to put on.
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Old 05-22-2018, 04:13 PM
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Curious, since I didn't see it in your rundown on P1, and may not have even been on your radar.
Did you take an Alltrack for a drive? Obviously, it's way less powerful, but curious.
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Old 05-22-2018, 04:19 PM
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Yes I drove it. The Alltrack is a lifted Golf wagon designed to appeal to people who say they don't want a wagon but don't want to admit to themselves that they actually want a wagon. It's not even in the same league as even the GTI in terms of performance. It does have a lot more trunk space though.

In Europe you can get a Golf R wagon...which I would have bought in a heartbeat if it was available here.

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Old 05-22-2018, 04:39 PM
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Thanks, I figured it wouldn't have near the performance of the GTI, with the 1.8T.

That Golf R Wagon is
A GTI Wagon would work too.

Shame the numbers aren't there for them here.
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Old 05-23-2018, 08:38 AM
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Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 View Post
Thanks, I figured it wouldn't have near the performance of the GTI, with the 1.8T.

That Golf R Wagon is
A GTI Wagon would work too.

Shame the numbers aren't there for them here.
There is an IS38 (Golf R turbo) swap option for the Alltrack and they hold their own down the 1/4 mile. The AWD launch puts them on par with GTI's with the same swap.
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