McLaren MP4 [WARNING: Technical Material]

Reply Subscribe

Thread Tools

Search this Thread

Sep 18, 2010 | 04:47 PM

ghttf

Thread Starter

Joined: Oct 2007

Posts: 1,038

Likes: 0

McLaren MP4 [WARNING: Technical Material]

Quote:

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa_oa_arrows.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa_oa_arrows.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa_oa_arrows-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

As cool as this naked chassis is, I would rather have a 2012 McLaren MP4-12C at home in my driveway, up on jackstands with the wheels off. Why? Getting one to my home would involve me driving it, of course.

But McLaren isn't quite ready to hand out keys just yet, not even for those who come armed with a quarter-million dollars in cash. No, even the paying customers must wait.

In this unfortunate reality, a de-bodied protoype like this is a more-than-acceptable substitute.

Already, we can see something interesting. The McLaren MP4-12C is not a unibody machine: the car gets all the strength it needs from what lies beneath the skin. The body itself adds a bit of rollover crash structure, aerodynamic scuplting and, of course, a heaping helping of bad-assedness, but you could drive one that looks like this with little trouble.

But the MP4-12C isn't a body-on-frame vehicle either, not really. That's because the heart of the "frame" is a single-piece carbon-fiber monocoque (yellow) that weighs just 80 pounds. I guess we can call this body-on-monocoque construction. Whatever the term, it's put together very much like a prototype racecar you might see at Le Mans or Daytona.

The engine, transmission and rear suspension are carried by an aluminum trusswork (orange) that's bolted behind. This sort of trusswork isn't found in racing applications where the engine block itself is a so-called "stressed member" that doubles as the rear half on the frame. Here the engine is "unstressed", so the trusswork is needed to do exactly what it looks like it's doing.

Meanwhile, that aluminum beam up front is not much more than a deformable crash structure and a place to hang the nose.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_oa-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Even though it's hard to see now, I can tell you from a test-sit in a full-bodied example that the monocoque provides plenty of space for occupants that stand well over 6 feet tall. In fact, McLaren tells me that 6-foot 7-inches was the upper end of their design envelope. Partial credit goes to the generously telescopic steering wheel that's supported by that magnesium dash support bracket.

Meanwhile, the gas tank sits beneath that shelf behind the seats.
 
 
 

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_oa.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_oa.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_oa-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Finally, some suspension bits to look at. To the surprise of no one, the McLaren's front suspension is comprised of double wishbones, a front-mounted steering rack and a coil-over shock absorber. And, of course, it's all made of "aluminium".

But this looks too clean and simple. Something's missing. What could it be?

I'll give you a few panels to figure it out.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_uarm_shck.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_uarm_shck.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_uarm_shck-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

In keeping with a construction theme we'll see repeated throughout, the MP4's upper control arm bushings have a tie-bar (yellow) that's bolted directly into bosses that are bonded into the side of the monocoque.

The shock absorbers have independent external adjustments (black) for compression and rebound damping force, with the uppermost one for compression and the lowermost for rebound. The electrical connectors at the ends (white) indicate that the adjustments are computer-controlled.

 
 
 

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_upshkmt.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_upshkmt.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_upshkmt-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Here again, we can see how the upper shock tower bolts to another boss molded into the monocoque.

Are those hoses making you curious? Don't worry if the light bulb still hasn't flicked on.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_ushck_hose.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_ushck_hose.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_ushck_hose-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Enough torture. The missing front suspension element is...a front stabilizer bar. The MP4-12C hasn't got one. Go ahead. Scroll back a couple of pictures and have another look. I'll wait.

What the McLaren has fitted instead is a complex series of tubes. These hoses (yellow) connect to the opposite side to form a hydraulic stabilizer bar that can be computer controlled. But to make it work they must cross over one another: the compression valve on this side connects to the rebound valve on the other side, and vice-versa.

Imagine you're in a sweeping bend. Naturally, the body wants to roll toward the outside, and this causes the outer shock to compress while the inner one grows. With this system, the pressure rise in the outer shock is re-routed across the car so it can repel the extension of the inner one, and vice-versa. But this only works if the hoses are "cross-wired", rebound to compression.

Here's another cool bit. There are valves, accumulators and electronics between the two interconnected hoses, and their presence allows the roll stiffness to be continuously variable, even during a single corner. For example: the system can be programmed to roll-in softly then firm-up as g-forces rise.

You can't do anything like that with a regular anti-roll bar, a simple bent piece of steel that tries to counteract body roll by simple torsion. Such a bar can only have one roll stiffness value. Even the adjustable ones have to be physically moved and "set" into one position.

Sebastian Loeb's all-conquering Citroen world-rally car once had a setup like this, and it was so effective it was later banned. More recently, a similar (but far less exquisite-looking) system is offered as an option in the new 2011 Infiniti QX-56 SUV. (We'll see more of that in an upcoming walkaround.)

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_hoses_across_strg.jpg" ><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_hoses_across_strg .jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_hoses_across_strg-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Still not getting it? Here's the pair of crossover pipes (green) that plumb one side to the other. Both are connected via pressure lines to a control valve assembly (yellow) that sits on the floor of the front sub-frame. Those black dumbbell ends are the accumulators. One thing that's missing from this rolling chassis is a pair of matching pressure lines running up from the rear of the car.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_strg_pump_accum.jpg">< img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_strg_pump_accum.j pg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_strg_pump_accum-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Keep looking at the control valve assembly if you want, but this picture is all about the steering. The MP4-12C uses rack-and-pinion steering, and McLaren engineers told me they wanted to use hydraulic power steering for its superior feel. But electric power steering would have helped engine-bay packaging and parasitic power loss by eliminating the belt-driven pump, the belt hardware itself and the need for long hose runs.

To get both benefits, McLaren fitted this electric-driven hydraulic pump (black), which feeds the rack directly via short lines (yellow). This, then, is electro-hydraulic or electric-over-hydraulic power steering, and it's the best of both worlds.

Meanwhile, this small gap (green) shows that the front suspension and steering subframe is independent of that front crash structure.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_lock.jpg "><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_loc k.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_lock-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

In order to give the carbon monocoque the maximum possible stiffness despite door cutouts, clearances must be tight. They're so tight, in fact that there's no place for traditional door hinges. Instead, the door hinges attach higher-up (yellow). And that's why...

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_door.jpg "><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_doo r.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_tireclearance_door-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

...the McLaren MP4-12C has "dihedral" scissor doors. Please don't call them Lambo doors.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_std.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_std.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_std-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

The standard front brakes use 4-piston fixed calipers and two-piece front rotors made up of aluminum hubs and ventilated and cross-drilled cast-iron rotors. But there is an upgrade available, even though most owners won't need it. At this price range, it's a "want" thing.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_ccb.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_ccb.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_fr_det_brk_ccb-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

I give you 6-piston fixed calipers and cross-drilled carbon-ceramic rotors. The little thingy above (yellow) is a brake cooling duct.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Moving to the rear, we can see another pair of wishbones and another coil-over shock. But wait? Is that (yellow) a stabilizer bar? No, it isn't.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa_R.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa_R.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_oa_R-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

See? Here on the right-rear there's nothing where the link on the other side attached to. This is something we've never seen before, so let's look at this again.

<img alt="2010_MP412C_800_sus_rr_det_zbar_L.jpg" class="full-size" height="426" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_800_sus_rr_det_zbar_L-thumb-320x426.jpg" width="320" /><img alt="2010_MP412C_800_sus_rr_det_zbar_R.jpg" class="full-size" height="426" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_800_sus_rr_det_zbar_R-thumb-320x426.jpg" width="320" /></form>

This is what they call a "z-bar" or "heave spring", and it's not something you see outside of high-level racing. And by high-level I mean high levels of aerodynamic downforce.</form>

A stabilizer bar is u-shaped (albiet a wide U), so it does nothing when both wheels compress together. Its job is to resist body roll, to dampen the suspension from being fully independent, in effect, when the wheels are moving in opposite directions, such as they do in body roll.</form>

Because one leg goes forward and the other aft, a z-bar (or heave spring) is exactly the opposite animal. In corners, it does nothing to inhibit roll. If one wheel hits a bump, it's not going to put up much of a fight. But when both wheels compress together, as they might when a huge wing is creating a ton of downforce, the z-bar becomes a spring that counteracts that force. This allows the coil springs at the wheels to be relatively soft for good mechanical grip and drivable comfort.</form>

You don't see this often because not many cars make enough downforce, either because they don't really have a big rear diffuser or wing, or because they don't go fast enough. The MP4-12C goes fast enough, and it's got a real, functional diffuser. The rear downforce is significant.</form>

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_larm_pivot.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_larm_pivot.jpg" class="full-size" height="477" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_larm_pivot-thumb-717x477.jpg" width="717" /> </a></form>

Like we saw up front, tie-bars (green) hold the rear control arms in place. The toe-link (yellow) pivots on an inner ball-and-socket joint.
No, that's still not a stabilizer bar. Sorry.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_uarm_shk.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_uarm_shk.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_uarm_shk-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a></form>

In order to clear a path for the shock, the aluminum upper control arm is L-shaped instead of A-shaped.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_ushock_tubes.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_ushock_tubes.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_ushock_tubes-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Like the front, the "stabilizer bar" is really just a pair of hoses.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_hoses_across_exh.jpg"> <img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_hoses_across_exh. jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_hoses_across_exh-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Don't be distracted by the pretty exhaust system that exits high so the rear diffuser can make gobs of rear downforce. Because this is a suspension walkaround, the thing to look at here is the pair of hoses that cross-links the shocks.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_frengmt_tank.jpg">< img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_frengmt_tank.j pg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_frengmt_tank-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Maybe this stretches the definition of suspension, but the engine is "suspended" in the rear frame by these (yellow) links. Fuel is suspended in this well-protected tank (black). That green thing? Oh, that's nothing much. Just one of two turbochargers, that's all.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_rrmt.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_rrmt.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_bonus_det_rrmt-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

The back half of the engine and transaxle is suspended from this frame crossmember.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_std.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_std.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_std-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Like the front, braking duties are handled by a 4-piston fixed caliper and two-piece cross-drilled and ventilated cast-iron rotors that ride on aluminum hubs. Unlike the front, there's a smaller brake caliper strictly for parking brake duty.

<a href="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_ccb.jpg"><img alt="2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_ccb.jpg" class="full-size" height="478" src="http://blogs.insideline.com/straightline/assets_c/2010/09/2010_MP412C_1600_sus_rr_det_brk_ccb-thumb-717x478.jpg" width="717" /> </a>

Upgraded rear brakes consist of carbon-ceramic rotors and silvery calipers. I prefer to use the term black chrome.

http://blogs.insideline.com/straight...alkaround.html

Sep 18, 2010 | 06:39 PM

speedemon90

Suzuka Master

Joined: Jan 2009

Posts: 9,012

Likes: 439

From: SoCal

Some of that suspension bit got really confusing, probably because I'm not so technical in this stuff. Cool stuff though, I'm pretty excited for this car.

Sep 18, 2010 | 09:25 PM

mattg

Senior Moderator

Joined: Nov 2001

Posts: 22,909

Likes: 388

From: OR

holy carp

Sep 19, 2010 | 06:31 AM

JnC

Former Sponsor

iTrader: (12)

Joined: May 2004

Posts: 6,961

Likes: 351

From: Bedford, MA

Sep 19, 2010 | 07:55 AM

Legend2TL

AZ Community Team

Joined: Nov 2004

Posts: 19,135

Likes: 4,768

From: Maryland

Wow, never seen a heave spring used anywhere but a open wheel high performance race cars (F1, GP2,...).

Pretty innovative hydraulic sway bar.

Sep 19, 2010 | 10:47 AM

knight rider

Rooting for Acura

iTrader: (1)

Joined: Nov 2003

Posts: 8,170

Likes: 1,842

From: Austin Burbs

That is very interesting. Thanks for sharing!

I only got lost with the bar that's not an anti-roll bar that's only connected to one side. And the brake components are one of those, "why didn't I think of that" technologies.

I have one question about the rotors. You said that they are 2 piece rotors. So are the literally 2 disk? If so, do the calipers have imposing pistons between the disks?

Sep 19, 2010 | 11:05 AM

fsttyms1

Senior Moderator

Joined: Aug 2002

Posts: 81,385

Likes: 3,068

From: Appleton WI

Quote:

Originally Posted by knight rider

2 piece rotors are that, 2 pieces.. There is the rotor and the hat (the hat is the part that the lugnuts slide thru and the wheel sits up against) and get bolted together

Last edited by fsttyms1; Sep 19, 2010 at 11:10 AM.

Trending Topics

Formula One: 2026 Season News and Discussion Thread

354

8.4k
RDX Battery Replacement

37

5.8k
The "Photos You've Taken of Exotic/Desirable Cars" Thread

14.1k

1M
2026 Formula One Fantasy League

27

613
2018 ILX Shifting seems odd

6

132

Sep 19, 2010 | 11:06 AM

fsttyms1

Senior Moderator

Joined: Aug 2002

Posts: 81,385

Likes: 3,068

From: Appleton WI

Oh and that car is

Sep 19, 2010 | 11:08 AM

mattg

Senior Moderator

Joined: Nov 2001

Posts: 22,909

Likes: 388

From: OR

2 piece rotors mean that the disk, and the center mounting area (hat) are separate pieces that bolt together. Most all big brake kits utilize 2 piece rotors.

- now that is thoroughly covered.

Sep 19, 2010 | 11:25 AM

#10

knight rider

Rooting for Acura

iTrader: (1)

Joined: Nov 2003

Posts: 8,170

Likes: 1,842

From: Austin Burbs

Quote:

Originally Posted by fsttyms1

2 piece rotors are that, 2 pieces.. There is the rotor and the hat (the hat is the part that the lugnuts slide thru and the wheel sits up against) and get bolted together

ahh.... got it, thx

Sep 19, 2010 | 12:14 PM

#11

nspec_ya4

Regional Coordinator (Texas)

iTrader: (38)

Joined: Aug 2008

Posts: 4,041

Likes: 607

From: Houston

worth every penny

Sep 19, 2010 | 12:19 PM

#12

FutureBagdA4

Burning Brakes

Joined: Jan 2002

Posts: 755

Likes: 0

From: Irvine, CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legend2TL

Pretty innovative hydraulic sway bar.

You'd be surprised that it really isn't. Mercedes' Active Body Control utilizes the exact same principle (which has been around for over a decade now), as do many other hydropneumatic suspensions on the market today.

Sep 19, 2010 | 12:32 PM

#13

Legend2TL

AZ Community Team

Joined: Nov 2004

Posts: 19,135

Likes: 4,768

From: Maryland

Quote:

Originally Posted by FutureBagdA4

Yeah, I forgot to think of about the active systems (Infiniti Q45a, MB,...) but one difference is the MB is a active system where computers control it and where as the McLaren system looks like a passive system with no computer.

Last edited by Legend2TL; Sep 19, 2010 at 12:44 PM.

Sep 19, 2010 | 12:35 PM

#14

Steven Bell

Team Owner

iTrader: (2)

Joined: Jan 2008

Posts: 36,545

Likes: 6,470

From: Kansas City, MO (Overland Park, KS)

It's cool to see it completely stripped down-nice write up.

Sep 19, 2010 | 03:25 PM

#15

Costco

Moderator

Joined: Jun 2006

Posts: 29,869

Likes: 3,489

Wow, so many cool technologies that should be more common on production cars. Electric-hydraulic power steering?

Sep 19, 2010 | 10:05 PM

#16

FutureBagdA4

Burning Brakes

Joined: Jan 2002

Posts: 755

Likes: 0

From: Irvine, CA

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legend2TL

From the article:

Quote:

What the McLaren has fitted instead is a complex series of tubes. These hoses (yellow) connect to the opposite side to form a hydraulic stabilizer bar that can be computer controlled. But to make it work they must cross over one another: the compression valve on this side connects to the rebound valve on the other side, and vice-versa.

I run hydropneumatic suspension on my own vehicle, so I'm a bit fluid-crazy. I'm actually working on my own variant for coilover suspensions currently.

Last edited by FutureBagdA4; Sep 19, 2010 at 10:09 PM.

Sep 20, 2010 | 02:33 AM

#17

mcflyguy24

Suzuka Master

Joined: Feb 2007

Posts: 5,847

Likes: 24

From: Oreland, Pa

I can't wait to see the finished car. I'd love to see McLaren take the title for worlds fastest production vehicle away from stupid Bugatti. I love the carbon monocoque on aluminum chassis along with all the suspension and steering stuff going on. It's like formula one meets aviation technology.

Sep 20, 2010 | 02:47 AM

#18

Costco

Moderator

Joined: Jun 2006

Posts: 29,869

Likes: 3,489

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcflyguy24

meh... Gordon Murray, designer and engineer of the McLaren F1 chastised Bugatti for making a car with just one main goal in mind - straight line speed. He isn't on the current McLaren team though, so I don't think it matters, but it really is silly to just focus on top speed.

Could care less anyways, I'd rather have one slower F1 than 3 faster Veyrons.

Sep 20, 2010 | 06:19 AM

#19

Legend2TL

AZ Community Team

Joined: Nov 2004

Posts: 19,135

Likes: 4,768

From: Maryland

Quote:

Originally Posted by FutureBagdA4

From the article:

I run hydropneumatic suspension on my own vehicle, so I'm a bit fluid-crazy. I'm actually working on my own variant for coilover suspensions currently.

Guess I should read the article.

ANother thing that I thought was pretty novel was the electric-driven hydraulic pump for the steering. Instead of a continous hydraulic pump or electric steering assist McLaren went with a hybrid solution.

I went to the Detroit Grand Prix in the 80's and there were a couple active suspension cars then (Lotus and Williams). The Lotus did not have any springs at all, I think hte Williams had some weak springs that had enough force to support the car at rest. What was amusing is the Lotius would come in the garage in Cobo Hall and once the motor was turned off would drop til the the chassis was resting on the floor.

Sep 20, 2010 | 12:57 PM

#20

shrykhar

Pro

Joined: Jul 2005

Posts: 656

Likes: 21

Quote:

Originally Posted by Legend2TL

The 1g Mazda3 also used an electro-hydraulic power steering, although supposedly because they intended to have a full EPS setup but fubared the communication with their supplier on the specs for it and didn't have space to mount a belt driven pump. Or something like that.

Sep 20, 2010 | 01:21 PM

#21

onebadna1nsx

Hello Friend

Joined: Apr 2007

Posts: 10,953

Likes: 219

Holy crap

Sep 20, 2010 | 04:34 PM

#22

mcflyguy24

Suzuka Master

Joined: Feb 2007

Posts: 5,847

Likes: 24

From: Oreland, Pa

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mourning Would

Well if McLaren is building it I'd expect it to handle well too. It's stupid that the Veyron has to weigh so much and needs a twin turbo'd 1000hp motor to beat a car made many years before it and only in a straight line.

Sep 20, 2010 | 08:49 PM

#23

ghttf

Thread Starter

Joined: Oct 2007

Posts: 1,038

Likes: 0

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcflyguy24

It's stupid that the Veyron has to weigh so much and needs a twin turbo'd 1000hp motor to beat a car made many years before it and only in a straight line.

the Veyron has quad turbos

Sep 20, 2010 | 09:36 PM

#24

mcflyguy24

Suzuka Master

Joined: Feb 2007

Posts: 5,847

Likes: 24

From: Oreland, Pa

Quote:

Originally Posted by MTwEeZi

the Veyron has quad turbos

so then even worse for the gayron...

Sep 20, 2010 | 10:41 PM

#25

FiveLiterCheater

Suzuka Master

Joined: Aug 2006

Posts: 6,030

Likes: 4

Quote:

Originally Posted by mcflyguy24

Can't really think of it like that. Bugatti had a lot of safety regulations to keep in mind when they designed this car...it wasn't so bad for the McLaren back in the early 90's. While I agree its still on the heavy side, its hard to argue with results.