gavriil

Actually the primary driver is the wife for this one but whenever driving together I am the designated driver. I admit it, I am pretty much anti-SUV for various reasons. The wife wanted one and after some research it was evident that the SUV/Crossover closest to a car today was the RX 300. So I told her, if you want an SUV, it has to be the RX300.

I still was hesitant though, there are so many of them out there (RXs) and after all, for that kind of money, you can get into a GS300 or a 525i.

The intro of the SilverSport though helped my hesitations. I tell ya, there is quite a difference in the looks because of the changes the SS package adds.

This new grill lowers the average age of the target market for the RX by 5 years IMO. The fact that the skirts around the sides are of the same color now make the "car" much better looking. The Brushed-Aluminum badging outside the car also helps to that.

There are 2 colors available, black and silver. I got the silver SilverSport Looks great in that color. My CL Type S is black so we did not want 2 black cars so...

Another option unique to the SS is a stiffer suspension (Euro-tuned Lexus calls it). I wanted to see how stiffer Lexus means and I tell you I was very pleased.

HOW LEXUS MANAGED TO ADD MORE CONTROL TO THE RIDE WITHOUT SACRIFICING COMFORT is incredible. And about this comfort. How the heck do they make this vehicle absorb so much is beyond me. My CL Type S is 11 months old and it is supposed to have a comfortable ride considering it is a "luxury GT" with a "sport tuned" suspension. Well, let me tell you, there were roads that felt annoying to drive on with my CL that I could not detect one road patching here in IL which is 2nd from last for the quality of its roads in the country! Plus, let us not forget, this vehicle wants to be called an SUV or even a Crossover, it is not the LS or the ES.

Inside, the changes that the SS package adds were helpful in deciding with the buy. Brushed alluminum where the "regular" RX has wood so there is that lowering of the avg. age argument again. But the one feature concerning the interior that I like most is the addition of perforated leather for the SS. We all have perforated leather in our CL Type S and it is not a gimmick folks. It breaths MUCH better than regular leather so during these hot summer days/nights your back does not look like someone threw you a bucket of water after you got off the car

All RXs add standard? VSC for 2001, or at least it is available this year. I am thinking, theoritically, this must be a very safe car as far as active safety is concerned (excluding the higher rollover chance due to the higher center of gravity...but not that much higher than a family sedan). Why safer? Well, this is an AWD vehicle. Permanent 50-50 torque split of all 4 wheels with center and rear limited slip differentials make this car safe as is. Add to that Traction Control and on top of that VSC (Vehicle Skid Cntrl) and I think it will be hard to take this thing off the road. Not that I am going to be driving it the way I am driving my CL but spirited driving is permitted with this new suspension, I tell ya

I loooove that huge moonroof! My CL's looks dinky compared to that. The opening is 1/3 that of the one in the RX. I love the space inside. I tell ya, I looked at the X5, the ML and the MDX and none of them have as much space for rear passengers as this smaller of all RX. All of the competitors have the rear seats fixed. Not only the RX's moves back and forth for added knee room but its back also reclines!!! Not much, but it makes a difference in comfort. Lexus engineers have taken advantage of interior space in a much more efficient way than the others. And I know that the X5 and the ML are body-on-frame which totally changes the character of the vehicle and how space is utilized but still, these SUVs look huge from the outside.

The engine is sufficient (220HP). You can feel the VVTi change the character of the engine at 2900rpm where it starts pulling the hardest, just like our VTEC kicks the more aggressive profie cams at 4800rpm. But the impressive part is that you can safely use 87 Octane gas. That is the part I like. Plus this is a torquey engine. 222 pounds from 3 liters is above average for 3 liters. The X5 and the ML would be slower in the 3 and 3.2 liter offerings.

Anyway, I am happy with this buy. Now we have a cruiser car in the family with plenty of room inside and 75 cubic feet of room when the back seats fold down. On top of that we gave nothing in luxury if we went with a car from Lexus like the GS or ES and the Lexus quality and service is with us. Plus the AWD will be handy in those Chicago winters especially if winter tires are used.

Now I have the option to get something very sporty/fast which would have no or very little room for luggage and 0 utility, to replace my CL. Say something like an M Roadster or something to that

Gabriel
CL Type S

[ 07-13-2001: Message edited by: gavriil ]

JATLIFE

Congratulations on the new Lexus! Those are nice SUV's and they look a lot better with the cleared out rear lights and the clearer headlights. The only thing I dont like too much about the car are the rims/tires. In my opinion they are too small, but that also helps explain why the ride is so smooth. Great car. How much did you pay, by the way? I dont like the ML too much and the X5 is super small (and not that great looking without the 18's, which gives it a harsh ride and not much in terms of winter driving.) The MDX is very nice, but thats about it in terms of luxury SUV's. Good choice.

About your replacement car. Personal opinion: not a big fan of the M roadster (that is the Z3, M'd out, right?). Especially since the Z3 has been out for so long. Hmmm what cars are there. I would say get a Vette (excellent handling, excellent performance, excellent ride, excellent looks). But some people arent fans of American cars. I still think this is a fantastic car. World-class handling, acceleration, handling, tons of cool options (like heads up display, heated seats, dual temp control, etc.)

If thats not your cup of tea, then maybe the new SC430? I saw it on Motorweek and although I dont like the back end too much, it might grow on me. The interior is absolutely gorgeous, no two ways about it. No car can touch it (that means you, SL600). For 60K you get hard top convertible with great acceleration, good handling, rare body, and a no good back seat.

There are also the new CLK430's, but I would get a SC instead. Just because the CLK's are a bit played out. Hmmmmm what other cars are there. An M3 convertible? Not sure what your requrements are (ie: no convertible, no rear wheel drive, etc.)

Just my two cents. Congrats on the new LexLuther.

HellaWhat

Congrats, for some reason I don't like the way that particular SUV looks. I'm normally anti-suv too, but I dunno, for the money the MDX has a much stronger physical appearance and a wider stance which would mean a lot to me if I were in the market for one. MY firned bought one too, some light metallic sky blue. NO SS though.

fast_daddy_car

I almost bought an rx300, instead went for the CL-S. (wife has the Sienna)

I like the new Toyota Highlander much better than the rx300, much cheaper too.

BigPimp

Congrats, very nice vehicle, handles great by SUV standards and excellent inside, very roomy and for even those over 6'. If I would buy a SUV, that would be the one. You have any pics post please, and if possible the price.

gobridge

Congrats. That is a very nice vehicle!

gavriil

Thanks.

About the rim/tire. The rims are 16s but you know, I could not believe that the tires are 225s (10mm wider than ours). These tires look dinky small from far away on that RX.

As for the z3. You are right, the car is getting old but I tell ya, I drove one with the older 240HP engine and it was great, I cannot even imagine how it drives with this new engine. I saw C&D just tested it for 4.5 for 0-60 and 13.1 for the 1/4 mile. World class numbers. You are right about the Vette but when I drove the Vette I got turned off by the interior and mostly by the fact that the car is too big and it feels bulky.

The new MB SLK 32 AMG is the fastest cars of all in this C&D issue. The guys from MB said 0-60 in 5.2 and that thing does it in 4.5 and 13 flat for the 1/4 mile and by 140mph it keeps pulling on the Vette. I tell ya, that engine is strong. It sounds underated at 345HP. All that with a 5 speed automatic, holy cow!

gavriil

There is price gauging going on for the MDX. The best I could do was get the car at MSRP but I HAD TO add the dealer installed options which were $2K worth of skirts and crap that I did not even like. Plus this thing looks like a minivan from the rear. They all do, even the ML. Only the RX looks NOT like a minivan from the rear.

[ 07-13-2001: Message edited by: gavriil ]

gavriil

Not really much cheaper. When you get a fully equipped Highlander it goes to $35K. Then I thought, I can add another $5K and get the RX. No sense there. The Highlander makes sense only if you manage to keep it in the $30K area.

gavriil

Oh yeah the price. JET asked that too and I forgot...

The MSRP was $40,500. I told him I would get it for $36,700. He asked for $37,900. I said let's split the $1200 diference and we so agreed for $37,300. After the 6.75% tax and all fees it ended up a little over $40K folks.

gavriil

Thanks.

gavriil

Here is the pics I found:

I got the Silver



And here it is in black

e1828

Nice buy Gavriil glad to see you are back to posting more stuff on the board.. some of us actually miss the banter that you and Tom2 used to have together.. what options did you get on the car besides the silversport package.. how do the Lexus' perforated leather compare to the Cl-S'.. did you get the Navigation package with it and how does it compare with the CL's navi? Again nice buy

kensteele

I like black, of course.

Either way, not bad; very nice....

gavriil

Thanks for being glad to see me back. I have been too busy lately folks. Technology is picking up now as "Larry" has said (for this quarter at least).

Other than the Silver, I got the color-keyed rear spoiler (which I could not delete, the dealer had it as must), the 6-disc changer, Xenon lights which I love cos they are much better than our CLS', the cargo mat and the wheel locks.

The perforated leather on the RX is rougher/harsher than in our CLS for some reason. I am not sure if that adds to durability, but I like our CLS better. Also, the seats are softer and more comfortable on our CLS. Other than that, when looking at the 2 leather packages they look like they came from the same vendor, they look identical. Even the perforated leather piece on the steering wheel is placed identically almost

I do not have the GPS on the CLS (did not want it) and did not get it for the RX for the same reason. Prefer to keep the $2K (wchich was also the price for the RX's GPS).

BBsAcuraRacing

Phew...i am glad it is the wife's vehicle....

gavriil

Oh another thing I like in the RX which I wish we had in our CLS is the outside electrochromic mirrors. Whenever the inside fades due to intense light, the outside do so automaticaly. Many times I had to hide behind some pillar because of some truck or SUV blinding the heck out of me.

Another thing is the one touch up OR down for all windows INCLUDING the sunroof. Nice. Get in the car and 3 touches later, the roof and the 2 windows are all the way open/down. This applies for the rear windows, dont forget the RX is a 4 door (plus one for the rear door).

And ON TOP OF THAT. This is a feature that cars in Europe/from Europe are getting for a long time now. I know the Passat has this feature. Approaching the car from far away, if you hold the UNLOCKL button on your remote for more than 2-3 seconds, all 4 windows and moonroof open. I tell ya, it does help air the car out a little in hot days so that when you get in, it is 4-5 degrees cooler. If you stop holding the button the operation will stop too, it is not a one-off thing.

Finally there is a $1800 rebate on the SS package and the Premium Plus package. So the car's MSRP would have been $42K.

Tom2

Wrong! Your new car does not have a permanent 50-50 split. It runs the front wheels until slippage is detected, then transfers power to the rear wheels. Exactly the same system in the Toyota Highlander.

You should really hit the magazines before you start telling lies here......

Also, you don't have traction control if you have the 4 wheel drive version of the RX300.

Traction control is only available on the front drive version.

Next time, learn a little about your car before you start singing its praises. You'll look like less of a fool......

acura_service

"HOW LEXUS MANAGED TO ADD MORE CONTROL TO THE RIDE WITHOUT SACRIFICING COMFORT is incredible. "


its because its based on a camry chassis
i'm sorry its a nice truck and all i don't mean to bash, i would rather have an ml430 or the new ml500 (or even the G500 - but thats way out of this price range)

Tom2

Exactly. It is a nice truck, but it is based on an AWD Camry platform. In all actuality, the RX300 is a higher riding AWD Camry.

IMO, the Toyota Highlander is a much better buy. Completely loaded with every option, you're looking at a sticker of about $35 grand. It has the exact same engine/tranny/drivetrain as the RX300, plus its a bigger vehicle with more interior room.....

Seems like a no-brainer to me--- The Highlander is less costly, bigger/more roomier and has an identicle drivetrain. Why would anyone informed choose the Lexus, unless they want the prestigious nameplate?

Tom2

Sitting here laughing my ass off just getting a mental picture of graviil. Picture this:

He's sitting on the floor with his magazine collection, ripping his hair out trying to find information on the RX300.

"Does it have permanently split AWD? Does it have traction control?" AAAaaargggghhhh!!

The guy is gonna look like a bald eagle by the time he finds the info that he's looking for.....

gavriil

Tom, nice run here. You wished you pissed me off. You cannot do that even if you tried. You are wrong on everything you said. No mag racer status needed here, the RX is not a new vehicle, it has been tested by everyone at this point.

Watch me prove Tom wrong for the "1000th" time:

From Edmunds.com:

"The solution was to make an all-wheel-drive option, combining an integrated transfer case with a viscous coupling center differential and an optional limited-slip rear differential. It provides a 50/50 front-to-rear power split for even traction, and we surmise that this system, along with the transmission in the "Snow" mode that starts the RX 300 off in second gear for less slippage, will be useful for residents of colder climes."
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadt...2/article.html

From DetroitNews:

"Although most owners are never likely to need it, the RX 300 has exceptional traction and off-road capability. You get full-time four-wheel drive, with a viscous center differential that sends torque to the wheels with the most traction on slippery roads. Our prototype was also equipped with a Torsen limited-slip rear differential that compensates for a loss of traction between the right and left wheels."
http://detroitnews.com/AUTOS/9802/04/drove/drove.htm

From world-off-road:

"Transmission is permanent four-wheel-drive, controlled via four-speed automatic gearbox, and employing a viscous limited-slip centre differential. The system is designed to transfer torque to the wheels with most traction."
http://www.worldoffroad.com/vehicles/lexus.asp

As for the traction control argument, it is in my manual. Traction control is optional for FWD cars and this is what got you confused. It says in the manual that Trac. Cntrl operats until 9mph.

From Lexus.com:

"TRAC senses impending wheelspin, then selectively applies the brakes and automatically transfers power to the driving wheel with better grip. TRAC works in conjunction with Vehicle Skid Control.1(VSC). VSC senses potential loss of traction in a turn and orchestrates the brakes and throttle accordingly."

As for the Highlander statements. If you think that the Highlander and RX300 are the same vehicle, then your ex-CLS is an Accord Coupe.

What's the matter Tom, cant you appreciate a forum member's new vehicle purchase like everyone else has? You already have proven to everyone here that you are complexic a million times already. You dont have to add more to this record of yours.

[ 07-14-2001: Message edited by: gavriil ]

SC TL

Very nice. Congrats.

gavriil

Thanks. See that is all Tom needed to say but...you know...the guy has problems obviously

fender4

LMFAO !!! Nice to have both of you back, youse guys (Chicago accent) remind me of "me and my brother". What part of Chicago are you from? I'm from the Wheeling , Buffalo Grove area. Could every edit the photos to one copy, I have dial up and this takes forever

gavriil

Naperville area here.

WildWolf

My wife in her X5 (3.0) will take your wife in her Lexus from a stop light any day of the week. The BMW IS faster!

gavriil

If she's got the auto tranny it will be a close match. 0-60 for the BMW is 8.6, it is 8.8 for the RX300. I guess it will be up to the driver

gavriil

You know I dont know how BMW does it. It seems that their cars are always faster than what the HP/weight figure suggests.

Take the X5 3.0 for eg here from the previous post. This thing weighs 4572 pounds with the auto tranny. The RX weighs 3924 pounds. The BMW has 5HP more and actually less peak torque (222 pounds versus 214 pounds).

Yet it is faster for the 0-60mph. Looking at the BMW's gearing looks very very short but still. I cant find the gear ratios for the RX anywhere.

Tom2

See Graviil, herein lies the problem.....

You can quote all the magazine articles in the world, but it doesn't really mean shit if you're too stupid to COMPREHEND them.

Where in ANY of your little quotes did it say that the RX300 employs a 4wd system with a full time 50-50 split front/rear? It didn't. Know why? Simple- because it doesn't.

If you need me to take you to school and explain exactly how a viscous coupling center differential works, then I will.

If you had any REAL understanding, then you'd realize how stupid it is to think that you have a full time 50-50 split on the 4wd.

Your new "car" drives the front wheels only, until there is slippage detected. ONLY then will you get any power distribution to the rear.

If you want to keep thinking that you've got a 50-50 split, then fine. It just makes you even more ingnorant...... even the articles you quoted obviously agree with what I've said.

Enjoy your all wheel drive Camry.

Tom2

Nice try, but I don't think so.....

Do you have ANY idea how many differences there are (mechanically) between the CL-S and the Accord coupe? The CL-S may be made on the same platform, but the similarities end there. I don't think I need to list the many differences.....hmmmm...260 HP comes to mind....

But what are the real differences (again, mechanically) between the Highlander and the RX300? Hmmm..... NONE! Same exact engine. Same exact Tranny. Same exact 4wd system. Same fuel mileage..yada yada yada......

The thing that separates the Highlander and the RX300 is the fact that the Highlander is larger and costs less.

Shoulda got a Highlander bud..... It's the smarter buy for sure......

BarryH

Why are a BMW guy and someone with a Lexus going to war on an Acura board over the features and specifications of an RX300?

Gavriil, I'm sure you're thrilled with your RX300, use it in good health - but the level of detail you're providing is giving me a headache. I have an MDX and -only- mention it on the TL or CL board when it is relevant. Most TL and CL owners could care less about the MDX and if they wanted information on it they'd go to acuramdx.org.

And Tom, crucifying an RX300 is beneath you. It makes no claims to be a feat of engineering mastery and is simply another interpretation of the now omnipresent crossover SUV.

If you guys want to have a pissing match do it through PM and don’t try to cloak your personal attacks on each other in faux relevance.

[ 07-16-2001: Message edited by: BarryH ]

cl-driver

well stated.

Tom2

Crucifying? Huh? You seem as clueless as Graviil. This argument is mainly about the 4wd system of the RX300.

If you don't like it, then don't read the thread. Simple as that.

After all, this is the "Car Talk" forum, right? It has been said time and time again that ANY AND ALL 'car talk' is welcome here.

I suggest that you skip this topic in the future.

gavriil

HOLY COW, THIS IS IT. I CANNOT BUT ADMIT THAT I AGREE WITH TOM FOR ONCE

By the way Tom about the AWD, it is really getting rediculus of you to not admit your mistake. I will find more evidence of this. But promise me that if I find more evidence if how the AWD on the RX works, you WILL admit you were wrong. Otherwise no poin in wasting our time here. Right?

Tom2

If I was wrong, then I'd gladly admit it....

But like I've said already-- If you understood the concept of a viscous coupling center differential, then you'd realize that all 4 wheels are not driving the RX300 at all times.

Do a little research on AWD systems......

gavriil

Tom, I know about how viscous couplings work, I had a 96 Talon AWD from 96-99. Trust me. That system worked exactly the same way that "I think" the RX works. Permanent AWD with 25% split of the torque between all 4 wheels. When slip detected the center dif takes over, and if there is a rear dif, the rear dif also takes over. And on top of that you got the VSC in the case of the RX.

The way you describe is how the MDX's AWD system works. It is a FWD car till slip is detected. That is the major reason why the MDX has better fuel consumption on -especially - the highway. I remember reading many times that Acura was bragging about that, saying something like: "...unlike the direct competitors, we use AWD only when needed..., etc"

I will try and find more info on this cos our CLS might be getting AWD in another 2-3 years so the dicsussion is worth it.

RayRay

Good Luck with the RX. I chose the RX300 also (see sig.). I looked at the Toyota and just didn't like it. The RX has performed exceptionally, beyond my expectations. BTW, I paid 38,900. I had the MDX ordered and cancelled it after test driving the RX.

WildWolf

Mercedes had a little get together down here a Gulfstream Park about a year ago. They brought with them an ML (many actually), BMW X5, and Lexus RX 300. They set up an uphill ramp with 3 wheels on rollers and one rear wheel with grip. Guess which truck could not make it up the ramp????? Yup the RX 300 could not get up the ramp- no problem with the ML or the X5. I wouldn't want my wife and kid in the RX with snow and ice on the ground.

Tom2

I'd bet that the RX300 tested did not have the limited slip rear differential.

For your information, an open differential sends power to the wheel with the LEAST amount of traction. This is the exact reason that you used to see all those American luxo-barges spinning one rear wheel on ice while the other wheel just sits there.

Had the RX300 been equipped with the limited slip diff in the rear, it should have easily been able to power up a ramp using just one rear wheel.