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danny25

that was disappointing. They really didn't have much good to say about it.

zeroday

it's an american muscle car. did you really expect those stupid brits to admit liking it?

danny25

they liked the Ford GT

Zapata

guess u missed the ford gt review??

zeroday

uh yeah i missed that one...guess they liked it huh....well i hate those top gear a-holes anyhow

cusdaddy

The GT is an absolutely awesome car and it of course will get a good review. Also the fact that Clarkson always dreamed of that car when he was young, he always had a thing for that car and the fact he bought one, they of course loved it.

But even the GT review was still full of their anti-american BS... American cars can't properly handle, bla bla bla. It even came across in their garbage 350Z review about how it was designed for Americans. I have less and less respect for this show.

I expected nothing less from this review. The C6 is an amazing car for the $$ period.

zeroday

I agree. Those guys are def. biased. However...I was disappointed about the fact that it uses leaf springs...WTF is that about? And the interior is a bit cheap looking too. I said that when i first saw it. I was hoping Lutz would've made it nicer.

cusdaddy

I can care less about the suspension design as long as it performs brilliantly, which it does, and always did (Z06). The interior is lightyears ahead of the previous version. Yes, it probably still has some way to go, but for the $$, you can't complain.

Same thing with the Z. The interior is cheap, but it's functional and for the $$ of the car, you can't complain. If the same interior was in a 911, then I'd complain.

Zapata

ahaha wow....really feel people have it out for the USA huh? lol... They didn't say anything that wasn't true and in the end they said it was a fun car that performance very well for the price. What more do you want???? Seems you want ass kissing for the sake of ass kissing. They are always VERY tough on cars and even ripped the NSX a new one. Toughen up.....

zeroday

ehh i disagree on that one. the corvette has less of an excuse for a cheap interior. it's considerably more expensive than the z. in that price bracket i would expect a better interior...despite whats under the hood etc. the materials needed to dress up the interior would be a very minimal added expense...if i was spending that much on a vette i know i'd spend 500-1000 bucks more to get some better interior materials.

as for the leaf springs, i see your point but i remember when i saw those on my chevy tahoe for the first time... i cringed...looked like something that belonged on a horse drawn buggy not a car. its so low tech...wonder how much $ they saved doing it that way...

Zapata

huh why?? less respect?? because they are critical?? They didn't say anything you just didn't.... c6 is amazing car for the money. What are you complaining about??

zeroday

Zapata if you didn't pick up on the condescending America bashing tone i'm not sure which video you watched. the one posted above was full of it.

cusdaddy

Watch the video again. This is my only response to you.

cusdaddy

Sorry, but there is no way that a NSX can beat a well-driven C6 in an acceleration test like it did in this video. The C6 has 400hp/400 torque and has performance times of mid 12's in the 1/4.

Even the TVR model they tested runs high 12's / mid 13's in the 1/4, yet it smoked the C6.

zeroday

yeah i was a little confused about that one myself....nsx should have been KILLED..

Zapata

Of course But that's the nature of the show.

Zapata

Watched it several times. Seems you want nothing but praise. They gave praise and they gave a fair criticism. What exactly did you disagree with? Perhaps you provide your educated opinion.

SiGGy

I thought it was funny when he pushed on the rear of the car, and then knocked the dashboard.

Ya they do seem a bit biased, and have some wierd "american" comments. Like we dont keep thing in out museums past 50 years?

Uhh, ok.... sometimes I wonder about those guys. What needs to happen is an American show that debunks what they say. Two guys who re-run the tests here in the US.

SiGGy

Just thought I'd add it's *NOT* like a 50 yr old leaf spring suspension like they make it out to be. What you can't see in this pic is the leaf runs from lef tto right. Maybe someone else can dig up a better pic.

zeroday

Exactly but it's also the reason why they can't maintain objectivity when it comes to reviewing American cars. Would you trust a white supremacist news man for an honest report on the unprovoked beating of a black man by white police? Extreme example, but you get the idea (i hope).

CraZee ZO6

They were biased. That was expected. They dont like corvettes.
Funny even after that "SLOPPY" run it still ran a respected number. Looked like that run could be improved alot. For the price I dont think that car could be beat.
The car should of tossed the nsx in the straight line. 400hp vs 290hp. I think they weigh similar too no? c6 is 3200lbs

gavriil

I dont get that one either.

gavriil

But Siggy, what does it matter? What matters here is actually that this is an advantage for the C6 and that's what the Europeans will never understand.

LOW TECH THAT WORKS ON THE TRACK AND CITY AS WELL AS HIGH TECH IS BETTER THAN HIGH TECH!

That's the lesson here. They will never get it because it's not to their interest to get it. Cos it makes all of them, including the Japs, look like ASSES!

cusdaddy

Just like a 6.0L pushrod LS2 that makes 400/400 yet gets even better gas mileage than a 3.2L NSX that produces significantly less HP. But the LS2 is low tech, so I guess it must suck.

gavriil

I mean this "low tech" discussion really reminds me of the dot com situation. In other words, the word that comes to mind is: FAD! Europe and Japan selling fad to the world and America going with what works. And note that I believe in no schools of thought and as you know, I am not biased. But this low tech, high tech argument is simply not existant and a bunch of crap which when you tell it, you sound like you have a good story but in the end it's fad!

Leaf springs, two valves per cylinder (not the case with the C6 but with the C5), OHV, pushrods, high desplacement, "low" specific HP (power per liter), etc., etc.

So if I, the USAmerican engineer can build a car that uses all of the above, so that I SAVE YOU DOLLARS, but at the same time do it so that the car STILL PERFORMS (track or city), then why would you bash me and call me low tech?

Do you think that GM cant build the engine in the ENzo? If Ferrari can hire the engineers that built the Enzo, or its engine, dont you think that GM can do that?

The question is not if GM can make a Ferrari beater, the question is can Ferrari or Porsche build a Corvette FOR THE PRICE OF THE CORVETTE! Let me answer it for you. NO. They absolutely CANNOT! Why? Cos they dont have the LS2 which is shared by a billion trucks and other cars (in 3 different versions) so that it brings the cost down to what it is. If Ferrari built the LS2 it'd cost 6 times more than what if GM built it.

Same for the platform and same for all the parts that are shared.

So now you go bash them for the low tech used. I see it the other way around which proves FAD! What is that?

If GM has proven that pushrods, leaf springs and all the other low technologies used can perform as well as the high tech, then doesnt that mean that what Porsche and the rest are selling you is FAD?! It's basically a lie! Stuff you dont need and just because it's high tech and complicated and because it tells a good story when promoted from people that know how to promote them, it makes you think you bought the best?

I am not saying that the C6 is as good as a 360 and it feels like one, etc., etc. But although I have not driven either, I hear a lot of comments from experts (even the biased ones) like: "wow, is this thing fun to drive!", etc., etc.

So there is nothing wrong with the way this car FEELS, which is completely subjective. So if the FEELING is right and if the performance is there and if the price is untouchable,

WHY WOULD ANYONE BASH THIS CAR FROM ANY PERSPECTIVE?!

Also, EVERY review from USAmerican mags I have read up to now have praised the shifter. I am listening to TOP GEAR and they bash the shit out of it. They make an effort to bash it.

Also:

Every reporter here praised the ride characteristics and how livable this car is. TOP GEAR humiliated the car's ride. What gives?

runnerX

Top Gear ppl == man-whores..

cusdaddy

Gavril: The answer is pure bias. They showed it with many of their reviews. Their show is pure entertainment, not automotive journalism. They are pandering off the anti-American feelings in Europe at the moment, so of course, they will entertain the audience and bash anything american-made.

Rod

I want a low-tech POS C6, even with that Playskool steering wheel Hopefully the steering wheel will change in the second or third year of production.

runnerX

I hate the steering wheel.. why is it so big and ugly

heyitsme

I dunno, as harsh as it was, there were some valid points about the car. For 50k I would like to have seen the car approaching m3 levels of refinement paired with the performance and the car is clearly lacking in that area.

Rod

Because it's shared with some other lower-end GM I believe.

Rod

That would be nice, but then the price would skyrocket.

runnerX

in fact, I think this 6.0L engine has even better fuel mileage than our CLS.. correct me if I am wrong..

edit:

it is actually the same, but 260hp/232tq vs. 405hp/400tq

current Z06 --> 19/28
CLS 6spd --> 19/28

gavriil

I am goind to merge this thread with the Automotive News C6 threads folks... Let me know if you dont agree.

heyitsme

[QUOTE=gavriil]
So if I, the USAmerican engineer can build a car that uses all of the above, so that I SAVE YOU DOLLARS, but at the same time do it so that the car STILL PERFORMS (track or city), then why would you bash me and call me low tech?

QUOTE]

How much money is GM really saving though when even under 20k cars today have the 'high tech' suspension.

gavriil

Shit, why dont you buy it and have the dealer put a new one in ?

gavriil

I know. It sucks.

SiGGy

Ya, I agree 100%. I was just trying to show they are using a leaf spring, but not in the old conventional way. That setup is nothing like an old pickup truck with leaf springs.

I'm with ya 100% man! just kinda ticked the way they worded it. So I was trying to show the suspension was not the way they depicted it.

cusdaddy

If the handling is amazing (which it is) and the ride is very well controlled and acceptable (according to every other review I have read), then why do they have to use a different setup? This one clearly works and works very well.

If it ain't broke, don't fix it.

Same thing with DOHC and multi-valve engines. GM has some 20k cars with these features (Ecotech engines for example) but it doesn't mean that the OHV Pushrod LS2 is a bad choice. They use what works and the current C6 setup works VERY well.

Hell, my 350Z has a supposed "advanced or high-tech" engine and suspension, but the car makes less hp and mpg than the LS2 and my supposedly "advanced or high-tech" suspension can knock your teeth out on rough roads vs the smooth and even better handling "low tech" C6.