---

---

Originally Posted by Sarlacc (Post 16183635)

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183561)

Did I hear something? AWD is mostly a gammick marketed for people who wants all the bells & whistles or are scared to be scared. In some cases, it is a commodity.

In winters, here, cops and taxis get around in 2WD cars. I guess that they are no sissies.

It is very interesting that no SRT or Hellcat (event eh Demon) cars is AWD. No Corvette, Mustang or Camaro AWD either. All of them have sub 4s 0-60mph variants.

And yeah, FWD is more predictable than AWD. ;) Meaning safer. For fun, RWD please.

Originally Posted by ttribe (Post 16181410)

And, just like that, you've summoned Saintor. Way to go.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16181411)

:rofl:

But seriously, no. He's an AWD guy

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183561)

Did I hear something? AWD is mostly a gammick marketed for people who wants all the bells & whistles or are scared to be scared. In some cases, it is a commodity.

In winters, here, cops and taxis get around in 2WD cars. I guess that they are no sissies.

It is very interesting that no SRT or Hellcat (event eh Demon) cars is AWD. No Corvette, Mustang or Camaro AWD either. All of them have sub 4s 0-60mph variants.

And yeah, FWD is more predictable than AWD. ;) Meaning safer. For fun, RWD please.

Originally Posted by SamDoe1 (Post 16183728)

And yet many AMG cars are AWD, new M5 is AWD, all Audi RS models are AWD, Golf R/FoRS/STi are AWD, Lambos are AWD, Bentleys are AWD, Bugattis are AWD, etc...

It is definitely not a gimmick.

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183748)

Again, the bells & whistles game.

For your information the top Bentley, the 530HP/811ft-lbs Mulsanne is RWD. So is the new 2018 RR Phantom and Mercedes-Maybach S 600 Pullman. And Ferrari's top LaFerrari and McLaren.

If AWD was so compelling (like ESP is) at least for safety, all these high-end cars money no object would have it standard, no question asked. This is the killer argument and really, there is no way around it.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183750)

AWD is compelling. It's also heavy. The list of AWD supercars is extensive.

And forgive us for discounting the opinion of someone who finds TLX compelling.

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183756)

You are so intelligent. http://www.m3post.com/forums/images/.../bellyroll.gif

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183748)

Again, the bells & whistles game.

For your information the top Bentley, the 530HP/811ft-lbs Mulsanne is RWD. So is the new 2018 RR Phantom and Mercedes-Maybach S 600 Pullman. And Ferrari's top LaFerrari and McLaren.

If AWD was so compelling (like ESP is) at least for safety, all these high-end cars money no object would have it standard, no question asked. This is the killer argument and really, there is no way around it.

Originally Posted by 00TL-P3.2 (Post 16181033)

Say you had 2 identical cars, available as RWD or AWD.
Mercedes, BMW, & Kia Stinger jump in my head immediately.
Which would you go with/why?

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16181355)

The thing is, while AWD may well have some clear advantages in winter weather, it has some drawbacks as well. Personally I'd opt for a shorter stopping distance than a faster stoplight sprint. Then there are the other 345 days of the year where the RWD car will have a decided advantage over the AWD car. To put my comments in context, I had a 530i (RWD) and my neighbor had a 530xi (AWD); my car was easily more tractable than his in anything but snow (and even then the difference wasn't enough to offset the other advantages).

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183561)

Did I hear something? AWD is mostly a gammick marketed for people who wants all the bells & whistles or are scared to be scared. In some cases, it is a commodity.

In winters, here, cops and taxis get around in 2WD cars. I guess that they are no sissies.

It is very interesting that no SRT or Hellcat (event eh Demon) cars is AWD. No Corvette, Mustang or Camaro AWD either. All of them have sub 4s 0-60mph variants.

And yeah, FWD is more predictable than AWD. ;) Meaning safer. For fun, RWD please.

Originally Posted by YeuEmMaiMai (Post 16183811)

there is no may have about it... having driven RWD, FWD and now AWD in the snow, there is no going back from it... when the snow is deep and the roads are not plowed no one gives a rat's ass about a car being trackable or not...

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183835)

Clearly you are speaking from your own perspective because in the larger scheme of things, you have no freakin' clue what you're talking about.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183852)

Can you be more specific? All tires the same, AWD is superior in the snow.

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183855)

No, it is only superior in acceleration and in some handling scenarios; RWD is superior in braking and some other handling scenarios.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183864)

I guess I'm confused. You're the only person I have ever heard talk about RWD as being somehow superior in the snow. I know from experience that RWD is a bitch in the snow. Even the most docile RWD vehicles (I had a RWD van when I was younger) severely oversteered on snow and ice. RWD cars are also far more likely to get stuck, lose traction.

This "You have no idea what you are talking about" is not necessary and particularly surprising as your claim is kind of a silly one.

And as far as breaking, anyone with any brains driving in the snow knows to leave plenty of braking distance, so any advantage from braking distance is minimal.

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183667)

Look back at your own ass, kid. I wrote CARS, not SUVs. I guess that you can't differentiate PICK-UPS either, especially the red ones.

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183869)

Apparently you haven't read the rest of this thread.

Regarding the "you have no idea" comment, it wasn't directed at you; within context, it is exactly correct.

Originally Posted by Sarlacc (Post 16183873)

:spit:

You are one of the stupidest motherfuckers out there, just a plain fact. You're also color blind in addendum to being one of the world's biggest idiots.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183878)

You're responding to a post about the snow

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183879)

Hey, I'm color blind!

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183884)

I was responding to the "no one gives a rat's ass" comment.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183887)

I think you misunderstood what he said then.

Think of it this way: in a foot of snow, no one cares how fun your car is to track because you're too worried about skidding into a telephone pole.

Originally Posted by TacoBello (Post 16183895)

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183892)

If you feel that way then in a foot of snow you'll feel the same way in your AWD car. I've driven many RWD cars in snow deep enough to render the front bumper a snow plow and I've never once, not even for a minute, worried about skidding into a telephone pole.

Originally Posted by SamDoe1 (Post 16183899)

RWD with snow tires is fine. AWD with snow tires is better. There's really nothing to refute here as it's a proven fact.

Originally Posted by 1killercls (Post 16183939)

Im all fucked up. I have AWD in Florida.

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183901)

What is a proven fact? Are you saying an AWD car with snow tires will stop faster than an otherwise identical RWD car? If so then I declare shenanigans on your post.

Originally Posted by Legend2TL (Post 16183925)

Driver skill + wisdom + patience + caution >>>>>>>AWD>RWD in low traction conditions. nuf said :tongue:

I've seen plenty of AWD/4WD vehicles leave the road, spin, loose control the road in snow and ice cause their drivers thought their expensive SUV's and trucks were super vehicles.
Common sense in ice/snow wins everytime.:thumbsup:

Originally Posted by horseshoez (Post 16183904)

Another thing you snow AWD fanbois need to keep in mind is heavy snow only happens a few days per year, the rest of the time it is a non-issue. My question is, "who gives a rat's ass" about a few days per year? I sure as hell don't.

Originally Posted by kurtatx (Post 16183943)

I have AWD in Texas.

Apparently we're AWD fanbois. After all, we like Audis and they have rear wheel drive available amirite?

Originally Posted by Saintor (Post 16183561)

Did I hear something? AWD is mostly a gammick marketed for people who wants all the bells & whistles or are scared to be scared. In some cases, it is a commodity.

In winters, here, cops and taxis get around in 2WD cars. I guess that they are no sissies.

It is very interesting that no SRT or Hellcat (event eh Demon) cars is AWD. No Corvette, Mustang or Camaro AWD either. All of them have sub 4s 0-60mph variants.

And yeah, FWD is more predictable than AWD. ;) Meaning safer. For fun, RWD please.

Originally Posted by SamDoe1 (Post 16183955)

You don't need it until you do. At that point, you're glad you have it. Same with snow tires, you can probably get by with your RWD car and all/no seasons and do just fine on all the days that there isn't snow around but I bet you wouldn't do that would you?

Originally Posted by SamDoe1 (Post 16183953)

It is a proven fact that more driven wheels = more grip = more traction = better to start and better in turns. This is why AWD is even made. If RWD was better in every way, no one would bother with AWD.

I never said that an AWD car with snow tires will stop faster, in fact I bet the stopping distance is probably exactly the same. On the flip side, the AWD car will do everything better than RWD when the road gets slippery.



Well yeah. If you're an idiot, it won't matter how many driven wheels you have. AWD/4WD doesn't make you invincible, it just makes it a bit harder to fuck it up. The downside is that the more features you have to unfuck yourself, the more you're really fucked when you do fuck it up.

Originally Posted by Sarlacc (Post 16183873)

:spit:

You are one of the stupidest motherfuckers out there, just a plain fact. You're also color blind in addendum to being one of the world's biggest idiots.