Volkswagen: Phaeton News
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,751
Likes: 69
I'll leave you the Hyundai, and I'll take the Phaeton for the fantastic interior, and superior building quality.
BUT boring and ugly exterior, sleepy drive, crazy high price...
If VW can correct these things, and it WILL (the next car will be much more lighter and frugal: hybrid engine, V6 TDI and so on) than it will be one of the cars on the top of my list for 2012...
BUT boring and ugly exterior, sleepy drive, crazy high price...
If VW can correct these things, and it WILL (the next car will be much more lighter and frugal: hybrid engine, V6 TDI and so on) than it will be one of the cars on the top of my list for 2012...
I'll leave you the Hyundai, and I'll take the Phaeton for the fantastic interior, and superior building quality.
BUT boring and ugly exterior, sleepy drive, crazy high price...
If VW can correct these things, and it WILL (the next car will be much more lighter and frugal: hybrid engine, V6 TDI and so on) than it will be one of the cars on the top of my list for 2012...
BUT boring and ugly exterior, sleepy drive, crazy high price...
If VW can correct these things, and it WILL (the next car will be much more lighter and frugal: hybrid engine, V6 TDI and so on) than it will be one of the cars on the top of my list for 2012...
Senior Moderator
Joined: Jan 2001
Posts: 34,937
Likes: 638
From: Chicago Burbs
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,751
Likes: 69
it NEVER sold well... even in Europe...
Wikipedia
Phaeton sales fell short of expectations. It debuted at prices comparable to similar offerings from Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Lexus and, not least, the Volkswagen Group's own Audi A8 (which shared its engineering underpinnings with the Phaeton), while lacking the "brand cachet" of these competitor vehicles.
In 2002 the manufacturer stated that the annual capacity of the new Phaeton plant at Dresden was 20,000: by September 2006, a four-year total of just 25,000 had been built[3], with production running at approximately 6,000 cars annually. The domestic market is by far the Phaeton's strongest, with 19,314 Phaetons delivered in Germany alone by January 2009. The German luxury sedan sector continued to be dominated by the Mercedes Benz S-Class and BMW 7 series, however, both models achieving more than twice the sales volume of the Phaeton in 2008.
In the United States market, 1,433 Phaetons were sold in 2004, but just 820 were sold in 2005, leading the company to announce that sales in the American market would end after the 2006 model year. The rare W12-engined models have depreciated significantly, and sell for a small fraction of their original cost.[4]
In April 2008, Volkswagen announced plans to reintroduce the Phaeton to the United States market in 2009.[5] As of December 2009, no Phaetons have been shipped to the U.S. for sale at VW dealers.
Wikipedia
Phaeton sales fell short of expectations. It debuted at prices comparable to similar offerings from Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Lexus and, not least, the Volkswagen Group's own Audi A8 (which shared its engineering underpinnings with the Phaeton), while lacking the "brand cachet" of these competitor vehicles.
In 2002 the manufacturer stated that the annual capacity of the new Phaeton plant at Dresden was 20,000: by September 2006, a four-year total of just 25,000 had been built[3], with production running at approximately 6,000 cars annually. The domestic market is by far the Phaeton's strongest, with 19,314 Phaetons delivered in Germany alone by January 2009. The German luxury sedan sector continued to be dominated by the Mercedes Benz S-Class and BMW 7 series, however, both models achieving more than twice the sales volume of the Phaeton in 2008.
In the United States market, 1,433 Phaetons were sold in 2004, but just 820 were sold in 2005, leading the company to announce that sales in the American market would end after the 2006 model year. The rare W12-engined models have depreciated significantly, and sell for a small fraction of their original cost.[4]
In April 2008, Volkswagen announced plans to reintroduce the Phaeton to the United States market in 2009.[5] As of December 2009, no Phaetons have been shipped to the U.S. for sale at VW dealers.
Pinky all stinky
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 20,677
Likes: 192
I prefer the current A8 to the new one.
It's one of those things where it's so perfect any changes you can make will ruin it, and that's what they did with the A8. the headlight design is just bizarre.
It's one of those things where it's so perfect any changes you can make will ruin it, and that's what they did with the A8. the headlight design is just bizarre.
Safety Car
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 4,068
Likes: 111
From: NYC
looks like it made zero progress since the last phaeton. also, considering how much audi (A8, esp.) has evolved since the last phaeton, this new one would surely be seen as an absolute POS in comparison.
is VWs strategy to let Hyundai spend the marketing dollars in creating a "modern affordable luxo sedan" image for them?...i.e. while hyundai spends god knows what in advertising to force the world into accepting a 40k luxo-box, VW will go ahead and sneak one in??? if thats not the case, then i cant think of one good idea as to why VW is bringing this back.
is VWs strategy to let Hyundai spend the marketing dollars in creating a "modern affordable luxo sedan" image for them?...i.e. while hyundai spends god knows what in advertising to force the world into accepting a 40k luxo-box, VW will go ahead and sneak one in??? if thats not the case, then i cant think of one good idea as to why VW is bringing this back.
Last edited by ThermonMermon; Apr 12, 2010 at 09:21 PM.
Race Director
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 14,432
Likes: 637
From: Orlando, Fl
AZ Community Team
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 19,084
Likes: 4,756
From: Maryland
Wonder if the current head of Audi North American will call the Phaeton "stupid" again like his predicensor did?
Still don't understand it, VW/Audi will discontinue the Cayenne but still push the Phaeton.
Still don't understand it, VW/Audi will discontinue the Cayenne but still push the Phaeton.
Pinky all stinky
Joined: Jul 2003
Posts: 20,677
Likes: 192
AZ Community Team
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 19,084
Likes: 4,756
From: Maryland
Senior Moderator
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 14,667
Likes: 13
From: NY
Fail.
About 5 people in the US would buy a Phaeton. Not that it's a bad car, but most will say why pay that kind of money for a VW when I can get an Audi, BMW, Lexus, etc. Just doesn't make much sense.
About 5 people in the US would buy a Phaeton. Not that it's a bad car, but most will say why pay that kind of money for a VW when I can get an Audi, BMW, Lexus, etc. Just doesn't make much sense.
Safety Car
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 4,581
Likes: 64
people are paying $30-$35k for Nissan Maxima.
I am sure if VW can put its 3.0T DI engine and price it around $55K fully loaded. there will be market for it. A8 is different as it has 0.25Cd in such large car. they have to design it this way for maximum aerodynamic efficiency.
look at A8 AWD torque vectoring 4.2FSI fuel economy for its class. It is even better than LS-460/LS-600H and outperforms BMW/MB. with similar performance.
I am sure if VW can put its 3.0T DI engine and price it around $55K fully loaded. there will be market for it. A8 is different as it has 0.25Cd in such large car. they have to design it this way for maximum aerodynamic efficiency.
look at A8 AWD torque vectoring 4.2FSI fuel economy for its class. It is even better than LS-460/LS-600H and outperforms BMW/MB. with similar performance.
Pro
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 679
Likes: 18
From: nyc
people are paying $30-$35k for Nissan Maxima.
I am sure if VW can put its 3.0T DI engine and price it around $55K fully loaded. there will be market for it. A8 is different as it has 0.25Cd in such large car. they have to design it this way for maximum aerodynamic efficiency.
look at A8 AWD torque vectoring 4.2FSI fuel economy for its class. It is even better than LS-460/LS-600H and outperforms BMW/MB. with similar performance.
I am sure if VW can put its 3.0T DI engine and price it around $55K fully loaded. there will be market for it. A8 is different as it has 0.25Cd in such large car. they have to design it this way for maximum aerodynamic efficiency.
look at A8 AWD torque vectoring 4.2FSI fuel economy for its class. It is even better than LS-460/LS-600H and outperforms BMW/MB. with similar performance.
The Phaeton's got no 'model' recognition, like the Max!
Senior Moderator
Joined: Dec 2001
Posts: 168,919
Likes: 23,738
it NEVER sold well... even in Europe...
Wikipedia
Phaeton sales fell short of expectations. It debuted at prices comparable to similar offerings from Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Lexus and, not least, the Volkswagen Group's own Audi A8 (which shared its engineering underpinnings with the Phaeton), while lacking the "brand cachet" of these competitor vehicles.
In 2002 the manufacturer stated that the annual capacity of the new Phaeton plant at Dresden was 20,000: by September 2006, a four-year total of just 25,000 had been built[3], with production running at approximately 6,000 cars annually. The domestic market is by far the Phaeton's strongest, with 19,314 Phaetons delivered in Germany alone by January 2009. The German luxury sedan sector continued to be dominated by the Mercedes Benz S-Class and BMW 7 series, however, both models achieving more than twice the sales volume of the Phaeton in 2008.
In the United States market, 1,433 Phaetons were sold in 2004, but just 820 were sold in 2005, leading the company to announce that sales in the American market would end after the 2006 model year. The rare W12-engined models have depreciated significantly, and sell for a small fraction of their original cost.[4]
In April 2008, Volkswagen announced plans to reintroduce the Phaeton to the United States market in 2009.[5] As of December 2009, no Phaetons have been shipped to the U.S. for sale at VW dealers.
Wikipedia
Phaeton sales fell short of expectations. It debuted at prices comparable to similar offerings from Mercedes-Benz, BMW, Lexus and, not least, the Volkswagen Group's own Audi A8 (which shared its engineering underpinnings with the Phaeton), while lacking the "brand cachet" of these competitor vehicles.
In 2002 the manufacturer stated that the annual capacity of the new Phaeton plant at Dresden was 20,000: by September 2006, a four-year total of just 25,000 had been built[3], with production running at approximately 6,000 cars annually. The domestic market is by far the Phaeton's strongest, with 19,314 Phaetons delivered in Germany alone by January 2009. The German luxury sedan sector continued to be dominated by the Mercedes Benz S-Class and BMW 7 series, however, both models achieving more than twice the sales volume of the Phaeton in 2008.
In the United States market, 1,433 Phaetons were sold in 2004, but just 820 were sold in 2005, leading the company to announce that sales in the American market would end after the 2006 model year. The rare W12-engined models have depreciated significantly, and sell for a small fraction of their original cost.[4]
In April 2008, Volkswagen announced plans to reintroduce the Phaeton to the United States market in 2009.[5] As of December 2009, no Phaetons have been shipped to the U.S. for sale at VW dealers.
Despite the poor sales, it's still quite a nice car. I'd drive one.
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,751
Likes: 69
New facelifted Phaeton revealed
The slow-selling Volkswagen Phaeton has been upgraded. The revised luxury saloon will be unveiled at the Beijing motor show this week.
The launch venue is no coincidence; the Phaeton has sold in modest numbers only in the UK and Europe, and was pulled from sale in US entirely in 2006.
China and South Korea are the car's biggest markets and VW sold 1400 Phaetons in China last year, a 40 per cent increase on 2008's levels.
The changes are largely cosmetic. The new Phaeton gets front-end styling now familiar from all new Volkswagens, including the Polo, Golf and Touareg.
Styling changes have also been made at the rear and new kit has been added inside, including Google Maps and road sign recognition technology.
The engine range is likely to be the same as in the current Phaeton. A 237bhp 3.0-litre V6 turbodiesel will be available in both short and long-wheelbase models, but the flagship 444bhp W12 petrol will be offered in the long-wheelbase Phaeton only.
The car is scheduled to go on sale in the UK in October; expect prices to start at around £45,000.
The launch venue is no coincidence; the Phaeton has sold in modest numbers only in the UK and Europe, and was pulled from sale in US entirely in 2006.
China and South Korea are the car's biggest markets and VW sold 1400 Phaetons in China last year, a 40 per cent increase on 2008's levels.
The changes are largely cosmetic. The new Phaeton gets front-end styling now familiar from all new Volkswagens, including the Polo, Golf and Touareg.
Styling changes have also been made at the rear and new kit has been added inside, including Google Maps and road sign recognition technology.
The engine range is likely to be the same as in the current Phaeton. A 237bhp 3.0-litre V6 turbodiesel will be available in both short and long-wheelbase models, but the flagship 444bhp W12 petrol will be offered in the long-wheelbase Phaeton only.
The car is scheduled to go on sale in the UK in October; expect prices to start at around £45,000.
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,751
Likes: 69
Three Wheelin'
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 1,751
Likes: 69
http://www.motorauthority.com/blog/1...haeton-preview
Volkswagen has updated its Phaeton flagship for the second time in its short life, reaffirming the lackluster opinion of the car in the full-size luxury sedan market. With a brand new BMW 7-series and facelifted Mercedes-Benz S-Class already on sale, plus the completely redesigned Audi A8 and Jaguar XJ just around the corner, Volkswagen’s entrant in this segment is facing a serious uphill battle.
The new 2011 Volkswagen Phaeton comes onto the market with a fundamentally new front design and is making its world debut in what will arguably be its biggest market, China. It will be on display for the first time at next week’s 2010 Beijing Auto Show.
The complete powertrain lineup includes six-, eight- and twelve-cylinder engines ranging in capacity from 240 horsepower to 450 horsepower. The most fuel efficient model packs a 3.0-liter V-6 turbodiesel and returns a fuel economy (European combined cycle) of 27.7 mpg yet can accelerate the car from 0-62 mph in 8.2 seconds and see it reach a top speed of 147 mph.
Coming as standard across the range is a 4Motion all-wheel drive system, air suspension, bi-xenon headlights, 18 inch alloy wheels, 4-zone air-conditioning, 18-way adjustable seats and leather and Alcantara trim.
Volkswagen is yet to confirm if the updated car will be sold in the U.S. but rumors of such have been brewing, off and on, for almost two years. The return now looks more likely than ever, with the brand’s American CEO Stefan Jacoby previously stating it's time for a comeback for the big sedan, and this update could be just what they needs to get the ball rolling.
Now, if only Volkswagen can get the pricing right. With the 2011 Hyundai Equus coming onto the market this summer with a mid-$50,000 sticker, Volkswagen can’t be aiming too high with its latest Phaeton unless the company is looking for another sales flop. When Volkswagen's flagship Phaeton was last sold in the U.S., it was almost universally overlooked, selling just 3,354 total cars in its brief 2003-2006 stint in the American market.
Volkswagen has updated its Phaeton flagship for the second time in its short life, reaffirming the lackluster opinion of the car in the full-size luxury sedan market. With a brand new BMW 7-series and facelifted Mercedes-Benz S-Class already on sale, plus the completely redesigned Audi A8 and Jaguar XJ just around the corner, Volkswagen’s entrant in this segment is facing a serious uphill battle.
The new 2011 Volkswagen Phaeton comes onto the market with a fundamentally new front design and is making its world debut in what will arguably be its biggest market, China. It will be on display for the first time at next week’s 2010 Beijing Auto Show.
The complete powertrain lineup includes six-, eight- and twelve-cylinder engines ranging in capacity from 240 horsepower to 450 horsepower. The most fuel efficient model packs a 3.0-liter V-6 turbodiesel and returns a fuel economy (European combined cycle) of 27.7 mpg yet can accelerate the car from 0-62 mph in 8.2 seconds and see it reach a top speed of 147 mph.
Coming as standard across the range is a 4Motion all-wheel drive system, air suspension, bi-xenon headlights, 18 inch alloy wheels, 4-zone air-conditioning, 18-way adjustable seats and leather and Alcantara trim.
Volkswagen is yet to confirm if the updated car will be sold in the U.S. but rumors of such have been brewing, off and on, for almost two years. The return now looks more likely than ever, with the brand’s American CEO Stefan Jacoby previously stating it's time for a comeback for the big sedan, and this update could be just what they needs to get the ball rolling.
Now, if only Volkswagen can get the pricing right. With the 2011 Hyundai Equus coming onto the market this summer with a mid-$50,000 sticker, Volkswagen can’t be aiming too high with its latest Phaeton unless the company is looking for another sales flop. When Volkswagen's flagship Phaeton was last sold in the U.S., it was almost universally overlooked, selling just 3,354 total cars in its brief 2003-2006 stint in the American market.
The sizzle in the Steak
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 71,436
Likes: 1,877
From: Southern California
^^ Tool.
Tell us all how this car is a FAIL?
The car is beautiful inside and out.
Props to VW for all the powertrain options....although I don't know why they will be putting a W12 in this car
Dunno if it's coming stateside or not....if it does they better price it right otherwise keep it in Europe and Asia.
Tell us all how this car is a FAIL?
The car is beautiful inside and out.
Props to VW for all the powertrain options....although I don't know why they will be putting a W12 in this car
Dunno if it's coming stateside or not....if it does they better price it right otherwise keep it in Europe and Asia.
Pro
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 679
Likes: 18
From: nyc
The sizzle in the Steak
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 71,436
Likes: 1,877
From: Southern California
True...I don't know you, but your comments are an insult to our collective intelligence in here.
So again, how is this car a fail?
You brought it up....enlighten us, please.
If you are trying to be funny, might I suggest ramblings.....
So again, how is this car a fail?
You brought it up....enlighten us, please.
If you are trying to be funny, might I suggest ramblings.....
Burning Brakes
Joined: Feb 2009
Posts: 826
Likes: 13
From: Philadelphia
hmm the interior is more 'old fashioned' when compared to the new A8, which is futuristic with its red lights and all.
The exterior looks more 'sturdy' then the A8 which is sleek looking. I like it a lot, just not as much as the new A8.
The exterior looks more 'sturdy' then the A8 which is sleek looking. I like it a lot, just not as much as the new A8.
The sizzle in the Steak
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 71,436
Likes: 1,877
From: Southern California
Too bad the A8's exterior didn't end up looking this good.
...oh how I loved the A8 until this gen....
they barely changed the interior