Toyota Going To Center Mounted Gauges
10-07-2004, 08:49 AM
#1
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Toyota Going To Center Mounted Gauges
Toyota favoring center-mounted controls, argues ease of use for drivers
JAMES B. TREECE | Automotive News
Posted Date: 10/4/04
TOYOTA CITY, Japan -- Attention Toyota dealers: You soon may have to sell skeptical shoppers on the benefits of looking for the speedometer atop the center of the instrument panel, rather than behind the steering wheel.
Toyota Motor Corp. argues that the high, center location for the instrument cluster is easier to use for a wider range of drivers.
Moving the gauges is just one of a number of changes that Toyota is introducing as part of a push to incorporate so-called "universal design" principles.
Toyota insists that it will be flexible in locating the gauges according to universal design. In other words, it won't repeat BMW AG's insistence that drivers adjust to its iDrive instrument controls.
But already, the cluster of gauges are on the center of the instrument panel in one-half of Toyota's vehicles sold in Japan.
"We don't think there is only one approach" to improving the driver's visual perception of instrument gauges, says Tadao Okumura, a project manager in the design development department. Toyota could use center-mounted gauges, head-up displays or just make the gauges larger, depending on the target buyer, he says.
But older drivers have more difficulty seeing objects that are close, Okumura says.
Research is mixed on the value of high, center-mounted gauges. It takes "a couple of months, maybe" for the average driver to become fully accustomed to center-mounted displays, says Toshiyasu Asai, general manager of Denso Corp.'s body electronics components engineering department. He cites in-house studies as evidence.
Okumura counters that it is "rather easy" for drivers to become accustomed to center-mounted gauges. He says Toyota has not had any negative customer feedback regarding its center-mounted displays.
Suppliers such as Visteon Corp. have promoted center-mounted displays as a cost-saving measure. Such instrument panels do not need to be redesigned for right- vs. left-hand drive markets.
Toyota says it has other motivations. Its universal design efforts are aimed at making cars easier for everyone to use. Much of the effort is clearly aimed at Japan's aging population.
An estimated 19.5 percent of Japan's population is over age 65.
JAMES B. TREECE | Automotive News
Posted Date: 10/4/04
TOYOTA CITY, Japan -- Attention Toyota dealers: You soon may have to sell skeptical shoppers on the benefits of looking for the speedometer atop the center of the instrument panel, rather than behind the steering wheel.
Toyota Motor Corp. argues that the high, center location for the instrument cluster is easier to use for a wider range of drivers.
Moving the gauges is just one of a number of changes that Toyota is introducing as part of a push to incorporate so-called "universal design" principles.
Toyota insists that it will be flexible in locating the gauges according to universal design. In other words, it won't repeat BMW AG's insistence that drivers adjust to its iDrive instrument controls.
But already, the cluster of gauges are on the center of the instrument panel in one-half of Toyota's vehicles sold in Japan.
"We don't think there is only one approach" to improving the driver's visual perception of instrument gauges, says Tadao Okumura, a project manager in the design development department. Toyota could use center-mounted gauges, head-up displays or just make the gauges larger, depending on the target buyer, he says.
But older drivers have more difficulty seeing objects that are close, Okumura says.
Research is mixed on the value of high, center-mounted gauges. It takes "a couple of months, maybe" for the average driver to become fully accustomed to center-mounted displays, says Toshiyasu Asai, general manager of Denso Corp.'s body electronics components engineering department. He cites in-house studies as evidence.
Okumura counters that it is "rather easy" for drivers to become accustomed to center-mounted gauges. He says Toyota has not had any negative customer feedback regarding its center-mounted displays.
Suppliers such as Visteon Corp. have promoted center-mounted displays as a cost-saving measure. Such instrument panels do not need to be redesigned for right- vs. left-hand drive markets.
Toyota says it has other motivations. Its universal design efforts are aimed at making cars easier for everyone to use. Much of the effort is clearly aimed at Japan's aging population.
An estimated 19.5 percent of Japan's population is over age 65.
10-07-2004, 08:58 AM
#2
I think that's a horrible idea. I don't see how this type of gauge cluster is easier to read for a wider variety of "drivers" as Toyota says. Maybe for passengers. 
I personally love the idea of the gauge cluster moving in conjunction with the steering wheel so there are never any parts of the guages covered by the steering wheel (i.e. the Infiniti FX). If they want to make it easier for the driver to see they should adopt this idea and not stupid center mounted gauges IMHO.
I personally love the idea of the gauge cluster moving in conjunction with the steering wheel so there are never any parts of the guages covered by the steering wheel (i.e. the Infiniti FX). If they want to make it easier for the driver to see they should adopt this idea and not stupid center mounted gauges IMHO.
10-07-2004, 09:28 AM
#5
Suzuka Master
Originally Posted by TSX 'R' US
:wtf:???!!!??? Center mounted guages are :ghey:
I don't want to be looking over to my right everytime I want to check my speed
I don't want to be looking over to my right everytime I want to check my speed
They are :ghey:
10-07-2004, 09:32 AM
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The center-mounted gauge idea is a cost-saving effort for the car manufacturers that is being pushed onto consumers as a "safety" or "progress" fad. While I think I can get used to it, I hate them and really don't think they are intuitive. If safety really were the overriding concern, then why not heads-up displays? Are there any studies that have proven that center-mounted gauges are actually better for drivers? Show me that and I might change my mind.
10-07-2004, 09:41 AM
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I think center clusters are :ghey: and a set-back in safety, but I can definitely understand the need for universality, resulting in decreased production costs.
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10-07-2004, 11:22 AM
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Originally Posted by xizor
is it possible this would increase accidents with people taking their eyes of the roading and turning their head?
10-07-2004, 03:05 PM
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Originally Posted by biker
Look inside most lower end French/Euro cars and what you see - quite a few have center mounted gages - not something Toyota came up with.
10-07-2004, 03:10 PM
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We once had a toyota echo for a loaner after we were in an accident. The centre mounted gauge was annoying as hell. I wouldn't purchase a car with a centre mounted gauge - no matter what brand. The mini only has the speedometer in the middle the Tach is right infront of the steering wheel.
10-07-2004, 03:42 PM
#14
Race Director
Originally Posted by AcuraFan
No, it certainly isn't something Toyota came up with. Mini and Saturn both have center mounted gauges. My problem is, as other have said, this is purely a cost saving measure for Toyota. (not that they'll pass the savings along to the consumer) There is no benefit to the driver...in fact, it's probably worse. The driver's eye has to travel farther and away from the road to see it. Not good.
No, if you really want to see cheapness when it comes to RHD vs. LHD cars look no further than the G35 - Nissan won't cough up the $2 to move the radio controls to the driver side.
10-07-2004, 03:54 PM
#15
IMO, the best location for the gauges would be something like what the Corvette has...where the gauges are projected onto the windshield directly in front of you.
10-07-2004, 03:59 PM
#16
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Originally Posted by phile
IMO, the best location for the gauges would be something like what the Corvette has...where the gauges are projected onto the windshield directly in front of you.
Anything that takes time to get used to especially 2 months should have never have been put there in the first place. Especially in a moving object that weighs anywhere from a ton to 2 tons and can travel over 60MPH.
10-07-2004, 05:33 PM
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From what I've been able to see only the "cheaper" or smaller cars have the center mounted gages. I think there was one nicer mini-van that had a center mounted gauge cluster that isn't absolutely horrible. I really don't see how it could be safer.
I did find a couple of cool/funny old school style cars:
Century
Crown Sedan <-- Looks like a giant Cressida.
I did find a couple of cool/funny old school style cars:
Century
Crown Sedan <-- Looks like a giant Cressida.
10-07-2004, 05:39 PM
#20
Originally Posted by corbs
I really don't see how it could be safer.
10-07-2004, 05:51 PM
#21
bleh...
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Originally Posted by CGTSX2004
I hate those center mounted gauges. Just hope they don't try that with Lexus. That'd be a disappointment.
Originally Posted by TSX 'R' US
:wtf:???!!!??? Center mounted guages are :ghey:
I don't want to be looking over to my right everytime I want to check my speed
I don't want to be looking over to my right everytime I want to check my speed
10-07-2004, 07:39 PM
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I'd like to see some studies done before every car manufacturer moves to center-mounted gauges en masse simply because of cost savings or styling fads. Safety and intuition should be paramount. The Chrysler Pacifica brings the nav screen directly in front of the driver by integrating it into the speedometer, one of the most intelligent designs I have seen. Then again, when we check our rear-view mirror it's not in the line of sight - I wonder if center-mounted gauges are just a case of whether or not it's something we have to get used to (although it sure doesn't feel like it)?
10-12-2004, 11:10 AM
#25
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Originally Posted by DEVO
I wonder if this saves them money when producing left/right hand drive cars. That's the only reason I can think of to have a center mount dash.
The only part that could be the same would have to be the part where the radio and such are located. The upper portions and rest of the dash don't seem to be uniform otherwise.
10-12-2004, 11:54 AM
#26
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well... take for example my civic hybrid... the center controls are identical to both the left and right hand side versions. I wonder if this concept is now going towards the dash as well. Keep things in the middle means... less parts that have to be moved when creating a car for both sides of the road.
the side effect to this... in the case of my hybrid. is that some of the controls look awkward. it's hard for me to set the vent output setting because the icons are obscured by the knob. sitting in the passenger seat, i don't have the problem, because i can see the icons clearly.
to me this means that it was designed with the right hand drive point of view, instead of left.
the side effect to this... in the case of my hybrid. is that some of the controls look awkward. it's hard for me to set the vent output setting because the icons are obscured by the knob. sitting in the passenger seat, i don't have the problem, because i can see the icons clearly.
to me this means that it was designed with the right hand drive point of view, instead of left.
10-12-2004, 12:17 PM
#27
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Originally Posted by Toyota
But older drivers have more difficulty seeing objects that are close, Okumura says.
Now they're making all of their cars cater to old people.
10-12-2004, 12:41 PM
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Originally Posted by drkangel348
Futher proof that Toyota is becoming "Buick" of japanese automobiles. First they kill the Supra, then the MR2, then the Celica...
Now they're making all of their cars cater to old people.
Now they're making all of their cars cater to old people.
10-12-2004, 04:50 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by drkangel348
Futher proof that Toyota is becoming "Buick" of japanese automobiles. First they kill the Supra, then the MR2, then the Celica...
Now they're making all of their cars cater to old people.
Now they're making all of their cars cater to old people.
but a note on the center gauges... i've experienced it a couple of times in a rental echo and its not bad at all... i mean right now with traditional placement of dash...you have to glance down and take your eyes off the road to read it. and those displays that project the speed/tach on the windshield is pretty much useless when there is sunlight around.
toyota have always been the best at ergonomics... i'll give them the benifit of the doubt on this one.
10-12-2004, 04:52 PM
#30
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Originally Posted by gilboman
its called catering to market demand... if you didnt notice, the average age of the population is increasing... they do have scion which is dedicated to the younger crowd though.
but a note on the center gauges... i've experienced it a couple of times in a rental echo and its not bad at all... i mean right now with traditional placement of dash...you have to glance down and take your eyes off the road to read it. and those displays that project the speed/tach on the windshield is pretty much useless when there is sunlight around.
toyota have always been the best at ergonomics... i'll give them the benifit of the doubt on this one.
but a note on the center gauges... i've experienced it a couple of times in a rental echo and its not bad at all... i mean right now with traditional placement of dash...you have to glance down and take your eyes off the road to read it. and those displays that project the speed/tach on the windshield is pretty much useless when there is sunlight around.
toyota have always been the best at ergonomics... i'll give them the benifit of the doubt on this one.
10-12-2004, 10:48 PM
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Originally Posted by ClutchPerformer
Wow. A decent post by gilboman. Amazing!
10-12-2004, 11:24 PM
#32
Originally Posted by ClutchPerformer
Wow. A decent post by gilboman. Amazing!
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