Subaru: Legacy News
03-01-2004, 01:28 PM
#131
'Big Daddy Diggler'
i think i will be holding out on buying a new car until i see the numbers on the new legacy. This thing looks sweet, and has the balls, lets see if it will be truly a contender.
05-07-2004, 07:17 PM
#132
Racer
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2005 Subaru Legacy Review
We need the AWD option on the TSX because the competition has already arrived.
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadt...8/article.html
"It's easily as much fun as a TSX or Mazda 6, and with the confidence of all four wheels putting power to the pavement, we began to wonder why someone would spend more on an A4."
"The Legacy and Outback have always been known for their fine handling, but for 2005, Subaru wanted them to behave less like workaday family cars and more like sporty entry-luxury cars, meaning excellent ride quality combined with sharp reflexes. The examples set by cars like the Acura TSX, Audi A4, Mazda 6 and Volkswagen Passat surely did not go unnoticed. "
"With a tightened-up chassis, turbocharged engine and a slick cockpit, the Legacy GT is a serious driver's car and, likely, one of the fastest vehicles in Subaru's lineup. Don't buy a TSX or Mazda 6 without trying one. "
http://www.edmunds.com/reviews/roadt...8/article.html
"It's easily as much fun as a TSX or Mazda 6, and with the confidence of all four wheels putting power to the pavement, we began to wonder why someone would spend more on an A4."
"The Legacy and Outback have always been known for their fine handling, but for 2005, Subaru wanted them to behave less like workaday family cars and more like sporty entry-luxury cars, meaning excellent ride quality combined with sharp reflexes. The examples set by cars like the Acura TSX, Audi A4, Mazda 6 and Volkswagen Passat surely did not go unnoticed. "
"With a tightened-up chassis, turbocharged engine and a slick cockpit, the Legacy GT is a serious driver's car and, likely, one of the fastest vehicles in Subaru's lineup. Don't buy a TSX or Mazda 6 without trying one. "
05-07-2004, 08:16 PM
#133
Cruise Missile Lobber
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I agree with you man....sorry to say it. My wife has a WRX right now, and claims she loves it more than the TSX, but I know that if she could drop her engine in my TSX she would be in heaven. Then Subaru went and did it with the 05 Legacy. I do think that the TSX looks way better in and out, but damn 250 horsies in an entry level luxury car is a nice idea!
05-08-2004, 02:23 AM
#135
Race Director
AWD is virtually meanigless - just think how much better the Subie could be if it was FWD or RWD only!!! 90+% of the time AWD is just a 200lb liability.
The things that matter are the exterior/interior, reliability, preformance, handling, fuel economy - it's on those counts that one should compare it to another car.
The things that matter are the exterior/interior, reliability, preformance, handling, fuel economy - it's on those counts that one should compare it to another car.
05-09-2004, 03:10 PM
#137
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Originally posted by biker
AWD is virtually meanigless - just think how much better the Subie could be if it was FWD or RWD only!!! 90+% of the time AWD is just a 200lb liability.
The things that matter are the exterior/interior, reliability, preformance, handling, fuel economy - it's on those counts that one should compare it to another car.
AWD is virtually meanigless - just think how much better the Subie could be if it was FWD or RWD only!!! 90+% of the time AWD is just a 200lb liability.
The things that matter are the exterior/interior, reliability, preformance, handling, fuel economy - it's on those counts that one should compare it to another car.
05-09-2004, 04:30 PM
#138
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Originally posted by Vans
Obviously that means that the AWD feature on the new RL is meaningless as well. Oh wait - it's on an Acura so it's all good. Come on - it's always nice to have. Especially on a car like the WRX, which is built for speed and handling.
Obviously that means that the AWD feature on the new RL is meaningless as well. Oh wait - it's on an Acura so it's all good. Come on - it's always nice to have. Especially on a car like the WRX, which is built for speed and handling.
05-09-2004, 11:39 PM
#139
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Yes a fwd legacy gt with torque steer would be wonderful. Awd is a nice feature for all types of conditions, rain, snow, powerful engine, etc. Should be a great car.
05-10-2004, 08:23 AM
#140
built for speed
AWD also allows you to put more power to the road immediately without wheelslip. This will improve acceleration and handling. Just ask anyone who owns a 911 Carrera 4.
05-10-2004, 08:32 AM
#142
Race Director
All other things being equal I rather have the RWD version of the a particular car than the AWD 200lb heavier version. If the RL had an option of either AWD or RWD I'd get the latter. With the RL and Subaru you have no choice.
05-10-2004, 08:06 PM
#143
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man... why cant Acura/Honda ever build something perfect or something close to it.... dump an extra 40-50 ponies in the engine, make it either a RWD or AWD.... after all, in my opinion from reading different magazines, tsx has the most potential in its chassis, if given more power and a more potent handling system either a rwd or awd....... wow...... i cant imagine what it would be like.... even with the FWD layout of the tsx, the tsx out handles audi S4, what would it be like to have it awd...... ok, i think i'm daydreaming too much now anyways, i would still choose the TSX over the legacy gt, because of the higher prestige acura has, reliability and quality.... Legacy is a terrifc car, good engine, good handling... But I'd still go with Acura's prestige, quality, reliability... and bottom line, "precision" in every aspect of my beloved TSX. Aint no regret, aint no going back, TSX forever 
my little 2 cent.
Kevin
anyways, i would still choose the TSX over the legacy gt, because of the higher prestige acura has, reliability and quality.... Legacy is a terrifc car, good engine, good handling... But I'd still go with Acura's prestige, quality, reliability... and bottom line, "precision" in every aspect of my beloved TSX. Aint no regret, aint no going back, TSX forever my little 2 cent.Kevin
05-11-2004, 12:55 PM
#144
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Originally posted by Vans
Obviously that means that the AWD feature on the new RL is meaningless as well. Oh wait - it's on an Acura so it's all good. Come on - it's always nice to have. Especially on a car like the WRX, which is built for speed and handling.
Obviously that means that the AWD feature on the new RL is meaningless as well. Oh wait - it's on an Acura so it's all good. Come on - it's always nice to have. Especially on a car like the WRX, which is built for speed and handling.
07-02-2004, 11:05 PM
#148
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It's Jap spec. Probably wont make it to NA. Pity. About red gauge, I remember reading it somewhere. It's safer for night driving. But I don't see the difference
07-05-2004, 07:24 PM
#151
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Originally Posted by Lung Fu Mo Shi
It's crap. Doesn't even have self-leveling projectors like BMW has.
:fingerfawk:
:fingerfawk:
Don't think those are LED taillights either
07-06-2004, 02:05 PM
#155
Teh ?
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2004/2005 Subaru Legacy reviews
As some of you know, I recently purchased a 04 Scoobie Legacy... which still needs a name. But since I just hit 3000 miles, and drove the 05 Legacy GT this weekend, I thought I give it a write up and comparisons to other rides...
First, the 04 Legacy...
Performance: The power is definitely lacking which causes slow launches, which is compounded by a slow tranny which really makes it hard for quick manuvers from dead stops. Highway performance ain't bad, with plenty of get up when rev'ed high enough. Handling is commendable for a car at this price. I don't know if this is even a word, but the car has a pseudo-neutral feel on corners, it really isn't sticking that well while cornering, but it feels like it is... must be the AWD or something. Suspension is nicely balanced, but not as good as the Accords. Breaks are a huge disappointment, with a quick response at touch but significant fade as it's pressed further.
Interior: Cheap plastic on some parts, which only looks decent at night. Sound system is cheap and sounds weak. Rattles aren't a problem so far, sounds solid. The seats are comfortable, with the rear being cramped for width, but great on leg room. The wagon came in handy during the bachelor party when I had to drive 8 drunks to a late night munchin'.
Overall: for just a bit over 20k total, it's not a bad car. Long as it holds up in the long run, it seems pretty solid. Still waiting to see what it's like on adverse weather conditions. If you need a cheap sedan with AWD and room for a family, it's not a bad buy.
Now, for the 05 GT model... Drove a black wagon with all beige interior, with all the goodies... oh, and an Auto (no manual on the lot that day).
Performance: Lordy, was it fast!!! Turbo is much smoother than the WRX, with even kick as it builds up. The rear-biased AWD definitely can be felt while driving. The suspension is a bit stiff for comfort at time, especially with the larger, low profile rims. The handling is great, with nice weight for straights and turns. The steering mounted shifting is not very impressive. The shifts are pretty slow on the down shift, making it kinda hard to time passings. The five speed does help the engine relax at it's top speeds (took it to 100). Breaks are still iffy, with the same probs as the previous 04 Legacy.
Interior: Hmmm... kind of a mix here. The new layout is nice, classier than what I expected. The plastic quality is still pretty horrid for it's price. The plood looks like it's printed on paper, than placed on the plastic, which makes it look sooooo fake, it's disgusting. The leather is a huge improvement, with the seats close to quality with the TSX. The rear gets a bit bigger but the wagon back loses about six inches in length, cutting down on space. The stereo sounds much better, but still not up to what it costs.
Overall: Scoobie enthusiasts will soak this one up, I'm sure... but it won't bring in new converts so much since the loaded model reached to msrp of 32k, with no navi, no HID lamps and some qualities that belong in cheaper cars. Maybe with some great financing, they can move a lot of them, especially in the less dressed-up version. But I'm doubting the price increase will sit well with buyers in the market for tweener cars (near lux).
I heard my buddy at Scoobie say that this new GT might run into the same probs as the RX-7 of the 90's... When the old RX-7 was replaced with the more exotic model, it lost almost 50% in sales in one year. Mazda was hoping that loyalists would upgrade to a more expensive car, but it never happened. That, with poor sales of other models, scrapped the entry lux badge that was to be launched by Mazda, as well as allowing GM Ford to buy into Mazda.
Junkster, who can post more now that Euro 04 is over
First, the 04 Legacy...
Performance: The power is definitely lacking which causes slow launches, which is compounded by a slow tranny which really makes it hard for quick manuvers from dead stops. Highway performance ain't bad, with plenty of get up when rev'ed high enough. Handling is commendable for a car at this price. I don't know if this is even a word, but the car has a pseudo-neutral feel on corners, it really isn't sticking that well while cornering, but it feels like it is... must be the AWD or something. Suspension is nicely balanced, but not as good as the Accords. Breaks are a huge disappointment, with a quick response at touch but significant fade as it's pressed further.
Interior: Cheap plastic on some parts, which only looks decent at night. Sound system is cheap and sounds weak. Rattles aren't a problem so far, sounds solid. The seats are comfortable, with the rear being cramped for width, but great on leg room. The wagon came in handy during the bachelor party when I had to drive 8 drunks to a late night munchin'.
Overall: for just a bit over 20k total, it's not a bad car. Long as it holds up in the long run, it seems pretty solid. Still waiting to see what it's like on adverse weather conditions. If you need a cheap sedan with AWD and room for a family, it's not a bad buy.
Now, for the 05 GT model... Drove a black wagon with all beige interior, with all the goodies... oh, and an Auto (no manual on the lot that day).
Performance: Lordy, was it fast!!! Turbo is much smoother than the WRX, with even kick as it builds up. The rear-biased AWD definitely can be felt while driving. The suspension is a bit stiff for comfort at time, especially with the larger, low profile rims. The handling is great, with nice weight for straights and turns. The steering mounted shifting is not very impressive. The shifts are pretty slow on the down shift, making it kinda hard to time passings. The five speed does help the engine relax at it's top speeds (took it to 100). Breaks are still iffy, with the same probs as the previous 04 Legacy.
Interior: Hmmm... kind of a mix here. The new layout is nice, classier than what I expected. The plastic quality is still pretty horrid for it's price. The plood looks like it's printed on paper, than placed on the plastic, which makes it look sooooo fake, it's disgusting. The leather is a huge improvement, with the seats close to quality with the TSX. The rear gets a bit bigger but the wagon back loses about six inches in length, cutting down on space. The stereo sounds much better, but still not up to what it costs.
Overall: Scoobie enthusiasts will soak this one up, I'm sure... but it won't bring in new converts so much since the loaded model reached to msrp of 32k, with no navi, no HID lamps and some qualities that belong in cheaper cars. Maybe with some great financing, they can move a lot of them, especially in the less dressed-up version. But I'm doubting the price increase will sit well with buyers in the market for tweener cars (near lux).
I heard my buddy at Scoobie say that this new GT might run into the same probs as the RX-7 of the 90's... When the old RX-7 was replaced with the more exotic model, it lost almost 50% in sales in one year. Mazda was hoping that loyalists would upgrade to a more expensive car, but it never happened. That, with poor sales of other models, scrapped the entry lux badge that was to be launched by Mazda, as well as allowing GM Ford to buy into Mazda.
Junkster, who can post more now that Euro 04 is over
07-06-2004, 02:23 PM
#156
Senior Moderator
Nice write up Junkster.
I too feel that Subaru is taking a big chance attempting to move up market. I think there were fine just where they were but what do I know.
I like the looks of the new Leg but feel it MAY be priced slighltly higher than it should be. But I seriously doubt sales will be cut in half like the RX-7. If anything they'll see a healthy boost IMO at least in the short term.
I too feel that Subaru is taking a big chance attempting to move up market. I think there were fine just where they were but what do I know.
I like the looks of the new Leg but feel it MAY be priced slighltly higher than it should be. But I seriously doubt sales will be cut in half like the RX-7. If anything they'll see a healthy boost IMO at least in the short term.
07-06-2004, 02:27 PM
#157
Teh ?
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I agree on both points...
Subaru should stay on non-near lux market, it's crowded as it is. They aren't going to steal any sales from the others in the market.
I don't think the price is going to kill the model, per say, but it probably won't meet the sales expectations that they have of the GT line.
Junkster, who would get a GT wagon loaded for about 29k
Subaru should stay on non-near lux market, it's crowded as it is. They aren't going to steal any sales from the others in the market.
I don't think the price is going to kill the model, per say, but it probably won't meet the sales expectations that they have of the GT line.
Junkster, who would get a GT wagon loaded for about 29k
07-06-2004, 03:33 PM
#158
Teh ?
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biker, I have the review of the 04 and 05 on the other page...
As for this WR model... I don't know, if I was paying 32+ for such a package, I wouldn't be a ricer/rally-wannabe kind of person.
BTW, the 05 Legacy gauges are pretty cute... flaps at ya when you turn her on...
Junkster, who thinks the TSX is a better buy overall
As for this WR model... I don't know, if I was paying 32+ for such a package, I wouldn't be a ricer/rally-wannabe kind of person.
BTW, the 05 Legacy gauges are pretty cute... flaps at ya when you turn her on...
Junkster, who thinks the TSX is a better buy overall
07-06-2004, 03:47 PM
#159
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Jeez bro, for $32k you're within a couple grand of a loaded AWD G35 sedan, and for MY05 it's getting 277/270 and body-colored side moldings, as well a couple small changes to the interior to clean up the central dash area a bit. =\
I definitely couldn't go with a Subie over that, especially with the better Infiniti warranty and likely better service experience.
That said, the old pics from last year of the STi version of the legacy still get me excited. If THAT came out at $32k and offered around 300hp, then we're talking, because the performance would balance out for the non-luxury interior.
(I don't think I have the STi pics still on my webspace but if I remember I'll up them when I get home later.)
I definitely couldn't go with a Subie over that, especially with the better Infiniti warranty and likely better service experience.
That said, the old pics from last year of the STi version of the legacy still get me excited. If THAT came out at $32k and offered around 300hp, then we're talking, because the performance would balance out for the non-luxury interior.
(I don't think I have the STi pics still on my webspace but if I remember I'll up them when I get home later.)
07-06-2004, 03:50 PM
#160
Teh ?
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I doubt that they can get the STi version here for anything less than 34~35k...
The G35 would be a interesting comparison to the GT. Never thought of that.
Junkster, who would give the edge to GT since it can be had in a wagon
The G35 would be a interesting comparison to the GT. Never thought of that.
Junkster, who would give the edge to GT since it can be had in a wagon