ccheung

Size, they are similar. Power, TL outpowered the new "5". Specs, pretty similar also. But price, we are talking about $15,000 difference. Should we compare TL to "3" instead because of price point?

lamster

I have read at least 3 times from Canadian newspapers which described the new TL as an "alternative" to the more expensive 5's series. Sure there's a HUGE gap in terms of pricing, but I don't see that has anything to do with the comparison of specs, features, and looks between these 2 cars.

ccheung

They never compare the TL to "5" even at the R/D. No factory comparison between these 2 cars from Acura at all!?

need4spd_RENAMED

Yes, but the Acura intro said it was designed with the 5 series sport in mind!

I think the two cars are comparable, as the sizes are roughly the same. Forget the cost.

People who cross shop are more likely to look at the A4 and 3 Series because the cost is similar, but then again, there will be some that are looking at the 5 and A6 that will look at the TL as it is similar in size (a little shorter, but interior is close).

For me, I looked at the 3 and A4, and liked them, but they were a little too small overall (main reason), and they had not gotten the 5 star ratings that I would have expected and were too much money for what they are.

BradW

Acura did alot of comparison testing between the new 5 car and the TL. At the GM meeting in San Fran they had both to drive, so that individuals could compare the two.

After driving the 5 car myself and spending 20 or so minutes messing with the interior functions I think its WAY over priced. I used to have a 1998 528 that I loved but I just can't justify $50,000 plus for the new 530.

jim_arrows

http://www.canadianautoreview.com/2004_acura_tl.htm

I think someone over at the freshalloy G35 site pointed this review out (can't remember for sure), but I hadn't seen it linked here. Sorry if it's a repost. Anyhoo, it's not that great of a review (I believe someone on the other forum said it was like reading a term paper 8). I think it's more like one of the Acura engineers going point-by-point through all of the new features, but it's full of information and they do compare the TL to the 2003 5 series, A6, G35, and ES300 in a bunch of different categories. So, evidently, they thought it was a worthy comparison to make.

Again, sorry if this review is old news around here, I just hadn't seen it before.

Regards,
Jim

Raheel

http://www.acura-tsx.com/forums/show...light=canadian

at the bottom I posted that link

legendguy

Jim A and 4004TL-
Actually thanks for the link. Although the report was long it has lots of facts and figures that might prove helpful in doing a comparison. The cars compared; TL, G35, A6, BMW5, ES330 were well chosen because, although they may appeal to different spending levels they have similar passenger volumes (interior dimensions are a better comparison then exterior), occupy similar places in the respective manufactures lineups, and are cars frequently cross-shopped. Could probably add the Lincoln LS, SAAB 9^5, and Lexus GS to the list.

The BMW5 has a little more passenger volume than the TL but the TL has way more than the BMW3 (even the TSX has more than the BMW3). I think TL and BMW5 can be compared this way. No, the BMW5 and TL are probably not all that cross-shopped (although I will) but this is due mainly to the big difference in price.

goldband

You can decide to put the TL and 5 series in different categories because they are seldom 'cross-shopped' or in the same category because taken as they are, they are similiar in size, dynamics, features, quality of materials and finishing, etc.

If you accept the 'cross-shop; method, you are just falling prey to the marketing story as it exists, which impells people to make the comparisons they make-- price being a big part of it. This generally leads to comparing TL to 3 series, A4, etc.

If you take the cars for what they are (rising above the marketing hype and image) you find 2 similar (and excellent) cars with a huge price difference in the TL and 5 series (could be said for A6, etc)

So what does BMW do with the extra $15-20K?? IMHO they do 3 things:

1) Spend a great deal on promoting the car, thereby giving you a product with certain real attributes, and other intangible attributes (prestige, ability to turn heads and impress people, ability to make you (if you inclined) feel successful and superior), etc. (50%)

2) spend it on inflated german labor and other costs (30%)

3) pocket the rest (20%)

As for me, Ill keep the money and drive my TL.

Dan Martin

I still think they are very different cars but I wouldn't necessarily say that one is better than the other, they're just different. I've driven both and I would say the overall difference is refinement. The 530i just has a more opulent feel than the TL. The TL would blow the doors off the 530i on the track but for daily driving the 530i feels much more substantial.

As far as reliability is concerned, the 530i doesn't have the same problems that the 3 series does. They have done their homework on that car and from what I've read it ranks up there with the best that Japan has to offer.

I'm still not wild about the styling of the 530i especially the interior, so from that standpoint the TL is much better.

I know someone who just bought a TL to take customers out for lunch but he has an S500 and a new SL55 AMG parked at home. The TL has a really good thing going for it when it comes to a reasonable company car. It's classy without being over the top. The 530i says "we're charging you too much" if you were to take customers out in it.

neuronbob

I agree. The current 3 and the outgoing 5 are hot-looking, great-performing cars. However, even though I can afford both, I prefer to invest the money that I save for retirement and drive a comparable hot car--my TL. 700 miles as of today and having fun every time I step into the car!

SPUDMTN

Sorry...while it might be remotely true...it just seems a little far fetched if you ask me. It just took one re-design to turn around BMW reliability issues?

Saintor_RENAMED

This car certainly can compete with new 5 series. I would have not said that with the previous gen. Not refined enough. But THIS one, wow. Did you see those door panels. And the ones from the new ugly BMW? Can't stand them.

Overall it is fabulous. And with 270HP, it humiliates German cars with only 225HP.

stlgasman

You must be a better investor than me or the past few years. One of my better investments was to pay cash for 00 TL in 01/00 instead of leaving the money in the market --- if you know what I mean.

biker

Although many car makers have been playing catch-up with BMW for a while (and the function/quality gap was there) I think some are getting close enough that a number of cars are going to eat into its sales. Although I have a fairly distant horizon when it comes to getting my next car, I foresee cars which will close in if not maybe even surpass BMW. If I had to buy today I would probably still lean toward the new 530 instead of the TL or almost anything else. The biggest issue I have with the TL is the Accord underpinnings and lack of RWD. Every car maker has a RWD platform on which it bases its luxury models, except Honda. Without cars such as G35, Cadillac CTS, Lexus GS BMW would have the market to itself. Because of its German rivarlry, BMW looks to Mercedes too much when cross shopping its cars. With cars such as the new Fuga (and GS replacement) on the horizon it better look elsewhere.
For me a MT RWD TSX with the Accord V6 would suffice - but alas no such luck. My needs are simple: RWD, MT, 0-60 in less than 8s, more than 30MPG, comfortably fit a family of 4 and of course it has to be pleasing to the eye. Unfortunately I have yet to find something with the above specs for less than the a base $40K 530.

Saintor_RENAMED

95% of people do not really care or 'need' RWD... who can fault Honda for not building them? BTW I *WANT* a FWD car. A lot of snow and slippery surfaces here for 5 months.

Dan Martin

Consumer Reports said it was the best car they had ever driven.

EDIT: Here's a screenshot from their website:

ALFA

Biker, if you go for 4wd you can add the Subaru to your shopping list. And if fuel economy is not such a priority, then your best bet is the G35. By the way, how many miles do you drive? Fuel economy is not so important if you drive less than 15K per year, IMHO.

SPUDMTN

Have you considered a pre-owned car? You might want to try looking at certified 540i 6-speed... I think the E39 5-series is much more attractive than the latest version...but maybe that's just me.

If you want gobs of power (and can deal with a slushbox) try looking for a pre-owned MB E55 on ebay. You can practically STEAL one, I'm sure.

lamster

The G35x (AWD) should be an excellent drive, since it shares the same AWD system with the new FX35/45 which has received a lots of good reviews. G35 is becoming so popular in Toronto, I see them everywhere.

But I don't really like G35's interior, especially when comparing to the new TL's.